Preexistence

[shimmer]

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 15 2012,13:53)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 15 2012,10:53) Hi T8, Jesus Christ is one with God's Spirit. He is the same yesterday today and forever. But Jesus was conceived in Mary Nick. He existed in the form of God before being conceived as a man. It is written. The man from heaven.

Jesus' flesh and bone and blood was no different than any other mans.  The flesh and bone and blood body which Jesus had did not stand out in the crowd (He had no form or comeliness that we should look at him, and no beauty that we should desire him).  The flesh and bone and blood body of Jesus suffered pain, as anyone elses did (As is seen in the crucifixion).  The only thing that was different, than all of the others, with Jesus, is that no sin was found in him (Revelations: Weep not).  So in the flesh he was the son of man.  However, the Spirit which was in him was from above and before that time.  That is why he said – “Where I am going, you cannot come.  You are from below, I am from above, you are of this world, I am not of this world”. That was the Spirit speaking through the flesh of man. The flesh of man (Jesus) did not pre-exist, but the Spirit that was in him did.  

My two cents worth.

[Frank4YAHWEH]

To ALL,

It is most definitely written that Yahshua EXISTED in the form of Yahweh. When this was written, it was well after Yahshua had EXISTED HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”). This passage as follows is not speaking of Yahshua pre-existing in Heaven with his and our Father Yahweh as an actual being, but is speaking of his existing HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”) in the form or image of his and our Father Yahweh just as you and I can also exist in the form or image of our Father Yahweh in doing His will. We are to do this in emptying ourselves of false pride and becoming humble servants of Father Yahweh and not being boastful because we are doing His will. This is because it is not of ourselves that we perform righteous works, but it is Father Yahweh that does the works through us in performing His righteous works.

Have this attitude in yourselves which was also in Messiah Yahshua, who, although he existed in the form of Yahweh, did not regard equality with Yahweh a thing to be seized upon, but made himself nothing, taking the form of a servant, being born in the likeness of men (Philippians 2:5-7).

Note that Yahshua told his disciples that anyone who believed and had faith in him would be doing what he had been doing and that they would be doing greater things than what he had been doing:

I tell you the truth, anyone who has belief and faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father (Yahchanan [John] 14:12).

The works that Yahshua had done was Father Yahweh doing His works through him. Yahshua was not boastful or proud in that he was the cause of the works that he had done. He humbled himself as a servant of his and our Father Yahweh. This is what Shaul was instructing at the beginning of Philippians chapter 2, that we humble ourselves as Yahshua had also humbled himself.

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (shimmer @ Feb. 15 2012,12:41)

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 15 2012,13:53) Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 15 2012,10:53) Hi T8, Jesus Christ is one with God's Spirit. He is the same yesterday today and forever. But Jesus was conceived in Mary Nick. He existed in the form of God before being conceived as a man. It is written. The man from heaven. Jesus' flesh and bone and blood was no different than any other mans.  The flesh and bone and blood body which Jesus had did not stand out in the crowd (He had no form or comeliness that we should look at him, and no beauty that we should desire him).  The flesh and bone and blood body of Jesus suffered pain, as anyone elses did (As is seen in the crucifixion).  The only thing that was different, than all of the others, with Jesus, is that no sin was found in him (Revelations: Weep not).  So in the flesh he was the son of man.  However, the Spirit which was in him was from above and before that time.  That is why he said – “Where I am going, you cannot come.  You are from below, I am from above, you are of this world, I am not of this world”.  That was the Spirit speaking through the flesh of man.  The flesh of man (Jesus) did not pre-exist, but the Spirit that was in him did.   My two cents worth.

shimmer,

Yes, and that spirit that was in Yahshua was the spirit of Father Yahweh. Yahshua did not pre-exist his birth as an actual spirit being in the beginning with his and our Father Yahweh.

[Proclaimer]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Feb. 15 2012,12:52)

It is most definitely written that Yahshua EXISTED in the form of Yahweh. When this was written, it was well after Yahshua had EXISTED HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”). This passage as follows is not speaking of Yahshua pre-existing in Heaven with his and our Father Yahweh as an actual being, but is speaking of his existing HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”) in the form or image of his and our Father Yahweh just as you and I can also exist in the form or image of our Father Yahweh in doing His will.

Frank, your view is flawed.

Why?

1) He EXISTED in the FORM of God. Yet it is you that say that he was born a man and always a man. When you hear the word human form, you think what? A body of flesh? What about God's form?

2) He emptied himself and came in the flesh. He emptied himself of his image of the Father? On the contrary, he is the image of the invisible God now. He is not any less than that.

3) He came in the flesh. Who came in the flesh? Ask yourself that. It was Jesus who came in the flesh. Subtly you will deny this and say something contrary like he is the flesh. Subtle tinkering with that has serious consequences because it identifies to us of what spirit you are of if you deny that he came in the flesh.

The whole text is as simple as it is written.

Existed in the form of God > Emptied himself > Came in the flesh > Died for our sins > Is with the Father in the glory that he had with him before the world began.

Simple. Do not let lies creep in here and there Frank.
It is your life, so I can only advise at most.

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Feb. 15 2012,11:25)

Because the children were flesh, Jesus also had to empty himself and become made in the likeness of flesh.  But this was long after the universe was created by his God through him. Nick, you apparently don't understand the mind of Christ we are told to have in us.  The whole point of Phil 2 is to emphasize how Jesus was in the most cushy position in existence, next to the Creator of all things; but he didn't hesitate to give that position up and make himself nothing to do his part in saving mankind. The teaching is that we should be willing to sacrifice the niceties of our lives to help others in need.  And not one of us will ever give up as much as Jesus did.   And thankfully, God is just and righteous, and not only brought Jesus back to his original position, but gave him a raise.

Mike,

What was is the “much” that you believe Yahshua gave up that no one else would give up?

[Ed J]

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 15 2012,10:45)

To those who say that Jesus existed in no other form before being a man, I need to remind you that it is written that he EXISTED in the form of God. Think about what the word EXISTED means. And if you do not agree with that scripture, then you also cannot agree that Jesus said, “Before Abraham, I am”. What does I am mean? Look it up.

Hi T8,

Do not some here in fact change that to mean he instead EXISTED in the form of 'an Angel'?.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[david]

Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 15 2012,13:35)

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 15 2012,10:45) To those who say that Jesus existed in no other form before being a man, I need to remind you that it is written that he EXISTED in the form of God. Think about what the word EXISTED means. And if you do not agree with that scripture, then you also cannot agree that Jesus said, “Before Abraham, I am”. What does I am mean? Look it up. Hi T8, Do not some here in fact change that to mean he instead EXISTED in the form of 'an Angel'?. God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Are not angels called “gods' in the Bible?

He existed in God's form, but emptied himself of that and became flesh.

Angels aren't flesh. Neither is God.

I don't know why we always have to see the word “form” as meaning the exact and precise nature and being.

God's form could just mean the non fleshly human form: spirit being, such as God or angels.

The point being made was that he gave that up and became something else: FLESH.

Neither angel nor God are flesh.

[Ed J]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Feb. 15 2012,08:03)

Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 14 2012,16:13) Hi Frank, It is YOU who incorrectly adds a “W” to Gods name, YHVH! God bless Ed J Ed J, No, I did not incorrectly add a “W” to our Heavenly Father and Creator's Name.

Hi Frank,

Since the Hebrew language has no “W” sound.
You HAVE added a “W” to God's name, YHVH!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Feb. 15 2012,08:03)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Feb. 14 2012,12:16) Quote “shall not thy teachers (Frank) be removed into a corner any more, but thine eyes shall see thy teachers: And thine ears shall hear a word behind thee, saying, This is the way, walk ye in it” (Isaiah 30:20-21) Now, go back to your corner where you rightfully belong wearing your pointed dunce cap atop of your head.

Hi Frank,

That verse AND your post seem to be saying two different things?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[NickHassan]

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 15 2012,13:09)

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Feb. 15 2012,12:52) It is most definitely written that Yahshua EXISTED in the form of Yahweh. When this was written, it was well after Yahshua had EXISTED HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”). This passage as follows is not speaking of Yahshua pre-existing in Heaven with his and our Father Yahweh as an actual being, but is speaking of his existing HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”) in the form or image of his and our Father Yahweh just as you and I can also exist in the form or image of our Father Yahweh in doing His will. Frank, your view is flawed. Why? 1) He EXISTED in the FORM of God. Yet it is you that say that he was born a man and always a man. When you hear the word human form, you think what? A body of flesh? What about God's form? 2) He emptied himself and came in the flesh. He emptied himself of his image of the Father? On the contrary, he is the image of the invisible God now. He is not any less than that. 3) He came in the flesh. Who came in the flesh? Ask yourself that. It was Jesus who came in the flesh. Subtly you will deny this and say something contrary like he is the flesh. Subtle tinkering with that has serious consequences because it identifies to us of what spirit you are of if you deny that he came in the flesh. The whole text is as simple as it is written. Existed in the form of God > Emptied himself > Came in the flesh > Died for our sins > Is with the Father in the glory that he had with him before the world began. Simple. Do not let lies creep in here and there Frank. It is your life, so I can only advise at most.

Hi T8,
Jesus CHRIST has come in the flesh.

[Ed J]

Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Feb. 15 2012,12:52)

To ALL, It is most definitely written that Yahshua EXISTED in the form of Yahweh. When this was written, it was well after Yahshua had EXISTED HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”). This passage as follows is not speaking of Yahshua pre-existing in Heaven with his and our Father Yahweh as an actual being, but is speaking of his existing HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”) in the form or image of his and our Father Yahweh just as you and I can also exist in the form or image of our Father Yahweh in doing His will. We are to do this in emptying ourselves of false pride and becoming humble servants of Father Yahweh and not being boastful because we are doing His will. This is because it is not of ourselves that we perform righteous works, but it is Father Yahweh that does the works through us in performing His righteous works. … The works that Yahshua had done was Father Yahweh doing His works through him. Yahshua was not boastful or proud in that he was the cause of the works that he had done. He humbled himself as a servant of his and our Father Yahweh. This is what Shaul was instructing at the beginning of Philippians chapter 2, that we humble ourselves as Yahshua had also humbled himself.

Hi Frank,

I not sure about the others here, but THIS
is the kind of dialog that interests me.
I hope we can see much more.

Your brother
in Christ, Jesus.
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (david @ Feb. 15 2012,13:41)

Are not angels called “gods' in the Bible?

Hi David,

Are you calling “us” Angels? (Jude 1:6-13)
(and yes, I know Jude only has one chapter)

(Psalms 82:1…6) “God standeth in the congregation of the mighty; he judgeth among the gods.
6 I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.”

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 15 2012,14:03)

Quote (t8 @ Feb. 15 2012,13:09) Quote (Frank4YAHWEH @ Feb. 15 2012,12:52) It is most definitely written that Yahshua EXISTED in the form of Yahweh. When this was written, it was well after Yahshua had EXISTED HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”). This passage as follows is not speaking of Yahshua pre-existing in Heaven with his and our Father Yahweh as an actual being, but is speaking of his existing HERE ON EARTH (or “IN THE WORLD”) in the form or image of his and our Father Yahweh just as you and I can also exist in the form or image of our Father Yahweh in doing His will. Frank, your view is flawed. Why? 1) He EXISTED in the FORM of God. Yet it is you that say that he was born a man and always a man. When you hear the word human form, you think what? A body of flesh? What about God's form? 2) He emptied himself and came in the flesh. He emptied himself of his image of the Father? On the contrary, he is the image of the invisible God now. He is not any less than that. 3) He came in the flesh. Who came in the flesh? Ask yourself that. It was Jesus who came in the flesh. Subtly you will deny this and say something contrary like he is the flesh. Subtle tinkering with that has serious consequences because it identifies to us of what spirit you are of if you deny that he came in the flesh. The whole text is as simple as it is written. Existed in the form of God > Emptied himself > Came in the flesh > Died for our sins > Is with the Father in the glory that he had with him before the world began. Simple. Do not let lies creep in here and there Frank. It is your life, so I can only advise at most. Hi T8, Jesus CHRIST has come in the flesh.

Nick,

Yes, this is what I believe and confess as Scripture asks me to. I certainly do not know where t8 got the idea that I believe or said that I deny this or that Yahshua emptied himself of the image of his and our Father Yahweh. I believe he and Mike are trying to mislead others who read their post in what it is that I truly believe. I believe that they are the ones who believe that he emptied himself of the image of “God”, right? Maybe they have more than one “God” that they worship? I most certainly can not figure out their foolish logic lies. Their avatars alone give me the creeps!

[NickHassan]

Hi Frank,
No they are honestly doing their best to guide people.

[Frank4YAHWEH]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 16 2012,06:10)

Hi Frank, No they are honestly doing their best to guide people.

Nick,

Guide them to what?

[NickHassan]

Hi F,
We are all at different stages.
Patience

[Pastry]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 16 2012,06:35)

Hi F, We are all at different stages. Patience

Hi Nick!  With that statement I do agree…..
To  say such foolishness, is not of God….You and I have known t8 and Mike longer then Frank has…. They are very honest people….
And I agree with their understanding that Jesus who was The Word of God, before He came to earth…. I often asked persons like that who is it then in

Rev 19:13   And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.  

Rev 19:14   And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.  

Rev 19:15   And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.  

Rev 19:16   And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.  

My believe is that this is who became Jesus, and your???

Peace and Love Irene

[NickHassan]

Hi Irene,
Yes Jesus became one with the Spirit and is the Word of God.

[Ed J]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 16 2012,06:10)

Hi Frank, No they are honestly doing their best to guide people.

Agreed!

[terraricca]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 16 2012,14:36)

Hi Irene, Yes Jesus became one with the Spirit and is the Word of God.

nick

becoming one with some thing what does it mean in you language

is it ;like ??

wen you mixed water and juice ?
or, cherry brandy and tomato juice ??
or ,you mixed a group of people ??
or ,or like a multy cultural nation mixes
or, what Nick ?

[Author]

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