Preexistence

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 11 2010,19:28)

Terricca……….Your problem is you have NO Idea HOW anyone here walks with GOD , Again Just you personal OPINIONS without ANY Knowledge . You use your own IDEA of who is in right standing with GOD and who is NOT and YOU ASSUME EVERYONE WHO DISAGREE WITH YOU ARE NOT OF GOD. And you base that judgment on what YOUR screwed up views of what you believe Scripture Says. You go about accusing people of being lairs or of Satan and other things. Never realizing You yours self are acting as the accuser of the Brethern. Exactly as Satan Himself is. You would be better of doing what JA and me and others have said (THINK BEFORE YOU SPEAK). IMO

peace and love………………………………….gene

gene

you know the saying ;every man is a fool; so do not open your mouth and prove it by what you say.

Pierre

November 11, 2010 at 5:29 am#224088

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 11 2010,21:55)

peace and love to you and yours…………………………….gene

gene

yea this is you typical in your behavior.

make the question that suppose to be from others ,and then answer is own stupid question ,and try to make others beleive that you are right,

you really must think we are blind

Pierre

November 11, 2010 at 6:12 am#224095

Participant

Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 11 2010,15:29)

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 11 2010,21:55)

peace and love to you and yours…………………………….gene

gene

yea this is you typical in your behavior.

make the question that suppose to be from others ,and then answer is own stupid question ,and try to make others beleive that you are right,

you really must think we are blind

Pierre

Hi Pierre, No I don't think He thinks that we are blind, but rather that we know that He is blind. He has denied plain Scriptures that Mike, You and I have put in front of Him and just ignores them….That is blind…and He always says that we are brainwashed by our former Church we belonged to….how ridiculous that is. It has nothing to do with it…
Peace Irene

November 11, 2010 at 6:38 am#224099

Participant

Quote (Baker @ Nov. 11 2010,23:12)

Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 11 2010,15:29)

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 11 2010,21:55)

peace and love to you and yours…………………………….gene

gene

yea this is you typical in your behavior.

make the question that suppose to be from others ,and then answer is own stupid question ,and try to make others beleive that you are right,

you really must think we are blind

Pierre

hi Irene

yea what can you do??

this is what scriptures say;1Ti 1:18 Timothy, my son, I give you this instruction in keeping with the prophecies once made about you, so that by following them you may fight the good fight,
1Ti 1:19 holding on to faith and a good conscience. Some have rejected these and so have shipwrecked their faith.
1Ti 1:20 Among them are Hymenaeus and Alexander, whom I have handed over to Satan to be taught not to blaspheme

1Ti 4:1 The Spirit clearly says that in later times some will abandon the faith and follow deceiving spirits and things taught by demons.
1Ti 4:2 Such teachings come through hypocritical liars, whose consciences have been seared as with a hot iron.
1Ti 4:3 They forbid people to marry and order them to abstain from certain foods, which God created to be received with thanksgiving by those who believe and who know the truth.

1Ti 6:3 If anyone teaches false doctrines and does not agree to the sound instruction of our Lord Jesus Christ and to godly teaching,
1Ti 6:4 he is conceited and understands nothing. He has an unhealthy interest in controversies and quarrels about words that result in envy, strife, malicious talk, evil suspicions
1Ti 6:5 and constant friction between men of corrupt mind, who have been robbed of the truth

2Ti 2:23 Don’t have anything to do with foolish and stupid arguments, because you know they produce quarrels.
2Ti 2:24 And the Lord’s servant must not quarrel; instead, he must be kind to everyone, able to teach, not resentful.
2Ti 2:25 Those who oppose him he must gently instruct, in the hope that God will grant them repentance leading them to a knowledge of the truth,
2Ti 2:26 and that they will come to their senses and escape from the trap of the devil, who has taken them captive to do his will.

2Ti 3:13 while evil men and impostors will go from bad to worse, deceiving and being deceived.
2Ti 3:14 But as for you, continue in what you have learned and have become convinced of, because you know those from whom you learned it,

verse 3;14 is good advise what you think?

Pierre

November 11, 2010 at 3:06 pm#224144

Participant

Pierre………….> I know where you and Irene learned it from and it was not Jesus or GOD , But from the Trinitarians who learned it from the Gnostic's you both have bought into their false teaching of the preexistence of Jesus as some Kind of God or demigod or super angel. You both act like you have the truth but deny all kinds of scriptures that show plainly you both are worn, But i noticed neither of you two have any problem attacking People and accusing there Character, by both are Hypocrites at best , Out of one side of your mouths you act Godly and out of the Other are accusers of the Brethern. You both have great problems with YOU EGO and PRIDE.

Now you want to call your SATAN , which neither of you even remotely understand on Me, by using scriptures Paul was wrote about some one else trying to make me a comparison to that. Good So be Unto YOURSELVES May you be turned over to your Satan and lets see what will happen Now, Rather I or you will pay the Price of your own MOUTHS> Remember you called it on yourselves not ME.

gene

November 11, 2010 at 3:39 pm#224148

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,01:06)

gene

Gene, we did not get our believes from the Catholic Church or any other Church. We have learned this from God out of the Bible…
It is always the same answer you give. Change your attitude and maybe God will let you see what we do…You are also judging us, which I do not do….and I don't do it to you, so why do you think it necessary to do so…?? Listen up and open your mind, and ask God to see. I learned all things from Georg who has studied the Bible for four hours in a row, since He retired…Show me one post that I have attacked a member here?? I might respond to someone who has attacked me, but from myself I will not do that…..that is a lie…..What about Satan? I have no idea what you are talking about. I know that you don't believe in Satan being real, but that too you seem to ignore those Scriptures that prove he is…Also I don;t consider it an attack when I explain what you do, like right now…
As far as our Ego, it takes one to know one…I say….All I have been doing is to show you Scriptures that plainly teaches, and all you do is ignore it…

And Gene I will expect an apology if you cannot produce a post where I attack someone….like you just did….saying that you are blind is mild to compare what you do….And I would not have to say that if you just open your eyes and see what Scriptures say and not to ignore them…..

.By Jesus own words He said

Jhn 6:37 All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out.

Jhn 6:38 For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me.

Jhn 6:39 And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day.

and

Jhn 1:1 ¶ In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

Jhn 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.

Jhn 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

Jhn 1:4 In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

Jhn 1:5 And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not.

Jhn 1:6 ¶ There was a man sent from God, whose name [was] John.

Jhn 1:7 The same came for a witness, to bear witness of the Light, that all [men] through him might believe.

Jhn 1:8 He was not that Light, but [was sent] to bear witness of that Light.

Jhn 1:9 [That] was the true Light, which lighteth every man that cometh into the world.

Jhn 1:10 He was in the world, and the world was made by him, and the world knew him not.

Jhn 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

Jhn 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, [even] to them that believe on his name:

Jhn 1:13 Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

Jhn 1:14 ¶ And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.
I think verse 14 explains it that it is who became Jesus.

Jesus will also came back as this

Rev 19:13 And he [was] clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

Rev 19:14 And the armies [which were] in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

Rev 19:16 And he hath on [his] vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.

I think I asked you once before and I don't remember if you ever answered me……I know it is Jesus who will come back ad King of Kings and Lord of Lords….There is no other being that fits this description, is there???

I also do not believe that Jesus was an Angel, that is also false….

These are only some Scriptures that prove that Jesus preexisted. There are over 30 of them in the debate tread…

Peace Irene

November 11, 2010 at 4:45 pm#224149

Participant

Irene…………Don't play the innocent person here you and Tericca have both attacked and ran people off from this Site Just to name one Martian how you accused of all kind of things as well a your Partner in crime Terricca. You now say Jesus was not and angel them pray tell what was He before he Preexisted on earth?

gene

November 11, 2010 at 9:26 pm#224166

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,08:06)

gene

you are the prove that Satan is real,you have most of his characteristics,you cheat in your quotes by not answering wen you should,
you lie wen scriptures are presented,
you twist sciptures so to make them closer to you way of thinking.

and run away from truth,
slander others so that you can be elevated,

those are but just a few.

Pierre

November 11, 2010 at 10:54 pm#224179

Participant

terricca…………You have no idea what you are saying , every time you open up your mouth you just stick you foot in it, Many here have noticed that not just me, and committed on it. Like other have said some others said you should (THINK) Before you open up your adversarial (SATAN) mouth. You can not produce ONE scripture i lied about nor miss quoted ,if so then produce them other wise control your split tung . From the very time you entered this sit you have been nothing but a trouble maker accusing people of all kind of thing and not just me .No one cam dialog with you except those who see just as your do, your are so convinced you are right about every thing you don't realize you are blind , as a bat and poor in Spirit understanding. If anyone Here fit the description of a Satan or (adversary) it is most definitely YOU. IMO

gene

November 11, 2010 at 11:12 pm#224181

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,02:45)

gene

Gene, i did not have any tiles, and still don't. If I would do what you accuse me of, I would have a tile. Martian on the other hand did, five to be exact….So did Ken(Kenrch). You have accuse me of taken my understand of the Scriptures and say that they come out of the Church that we belonged to, which is a lie….Since that is all you are doing, I will, do what I did to Martian and ken. I stopped posting. Martian then attacked Mike….Calling Him something like Monkey teacher etc. That is how He then got tiles and had to leave, which he said he wanted to…..So I say to you good ridden and good bye for the last time….You can post all you want I will not respond to it….Irene

November 12, 2010 at 12:05 am#224198

Participant

Quote (Baker @ Nov. 12 2010,09:12)

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,02:45)

gene

Ok Gene! look at the tread of Martians Show me your fruits….On page 14 and 15 are the posts that I was talking about. He was very nasty..Martian ran Himself off and not i or Pierre did none like that……Irene

November 12, 2010 at 12:08 am#224200

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,15:54)

gene

read this but i know you would not;
my answer was ;that since Christ is the firstborn of all creation this would mean;; God to Christ and trough (not from )the rest of all creation;
so since God created Christ first how was he made ? i do not know,what is his real nature be side being of spirit i do not know,

but what we know ;is that he is the only one created or made or begotten ect,from God, now this alone would put Christ in a position above all others because he is first,elder,first born,first choice to pick,ect
so is glory would be to be the son of God,this is a honor received by birth.
the glory he received later is earned this is the big difference.and so became superior to all exept God who as given this superiority.

if you want some scriptures about it go to preexistence data “

there about 40 scriptures there.and you are welcome to comment on them.

Pierre

who matian is back 1+1+1=1

November 12, 2010 at 12:25 am#224207

Participant

Irene……….Thank you for saying you will not post back to me any more, i really do not like your attitude toward me or Martian and others who have disagreed with you in the past. You have slandered many her Jodi, Laurel, Martian, and others , when scriptures are posed to you as in the case of the Lucifer thing where scripture shows He was a Man and the message was to the King of Babylon Not to some elusive being who you believe is Satan. You simply just ignore this truth without even addressing it, as well as the wisdom thing who you say is Jesus and it is described as a SHE, and Jesus is a HE.

What i meant by out of the Church you belonged to was the Catholic Church , teaches THE PREEXISTENCE DOCTRINES AND STILL DOES, They believe Jesus was GOD and Created every thing, you believe Jesus was and demigod or a angle morphed into a human being and it was he who created everything too as they do. That was what i was referring to and that is NO LIE, and that applies to Mike , Terricca, and WJ, JA and many other preexistences here also. The doctrines of Preexistences originated from the Gnostic's and later became the main tenet if the Catholic and Protestant Churches and still is. IMO

November 12, 2010 at 12:40 am#224212

Participant

To all! The Catholic Church does not teach the preexisting of Jesus. We belonged to the Catholic Church all of our lives until Georg was 47 and I was 46. It has nothing to do with the trinity which the Catholics do teach….Also it was Martian and Ken who have abused Mike in the Show me your fruit, of Truth or Tradition on page 14and 15. it is simple a lie….. Liars are not Christians. And those that believe in the preexisting of Jesus are not Anti-Christ either…that too is a lie….To say such lie's is uncalled for by a Christian. The Bible has more then over 30 Scriptures that teach us, who have an open mind to see, that Jesus did preexist…To deny those Scriptures is not what a Christian should do….I also would like to know where Gene got that wrong information about the Catholic Church… Show me the prove….I have shown many Scriptures and so has Mike and Pierre and JA. Yet all that Gene is doing lately is accusing us of wrong doing….That kind of behavior should never be aloud in a Christian Forum….. Irene

November 12, 2010 at 1:03 am#224220

Participant

To All………All Catholics and Protestants believe Jesus was GOD the Creator of all thing and they all believe Jesus Preexisted His Berth on Earth as that GOD, and the LIE is To DENY that they do not believe Jesus preexisted. They believe John 1:1 is saying Jesus was with GOD and WAS a GOD, (IN THE BEGINNING) That is one of there preexistence scriptures , to say differently is simple a LIE. Common sens would tell anyone if they believed Jesus was GOD (IN the Beginning ) he would Have to have (PREEXISTED) this is one of their main teachings. It is amazing how people can twist things around . I believe it is wrong to try to accuse other here and twist what they are saying to push there own dogmas down others throats, We all can believe any way we want to and No one here has any right to personally attack there Character as i have seen Irene and Terricca both do here on several occasions. And as far as the bible have some many (SO-CALLED ) scripture that teach preexistence that simple is a false statement. Many do not see those as supporting a preexisting position at all. IMO

Peace and love to you all………………………….gene

November 12, 2010 at 1:17 am#224221

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,18:03)

Peace and love to you all………………………….gene

gene

do you understand what you are writing in your comment??

i beleive you are the only catholic and protestant,and non religious person on this site.

boy you go to a long stretch to have your lies spread,
the truth is not in you,that why you do not make any sense in truth.

Pierre

November 12, 2010 at 1:33 am#224227

Participant

Terrica…………… I understand perfectly what i am writing , it is you who don't understand not me. If there is error in that post then Show it , you mouthing off about Me is all you seem to be able to DO , Post the error not just mouth off and attack me personally. Now you deny the Catholic and Protestants Don't believe Jesus preexisted as some Kind of Being as GOD. Which is a direct Lie as you well know And by the way i never was a Catholic at all an was not a Protestant either, They believe in preexistence as you do in fact. so calling me one is baseless and is another of your LIES and Character assignation you are so good at here.

gene

November 12, 2010 at 1:48 am#224229

Participant

Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Nov. 12 2010,18:33)

gene

look at your comment this is your doing ,
because your refusal to go to scriptures and only puke out your lies.

if preexisting of Christ would be unscriptural you would be the first one to show scriptures for support,

but you do not do that,in this you are preaching your garbage of lies,

so this is the last chance i give you to produce your scriptures to show your views ?

after that keep silence about it.

Pierre

November 12, 2010 at 2:02 am#224231