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I remember what seemed to me to be a very helpful discussion on omnipresence in Systematic Theology class… maybe what I learned will be helpful… but then again, maybe not… but in hopes in might….
we were told that when thinking of omnipresence its probably better not think of God has being some kind of cosmic peanut butter spread out through all of material creation, which is what Pantheism seems to believe, but rather to instead think that when the bible speaks of God's being everywhere, that there is nowhere one could go to flee from His presence, etc… that all of creation is ever present before God. Just a lightly different angle to look at the issue, but helpful I think…
blessings,
kenHi E,
So since there are no scriptures that call God omnipresent and this is a theological term we can only dialogue in the words of theoretical and weak human wisdom and not the wisdom of God.[lk11]Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 15 2009,08:53) Hi E,
So since there are no scriptures that call God omnipresent and this is a theological term we can only dialogue in the words of theoretical and weak human wisdom and not the wisdom of God.[lk11]
N, I did not see one single scripture in your post, why are you spreading these lies? You even used nonbiblical words to describe your views, and since the word “theological” does not appear in the Scriptures I have to take what you are as saying as being false.Or could it be that just because a word is nonbiblical that it is NOT THEREFORE NECESSARILY unbiblical….? Inquiring minds want to know. At any rate, as long as you use nonbiblical words to describe your beliefs N, and in general everyday conversation, you can hardly fault others for doing the same, unless of course you want to be hypocritical….? You don't want that do you?
blessings,
kenNick Hassan wrote:
Quote So since there are no scriptures that call God omnipresent and this is a theological term we can only dialogue in the words of theoretical and weak human wisdom and not the wisdom of God.[lk11]
I will start with a warning from scripture since you seemed to get wrapped up in the letter without considering the purpose of scripture. That is the same thing Jesus often rebuked the Pharisees for as Jesus was known to break the letter of scripture in order to keep the purpose of scripture.
2 Corinthians 3:6(NIV) reads:
Quote He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
Here are scriptures that testify to God presence everywhere.
Psalms 139:7-8(NIV) reads:
Quote Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.and
Acts 17:27-28(NIV) reads:
Quote God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 'For in him we live and move and have our being.' As some of your own poets have said, 'We are his offspring.'
If mankind has their being in Him, which we do if scripture is correct, then no one has their being outside Him. I assure you that you will not escape the presence of God.
Kerwin…….you have hit on the key, that might help us all come to a better understanding of How GOD is always present. remember it says when we die the Spirit goes back to him who gave it, so the spirit may be the key to God presents in all life, Now if we understand that Spirit is intellect or thought expressed through words, then all thought is from GOD and it is the spark that enlightens or gives life to us all, but seeing there is (NO) new thoughts, but only part of what has always exists , God could easily be Present through the spirit in us. You see He is connect to us through our thoughts. IMO
love and peace to you and yours………………………….gene
E…..> would like you commits on what i posted to Kerwin brother.
love and peace to you and yours…………………………….gene
Quote (Gene @ April 18 2009,15:18) E…..> would like you commits on what i posted to Kerwin brother. love and peace to you and yours…………………………….gene
I am not sure where that post is Gene….. give me a link and I will check out it out….blessings,
kenQuote (Gene @ April 18 2009,15:17) Kerwin…….you have hit on the key, that might help us all come to a better understanding of How GOD is always present. remember it says when we die the Spirit goes back to him who gave it, so the spirit may be the key to God presents in all life, Now if we understand that Spirit is intellect or thought expressed through words, then all thought is from GOD and it is the spark that enlightens or gives life to us all, but seeing there is (NO) new thoughts, but only part of what has always exists , God could easily be Present through the spirit in us. You see He is connect to us through our thoughts. IMO love and peace to you and yours………………………….gene
G,
Why not go back to relying on scripture if you need to find truth?God is in heaven but present among His creation by His Spirit.[Ps139]
The Spirit of God does not ever leave the sons of God,[Acts, Heb] only the human spirit at death[Ecc12, Mt27]
Quote (Gene @ April 18 2009,15:17) Kerwin…….you have hit on the key, that might help us all come to a better understanding of How GOD is always present. remember it says when we die the Spirit goes back to him who gave it, so the spirit may be the key to God presents in all life, Now if we understand that Spirit is intellect or thought expressed through words, then all thought is from GOD and it is the spark that enlightens or gives life to us all, but seeing there is (NO) new thoughts, but only part of what has always exists , God could easily be Present through the spirit in us. You see He is connect to us through our thoughts. IMO love and peace to you and yours………………………….gene
E…….this is the post i would like you to commit on brother.peace and love to you and yours……………………..gene
Quote (kerwin @ April 18 2009,08:32) Nick Hassan wrote: Quote So since there are no scriptures that call God omnipresent and this is a theological term we can only dialogue in the words of theoretical and weak human wisdom and not the wisdom of God.[lk11]
I will start with a warning from scripture since you seemed to get wrapped up in the letter without considering the purpose of scripture. That is the same thing Jesus often rebuked the Pharisees for as Jesus was known to break the letter of scripture in order to keep the purpose of scripture.
2 Corinthians 3:6(NIV) reads:
Quote He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.
Here are scriptures that testify to God presence everywhere.
Psalms 139:7-8(NIV) reads:
Quote Where can I go from your Spirit?
Where can I flee from your presence?
If I go up to the heavens, you are there;
if I make my bed in the depths, you are there.and
Acts 17:27-28(NIV) reads:
Quote God did this so that men would seek him and perhaps reach out for him and find him, though he is not far from each one of us. 'For in him we live and move and have our being.' As some of your own poets have said, 'We are his offspring.'
If mankind has their being in Him, which we do if scripture is correct, then no one has their being outside Him. I assure you that you will not escape the presence of God.
This is the post for brother E.Hi GM,
No life exists except that which is given of God.
But eternal life is from the Spirit of God and not of the spirit of man.
The breath of God is expressed from God into the soil of earth and lent to us before returning to Him.No man or animal or insect or tree naturally has the Spirit of God.
Nick……….if the Spirit (intellect) is lent to us then it is GOD'S. SO GOD is in all life right? In fact GOD is the life in a person, without his presents we would all die, because He is life. IMO
love and peace…………………………….gene
G,
Is logic all we need to find truth?
“God is the life in a person” is a new and false doctrine.
God gave us of his breath to live but His own eternal life is only accessible through His Son.Nick…..what do you make of this, JOB 34:14-15..> If he set his heart upon man, if he gather unto himself his Spirit and his breath ; All flesh shall perish together, and man shall turn again unto dust.
Is that clear enough for you brother?
peace and love……………………………..gene
G,
Jb34
12Yea, surely God will not do wickedly, neither will the Almighty pervert judgment.13Who hath given him a charge over the earth? or who hath disposed the whole world?
14If he set his heart upon man, if he gather unto himself his spirit and his breath;
15All flesh shall perish together, and man shall turn again unto dust.
If man already had the Spirit of God then Jesus did not need to come to teach about rebirth from above as all men already had eternal life.
God gave men a spirit that returns to Him
Nick………..Men have the Spirit(intellect) from GOD in them, what do you think goes back to Him who gave it. Is it not the spirit in man?' What men have added to the existing Spirit (Intellect) is the ability to recognize the truth, Better Known as the Spirit of truth, or comforter that's what is added to man, it is the ability to recognize truth which convicts us of the truth and guides us to accept truth, This was not in man before God gave it to us, it completely changes our prescriptions and realities. God is regenerating Man through His spirit of truth , Better known as (HOLY) SPIRIT> IMO
love and peace…………………………………gene
G,
No you must be reborn from above.
You have not learned much if you think natural men already have the Spirit of God.Check the fruit.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 22 2009,10:19) G,
No you must be reborn from above.
You have not learned much if you think natural men already have the Spirit of God.Check the fruit.
So are you saying that a person must be preexistent?
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