Mistakes and sins

Participant

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ July 06 2010,03:02)

Quote (Tim Kraft @ July 05 2010,14:27)

SF: IMO sins have to do with ones relationship with God. Sin is an error or mistake of ones mind that could make him believe that he is separated, for any reason, from God. Sin is a mental mistake. Mans relationship with God is mental. Mans earthly trek is completely controled by man. Only through prayer or asking God for help can God move for the benefit of man. Man rules the earth. God gave it to him. Mistakes here on earth have nothing to do with ones relationship with God! This is an extremely important thread. Bless you, TK

Tk,
Sin is more than a mental state,
first of all its in our nature to sin,
not about the mind in the end, its about the intentions of your heart.
sin is the by product of hate,
incorrect, man does not rule the earth, that was given up to the devil when man fell.
Jesus gave us our rights back to rule the earth per say.
I think your scratching the surface of sin,

i see you post alot about the mind and choices, there is more depth than that. God HATES sin, study Gods reaction to such a thing, its more than just thuoghts and actions.

Mistakes can cost you your life fyi.

Mistakes can cause other to fall, can cause others to die.
lets say one made a mistake by using raw meat in a fast food restuarnt, a costumer ate it and died,

sin or mistake?

SF: I want so bad to get my point across about sin yet I am doing so poorly. Please allow me another attempt!

As students of the Bible we must separate the teachings from a lesson on how to live on earth in physicality from spirit teachings of Jesus that were always pertaining to mans relationship to God.

The nt scriptures are teaching us how to return to God. They were lost in sin. Jesus came to teach the truth about the way to God/where God is. The religious order of the old test. had failed and were lost in darkness and sin.

Actually darkness and sin are the same. Not knowing the truth about your union with God means your mind is disconnected to the truth by either sin or darkness or being un-aware, or thinking incorrectly that you and God were ever separated for any reason!

God is spirit, light, truth, and he is everywhere! God is pheuma, air, life, and goodness. God is thought, words, and beliefs through awarness. Total relationship in thd MIND!

As a human finds Jesus, the truth of God, in his thinking/mind, through awareness and acceptance he is in union with God.

This is being born again. A menal recreation of the sinful human mind. As a man searches the words of God through Jesus he either agrees with them and believes them thereby becoming one with them or he dis-believes some or all of the words and becomes lukewarm in God.

Lukewarm is chaotic and scatterbrained. A reed blowing to and fro in the wind. God said lukewarm he would spit out!

If mankind accepts the purified words of God, offered through Jesus, of pure love, cleanliness, perfection, forgiveness for wrong thinking,and basic salvation, to whatever degree one recieves in his mind/awareness, to that degree he is being re- created of God.

Sin is being unable to accept the perfection freely given by God through Jesus. Sin is a mistake. Sin is an error of thinking that you are being graded by what you do on the earth. Sin is thinking that what you do or don't do on earth dictates

your relationship with God. Sin is believing in works. Sin is sinful thinking or thinking one is still in sin. Sin is refusing to

believe that you have no sin. Since God has cleansed us it is sin to deny that truth. Sin is not believing the truth that you have no more sin.

Sin is rejecting the truth of Jesus. Sin is thinking that purification unto God is based on ones good works or bad works.

Sin is rejecting salvation by faith! Sin says you must still do something for perfection. That is a lie. Jesus did it all. Jesus paid the price. The work for perfection is done by Christ.

Its time to believe to recieve. Believing connects us with God.
Awareness that God never left us, ever. He has always been within his creation. The creation covered his awarness of that truth by accepting lies.

Thinking that works have anything to do with ones perfection unto God is straight out denial of Jesus and the truth.

IMO the work of today is to believe the truth of Jesus. He did the work for us and gave us rest in him. God Bless, TK

July 6, 2010 at 11:35 am#201960

Ed J

Participant

Quote (Tim Kraft @ July 06 2010,20:22)

Ed J: Salvation and oneness to God through Jesus is for “whosoever will believe the truth”. What you attempt to name God makes no difference. Doing works of God in the “name” of Jesus is doing works is the same authority that Jesus had. A more descriptive name for God would be “the most high God” if you are concerned in a name or description. IMO, TK

Hi Tim,

I only attempt to deliver “Bible Truth” to you.
“The Bible” tells us what God's Name is!

YHVH means: Causes to become.
This is why YHVH is called “The Creator

When Moses Asked God what His name was(Ex.3:14), God responded…
[אהיה אשר אהיה] ěhyäh ăsher ěhyäh, which translates into English as…
“I will be what I will be” or “I will be that I will be” (Click Here)

YHVH=63 and “will be”=63

Theomatics(numbers relating to God) clearly illustrate who God is.
The Divine=63 Deity=63 of The Bible=63 is YHVH=63.
[יהוה] translates directly into English as YHVH.

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

July 6, 2010 at 12:53 pm#201962

Participant

Ed J: The Bible (old testament) gives God many names and says many things. The old testament reveals a god of anger and destruction. A schizophrenic god that orders and commands specialized people to go into entire villages and kill, men, women, children and animals. Yet he gives 10 commandments which include do not kill and do not steal to moses for his people to follow. Shall we whitewash these truthes and say they didn't happen or shall we say the God of love revealed by Jesus also has a destructive side. He's really not all good. At least note that traslation causes much misunderstanding. I believe God was saying to the people if you love the lord thy God with all your heart these are 10 examples of what you will do and be. Anyone can find a God of their choice if they don't follow Jesus and the truth. My God is the God of Jesus, the Father of us all. The God I serve is revealed as love by Jesus. Now anything I read in the old or new testament about God I find only love or error.

There are many things written in the Bible that even though they are truly written they are not necessarilly the truth. Job said the lord giveth and the Lord taketh away…. he truly said that but that is not a true statement! The God of Jesus does not kill, steal, and destroy.

It is your right to call upon whatever name you believe is God to you. There will either be a response or not. I follow only one man/truth, Jesus! These are my beliefs, TK

July 6, 2010 at 1:43 pm#201964

Participant

Tim Kraft,

If that is the God you read of in the Old Testament it speaks more of the evil within you than of God's actions. I would say offhand that you do not understand justice or mercy. This is not rare as the Western cultures seem prone to teach their children to enable evil behaviors. Never the less it is a tradition of man and must be denied.

Your fellow student,

Kerwin

July 6, 2010 at 2:57 pm#201967

GeneBalthrop

Participant

Tim…………..Once many years ago when i was about 34 years old i developed a attitude against God , after reading all the terrible thing he did to Israel his own people and it was effecting my heart towards him. I thought this is an evil GOD to cause People to starve to death and even eat there own childern, it was just horrible to me that He would do such a thing. So What God Did was cause my only son to turn against me and show contempt and unappreciative to me . I has ask him to mow our lawn and he just got in the truck i had brought him and drove off, I became enraged and began to curse Him because of all the good thing i had given him and blessed him with, and this was how he was repaying me, so i and got on the mower myself and began to mow but all the time cursing him for his inappreciativeness for all that i did for him. Then suddenly this voice said to me “Why are you mad and upset Gene and i said because my son who i have given so much to did not do what i ask him to and then he said, and should i not have been upset with Israel because of all that i gave and did for them. Then i said you were justified Lord to do what you did to those ungrateful people I now understand your feeling LORD. My attitude completely changed and so did my sons attitude also, GOD caused this to happen in my life to straighten out my attitude towards him. So when we see the cruelty of GOD remember first how it hurt GOD'S Heart by what they were doing to him. IMO

July 6, 2010 at 9:49 pm#201998

Participant

Gene: I don't tell God what to do and I don't try to please him or appease him with good works. I was nothing until I read what Jesus said I/we are. But lets be fair, somethings amiss. I don't believe that the God that commanded killing and destruction is the God that Jesus revealed to me. If I did believe that God was doing that it would be even worse if he told us to do the killing and then told us it is a sin if we kill. You can believe what you choose. As I said before, I follow Jesus and believe he was the Christ coming to show us the true God. The fruit of a God of love is as you know, peace, joy, kindness etc.! I know who the so called god of destruction is and the fruit of that spirit is murder, lies, degradation, unworthiness, sin etc.! The old way was lost in sin. Jesus said the old way was completed. He said I did not come to destroy(stay in or lodge in) the law I came to fulfill it. It is done. The new way is life and peace with God. I choose life without sin. For a long time I tried to make it work until Jesus showed me the true way to God. Thank you, this is also IMO. Bless you, TK

July 6, 2010 at 10:09 pm#201999

Participant

Quote (kerwin @ July 07 2010,00:43)

Tim Kraft,

Your fellow student,

Kerwin

Kerwin: Why is it that if I speak of love and peace in the God of Jesus that you don't say, my how pure my heart is toward God by trusting Jesus his lord and savior?

Faith in what Jesus says is the only justice and mercy anyone is going to get anyway, in my opinion.

You say I have evil in me. If my fruit (what I say or write) is of love in Christ Jesus, then you are incorrect.

What evil behaviors have I done? If I was doing any evil behaviors wouldn't those be like the god of the old testament, like killing and stealing? Isn't that what you call sin?

There is only one thing that can cleanse me and that is the words of God through Jesus.

Thank you for saying that I have evil in me. Jesus promised that the evil one would come to steal the good word of God.
People hated Jesus for the good news he taught, so I guess I'm in good company.

We could learn together without firing darts! TK

July 6, 2010 at 10:26 pm#202000

NickHassan

Participant

Hi TK,
God owns all things including life.
You accuse Him?

July 7, 2010 at 9:49 am#202334

Participant

Nick: Thats a religiously cute little phrase of untruth. “God owns everything” God is not a man that he should ever lie. God is bound by his word. What God says is truth and it will not return to him void. God has taken his word and established certain things that he will not ever change. What God has given he will not demand back. God has given mankind control of the earth, that is why it is in such condition. God can only intervene in earth through prayer (request of a human being) If the earth were to be operated by God/spirit the fruit would be peace, love, joy, and no evil or sin! Jesus came to tell us that truth. In mass we have not listened yet. We have been busy building religious doctrines of fear, hate, commands, destruction etc.!

Lets try to wake up the world to love/truth. Find the real truth and shine the light for all to see. In the light there is no sin! In the light there is no death, evil, destruction etc.! We should stop proliferating destruction through sin teaching. If a man doesn't believe in sin how could he sin?
We need to stop believing in evil and evil will go away!!! What a man believes in his heart, so he is. Religion produces more fear, sin, hate, evil thinking, degradation, sin and evil work than anyone else. Lets pick at the doctrines that bind us and not at one another. When will we be honest and say the old testament is finished. Thanks for your time, TK

July 7, 2010 at 11:16 am#202344

Participant

Quote (JustAskin @ July 04 2010,22:03)

RM,

Are you being paid to use the word 'Paradox'?

Or is your whole world a 'Paradox'?

Faith is greater than works.

But works without faith is subject to the Judgement of Jesus. It is the reason behind the lack of faith that matters, for instance: Was that person subjected to the truth of the word of God.
If they were mislead and therefore did not believe because of that … But they did good works… Then , in the second rising they will be given the chance to be subjected to the truth. If they decide from that, tnat they still donlt believe then that will be that.

Where is the 'Paradox'?

RokkaMan, from now I give you a new name, 'Luke' (as in 'Lukewarm')

Yes but your stance is irrelevant to what I am saying.

My whole point was salvation is found in Faith, but faith without works is dead.

Faith + Works = Walk

It's a walk with God that solidifies your salvation through demonstration of your faith.

Your works establish your faith, and determines your rewards.

——–

If you do good works but don't have faith, you don't enter salvation and your punishments in hell are according to your works.

If you have faith only, you can possibly enter the kingdom, but there are definately classes in heaven just like on earth.

And you with little works, will be unto the likes of a begger on the streets of heaven.

I definately believe it's better to be poor in heaven than rich in hell.

but my whole point was to show the irrelevance of this thread.

Scripture clearly defines we earn salvation by faith, but faith without works is dead.

Hence the paradox.

You can call me lukewarm all you want, but just because you don't understand it, doesn't make it false, especially when my statements are backed up by scripture.
——-

Even the devil and demons believe Jesus Christ is Lord and savior… yet they do no good work from that faith and continue to sin.

The devil isn't atheist, he believes in God and knows who he is. Yet even with knowledge and faith in God, he did a BAD work and rebelled against God.

This is why Paul said faith without works is dead.
Just like works without faith is also dead.

You need both, faith in God and works to prove your faith.

The faith gets you in heaven, the works solidify the faith and earn you rewards.

Together you would call it a walk with God.

——

but apparently you believe what I am saying is lukewarm and untrue.

All because you cannot comprehend the truth of it's paradoxical nature, even when it's clearly illustrated in front of you.

July 7, 2010 at 11:23 am#202345

Participant

Quote (Tim Kraft @ July 07 2010,20:49)

Amen, the OT was not abolished but fufilled by Jesus Christ.
Who came to preach truth, and love.

All sin died on the cross with Jesus.
And his life wasw ressurected in spirit and received in glory.

what does that mean?

Does it mean sin is no more?

Yes, it does, to those who walk with God through Jesus Christ.

—–
To those who don't receive him however, or backslide and enter back into the world…sin is still present.

That is why sin still exists on earth, because not everyone has received christ.

——

As christians we are to preach truth and love and not only believe it by faith, but demonstrate it by works.

As christians, if we sin, it's by accident, but we are to immediately confess, pray for forgiveness and abstain.

——

If the world did that, we'd live in a utopia…yes people would still be making mistakes, but it all would be so short lived that we would still have semi-perfect peace.

——

We know it won't happen with our own power, because the devil still has a strong influence on earth but we are to strive for it.

We are to make the kingdom of God as plentiful as possible!

July 7, 2010 at 1:12 pm#202348

Participant

Tim Kraft,

You sit in judgment on God and yet are blind to the evil that you are doing so what can I say to open your eyes. Who are you to judge God. It is wiser to sit there patiently and learn what mercy and justice are from God instead of falsely accusing him.

Jesus is a teacher and his words teach about the same God testified in the Old Testament. Have you not read and believed his teaching of the fig tree that was unfruitful in Luke 13:6-8. A man owned a fig tree and for three years he choose to suffer its fruitfulness hoping that it would bear fruit but on the third year his patience wore thing from the fig tree testing him and ordered the gardener to destroy it. The gardener took pity on the fig tree and begged the owner for one more year in which the fruit tree could become fruitful but at the end of that year that fruit tree did not bear fruit it would be put to death.

In the Old Testament God commanded the Twelve tribes to put all the unfruitful people of Canaan to death after suffering their evil for many years. He showed his mercy to them for many years by choosing to suffer their evil but they refused to repent and thus they received their just punishment. I assure you even as Jesus taught us if we do not repent we too will perish, Luke 13:3.

Faith is believing that what God promised will happen and God promises that you will stop sinning if you hunger and thirst for righteousness and so obey all his the teachings of the Anointed.

Your fellow student,

Kerwin

July 7, 2010 at 1:50 pm#202350

Participant

Sin is an ominus, man made concept of “something done” that separates us from God! There is nothing that can be done that separates us from God aside from believing we are aside from God. We are not being graded by our actions. All people do good works and all people do things that they might wish they had done differently but that does not separate one from God.

Any belief in any form of separation from God is sin. Sin is wrong believing. There is no separation between you and God, unless it is in the mind. Even wrong thinking that you are separated from God for any reason is not the truth. It is an illusion of the mind that you are apart from God. God will never leave you nor forsake you. So the only way to be apart from God is you leave God by an error of thought.

When the disciples ask Jesus, in John 6:28, “what shall we do that we might work the works of God”?…Jesus said “THIS IS THE WORK OF GOD THAT YOU BELIEVE ON HE WHOM HE SENT”! Gods work is to believe him.

Faith without faith, the power works of God are dead!! Good works are God/good works!! Jesus went about doing good/God works, healing all who came to him.

To me you are confusing the healing power works of God that are by faith for the believer. Those that have the spirit of truth within produce the fruit of the spirit of God within them which is peace, love, joy, etc.!

If faith connects you to God how does one backslide and enter back into a world he never left?

The devil is the lying influence you feel to reject this truth. IMO, God Bless, TK

July 7, 2010 at 3:12 pm#202357

Participant

Tim Kraft,

You are correct that the Devil is a liar and you have chosen to believe him because he has told you what your itching ears want to know.

Sin is action. If you sin against me it is an action you perform even though I may be unaware of your oppression of me as it could me in your mind or behind my back.

Murder is a sin and murder is an action. By your words you deny that fact and thus show you serve the evil one who is the father of lies.

Your need to change your ways and embrace what is true for the Devil has lied to you are your life sometimes by taking the form of one you love and trust or using even your own self.

Your fellow student,

Kerwin

July 7, 2010 at 3:34 pm#202359

GeneBalthrop

Participant

Kerwin……………Have you considered, the difference between Iniquities and Sins are. Why does God mention both , saying He would forgive our Sin (AND) our iniquities. Why does He desperate them in his statement if they are one and the same thing? What is the bibles definition of iniquity , not the dictionary. I believe the scriptures show iniquity as a sin unaware of or when a person (thinks) they are doing right but are sinning unaware of it. Whats you thoughts ?

peace and love……………..gene

July 7, 2010 at 4:36 pm#202366

Participant

Gene,

I looked at a dictionary for the dictionary and was told that an iniquity is a gross sin while a sin is any transgression of the law. Assuming the translates are correct this is equivalent to the Catholics teaching of the difference of mortal sins and venial sins. The Catholics are not correct when they say you commit a venial sin and not have your soul become dead to God as any sin causes you to become dead to God.

It is possible though that violating the dietary laws is a sin while violating the prohibition against coveting is an iniquity. Of course it is also possible that God was using synonyms to emphasize a point. What the actual case is I have no idea though I do know that all sin comes from the heart according to Jesus and Jesus does not lie.

Your fellow student,

Kerwin

July 7, 2010 at 7:34 pm#202399

Participant

Hello Just Askin,

Just wanted to point out to further solidify my point and prove that your charge against me was done in ignorance of The Word.

Luke 1:13

For he shall have judgment without mercy, that hath shewed no mercy; and mercy rejoiceth against judgment.

14What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

20But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

July 7, 2010 at 7:41 pm#202400