Mikeboll64 vs francis

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi all

I must say that in all the time I have been here I have not seen anyone with the knowledge, and the gracefulness in presenting that knowledge as I see Francis has done in this debate.

I had wanted to respond yet be respectful of the personal debate between Mike and Francis so I opened a new thread where others could comment on their debate without interrupting the debate.

The following was one of Francis last responses and a good one.

As he brings out Orthodox Christianity teaches and has always believed in the Trinity, (Francis post is in blue)….

Hello Mike…

Quote

Mike At any rate, this was just for warm ups.  Let's get to the scriptures. Your stand is that Jesus is God Almighty. Micah 5:4 NWT “And he will certainly stand and do shepherding in the strength of Jehovah, in the superiority of the name of Jehovah his  God. And they will certainly keep dwelling, for now he will be great as far as the ends of the earth.” This passage is about the Messiah.  And this passage clearly shows that Jesus is someone OTHER THAN and LESSOR TO Jehovah,  his God.  In fact, there are many scriptures that have Jesus referring to his God.  Does God Almighty call anyone “my  God”, Francis?

If you start with the premise that the Trinity does not exist… and if you were reading this verse (and the others that  you allude to) for the first time… and if you read this verse in isolation and not within the entire scope and context  of the Bible… and if you don't do any research about why orthodox Christians believe in the Trinity… then, and only   then would it be reasonable to infer from Micah 5:4 that the Messiah may not be God or be an equal person within the  Trinity.

But you see, that is not how scholars work.  This is not how people… who are interested in the truth… do their  research in the quest for truth.

Anyway… if the Trinity does exist, then the answer to your question becomes crystal clear and obvious. Orthodox  Christians believe that Jesus… HIS SPIRIT…  that nature of His which was divine… inhabited a human body made of  flesh… much like God almighty indwelled within the Temple and within the Tabernacle in the OT.

Orthodox Christianity does not teach that Jesus' flesh was divine.  Orthodox Christianity does not teach that Jesus'  ordinary human consciousness was divine.   Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human.  And so it  makes perfect sense that the 100% human part of Jesus… his 100% ordinary human consciousness which is part of his  earthly flesh… can call God… “my God”… without entailing any logical problems or contradictions.

Jesus divine spirit… indwelling inside the human body of flesh… is different than Jesus' ordinary human consciousness  which comes with the human body of flesh.

Every verse where we see Jesus speaking to God as if a human speaks to God… only shows and indicates that he… being  God… voluntarily submitted and limited himself as a human being for our sake… interacting with us through a human body  of flesh which comes with a human consciousness.

Here I find it useful to distinguish between the ontological Trinity and the economic Trinity. You can find a fuller   explanation of each of these concepts in Wikipedia's discussion of the Trinity.  Type in Trinity and you'll see a subhead   entitled Economic and Ontological Trinity

Basically… The ontological Trinity is the Trinity as it exists of itself apart from God’s relation to the world. The   economic Trinity has reference to the different roles played by the persons of the Trinity in relation to the world and   especially in the plan of salvation. In this economic Trinity there is a type of voluntary submission of one person to   another, as the incarnate Son does the Father’s will and the Spirit speaks, not on His own account, but on behalf of the   Son. The economic Trinity does not reflect ontological differences between the persons but rather is an expression of  God’s  loving condescension for the sake of our salvation. There is never any actual subordination within the nature of  the Godhead  itself.   Ontologically, the 3 persons of the Trinity are equal and completely harmonious in everything.

Therefore, when we understand the Ontological Trinity vs. the Economic Trinity as found in Wikipedia… we can see that   there is absolutely NO LOGICAL FLAWS for Trinitarians in Micah 5:4.

I hope this helps you to understand where I am coming from.  Please feel free to ask any questions you like.

God Bless You

Respectfully, Francis

Thanks Francis for this post and for your example of the Spirit of love demonstrated in your post.

Blessings Keith

[JustAskin]

Ha ha ha ha hah…

[JustAskin]

The Scriptures warns of those who would try to pursuade againt God using phylosophical arguments.

Ha ha ha ha ha hah…

[Ed J]

Quote

Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human.

Hi WJ,

In math you can't have 200%? (Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)

                        Jesus lineage explained

“Son of Man”: 25%; Mary's mother's lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36)
“Son of Man”: 25%: Mary's father's lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31)
“Son of God”: 50%: Jesus' Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35)

At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)!
At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14)

Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…

                   Mother         Father
                    Mary         HolySpirit
                     50%           50%
                         \              /
                           \          /
                             Jesus
                            /        \
                          /            \        
                        /                \
              Son of Man     Son of God
             (Mark 6:3)        (Luke 1:35)

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16)

[SimplyForgiven]

ed j,
how many times did you post this same response?

[Ed J]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Dec. 21 2010,11:48)

ed j, how many times did you post this same response?

Hi Dennison,

My Posts aren't for your entertainment,
but are for the readers enlightenment!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[SimplyForgiven]

Anyways WJ,

Francis made very clear points.

But the important thing is that he finally was able to clear up that fallacies that Mike creates.

1. that we must “limit” ourselves in writing until it pleases mike.
2. making bogus points about “what is not said” and making a whole big arguement based on conjectures without any evidence or based on fantasy.
3. Somehow Mike has this “insight” about how exactly Paul, Peter, and the writers of the bible “intent” and “belief” was.
4. His “Im right, your wrong, becuase i say so” when he is backed into a corner, and ignores most of what you say and starts over.
5. he doesnt refute certain points, which leaves them valid, but of course that doesnt matter to him.

“I personally feel that each word was important and necessary in my attempt to be thorough and very  clear as I try and give what I think is the truth.  I understand that you may very well disagree, but I have to be true to what I believe is the best way  to get across my point.   Although I will try and accomodate your concern, I can't guarantee anything because to me, it is like asking a Grand  Master Chess player to keep his moves under 20 seconds while his opponent, also a Grand Master, is allowed to take over an hour to move.

If the first Grand Master is lousy at speed chess, but very accomplished at regular chess, then you've basically hamstrung his ability to express  himself through his strength.

Anyway… that might be a lousy example, but because I'm not a genius, that is what I came up with at this time.
……………..

To suggest more, without any evidence whatsoever, is nothing but fantasy, wishful thinking and maybe even bias.  I could very well be wrong, but  that is how it appears to me from where I am sitting.

Also, just as you used the phrase “in passing” above, which seems to pass judgment, you are now using the word  “neglected”.  Both…. the word “neglected” and the prase “in passing”… appear to make direct judgements about the state of  mind  and the intent of the signers of creed 325.  And without any evidence from the writings of the Bishops themselves… the ones who signed  the Creed of 325… your judgments can only be described as being objectively and impartially”   unwarranted.From Francis debate with Mike.

Francis is clearly a debater, and uses alot of debate terms.
Though I personally do not believe in the Trinity, he makes a good case.

My only problem with what he said is that he starts to define God by a certain trinity, and different types of doctrinal trinities, and that uneeded to define God, for he is beyond that.

[SimplyForgiven]

Quote (JustAskin @ Dec. 21 2010,02:52)

The Scriptures warns of those who would try to pursuade againt God using phylosophical arguments. Ha ha ha ha ha hah…

Verse?

[Ed J]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Dec. 21 2010,19:17)

Quote (JustAskin @ Dec. 21 2010,02:52) The Scriptures warns of those who would try to pursuade againt God using phylosophical arguments. Ha ha ha ha ha hah… Verse?

Hi SF,

Have you forgotten so quickly, this is what gets BURNED UP!

Col.2:8 Beware lest any man spoil you through philosophy and vain deceit,
after the tradition of men, after the rudiments of the world, and not after Christ.

2Pt.3:12 Looking for and hasting unto the coming of the day of God, wherein the heavens
being on fire shall be dissolved, and the rudiments shall melt with fervent heat?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 20 2010,17:40)

Quote Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human. Hi WJ, In math you can't have 200%? (Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)                         Jesus lineage explained “Son of Man”: 25%; Mary's mother's lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36) “Son of Man”: 25%: Mary's father's lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31) “Son of God”: 50%: Jesus' Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)! At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14) Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…                    Mother         Father                     Mary         HolySpirit                      50%           50%                          \              /                            \          /                              Jesus                             /        \                           /            \                                 /                \               Son of Man     Son of God              (Mark 6:3)        (Luke 1:35) Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16)

ED J

Thats your problem ED is you are trying to figure out God by using math.

Forget the math, Jesus is fully God according to the Spirit and fully man according to the flesh. Comprende?

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (SimplyForgiven @ Dec. 21 2010,03:16)

Francis made very clear points. But the important thing is that he finally was able to clear up that fallacies that Mike creates. 1. that we must “limit” ourselves in writing until it pleases mike. 2. making bogus points about “what is not said” and making a whole big arguement based on conjectures without any evidence or based on fantasy. 3. Somehow Mike has this “insight” about how exactly Paul, Peter, and the writers of the bible “intent” and “belief” was. 4. His “Im right, your wrong, becuase i say so” when he is backed into a corner, and ignores most of what you say and starts over. 5. he doesnt refute certain points, which leaves them valid, but of course that doesnt matter to him.

Hi Dennison

Agreed.

WJ

[Ed J]

Quote (francis @ Dec. 21 2010,02:34)

Hello Mike… 1) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever called God, “my God”.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that said “my God”… not His divinity. 2) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever came from God.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 3) Orthodox Christianity believes that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… comes from no one.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 4) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… was begotten.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that was begotten… not His divinity. 5) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… can ever die.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that died on the cross… not His divinity. 6) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… took sin upon Himself.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that took sin upon himself and died on the cross… not His divinity. God Bless You Respectfully, Francis

Hi Everyone,

Where are “the bible verses” for any of these,
which Francis attributes to Orthodox Christianity?

5) Here is the verses for point number 5!   …Luke 10:30-37
    This is because Jesus (in the flesh) was 1/2 God.
    (see Fourth Post on previous page)

Are these other points all factious?
If NOT, produce “the bible verses”!!!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:11)

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 20 2010,17:40) Quote Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human. Hi WJ, In math you can't have 200%? (Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)                         Jesus lineage explained “Son of Man”: 25%; Mary's mother's lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36) “Son of Man”: 25%: Mary's father's lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31) “Son of God”: 50%: Jesus' Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)! At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14) Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…                    Mother         Father                     Mary         HolySpirit                      50%           50%                          \              /                            \          /                              Jesus                             /        \                           /            \                                 /                \               Son of Man     Son of God              (Mark 6:3)        (Luke 1:35) Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16) ED J Thats your problem ED is you are trying to figure out God by using math. Forget the math, Jesus is fully God according to the Spirit and fully man according to the flesh. Comprende? WJ

Hi WJ,

Are you saying that Jesus didn't (according to WJ) have a spirit of his own?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:15)

Quote (francis @ Dec. 21 2010,02:34) Hello Mike… 1) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever called God, “my God”.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that said “my God”… not His divinity. 2) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever came from God.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 3) Orthodox Christianity believes that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… comes from no one.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 4) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… was begotten.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that was begotten… not His divinity. 5) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… can ever die.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that died on the cross… not His divinity. 6) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… took sin upon Himself.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that took sin upon himself and died on the cross… not His divinity. God Bless You Respectfully, Francis Hi Everyone, Where are “the bible verses” for any of these, which Francis attributes to Orthodox Christianity? 5) Here is the verses for point number 5!   …Luke 10:30-37     This is because Jesus (in the flesh) was 1/2 God.     (see Fourth Post on previous page) Are these other points all factious? If NOT, produce “the bible verses”!!! God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

ED J

The BIble verses have been presented many times. But you choose to see them with your own interpretation.

Francis points are based on “Orthodox Christianity” and their interpretation of those verses which disagree with you.

So do the Forefathers disagree with you, who preserved the scriptures and the history of the Church.

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:24)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:11) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 20 2010,17:40) Quote Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human. Hi WJ, In math you can't have 200%? (Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)                         Jesus lineage explained “Son of Man”: 25%; Mary's mother's lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36) “Son of Man”: 25%: Mary's father's lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31) “Son of God”: 50%: Jesus' Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)! At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14) Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…                    Mother         Father                     Mary         HolySpirit                      50%           50%                          \              /                            \          /                              Jesus                             /        \                           /            \                                 /                \               Son of Man     Son of God              (Mark 6:3)        (Luke 1:35) Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16) ED J Thats your problem ED is you are trying to figure out God by using math. Forget the math, Jesus is fully God according to the Spirit and fully man according to the flesh. Comprende? WJ Hi WJ, Are you saying that Jesus didn't (according to WJ) have a spirit of his own? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

ED

Where do you read that in my statement?

The Spirit of Christ, the Spirit of God, is Jesus! Rom 8:9

There is only “One Spirit” Ed!

WJ

[Ed J]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:27)

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:15) Quote (francis @ Dec. 21 2010,02:34) Hello Mike… 1) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever called God, “my God”.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that said “my God”… not His divinity. 2) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever came from God.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 3) Orthodox Christianity believes that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… comes from no one.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 4) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… was begotten.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that was begotten… not His divinity. 5) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… can ever die.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that died on the cross… not His divinity. 6) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… took sin upon Himself.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that took sin upon himself and died on the cross… not His divinity. God Bless You Respectfully, Francis Hi Everyone, Where are “the bible verses” for any of these, which Francis attributes to Orthodox Christianity? 5) Here is the verses for point number 5!   …Luke 10:30-37     This is because Jesus (in the flesh) was 1/2 God.     (see Fourth Post on previous page) Are these other points all factious? If NOT, produce “the bible verses”!!! God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org ED J The BIble verses have been presented many times. But you choose to see them with your own interpretation. Francis points are based on “Orthodox Christianity” and their interpretation of those verses which disagree with you. So do the Forefathers disagree with you, who preserved the scriptures and the history of the Church. WJ

Hi WJ,

Then you should have no trouble digging them up and Posting them here for us all; right?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Ed J]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:30)

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:24) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:11) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 20 2010,17:40) Quote Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human. Hi WJ, In math you can't have 200%? (Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)                         Jesus lineage explained “Son of Man”: 25%; Mary's mother's lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36) “Son of Man”: 25%: Mary's father's lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31) “Son of God”: 50%: Jesus' Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)! At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14) Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…                    Mother         Father                     Mary         HolySpirit                      50%           50%                          \              /                            \          /                              Jesus                             /        \                           /            \                                 /                \               Son of Man     Son of God              (Mark 6:3)        (Luke 1:35) Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16) ED J Thats your problem ED is you are trying to figure out God by using math. Forget the math, Jesus is fully God according to the Spirit and fully man according to the flesh. Comprende? WJ Hi WJ, Are you saying that Jesus didn't (according to WJ) have a spirit of his own? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org ED Where do you read that in my statement? The Spirit of Christ, the Spirit of God, is Jesus! Rom 8:9 There is only “One Spirit” Ed! WJ

Hi WJ,

Are you denying Jesus had a 'spirit' of his own?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:35)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:30) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:24) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:11) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 20 2010,17:40) Quote Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human. Hi WJ, In math you can't have 200%? (Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)                         Jesus lineage explained “Son of Man”: 25%; Mary's mother's lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36) “Son of Man”: 25%: Mary's father's lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31) “Son of God”: 50%: Jesus' Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)! At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14) Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…                    Mother         Father                     Mary         HolySpirit                      50%           50%                          \              /                            \          /                              Jesus                             /        \                           /            \                                 /                \               Son of Man     Son of God              (Mark 6:3)        (Luke 1:35) Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16) ED J Thats your problem ED is you are trying to figure out God by using math. Forget the math, Jesus is fully God according to the Spirit and fully man according to the flesh. Comprende? WJ Hi WJ, Are you saying that Jesus didn't (according to WJ) have a spirit of his own? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org ED Where do you read that in my statement? The Spirit of Christ, the Spirit of God, is Jesus! Rom 8:9 There is only “One Spirit” Ed! WJ Hi WJ, Are you denying Jesus had a 'spirit' of his own? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

ED

When I give you the answer, why do you ask the same question?  Again…

No, I am denying there is more than “One Spirit”.

Are you denying that there is more than “One Spirit” in you?

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:35)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:27) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:15) Quote (francis @ Dec. 21 2010,02:34) Hello Mike… 1) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever called God, “my God”.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that said “my God”… not His divinity. 2) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… ever came from God.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 3) Orthodox Christianity believes that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… comes from no one.  This is because Jesus is God.  Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that came from God… not His divinity. 4) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… was begotten.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that was begotten… not His divinity. 5) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… can ever die.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that died on the cross… not His divinity. 6) Orthodox Christianity does not believe that Jesus… the Divine part of him… the Deity part of him… took sin upon Himself.  This is because Jesus is God.   Instead it was Jesus' fully human body and human consciousness that took sin upon himself and died on the cross… not His divinity. God Bless You Respectfully, Francis Hi Everyone, Where are “the bible verses” for any of these, which Francis attributes to Orthodox Christianity? 5) Here is the verses for point number 5!   …Luke 10:30-37     This is because Jesus (in the flesh) was 1/2 God.     (see Fourth Post on previous page) Are these other points all factious? If NOT, produce “the bible verses”!!! God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org ED J The BIble verses have been presented many times. But you choose to see them with your own interpretation. Francis points are based on “Orthodox Christianity” and their interpretation of those verses which disagree with you. So do the Forefathers disagree with you, who preserved the scriptures and the history of the Church. WJ Hi WJ, Then you should have no trouble digging them up and Posting them here for us all; right? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Already done many times and this thread is to disguss points made by Mike and Francis.

WJ

[Ed J]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:43)

Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:35) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:30) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 21 2010,09:24) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Dec. 22 2010,01:11) Quote (Ed J @ Dec. 20 2010,17:40) Quote Instead, it teaches that Jesus was both 100% God and 100% human. Hi WJ, In math you can't have 200%? (Matthew 1:18 / Matthew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) (Luke 10:30-37)                         Jesus lineage explained “Son of Man”: 25%; Mary's mother's lineage was of the tribe of Levi. (Luke 1:5, 1:36) “Son of Man”: 25%: Mary's father's lineage was (Judah) through Nathan(son of David). (Luke 3:23-31) “Son of God”: 50%: Jesus' Father was the “HolySpirit”; NOT Joseph! (Mathew 1:18 / Mathew 1:20 / Luke 1:35) At birth: Jesus was 50% HolySpirit(God)(Matt.1:18 / Matt.1:20 / Luke 1:35), 25% Levite(Priest) and 25% Judah(King)! At baptism by John the baptizer, Jesus was filled with the HolySpirit(God) beyond measure! (John 3:34 / John 1:14) Here is why Jesus is called both the “Son of Man” and the “Son of God”…                    Mother         Father                     Mary         HolySpirit                      50%           50%                          \              /                            \          /                              Jesus                             /        \                           /            \                                 /                \               Son of Man     Son of God              (Mark 6:3)        (Luke 1:35) Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17) יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā  hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! Ed J (Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 49:16 / Isaiah 60:14) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org (Ecl.9:12-16) ED J Thats your problem ED is you are trying to figure out God by using math. Forget the math, Jesus is fully God according to the Spirit and fully man according to the flesh. Comprende? WJ Hi WJ, Are you saying that Jesus didn't (according to WJ) have a spirit of his own? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org ED Where do you read that in my statement? The Spirit of Christ, the Spirit of God, is Jesus! Rom 8:9 There is only “One Spirit” Ed! WJ Hi WJ, Are you denying Jesus had a 'spirit' of his own? God bless Ed J (Joshua 22:34) http://www.holycitybiblecode.org ED When I give you the answer, why do you ask the same question?  Again… No, I am denying there is more than “One Spirit”. Are you denying that there is more than “One Spirit” in you? WJ

HI WJ,

Romans 8:16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God:
And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be
that we suffer with him, that we may be also glorified together.

You cannot have 200% of anything, WJ; Wake-up!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

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