t8 said:
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“I pray that they will know the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom you have sent”. |
Jesus said this BEFORE He had returned to the glory He had with the Father before the world began.
t8:
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If something can have multiple meanings, then in context you know the true meaning. |
But the denomination “the eternal life” in 5:20 does NOT have multiple meanings. John NEVER applied this expression to the Father.
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There is no instance in the writings of John, inwhich the appellation LIFE, and ETERNAL LIFE is bestowed upon the Father, to designate him as the author of spiritual and eternal life; and as this occurs so frequently in John's writings as applied to Christ, the laws of exegesis require that both the phrase 'the true God' and 'eternal life,' should be applied to him. Barnes Notes p. 353-354 |
Why are you making me repeat this stuff t8? The “laws of exegesis” require that the appellations “the true God” and “the eternal life” be applied to Christ because (1) There is only ONE person who is called by both appellations and (2) it was Jesus Christ John had just mentioned and (3) the second appellation is applied only to Christ throughout John's writings.
Come on! I am tired of repeating this stuff. We are not moving forward at all.
t8:
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John 17:3 Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent.John 17:3 gives you a key in unlocking the true meaning of 1 John 5:20 |
John 17:3 is NOT the “key” to unlocking 1 John 5:20. The “key” is Philippians 2. Paul essentially said that Jesus was God who became servant who became God (Lord) again. Paul said that the bowing of the knee to Christ and the confession of the tongue that Christ is Lord was according to what is “written” that every knee would bow and every tongue would confess YHWH (Isaiah 45). Therefore, Christ is YHWH.
t8:
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You have contradiction if you see Jesus as the true God because there is the true God AND Jesus Christ. It is very clear in John 17:3 and is clear in 1 John 5:20 with certain translations and not so clear with others. |
John 17:3 clearly speaks about TWO persons and makes a functional distinction between God and the Christ. But 1 John 5:20 speaks of only ONE person with the TWO appellations which are “the true God and the eternal life.” ONLY Jesus Christ is called “the eternal life.” Therefore, He is the true God also.
t8:
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Now read carefully the NIV 1 John 5:20 20 We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know him who is true. And we are in him who is true by being in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life. We are in him who is true, (God) by being in his son Jesus Christ. This sorts your misconception out. You also have to admit that this way of reading it is true in principle. |
1. I have already shown that John did not use personal pronouns. He used articles and they may be translated “that which is true.” The article is found in 1:1 in the same construction, “That which was from the beginning….”
The “true” way of translating 5:20 is thus:
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We know also that the Son of God has come and has given us understanding, so that we may know that which is true. And we are in that which is true that is, in his Son Jesus Christ. He is the true God and eternal life. |
Again you are making me repeat myself.
2. John had just stated his purpose for writing this section. He said that he wrote this section in order that we might believe in the name of the Son of God and that by believing we might have life. He said that he wrote this section that we might have the confidence to petition HIM knowing that if we ask anything according to HIS will HE hears us and will grant our requests.
IT SURE LOOKS LIKE HE FUNCTIONS AS GOD TO ME!
I have asked you several times to answer verses 13-15. Do you plan to get around to it soon? Don't accuse me of not answering you when I have had to pull teeth from you to get an answer on verses 13-15.
KJ