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Thank you very much Sis,
I always praise God the way you encourage brothers and sisters here.May God continue to bless you with more love
AdamQuote (Nick Hassan @ June 16 2009,14:53) Hi Jodi,
No Satan was yet in Peter.
Well not Satan himself but one of his faithful servants.
Poor Peter was yet untransformed in his mind and spoke as men do of worldly things.
Only the Spirit of God will allow youi to see beyond the earthly plane and discern spiritual things.
Nick, sorry man I find your last sentence buddy a load of crap.I grew up as a child believing what you believe, I was ignorant, believing in a doctrine of superstitions.
and you call it the need of God's Spirit to help me see
?Did you get that Nick? I believed what you believed as a child not knowing scripture for myself, did I have God's Spirit then?
When I started reading the scriptures for myself, thinking for myself trying to stick with JUST what the scriptures specifically say, staying away from man's ideas of what the scriptures say, I saw the truth.
Once again, you need to defend your position with scripture.
You cannot take the word adversary and turn it to fit your doctrine, that it represents ONE rebel spirit, without scriptural proof.
We have MEN and God's messengers specifically called satan, when we see Jesus call Peter satan, rather adversary, by what scriptural authority do you have to define satan as a rebel spirit?
Jesus called Peter satan, you Nick seem to be confused.
He said, “get behind me adversary”
and you say NO, that satan was yet in Peter?
Huh
Nick where in the bible does it say that it takes spiritual possession to cause a man to think worldly things?
I have shown scripture proving that worldly things come from man. Worldly things are things such as greed and sexual immorality. All things which we are told come from MAN alone, from his nature, his fleshly desires.
Kings were said to follow their OWN WILLS, they established evil dominion according to their OWN hearts desires.
You cannot take all the scriptures where evil is said to come from a man's own heart and ADD that it comes from their heart due to invisible monsters.
Nick it's just such a blatant addition I find it repulsive.
Show me the scripture where the word for adversary becomes the representation of ONE person as if it’s that person’s proper name?
Can anyone on this forum do that?
Just where in the bible does it say that it takes rebel invisible spirits to make men act like men?
What a bunch of pure nonsense IMO!!
Ge 6:5 Then the Lord saw that the wickedness of man was great in the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually.
Ge 8:21 And the Lord smelled a soothing aroma. Then the Lord said in His heart, “I will never again curse the ground for man's sake, although the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; nor will I again destroy every living thing as I have done.
Genesis 3:3 And in the process of time it came to pass that Cain brought an offering of the fruit of the ground to the Lord. 4 Abel also brought of the firstborn of his flock and of their fat. And the Lord respected Abel and his offering, 5 but He did not respect Cain and his offering. And Cain was very angry, and his countenance fell.
6 So the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? And why has your countenance fallen? 7 If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin lies at the door. And its desire is for you, but you should rule over it.”
Cain is told that he needs to rule over the sin that lies at his door. How do we see this sin rise up or enter into the heart of Cain? Did it take some invisible monster causing Cain to become angry and jealous?
James 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. 15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.
Nu 15:39 And you shall have the tassel, that you may look upon it and remember all the commandments of the Lord and do them, and that you may not follow the harlotry to which your own heart and your own eyes are inclined,
1 Kings 8:37 “When there is famine in the land, pestilence or blight or mildew, locusts or grasshoppers; when their enemy besieges them in the land of their cities; whatever plague or whatever sickness there is; 38 whatever prayer, whatever supplication is made by anyone, or by all Your people Israel, when each one knows the plague of his own heart, and spreads out his hands toward this temple: 39 then hear in heaven Your dwelling place, and forgive, and act, and give to everyone according to all his ways, whose heart You know (for You alone know the hearts of all the sons of men), 40 that they may fear You all the days that they live in the land which You gave to our fathers.
Neh 6: 8 Then I sent to him, saying, “No such things as you say are being done, but you invent them in your own heart.”
Psalms 81:11 “But My people would not heed My voice, And Israel would have none of Me. 12 So I gave them over to their own stubborn heart, To walk in their own counsels. 13 “Oh, that My people would listen to Me, That Israel would walk in My ways!
Romans 1:21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing to be wise, they became fools, 23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man–and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things. 24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves, 25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen. 26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature. 27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due. 28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting; 29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers, 30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents, 31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful;
The scriptures are clear Nick man’s OWN stubborn heart leads him into every sin under the book.
According to you I need God’s Spirit to understand what is NOT THERE? Well you’re a false teacher if I ever saw one, and a major hypocrite.
Pr 14:10 The heart knows its own bitterness, And a stranger does not share its joy.
Pr 14:14 The backslider in heart will be filled with his own ways, But a good man will be satisfied from above.
Pr 18:2 A fool has no delight in understanding, But in expressing his own heart.
Pr 28:26 He who trusts in his own hear
t is a fool, But whoever walks wisely will be delivered.Jer 16:12 And you have done worse than your fathers, for behold, each one follows the dictates of his own evil heart, so that no one listens to Me.
Jer 18:12 And they said, “That is hopeless! So we will walk according to our own plans, and we will every one obey the dictates of his evil heart.”
Jer 23:16 Thus says the Lord of hosts: “Do not listen to the words of the prophets who prophesy to you. They make you worthless; They speak a vision of their own heart, Not from the mouth of the Lord.
Jer 23:17 They continually say to those who despise Me, 'The Lord has said, “You shall have peace” '; And to everyone who walks according to the dictates of his own heart, they say, 'No evil shall come upon you.' ”
Jer 23:26 How long will this be in the heart of the prophets who prophesy lies? Indeed they are prophets of the deceit of their own heart,
Eze 13:2 “Son of man, prophesy against the prophets of Israel who prophesy, and say to those who prophesy out of their own heart, 'Hear the word of the Lord!' ”
Eze 13:17 “Likewise, son of man, set your face against the daughters of your people, who prophesy out of their own heart; prophesy against them,
Ac 5:4 While it remained, was it not your own? And after it was sold, was it not in your own control? Why have you conceived this thing in your heart? You have not lied to men but to God.”
1Co 7:37 Nevertheless he who stands steadfast in his heart, having no necessity, but has power over his own will, and has so determined in his heart that he will keep his virgin, does well.
Jas 1:26 If anyone among you thinks he is religious, and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this one's religion is useless.
There is NO scripture that shows that man is deceived by rebel spirits. The scriptures abound and are clear that sin comes out of the heart and mind of man himself. MAN INVENTS, CONCEIVES, DICTATES THE EVIL THAT EXISTS IN THE WORLD!
Man fills himself with evil thoughts, he invents false visions.
Could scripture BE MORE CLEAR? Evil comes when man trusts in his own heart, when he walks in his own ways, and follows his own plans.
Evil is an expression of man’s own heart.
In ALL these scriptures, WHAT is shown to be man’s adversary leading him away from God?
Man’s own heart, his own mind with his own desires and passions!
When we read Jesus calling Peter an adversary for having in mind the things of men, could the OT make it more clear as to who the adversary is? Knowing that satan strictly means adversary, I feel that it is completely clear all by itself. However those of you who are blind from indoctrination, what more proof do you need, in order to come out of your false teachings?Read what the scriptures say…
2 Corinthians 11:1 Oh, that you would bear with me in a little folly–and indeed you do bear with me. 2 For I am jealous for you with godly jealousy. For I have betrothed you to one husband, that I may present you as a chaste virgin to Christ. 3 But I fear, lest somehow, as the serpent deceived Eve by his craftiness, so your minds may be corrupted from the simplicity* that is in Christ. 4 For if he who comes preaches another Jesus whom we have not preached, or if you receive a different spirit which you have not received, or a different gospel which you have not accepted–you may well put up with it!
Who has scripture shown to be crafty? Man has been proven to be crafty through his own mind deceiving himself and others.
Man is referred to in the bible as being a serpent and a viper.
Ge 49:17 Dan shall be a serpent by the way, A viper by the path, That bites the horse's heels So that its rider shall fall backward.
Job 7:12 Am I a sea, or a sea serpent, That You set a guard over me?
Psalms 58:1 To the Chief Musician. Set to 'Do Not Destroy.' A Michtam of David. Do you indeed speak righteousness, you silent ones? Do you judge uprightly, you sons of men? 2 No, in heart you work wickedness; You weigh out the violence of your hands in the earth. 3 The wicked are estranged from the womb; They go astray as soon as they are born, speaking lies. 4 Their poison is like the poison of a serpent; They are like the deaf cobra that stops its ear,
The SERPENT in the garden that led Adam and Eve away separating them from God was their own heart. Man speaks lies out of his own heart.
There is NO scriptural evidence that links the serpent in the garden with some rebel spirit. On the contrary we have scripture that directly shows us what a serpent is symbolic of, which is the lies of man of which come from his own heart.
Ps 140:3 They sharpen their tongues like a serpent; The poison of asps is under their lips. Selah
Ec 10:11 A serpent may bite when it is not charmed; The babbler is no different.
Mic 7:17 They shall lick the dust like a serpent; They shall crawl from their holes like snakes of the earth. They shall be afraid of the Lord our God, And shall fear because of You.
Mt 3:7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, “Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Mt 12:34 Brood of vipers! How can you, being evil, speak good things? For out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks.
Mt 23:33 Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell?
Lu 3:7 Then he said to the multitudes that came out to be baptized by him, “Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Man in scripture is directly referred symbolically as being a serpent. There is not a single scripture that speaks of rebel spirits as being serpents, or disguising themselves as serpents.
Man’s own foolish wisdom has invented the idea that the serpent in the garden is some invisible spirit, who manipulates the whole world.Who distorts and deceives God’s ways, and thus is a devil? Who deceives men with their own doctrine and their own false visions and prophecies? Who falsely persecutes Christians?
1 John 3:1 Behold what manner of love the Father has bestowed on us, that we should be called children of God!* Therefore the world does not know us,+ because it did not know Him. 2 Beloved, now we are children of God; and it has not yet been revealed what we shall be, but we know that when He is revealed, we shall be like Him, for we shall see Him as He is. 3 And everyone who has this hope in Him purifies himself, just as He is pure. 4 Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness. 5 And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. 6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him. 7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God. 10 In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother.
Romans 9:6 But it is not that the word of God has taken no effect. For they are not all Israel who are of Israel, 7 nor are they all children because they are the seed of Abraham; but, “In Isaac your seed shall be called.” 8 That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed.
Mr 14:38 Watch and pray, lest you enter into temptation. The spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.”
Joh 1:13 who were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.
Joh 3:6 That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Joh 6:63 It is the Spirit who gives life; the flesh profits nothing. The words that I speak to you are spirit, and they are life.
Ro 6:19 I speak in human terms because of the weakness of your flesh. For just as you presented your members as slaves of uncleanness, and of lawlessness leading to more lawlessness, so now present your members as slaves of righteousness for holiness.
Ro 7:5 For when we were in the flesh, the sinful passions which were aroused by the law were at work in our members to bear fruit to death.
Ro 7:18 For I know that in me (that is, in my flesh) nothing good dwells; for to will is present with me, but how to perform what is good I do not find.
Ro 7:25 I thank God–through Jesus Christ our Lord! So then, with the mind I myself serve the law of God, but with the flesh the law of sin.
Ro 8:1 There is therefore now no condemnation to those who are in Christ Jesus,* who do not walk according to the flesh, but according to the Spirit.
Ro 8:3 For what the law could not do in that it was weak through the flesh, God did by sending His own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh, on account of sin: He condemned sin in the flesh,
Ro 8:5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit, the things of the Spirit.
What happens when those who live according to the flesh, walking according to the flesh, setting their minds on their flesh? They INVENT AND CONCIEVE, their OWN evil, from their OWN hearts and minds. Nothing in scriptures says that those who walk according to the flesh give into the influences of invisible rebel spirits.
Ro 9:8 That is, those who are the children of the flesh, these are not the children of God; but the children of the promise are counted as the seed.
1 John 3:4 Whoever commits sin also commits lawlessness, and sin is lawlessness. 5 And you know that He was manifested to take away our sins, and in Him there is no sin. 6 Whoever abides in Him does not sin. Whoever sins has neither seen Him nor known Him. 7 Little children, let no one deceive you. He who practices righteousness is righteous, just as He is righteous. 8 He who sins is of the devil, for the devil has sinned from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that He might destroy the works of the devil. 9 Whoever has been born of God does not sin, for His seed remains in him; and he cannot sin, because he has been born of God. 10 In this the children of God and the children of the devil are manifest: Whoever does not practice righteousness is not of God, nor is he who does not love his brother.
1Jo 3:12 not as Cain who was of the wicked one and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his works were evil and his brother's righteous.
How disingenuous were the translators with the words wicked one?
The Greek word translated wicked one is ponhrovß and it is translated throughout the NT King James, 76 times as evil. 10 times as wicked, 6 times as wicked one, 2 times as wicked things, and 7 miscellaneous.
I John 3:12 should properly be rendered, “ not as Cain who was evil and murdered his brother. And why did he murder him? Because his works were evil and his brother’s righteous.
People see wicked one and because of their indoctrination they automatically start visioning rebel spirit or that fable character fallen angel Lucifer.
Children of the flesh are not children of God, he who sins is of the devil and is a child of the devil.
Scripture shows us that to be a child of the devil is one and the same as being a child of the flesh. Being a child in the flesh is NEVER represented as being one who follows the influence of invisible rebel spirits, but it is directly shown to be one who conceives, invents and dictates evil from within his OWN heart and mind.
Cain was a murderer and a liar from the beginning he was evil, being of the devil, because his works were evil.
Kings and their armies, and their messengers, and their governments are referred to as serpents, dragons, beasts, adversaries and slanderers, because they follow after the evil inventions that are conceived out of their own hearts. They follow their own wills, not the wills of invisible rebel spirits.
Nick and everyone else, you all need to stop adding and distorting what the scriptures say.
Come out of your false teachings and stick with what the scriptures specifically tells us.
Peace to all, Jodi
Jodi and Gene! Jodi I have read some of your Post, not all. What you are saying in your last post is about Sin. We however need to ask our self who is the Author of Sin, and where it started. God will not put that into a man, that is Satans doing. Sin starts with a thought. But first I like to show you about the Angel Lucifer in
Isaiah 14:12 ” How you have fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! You who weak end the nations!verse 13 For you have said in your heart:” I will asccend to heaven, I will exalt my throne above the stars of God; I will also sit on the mount of the congregation, On the farthest sides of the north;
verse 14 I will accened above the heights of the clouds, I will be like the Most High.
Then there was war in heaven
Rev. 12:7 And war broke out in heaven Michael and His Angels fought against the dragon: and the dragon and his angels fought.
Rev. 12:9 So the great dragon was cast out, that serpent of old, called the Devil and Satan, who deceives the whole world, he was cast to the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.Now we do know that the serpent was already in Paradise when God created man. He deceived Eve and then through Eve Adam.
He is still very busy, because he knows that he only has a short time left.
Rev. 12:12
” Therefore rejoice, O heaven and you who dwell in them. Woe to the inhabitants of the earth and sea! For the devil has come down to you having great wrath, because he knows that he has a short time.”
Let me say also my theory about the earth. In Genesis we read that the earth is void and empty. And the Angels shouted for joy. I always been wondering why God created a dark and void earth. And the Angels shouted for joy for that? Since Satan was cast down and was here before man, that Satan made such a mess out of this earth, and God recreated it for us to live in.
Now that is only a theory, so don't ask for a Scripture. Unless you have one? But it goes along with Science saying that this earth is older then 6000 years.
Peace and Love IreneIrene……….Your leaving out where it says Lucifer was a MAN? Why do you do that? Isa 14:16….They that see you shall narrowly look upon you and consider you, saying, is this (the man) that made the earth tremble, that did shake Kingdoms. Not super being Here just a Plain Man.
Jodi's Posts is both scriptural, and accurate. IMO
peace and love……………….gene
Jodi………..If they can't get it with all the sound scriptures you have given, there just is not light in them. IMO
peace and love to you and yours………….gene
Hi Jodi,
Indeed Jesus said the same thing to Satan when he was being tested that he said to the adversary in Peter.
We are promised that God will crush satan under our feet[Rom16]
How can you when you cannot see him?Nick…….The adversary in Peter was Peters own stubborn nature not some Spook going around jumping in and out of people, as you assume. Peter himself was being a adversary to Jesus. Jesus said Have i not chosen you and one of you (IS A DEVIL) an Adversary, also said to the Pharisees you are of your Father the Devil (the adversary) and do the deed of your father. The adversary of GOD is fallen Mankind, who lives in rebellion to GOD. Jodi has explained it right and proved what she was saying with many scriptures, you on the other hand only make suppositions to try to support you ideologies, “the sum of thy word is truth” . Man is held accountable for his (OWN) actions even as Peter was By Jesus. IMO
peace and love………………….gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 22 2009,07:31) Hi Jodi,
Indeed Jesus said the same thing to Satan when he was being tested that he said to the adversary in Peter.
We are promised that God will crush satan under our feet[Rom16]
How can you when you cannot see him?
Hi brother Nick,
You mean to say that we are going to crush a spirit being (Satan) literally under our feet?Does literalism of Bible not ofend you?
Nick………..Jesus said he who comes after me must bear his (cross) another word His own crucification, this crucification is putting our own human natures to death, not stepping on the head of some mysterious Satan being . WE are the satans and devils its that carnal nature in man that works though HIS so called (FREE) WILL, the spirit (intellect) of disobedience, that must be put to death, not some mysterious being going around jumping in and out of People. You need to come out of the false teachings of the fallen churches. IMO
peace and love………………………..gene
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