Jesus the source of all things!

[942767]

Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 21 2014,02:12)

Marty Quote And I am also correct in this case, the Word of God is always what God has spoken, but there is an outward man and a inward man which is this case the spirit that was formed in Jesus by the Word of God that he obeyed unto death on the cross, and is the same Word of God by which he will judge the living and the dead. this needs background and scriptures , the inward man is the one that walks with God the outward man is the one that walks in vain and in the flesh , am I right

Hi Pierre:

As Christians we have been saved in a physical body, and that is our outward man, and it will either go by the grave or it will be transformed to a spiritual body when the Lord comes for the church should we be alive at the time of his coming.

The inward man is the spirit that is being formed in us by our Father as we learn to apply the Word of God in our daily lives.  This is the person that we are.  The life that we live determines who we are.  The outward man is the vessel or temporary tent that houses our spirit man, and out of which we operate in the physical realm. But if we continue in the faith, we will have a spiritual body for our spirit man, when the Lord comes for the church either in the resurrection from the dead or in the transformation if we are alive.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[NickHassan]

Hi 94,
Of course there is a division between the spirit given by God which returns to Him[eccl12] and the SOUL
Heb 4.12

[942767]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 21 2014,06:43)

Hi 94, Of course there is a division between the spirit given by God which returns to Him[eccl12] and the SOUL Heb 4.12

Hi Nick:

If we go by the grave, the spirit man goes to God when we die, and the soul is asleep until the resurrection, and then the spirit being will be united with the soul in the new spirtual body.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[NickHassan]

Hi 94,
Men [souls] sleep in the earth awaiting judgement when the spirit returns to God and the body decays.
The resurrection will be from the earth

[mikeboll64]

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 20 2014,08:02)

Hi Mike & Wakeup: I have already been over the things that you present to me in your last posts to me, and there is not need for me to keep going over the same things with you time and time again.  I have given you my understanding of the scriptures. We are all responsible to God for what we teach, and so, I will just pray that God will correct whoever is not teaching the truth. Love in Christ, Marty

Fair enough Marty,

But it seems that each time we go through these things, you move a little closer to the sensible truth of the matter.

That is a good thing. So hit me up any time you want to go over everything again.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Wakeup @ Mar. 20 2014,11:21)

We know that Jesus was a spirit being made into a flesh being. This spirit being was with God and had glory with God. This means that HE was there,before the earth was. The problem we have, is to understand who/what; this spirit being is. Scriptures tell us; HE is the Word of God.

You started off so well, but then went downhill fast, Wakeup.

The part of your post that I quoted is correct.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 20 2014,14:07)

Hi 94, Men [souls] sleep in the earth awaiting judgement when the spirit returns to God and the body decays. The resurrection will be from the earth

I agree with you on this one, Nick.

The body decays and disappears.

The spirit that animated us, which was on loan to us from God, goes back to Him who gave it.

And the soul sleeps and is conscious of nothing at all.

There are, however, exceptions.  The soul of Samuel was once awakened by Saul.  (1 Samuel 28:3-20)

And the souls of those who were killed directly because of the word of God and the testimony about Jesus they had maintained are conscious and in heaven with God, waiting for God's vengeance to be poured out on the wicked.  (Rev 6:9, 20:4)

[NickHassan]

Hi MB,
Under the throne is not necessarily in heaven

[terraricca]

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 21 2014,01:40)

Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 21 2014,02:12) Marty Quote And I am also correct in this case, the Word of God is always what God has spoken, but there is an outward man and a inward man which is this case the spirit that was formed in Jesus by the Word of God that he obeyed unto death on the cross, and is the same Word of God by which he will judge the living and the dead. this needs background and scriptures , the inward man is the one that walks with God the outward man is the one that walks in vain and in the flesh , am I right Hi Pierre: As Christians we have been saved in a physical body, and that is our outward man, and it will either go by the grave or it will be transformed to a spiritual body when the Lord comes for the church should we be alive at the time of his coming. The inward man is the spirit that is being formed in us by our Father as we learn to apply the Word of God in our daily lives.  This is the person that we are.  The life that we live determines who we are.  The outward man is the vessel or temporary tent that houses our spirit man, and out of which we operate in the physical realm.  But if we continue in the faith, we will have a spiritual body for our spirit man, when the Lord comes for the church either in the resurrection from the dead or in the transformation if we are alive. Love in Christ, Marty

Marty

the body of Christ are the 144k and that I am sure is not us or may be few of us at best , but the great crowd is not part of the body just as the temple was not part of the out side court ,the priesthood are a chosen group the great crowd are people of faith that have believed in the name of Christ and his father ,

so it is the WORD OF GOD who was with God in the beginning that is the son of God and Christ Jesus ,that is the head of his church that he assemble sins his anointment at the Jordan river ,

the new covenant was made and is for those that he chooses, (144k) all others are welcome believers as per Revelation

Rev 7:9 After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands.
Rev 7:10 And they cried out in a loud voice:
“Salvation belongs to our God,
who sits on the throne,
and to the Lamb.”

you may think you are one of those that are called by Christ and this should be reflected in your true teaching ,and understanding in scriptures ,

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 20 2014,18:32)

Hi MB, Under the throne is not necessarily in heaven

Yeah, we've discussed this before, Nick – a long time ago.

The vision was of things that were happening in heaven – so I think it's an easy bet that the alter was in heaven. At any rate, those souls are definitely conscious, and are therefore an exception to the general rule.

And that was the real point I was making.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 11 2014,20:05)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 11 2014,08:23) Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God. Heb 12:2 Yes Keith.  No man has ever seen God Almighty.

Wow Mike, so you admit that Jesus must be God as the Father since he has seen the Father yet you say Jesus is still a man! John 6:46

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 11 2014,20:05)

But the only begotten god was sent by his and our Almighty God – to make that Almighty God known to us.

If Jesus has been given all Authority and all things are in his hands, then that means Jesus is “Almighty”. Then of course the scriptures call him God so that would make him God Almighty right? But you have chosen to diminish his authority and his role as God over “His People”. So sad Mike!

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 11 2014,20:05)

Jesus explained to us what true faith in God is.  There will be no other to explain it any better to us, because Jesus is still available to those who seek.  In this way, he began our search and understanding of true faith (the author), and is still there as the mediator between us and God, if we should ever start to doubt that faith (finisher).

Nice how you sugar coat it, but tell me Mike, just how does Jesus “explain to you about true faith”? Is he still the same to you as the scriptures says he is, the “same yesterday, today and forever”? Is he alive and still speaking to you Mike, and if so then how do you fellowship with him? You have dodged this question again. Why? Mike do you still call on the name of Jesus today?

Unto the church of God which is at Corinth, to them that are sanctified in Christ Jesus, called to be saints, with all that in every place call upon the name of Jesus Christ our Lord, both theirs and ours 1 Cor 1:2

If not why not? Please explain…

More later…

WJ

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 11 2014,20:05)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 11 2014,08:23) First, Paul says we are to look to Jesus. Why would he say that in the first place not only here but also in many others he points us to Jesus? Why would he not say “look to the Father through Jesus”? And what if Paul, in that particular instance, HAD said, “look to the Father through Jesus”?  Would it change your understanding at all?

That’s a hypothetical Mike, and no it wouldn’t change my mind because of the many scriptures I have posted where Paul makes Jesus equal to the Father like…

Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and “from the Lord Jesus Christ”.   1 Cor 1:2

And…
Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and “from the Lord Jesus Christ”. Eph 1:2

There you go Mike, Grace and Peace comes from the Father and the Lord Jesus!

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 11 2014,20:05)

Because there are about 100 times in scripture where Paul plainly distinguishes Jesus as someone other than, and lesser than, the one he calls “God”.

Really Mike, then why don’t you produce those scriptures that say Jesus is lesser than the Father God. I have given you over a 150 scriptures that says Jesus is our source and you have yet to prove that even one of those scriptures do not say so. All you can point to is the Father gave him all things after he had left all things and came into this world in the likeness of sinful flesh.

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 11 2014,20:05)

So when Paul says, “I thank God for you through Jesus Christ” – or something similar, do you take that to heart and understand that “Jesus” and “God” are two different beings that Paul is talking about?

Two different persons yes, but they are of the same kind, just as man is mankind, God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit are God kind.

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 11 2014,20:05)

If not, then why do you suppose “look to the Father through Jesus” would make an ounce of difference to you?

But the scripture nowhere says “look to the Father through Jesus the author and finisher of your faith” does it Mike? It says look to Jesus. Jesus himself said “come unto me”, but you will not come to him.

Call upon the name of Jesus and be saved Mike. Talk to Jesus and he will talk to you.

Lord willing, more later!

Blessings!

WJ

[942767]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 21 2014,07:07)

Hi 94, Men [souls] sleep in the earth awaiting judgement when the spirit returns to God and the body decays. The resurrection will be from the earth

Yes, of course, the mortal body will decay in the grave, but may be changed in a twinkling of an eye at the coming of the Lord for the church if that person is saved and is alive at his coming.

As to your statement, that the resurrection will be from the earth, I don't know from where else it can be.

And so, if you are disagreeing with me in what I said in my post to you., I am not sure that I am understanding with what you are disagreeing.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[NickHassan]

Hi 94,
SPIRIT MAN is not a scriptural term.

[942767]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 21 2014,11:11)

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 20 2014,08:02) Hi Mike & Wakeup: I have already been over the things that you present to me in your last posts to me, and there is not need for me to keep going over the same things with you time and time again.  I have given you my understanding of the scriptures. We are all responsible to God for what we teach, and so, I will just pray that God will correct whoever is not teaching the truth. Love in Christ, Marty Fair enough Marty, But it seems that each time we go through these things, you move a little closer to the sensible truth of the matter. That is a good thing.  So hit me up any time you want to go over everything again.

No, I don't agree that we are getting closer to the truth unless you have believed what I have stated.

Quote

Heb 1:3Who(Jesus) being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high;

His name is Jesus, and the names that the scriptures say that he is called are titles.

Quote

Rev 1:1: The Revelation of Jesus Christ, which God gave unto him, to shew unto his servants things which must shortly come to pass; and he sent and signified it by his angel unto his servant John: Rev. 22:16: I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.

His name was Jesus, and it is still Jesus according to the scriptures.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[942767]

Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 21 2014,11:38)

Quote (942767 @ Mar. 21 2014,01:40) Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 21 2014,02:12) Marty Quote And I am also correct in this case, the Word of God is always what God has spoken, but there is an outward man and a inward man which is this case the spirit that was formed in Jesus by the Word of God that he obeyed unto death on the cross, and is the same Word of God by which he will judge the living and the dead. this needs background and scriptures , the inward man is the one that walks with God the outward man is the one that walks in vain and in the flesh , am I right Hi Pierre: As Christians we have been saved in a physical body, and that is our outward man, and it will either go by the grave or it will be transformed to a spiritual body when the Lord comes for the church should we be alive at the time of his coming. The inward man is the spirit that is being formed in us by our Father as we learn to apply the Word of God in our daily lives.  This is the person that we are.  The life that we live determines who we are.  The outward man is the vessel or temporary tent that houses our spirit man, and out of which we operate in the physical realm.  But if we continue in the faith, we will have a spiritual body for our spirit man, when the Lord comes for the church either in the resurrection from the dead or in the transformation if we are alive. Love in Christ, Marty Marty the body of Christ are the 144k and that I am sure is not us or may be few of us at best , but the great crowd is not part of the body just as the temple was not part of the out side court ,the priesthood are a chosen group the great crowd are people of faith that have believed in the name of Christ and his father , so it is the WORD OF GOD who was with God in the beginning that is the son of God and Christ Jesus ,that is the head of his church that he assemble sins his anointment at the Jordan river , the new covenant was made and is for those that he chooses, (144k) all others are welcome believers   as per Revelation Rev 7:9 After this I looked and there before me was a great multitude that no one could count, from every nation, tribe, people and language, standing before the throne and in front of the Lamb. They were wearing white robes and were holding palm branches in their hands. Rev 7:10 And they cried out in a loud voice: “Salvation belongs to our God, who sits on the throne, and to the Lamb.” you may think you are one of those that are called by Christ and this should be reflected in your true teaching ,and understanding in scriptures ,

Hi Pierre:

If you have made Jesus your Lord, then you are a member of the body of Christ, and yes, the 144,000 are included in this body, but the body of Christ includes all the members., and so, I do not know why you keep stating that the body of Christ is only the 144,000?

This is what the scriptures state:

Quote

1 Co 12:14 For the body is not one member, but many. 15 If the foot shall say, Because I am not the hand, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? 16 And if the ear shall say, Because I am not the eye, I am not of the body; is it therefore not of the body? 17 If the whole body were an eye, where were the hearing? If the whole were hearing, where were the smelling? 18 But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him. 19 And if they were all one member, where were the body? 20 But now are they many members, yet but one body. 21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you. 22 Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary: 23 And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness. 24 For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked. 25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another. 26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it. 27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.

Quote

John 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing. 6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Love in Christ,
Marty

[942767]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 22 2014,06:24)

Hi 94, SPIRIT MAN is not a scriptural term.

Ok.

What do you suppose that the scriptures mean “by the inward man”?

Quote

1.Romans 7:22 For I delight in the law of God after the inward man: 2.2 Corinthians 4:16 For which cause we faint not; but though our outward man perish, yet the inward man is renewed day by day.

Quote

51.Romans 2:29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God

Love in Christ,
Marty

[mikeboll64]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 21 2014,10:14)

Wow Mike, so you admit that Jesus must be God as the Father since he has seen the Father yet you say Jesus is still a man! John 6:46

Not sure what you're talking about here, Keith.  Jesus was able to see God BEFORE he became flesh, and he can see God now that he is no longer flesh, but there is no indication from scripture that Jesus saw God with his human eyes.

My point was that John said no man had ever seen God…….. yet MANY men saw Jesus.  Ergo, Jesus is NOT God.

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 21 2014,10:14)

If Jesus has been given all Authority and all things are in his hands, then that means Jesus is “Almighty”.

Not exactly, Keith.  Read 1 Cor 15:27 again.  Learn what it means to read the emphatic statement, “everything has been placed under Jesus' feet”, while still being able to use your God-given common sense to understand that “everything” OBVIOUSLY doesn't include the God who placed those things under Jesus.

In that verse, Paul spells it out for those of us who are short on God-given common sense, but we can also apply that same common sense to scriptures where Paul didn't spell it out for us.

Obviously, the statement “all authority” does NOT mean Jesus has authority over his and our God, who GAVE him that authority in the first place.

Therefore, only the one who GAVE Jesus all that authority is truly “Almighty”.  If one had to be GIVEN that authority FROM someone else, then that one is clearly NOT “Almighty”.  Unlike Jesus, the one and only Almighty God has NEVER been GIVEN any authority from someone else, Keith.

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 21 2014,10:14)

Is he alive and still speaking to you Mike, and if so then how do you fellowship with him? You have dodged this question again. Why? Mike do you still call on the name of Jesus today?

Yes, I fellowship with Jesus and his and our God Jehovah.  Keith, surely you know that it was GOD who sent His Son to earth as HIS sacrificial lamb, and made it so the only name under heaven by which we can be saved is Jesus, right?

This was GOD'S will, and by GOD'S design, and for the pleasure of GOD.  It was GOD who made Jesus both Lord and King over us, right?  You know this stuff, right?

So how does calling on the name of God's most holy SERVANT Jesus Christ equate that servant with his own Master?  

If Jehovah gave us David as the mediator BETWEEN us and Him, would David also be God in your mind?  

Sure, the greatest SERVANT of God is wonderful.  But that servant is NOT the God he serves.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 21 2014,10:44)

Grace be unto you, and peace, from God our Father, and “from the Lord Jesus Christ”.   1 Cor 1:2 And… Grace be to you, and peace, from God our Father, and “from the Lord Jesus Christ”. Eph 1:2 There you go Mike, Grace and Peace comes from the Father and the Lord Jesus!

So when you read those greetings from Paul, you don't notice right away that “Jesus” is someone OTHER THAN “God”?  Interesting………..

Instead of seeing that obvious thing, your mind apparently convinces you that grace and peace coming from two persons equates those persons as the same exact being.  Even more interesting………..

This is the work of that comically flawed man-made doctrine of the trinity, Keith.  That doctrine has you brainwashed.  

Genesis 33
3 And he passed over before them, and bowed himself to the ground seven times, until he came near to his brother

10 And Jacob said, Nay, I pray thee, if now I have found grace in thy sight, then receive my present at my hand: for therefore I have seen thy face, as though I had seen the face of God, and thou wast pleased with me.

If that passage had been written about Jesus instead of Esau, you'd be going nuts with all the “Jesus is God” proof texts!  

Look Mike!  Jacob BOWED DOWN before him!  That means Jacob knew he was God!  Then he PRAYED to him, which definitely means he was God! And then he gave GRACE to Jacob, so that means he is God!  And then Jacob even said that seeing his face was as seeing the face of God!  That part SURELY means he was God, Mike!  

Anyway, many can offer their grace and their peace to many others.  This is not strictly an act of God only, Keith.

So forget the “grace and peace” part, and start focusing on the fact that Paul was talking about TWO DIFFERENT BEINGS – only ONE of whom was “God”.

[Wakeup]

God is the source of His Word.
God is the source of the Holy spirit.
God is the source of love.
God is the source of all things physical
and spiritual.

Gods Word brought things into action.
A command can not be carried out with the mind.
A command needs to be spoken out.
He brought forth all things into existence.
God commanded all things into existence,
by speaking out His Word.
In God's Word is power and life.

A living force with a form,as God's own image.
THE Word identified himself as *US*.(LET US).(Genesis).
When the Word speaks: it is really God's mind speaking out through His Word.

God thinks of what to say,and His Words comes out of the mouth of the being which is His own image.

This being which is God's own living Word,was made flesh.
He also spoke out what God was thinking.
He also was a living person in the flesh. Just as he was also a living being in heaven.

If you can connect; then You know the Father and the Son.

wakeup.

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