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Hi MB,
In the unusual language style of God Jesus Christ came from Heaven.
Jesus Christ has come in the flesh.We are meant to discern it was the Word that became one with Jesus at the Jordan
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 20 2012,06:59) Quote (kerwin @ April 19 2012,18:51) Mike, Where is that written?
Phil 2:6 and Romans 8:3
Mike,Those do not support what you wrote as we are to be like minded with Jesus Christ.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 21 2012,09:34) The words “who is in heaven” is most likely a marginal note that was inadvertently added into the words of Jesus. Jesus was not “in heaven” when he was speaking to Nicodemus. In Col 3, Paul is using zealous language. He does that often, like when he says “we have died to sin”. Nobody he said that to was literally dead.
I asked you if you disagreed with Jesus that he came down from heaven. What is your answer?
Mike,Jesus is in God and God is in Jesus. Jesus was in heaven at that time because he was and is in God; who was and is in heaven. Jesus had already ascended to heaven to be in God and God had come from heaven to be in Jesus.
The passage does say hath;which is an action which is already accomplished.
Hi,
From MB's notes on the NIV
“The reading “who is in heaven” thus seems to be too hard. All things considered, as intriguing as the longer reading is, it seems almost surely to have been a marginal gloss added inadvertently to the text in the process of transmission.”
WHERE IS THE EVIDENCE FOR SUCH CLAIMS?
TOO HARD does not washQuote (Gene Balthrop @ April 20 2012,23:23) Mike……….But what if it is not a “MARGINAL NOTE” then what is your answer?
Gene,I am convinced that someone would have asked for an explanation for Jesus saying he was in heaven at the time. If not Nicodemus, then the disciples who witnessed the conversation.
Why don't you focus on the fact that Jesus said no one has gone into heaven except for the one who came from heaven?
How can one “go into heaven” if heaven is just an abstract notion, like you preach?
Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 20 2012,23:45) We are meant to discern it was the Word that became one with Jesus at the Jordan.
Apparently not, Nick. If we were meant to discern such a doctrine, then there wouldn't be so many clear, scriptural obstacles to that doctrine.Your doctrine allows for God coming down from heaven, not to do His own will, but the will of God.
Your doctrine allows for God to be one witness, while the Father is His other witness.
You need to seriously rethink your doctrine, Nick. It doesn't align with the words of scripture.
Quote (kerwin @ April 21 2012,02:25) Mike, Those do not support what you wrote as we are to be like minded with Jesus Christ.
Yes they do, Kerwin. Those witnesses not only support what I wrote, but they are the witnesses that teach us what I wrote.Kerwin said:
Quote Jesus was in heaven at that time because he was and is in God; who was and is in heaven. Nick said:
Quote TOO HARD does not wash I invite you both to deal with the meat of the teaching, as I posted for Gene. Jesus said that no one had ever gone into heaven except for him, who came from heaven.
Deal with that part, and stop trying to confuse the teaching with words that could have been John's own words after the fact saying that Jesus is now back in heaven. There are many possibilities for those hard words, none of which change the teaching that Jesus came down from heaven, and that heaven is an actual PLACE that flesh cannot ENTER INTO.
Quote (kerwin @ April 22 2012,02:31) Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 21 2012,09:34) The words “who is in heaven” is most likely a marginal note that was inadvertently added into the words of Jesus. Jesus was not “in heaven” when he was speaking to Nicodemus. In Col 3, Paul is using zealous language. He does that often, like when he says “we have died to sin”. Nobody he said that to was literally dead.
I asked you if you disagreed with Jesus that he came down from heaven. What is your answer?
Mike,Jesus is in God and God is in Jesus. Jesus was in heaven at that time because he was and is in God; who was and is in heaven. Jesus had already ascended to heaven to be in God and God had come from heaven to be in Jesus.
The passage does say hath;which is an action which is already accomplished.
Kerwindid you sew the universe picture recently
this could help you to understand were is the heaven of the scriptures ,
the fact that you can not and will not believe the scriptures is for you unbelieving the scriptures ,
and this also you do not want to believe ,so could you tell what you believe in scriptures ,???
as I can see you do not believe they are the WORD OF GOD .
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 22 2012,02:29) Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 20 2012,23:45) We are meant to discern it was the Word that became one with Jesus at the Jordan.
Apparently not, Nick. If we were meant to discern such a doctrine, then there wouldn't be so many clear, scriptural obstacles to that doctrine.Your doctrine allows for God coming down from heaven, not to do His own will, but the will of God.
Your doctrine allows for God to be one witness, while the Father is His other witness.
You need to seriously rethink your doctrine, Nick. It doesn't align with the words of scripture.
Hi MB,
Your clarity is a mirage.It has even led you now to say Jesus was an angel and a lesser god.
CHRIST is the SERVANT
Well Nick,
Once again: Jesus IS called a god in scripture. He is not the GREAT God Jehovah, and therefore a lesser god.
Also, the English word “angel” refers to spirit messengers of God, of which Jesus most definitely is.
So thanks for pointing out once again that I preach what the scriptures preach.
Hi MB
THEREFORE belongs in weak greek logic.It is not a scriptural tool
You are alone in your view that Jesus an angel and a lesser god.
Better to be alone and aligned with scriptures than to have millions of supporters and contradict the scriptures.
Or perhaps you think sheer volume makes the Trinitarians right?
Btw, I'm not “alone” in this belief.
Hi MB,
No the JWs even go as far as to speculate that Jesus is the archangel Michael.The road of speculation is wide
Come back to spiritual understanding.
Eat the flesh and drink the blood of the Word.
Test your “spiritual understanding” against the scriptures, Nick.
If it doesn't align with them, then you are being led by the wrong spirit.
Nick,
I won't be addressing many of your posts from now on, okay? You are a pesky little mosquito hovering around my head buzzing unsubstantial noise.
If you ever actually make a scriptural point that seems to refute a statement or belief of mine, I will respond.
But I'm trying to answer to your smart-aleck, senseless remarks like, “Dig deeper to the rock”.
How does that refute anything I said? And this kind of silly remark sums up 99% of all of your remarks on this site, Nick.
I'm just tired of fending them off. So you keep slamming others here if it somehow makes you feel like more of a man, and I will just continue to ignore most of your posts.
Hi,
Phil 3
21Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.Quote (Nick Hassan @ April 26 2012,14:39) Hi,
Phil 3
21Who shall change our vile body, that it may be fashioned like unto his glorious body, according to the working whereby he is able even to subdue all things unto himself.
Nso you claim to be one of those who are redeemed from the earth
this is not to taken lightly
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