Jesus/ begotten, what it means

[bodhitharta]

And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn:
Exodus 4:21-23

We all know that God has called many sons and children so how is it Jesus is the only begotten son of God?

The fact is Jesus is the ONLY BORN of BODY son God created directly.

Adam was created from the earth and Eve was created from Adam and all humans were born from this unity of flesh, with Jesus he was the first son of God that God created out from another Person in this way Jesus is unique because he was born of Body God had never directly created a person in the womb before this or since.

This is why the Virginity was so important because Adam was made from virgin earth and so Jesus was made from a virgin of the earth.

Genesis 2

5And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground.

6But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground.

7And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

[terraricca]

hi
why you don t pick up a dictionary to find out wath it means ?

[bodhitharta]

Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 23 2009,15:48)

hi why you don t pick up a dictionary to find out wath it means ?

Because if you simply go by the dictionary it wouldn't tell you what it means metaphorically, would it? Paul said he “begot” Timothy in the Gospel and then said timothy was his son. Now do you think timothy was Paul's actual son? NO.

[banana]

bod

Did Paul ever say that Timothy was his begotten son, or his first born?

Georg

[bodhitharta]

Quote (banana @ Nov. 24 2009,11:47)

bod Did Paul ever say that Timothy was his begotten son, or his first born? Georg

I beseech thee for my son Onesimus, whom I have begotten in my bonds:
Philemon 1:9-11

1 Corinthians 4:14-16 (King James Version)

14I write not these things to shame you, but as my beloved sons I warn you.

15For though ye have ten thousand instructers in Christ, yet have ye not many fathers: for in Christ Jesus I have begotten you through the gospel.

16Wherefore I beseech you, be ye followers of me.

[banana]

bod

You're telling me that, “begotten in my bonds” and “begotten you through the gospel”, is or means the same as, “firstborn” and “only begotten Son”?

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg…….If you take time to research you will find it really says (uniquely) begotten son. Not ONLY because scripture shows GOD has Many son in Heaven. Jesus was the First to come into that relationship from among Men. Firstborn from mankind into the Kingdom of GOD. He is unique in that sense. WE have born through the seed of man, the nature of man earthly and carnal , we who have the seed of GOD in Us are begotten from above and His seed (HOLY SPIRIT) intellect unites with us and changes our Nature to a Heavenly ONE.

Georg, why do you and others want to separate Jesus from a (exact Same) Identity, what is behind this effort, what is gained by making Jesus different from us or giving Him some Special advantage we don't Have available to us. Can't you see how that brakes down (HOPE) and the reality What GOD can DO for us all. This false teaching of the preexistence turn peoples eyes to Jesus and Not to GOD the FATHER who saved HIM and Perfected HIM. This tunning is the process of creating another GOD, worshiping Jesus instead of who Jesus worshiped and gave us instruction of having a proper relationship with the FATHER. The doctrine of Preexistence is as great a sin as the doctrine of the TRINITY, maybe even MORE, because it separates our likeness of Jesus. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Gene @ Nov. 24 2009,18:35)

Georg…….If you take time to research you will find it really says (uniquely) begotten son. Not ONLY because scripture shows GOD has Many son in Heaven. Jesus was the First to come into that relationship from among Men. Firstborn from mankind into the Kingdom of GOD. He is unique in that sense. WE have born through the seed of man, the nature of man earthly and carnal , we who have the seed of GOD in Us are begotten from above and His seed (HOLY SPIRIT) intellect unites with us and changes our Nature to a Heavenly ONE. Georg, why do you and others want to separate Jesus from a (exact Same) Identity, what is behind this effort, what is gained by making Jesus different from us or giving Him some Special  advantage we don't Have available to us. Can't you see how that brakes down (HOPE) and the reality What GOD can DO for us all. This false teaching of the preexistence turn peoples eyes to Jesus and Not to GOD the FATHER who saved HIM and Perfected HIM. This tunning is the process of creating another GOD, worshiping Jesus instead of who Jesus worshiped and gave us instruction of having a proper relationship with the FATHER.  The doctrine of Preexistence is as great a sin as the doctrine of the TRINITY, maybe even MORE, because it separates our likeness of Jesus. IMO peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene

Gene

Straw mans argument!

Do you or has any man had the “Spirit without Measure”?

He did have an advantage over us for it is he that came to destroy the works of the devil and the flesh so that we through him can overcome also!

He was without sin! We are not!

WJ

[bodhitharta]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 25 2009,10:47)

Quote (Gene @ Nov. 24 2009,18:35) Georg…….If you take time to research you will find it really says (uniquely) begotten son. Not ONLY because scripture shows GOD has Many son in Heaven. Jesus was the First to come into that relationship from among Men. Firstborn from mankind into the Kingdom of GOD. He is unique in that sense. WE have born through the seed of man, the nature of man earthly and carnal , we who have the seed of GOD in Us are begotten from above and His seed (HOLY SPIRIT) intellect unites with us and changes our Nature to a Heavenly ONE. Georg, why do you and others want to separate Jesus from a (exact Same) Identity, what is behind this effort, what is gained by making Jesus different from us or giving Him some Special  advantage we don't Have available to us. Can't you see how that brakes down (HOPE) and the reality What GOD can DO for us all. This false teaching of the preexistence turn peoples eyes to Jesus and Not to GOD the FATHER who saved HIM and Perfected HIM. This tunning is the process of creating another GOD, worshiping Jesus instead of who Jesus worshiped and gave us instruction of having a proper relationship with the FATHER.  The doctrine of Preexistence is as great a sin as the doctrine of the TRINITY, maybe even MORE, because it separates our likeness of Jesus. IMO peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene Gene Straw mans argument! Do you or has any man had the “Spirit without Measure”? He did have an advantage over us for it is he that came to destroy the works of the devil and the flesh so that we through him can overcome also! He was without sin! We are not! WJ

not according to Paul

Hebrews 5:2-6 (English Standard Version)
2(A) He can deal gently with the ignorant and wayward, since he himself(B) is beset with weakness. 3Because of this he is obligated to offer sacrifice for his own sins just as he does for those of the people. 4And(D) no one takes this honor for himself, but only when called by God,(E) just as Aaron was.

5So also Christ(F) did not exalt himself to be made a high priest, but was appointed by him who said to him,

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 24 2009,19:49)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 25 2009,10:47) Quote (Gene @ Nov. 24 2009,18:35) Georg…….If you take time to research you will find it really says (uniquely) begotten son. Not ONLY because scripture shows GOD has Many son in Heaven. Jesus was the First to come into that relationship from among Men. Firstborn from mankind into the Kingdom of GOD. He is unique in that sense. WE have born through the seed of man, the nature of man earthly and carnal , we who have the seed of GOD in Us are begotten from above and His seed (HOLY SPIRIT) intellect unites with us and changes our Nature to a Heavenly ONE. Georg, why do you and others want to separate Jesus from a (exact Same) Identity, what is behind this effort, what is gained by making Jesus different from us or giving Him some Special  advantage we don't Have available to us. Can't you see how that brakes down (HOPE) and the reality What GOD can DO for us all. This false teaching of the preexistence turn peoples eyes to Jesus and Not to GOD the FATHER who saved HIM and Perfected HIM. This tunning is the process of creating another GOD, worshiping Jesus instead of who Jesus worshiped and gave us instruction of having a proper relationship with the FATHER.  The doctrine of Preexistence is as great a sin as the doctrine of the TRINITY, maybe even MORE, because it separates our likeness of Jesus. IMO peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene Gene Straw mans argument! Do you or has any man had the “Spirit without Measure”? He did have an advantage over us for it is he that came to destroy the works of the devil and the flesh so that we through him can overcome also! He was without sin! We are not! WJ not according to Paul Hebrews 5:2-6 (English Standard Version) 2(A) He can deal gently with the ignorant and wayward, since he himself(B) is beset with weakness. 3Because of this he is obligated to offer sacrifice for his own sins© just as he does for those of the people. 4And(D) no one takes this honor for himself, but only when called by God,(E) just as Aaron was. 5So also Christ(F) did not exalt himself to be made a high priest, but was appointed by him who said to him,

BD

It was Paul that wrote these words in the same book!

For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, “YET WITHOUT SIN”. Heb 4:15

For he hath made him to be sin for us, “WHO KNEW NO SIN”; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. 2 Cor 5:21

For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps: “WHO DID NO SIN, neither was guile found in his mouth: 1 Peter 2:21, 22

Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and “HATH NOTHING IN ME”. John 14:30

”WHICH OF YOU CONVINCETH ME OF SIN?” And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? John 8:46

“BUT LIKE A TRUE MUSLIM YOU PIT THE HOLY SCRIPTURES AGAINST THEMSELVES”!

The passages you quote are not referring to Jesus but to the Levitical Priesthood which Jesus “WHO KNEW NO SIN” replaced after the order of Melchisedec and brought in a better Covenant by the shedding of his blood and the offering of his body as a living sacrifice!

Believe the Gospel and be saved!

WJ

[bodhitharta]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 25 2009,12:31)

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 24 2009,19:49) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Nov. 25 2009,10:47) Quote (Gene @ Nov. 24 2009,18:35) Georg…….If you take time to research you will find it really says (uniquely) begotten son. Not ONLY because scripture shows GOD has Many son in Heaven. Jesus was the First to come into that relationship from among Men. Firstborn from mankind into the Kingdom of GOD. He is unique in that sense. WE have born through the seed of man, the nature of man earthly and carnal , we who have the seed of GOD in Us are begotten from above and His seed (HOLY SPIRIT) intellect unites with us and changes our Nature to a Heavenly ONE. Georg, why do you and others want to separate Jesus from a (exact Same) Identity, what is behind this effort, what is gained by making Jesus different from us or giving Him some Special  advantage we don't Have available to us. Can't you see how that brakes down (HOPE) and the reality What GOD can DO for us all. This false teaching of the preexistence turn peoples eyes to Jesus and Not to GOD the FATHER who saved HIM and Perfected HIM. This tunning is the process of creating another GOD, worshiping Jesus instead of who Jesus worshiped and gave us instruction of having a proper relationship with the FATHER.  The doctrine of Preexistence is as great a sin as the doctrine of the TRINITY, maybe even MORE, because it separates our likeness of Jesus. IMO peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene Gene Straw mans argument! Do you or has any man had the “Spirit without Measure”? He did have an advantage over us for it is he that came to destroy the works of the devil and the flesh so that we through him can overcome also! He was without sin! We are not! WJ not according to Paul Hebrews 5:2-6 (English Standard Version) 2(A) He can deal gently with the ignorant and wayward, since he himself(B) is beset with weakness. 3Because of this he is obligated to offer sacrifice for his own sins© just as he does for those of the people. 4And(D) no one takes this honor for himself, but only when called by God,(E) just as Aaron was. 5So also Christ(F) did not exalt himself to be made a high priest, but was appointed by him who said to him, BD It was Paul that wrote these words in the same book! For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, “YET WITHOUT SIN”. Heb 4:15 For he hath made him to be sin for us, “WHO KNEW NO SIN”; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. 2 Cor 5:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps: “WHO DID NO SIN, neither was guile found in his mouth: 1 Peter 2:21, 22 Hereafter I will not talk much with you: for the prince of this world cometh, and “HATH NOTHING IN ME”. John 14:30 ”WHICH OF YOU CONVINCETH ME OF SIN?” And if I say the truth, why do ye not believe me? John 8:46 “BUT LIKE A TRUE MUSLIM YOU PIT THE HOLY SCRIPTURES AGAINST THEMSELVES”! The passages you quote are not referring to Jesus but to the Levitical Priesthood which Jesus “WHO KNEW NO SIN” replaced after the order of Melchisedec and brought in a better Covenant by the shedding of his blood and the offering of his body as a living sacrifice! Believe the Gospel and be saved! WJ

WJ,

I didn't say that Jesus sinned I said Paul suggested such, Now why haven't you been so bold enough to answer my posts in the thread Blashemy and Trinity?

Don't be afraid, you will learn that the trinity is false.

[NickHassan]

Hi BD,
Who said Jesus was strong in himself?

God's power shows up best in weak people.[Is53]

He could do all things by the One who strengthened him.

[banana]

Quote (Gene @ Nov. 25 2009,10:35)

Georg…….If you take time to research you will find it really says (uniquely) begotten son. Not ONLY because scripture shows GOD has Many son in Heaven. Jesus was the First to come into that relationship from among Men. Firstborn from mankind into the Kingdom of GOD. He is unique in that sense. WE have born through the seed of man, the nature of man earthly and carnal , we who have the seed of GOD in Us are begotten from above and His seed (HOLY SPIRIT) intellect unites with us and changes our Nature to a Heavenly ONE. Georg, why do you and others want to separate Jesus from a (exact Same) Identity, what is behind this effort, what is gained by making Jesus different from us or giving Him some Special  advantage we don't Have available to us. Can't you see how that brakes down (HOPE) and the reality What GOD can DO for us all. This false teaching of the preexistence turn peoples eyes to Jesus and Not to GOD the FATHER who saved HIM and Perfected HIM. This tunning is the process of creating another GOD, worshiping Jesus instead of who Jesus worshiped and gave us instruction of having a proper relationship with the FATHER.  The doctrine of Preexistence is as great a sin as the doctrine of the TRINITY, maybe even MORE, because it separates our likeness of Jesus. IMO peace and love to you and Irene……………………gene

Gene

Rev 3:14 ¶ And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;

If you are not sure what beginning means, look it up in your dictionary.

Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:

While you're in your dictionary, look up firstborn.

Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

How could he have created all things if he had his beginning at his physical birth, or how could have been before all things, next verse.

Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

If you call these scriptures false teaching, you call God a Liar, because he dictated them.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg……….Beginning can mean many beginnings, which beginning is scripture referencing Here is a matter of opinion. The beginning of all creation or the beginning of the Creation of man becoming the sons of GOD by the resurrection of Jesus as the FIRSTBORN of the dead, a beginning of God Creating Man into His Childern by raising Jesus from the grave into the kingdom of GOD. Which was GOD Purpose for man all along. Jesus is before all things, or has preeminence in all things because he is the Firstborn from ordinary man kind. Jesus did not preexist his berth here on earth except in the Perfect (PLAN) and WILL of GOD. Trinity and Preexistence both support each other and are from the exact same source, false Religion fostered by Mystery RELIGIONS> IMO

gene

[banana]

Quote (bodhitharta @ Nov. 22 2009,09:10)

And thou shalt say unto Pharaoh, Thus saith the LORD, Israel is my son, even my firstborn: Exodus 4:21-23 We all know that God has called many sons and children so how is it Jesus is the only begotten son of God? The fact is Jesus is the ONLY BORN of BODY son God created directly. Adam was created from the earth and Eve was created from Adam and all humans were born from this unity of flesh, with Jesus he was the first son of God that God created out from another Person in this way Jesus is unique because he was born of Body God had never directly created a person in the womb before this or since. This is why the Virginity was so important because Adam was made from virgin earth and so Jesus was made from a virgin of the earth. Genesis 2 5And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and there was not a man to till the ground. 6But there went up a mist from the earth, and watered the whole face of the ground. 7And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

bod

For God to call Israel, meaning the nation, his firstborn, is symbolically meant. Israel was the first nation to be taught of God through Moses, the rest will be taught by his son Jesus in the millennium.
When God created Adam of the dust of the earth, it was not exactly virgin earth. The earth and the universe was created long before then.
Remember when God created all the vegetation, the fish, the birds, the cattle and the beasts, he created them “after their kind”. When you create something after something, that means it had to be there before.
You also notice that he did not create man after his kind, his kind did not exist before.

Georg

[Author]

Posts