Is salvation by us, or of God?

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  • #61058
    kejonn
    Participant

    CO,

    I'm not under the Law either. But I do value these verses

    2Ti 3:16 All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness;

    1Cr 7:19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but what matters is the keeping of the commandments of God.

    1Jo 2:3 By this we know that we have come to know Him, if we keep His commandments.
    1Jo 2:4 The one who says, “I have come to know Him,” and does not keep His commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him;
    1Jo 2:5 but whoever keeps His word, in him the love of God has truly been perfected. By this we know that we are in Him:
    1Jo 2:6 the one who says he abides in Him ought himself to walk in the same manner as He walked.

    #61074
    kejonn
    Participant

    Are we all going to remain unsaved? Well, some of us who belong to an elite group will have a chance. Let's look at these elite groups and we can figure out if we belong to any of them.

    Mat 15:24 But He answered and said, “I was sent only to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.”

    So Yeshua came for the Jews. If you are a Jew, you have a chance for eternal life, if you believe.

    Rom 1:7 to all who are beloved of God in Rome, called {as} saints: Grace to you and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

    If you are a Roman, you have a chance!

    1Cr 1:2 To the church of God which is at Corinth, to those who have been sanctified in Christ Jesus, saints by calling, with all who in every place call on the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, their Lord and ours:
    2Cr 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, and Timothy our brother, To the church of God which is at Corinth with all the saints who are throughout Achaia:

    If you are a part of the church of God which is at Corinth, you might just make it.

    Gal 1:2 and all the brethren who are with me, To the churches of Galatia:

    Here's to hoping to you are from the churches in Galatia.

    Eph 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus by the will of God, To the saints who are at Ephesus and who are faithful in Christ Jesus:

    Hmmm, seems like Paul is writing only to those who already know Christ at Ephesus.

    Phl 1:1 Paul and Timothy, bond-servants of Christ Jesus, To all the saints in Christ Jesus who are in Philippi, including the overseers and deacons:

    Again, only for the saved, but this time in Philippi.

    Col 1:2 To the saints and faithful brethren in Christ who are at Colossae: Grace to you and peace from God our Father.

    Paul sure was exclusionary in his writings wasn't he? This letter is for his brethen in Christ at Colossae, so its doubtful we can use this book.

    1Th 1:1 Paul and Silvanus and Timothy, To the church of the Thessalonians in God the Father and the Lord Jesus Christ: Grace to you and peace.
    2Th 1:1 Paul and Silvanus and Timothy, To the church of the Thessalonians in God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ:

    What a disturbing trend. Are you from the church of the Thessalonians? If not, this book isn't for you.

    1Ti 1:2 To Timothy, my true child in the faith: Grace, mercy and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.
    2Ti 1:2 To Timothy, my beloved son: Grace, mercy and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Lord.

    Wow, now Paul is really being exclusive. If your name is Timothy, you might have a chance, but Paul kinda squashes that hope with the conditions “my true child in the faith” and “my beloved son”. Oh well.

    Tts 1:4 To Titus, my true child in a common faith: Grace and peace from God the Father and Christ Jesus our Savior.

    See above. Instead of Timothy, only Titus. In my part of the world, I don't hear of many people named Titus.

    Phm 1:1 Paul, a prisoner of Christ Jesus, and Timothy our brother, To Philemon our beloved brother and fellow worker,
    Phm 1:2 and to Apphia our sister, and to Archippus our fellow soldier, and to the church in your house:

    Well, at least Paul expanded this book to three people. See if you fit the qualifications.

    Thus far then, I can stop reading the Old Testament, the four Gospels, and all of Paul's letters. My Bible is getting rather thin. Let's see what other books are for us.

    Jam 1:1 James, a bond-servant of God and of the Lord Jesus Christ, To the twelve tribes who are dispersed abroad: Greetings.

    1Pe 1:1 Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ, To those who reside as aliens, scattered throughout Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia,

    2Jo 1:1 The elder to the chosen lady and her children, whom I love in truth; and not only I, but also all who know the truth,

    3Jo 1:1 The elder to the beloved Gaius, whom I love in truth.

    Rev 1:4 John to the seven churches that are in Asia: Grace to you and peace, from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne,

    Well, there you have it. If you don't belong to any of the groups addressed above, you might just be able to read, cherish and adhere to certain parts of Acts, Hebrews (maybe), 2 Peter, 1 John, and Jude. Hey, you can certainly fit that in your back pocket!

    Of course, I'm being facetious. But we risk a great danger in picking and choosing which parts of the Bible, certainly anything in the New Testament, apply to us as Gentiles. If Yeshua was commissioned to the Jews, and he did not make a statement to the contrary before his death, then his death was only for the Jews too right? The sign on the cross said “King of the Jews”.

    Might as well take up Buddhism then…

    #61088
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi,
    So all the apostles letters are written to the saved.
    Seek ye first the kingdom
    then everything else will be added to you.

    #61092
    kejonn
    Participant

    Nick,

    To me its all good, from Genesis to Revelation.

    #61100
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi KJ,
    Absolutely.
    And the Saved are ONE in the body of Christ whether 2000 years ago or today, in Ephesus or in Dunedin.
    All are one in Christ enlivened and empowered by the Spirit of Christ.

    #165797
    chosenone
    Participant

    WHAT DISTINGUISHES our position from that of many others is briefly summed up in a single passage of scripture, one of the simplest, yet by far the most comprehensive in the Word of God. It is this: “out of Him and through Him and for Him is all . . .” (Rom.11:36). We find the source of everything in God, the course of everything is according to His will, and He is the goal of all. The realization of this sublime truth gives comfort and stability and satisfaction, but above all it glorifies God and His Christ.
    All Scripture (when properly translated) is in full accord with this majestic summary of God’s course with His creatures. While this truth is so simple, it solves almost all of those knotty problems of theology which make the Bible so hard to understand for many people. If those new to these things will have a little patient perseverance they will be rewarded with such a grand and glorious conception of God and His purpose and grace as will turn their theological gropings into the brightness of the noonday sun, and will not only illumine the glory of God, but the lives of those who step out of the shadows into His marvelous light.

    Copied from Concordant Publishing Concern,

    #165799
    chosenone
    Participant

    THAT all is out of God is the basic truth of divine revelation, yet who believes it? Almost all, even men who stand fearlessly for other truths, cannot break the bands of tradition, to acknowledge that evil as well as good is out of Him. The sad effect is that, not being able to glorify Him as God, they become vain in their reasonings, in their attempt to spare God the onus of evil. Almost all translators and expositors do their best to expunge this great truth from the Scriptures, so it seldom is allowed to reach our ears. When God says,

    See now that I, I am He!
    And there are no other elohim beside Me.
    I Myself put to death, and I keep alive.
    I have transfixed, and I Myself shall heal. (Deut.32:39)

    We listen politely, but do not think of believing what He says. God, we say, allows, permits, bears with evil, but of course He never began it! We are like the heathen, who usually have at least two gods, one good (whom we do not need to regard very seriously) and one evil (who is dangerous and needs to be propitiated). Yahweh Elohim Himself says:

    I am Yahweh, and there is no other;
    Except for Me, there is no Elohim . . . .
    Former of light and Creator of darkness,
    Maker of good and Creator of evil,
    I, Yahweh, make all these. (Isa.45:5,7)

    The most incredible explanations are offered to keep us from the fundamental of all fundamentals, that there is only one God. Satan is usually made the creator of evil. How foolish to flatly oppose God’s own words, and give His deity to another! Thanks be to Him that He alone is the Source of all, and has control of all, for only so could He bring His creation to its glorious goal! Let us revel in one God, the Father out of Whom all is, even the evil which He will transmute into glory for Himself and blessing for His creatures!

    THANKING GOD
    WE HAVE the precious privilege of giving thanks at all times and for all things: not for good things only, but for apparently bad things; not in seasons of prosperity alone, but when all seems dark and dismal, even “when all further expectation of being saved” (cp Acts 27:20), seems taken from us. All things, whatever their appearance, are cooperating for our welfare, and the keener our realization of God’s supervising care and control, the more ready we are to rejoice, even in the midst of sorrow and suffering.
    It is not the mission of this little magazine merely to teach the truth, but to put our readers into the most intimate relations with God, Who is Truth.
    It is possible to talk about the omnipotence, omnipresence and immanence of the Deity, yet deny them in thought and action. The apostle Paul wished to attain, in his experience, to the resurrection life. So it is our privilege, not only to see the grand vision of God’s ultimate, but to allow its rays to illumine our lives even now.
    Unless God retains the reins of the universe in His hands today, He can never guide it to the goal. And, since He controls all and cares for His own, we must not only trust, we may not merely acquiesce, we should tune our hearts to continual thanksgiving, unphrased, inaudible perhaps, but grateful to the heart of God.

    A. E. Knoch

    Copyright © Concordant Publishing Concern
    15570 Knochaven Road, Santa Clarita, CA 91387, U.S.A. 661-252-2112

    #166103
    chosenone
    Participant

    Anyone?

    #166105
    terraricca
    Participant

    hi chone
    Rom 11;36 talks about Christ as being the Word,the first born of creation,

    #166116
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi T,
    Jesus is not mentioned in Rom 11.36 but just his Father God.

    #166152
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    Quote (chosenone @ Dec. 22 2009,17:12)
    THAT all is out of God is the basic truth of divine revelation, yet who believes it? Almost all, even men who stand fearlessly for other truths, cannot break the bands of tradition, to acknowledge that evil as well as good is out of Him. The sad effect is that, not being able to glorify Him as God, they become vain in their reasonings, in their attempt to spare God the onus of evil. Almost all translators and expositors do their best to expunge this great truth from the Scriptures, so it seldom is allowed to reach our ears. When God says,

    See now that I, I am He!
    And there are no other elohim beside Me.
    I Myself put to death, and I keep alive.
    I have transfixed, and I Myself shall heal.  (Deut.32:39)

    We listen politely, but do not think of believing what He says. God, we say, allows, permits, bears with evil, but of course He never began it! We are like the heathen, who usually have at least two gods, one good (whom we do not need to regard very seriously) and one evil (who is dangerous and needs to be propitiated). Yahweh Elohim Himself says:

    I am Yahweh, and there is no other;
    Except for Me, there is no Elohim . . . .
    Former of light and Creator of darkness,
    Maker of good and Creator of evil,
    I, Yahweh, make all these.  (Isa.45:5,7)

    The most incredible explanations are offered to keep us from the fundamental of all fundamentals, that there is only one God. Satan is usually made the creator of evil. How foolish to flatly oppose God’s own words, and give His deity to another! Thanks be to Him that He alone is the Source of all, and has control of all, for only so could He bring His creation to its glorious goal! Let us revel in one God, the Father out of Whom all is, even the evil which He will transmute into glory for Himself and blessing for His creatures!

    THANKING GOD
    WE HAVE the precious privilege of giving thanks at all times and for all things: not for good things only, but for apparently bad things; not in seasons of prosperity alone, but when all seems dark and dismal, even “when all further expectation of being saved” (cp Acts 27:20), seems taken from us. All things, whatever their appearance, are cooperating for our welfare, and the keener our realization of God’s supervising care and control, the more ready we are to rejoice, even in the midst of sorrow and suffering.
    It is not the mission of this little magazine merely to teach the truth, but to put our readers into the most intimate relations with God, Who is Truth.
    It is possible to talk about the omnipotence, omnipresence and immanence of the Deity, yet deny them in thought and action. The apostle Paul wished to attain, in his experience, to the resurrection life. So it is our privilege, not only to see the grand vision of God’s ultimate, but to allow its rays to illumine our lives even now.
    Unless God retains the reins of the universe in His hands today, He can never guide it to the goal. And, since He controls all and cares for His own, we must not only trust, we may not merely acquiesce, we should tune our hearts to continual thanksgiving, unphrased, inaudible perhaps, but grateful to the heart of God.

    A. E. Knoch

    Copyright © Concordant Publishing Concern
    15570 Knochaven Road, Santa Clarita, CA 91387, U.S.A. 661-252-2112


    Chosenone……..Good Post, i totally agree that GOD is in control of everything, be it good or evil. and we need to be as James said, “Brethern above all things be you thankful”. Our GOD is the JUDGE and the JURY of all things , Even when He gave Jesus the power to Judge mankind it is still through HIS Spirit (intellect) that Judgment will be rendered, and where it say “and Judgment will be given to he Saints of the MOST HIGH”, it still will be by HIS SPIRIT this JUDGMENT will be. both in heaven and earth, none can deliver from his hands, but (ALL) can be delivered (BY) His hands.

    peace and love to you and yours……………….gene

    #166254
    chosenone
    Participant

    Quote (Nick Hassan @ July 23 2007,07:55)
    Hi,
    So all the apostles letters are written to the saved.
    Seek ye first the kingdom
    then everything else will be added to you.


    NH,
    Correction, Pauls letters are ADDRESSED to the saints, his message is to the “nations'.
    Ro.15:16 …because of the grace being given to me from God,
    16 for me to be the minister of Christ Jesus for the nations, acting as a priest of the evangel of God, that the approach present of the nations may be becoming well received, having been hallowed by holy spirit.

    You're wecome.

    Blessings.

    #166359
    chosenone
    Participant

    Thanks Gene, much appreciated.

    Blessings.

    #166364
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi CO,
    Indeed the message of God through Paul was preached to the nations to reconcile them with God.
    Then his godly teachings are food to them.

    #166502
    chosenone
    Participant

    NH.
    The meanings of “conciliate” and “reconciliate” are very important in understanding scripture.

    Example: Two are at odds with each other, lets call them 'A' and 'B'.
    'A' relents, forgives, and “conciliates” to 'B', but 'B' does not to 'A'.
    Now if 'B' decides to forgive as well, Then'A' and “B” have “reconciliated” to each other, a joint reunion so to speak.
    In review: If one relents and the other doesn't, this is a “conciliation”.
    If then the other also relents also, this is a “reconciliation”.

    A scripture as in 2Cor.5:18-21 … Yet all is of God, Who conciliates us to Himself through Christ, and is giving us the dispensation of the conciliation,
    19 how that God was in Christ, conciliating the world to Himself, not reckoning their offenses to them, and placing in us the word of the conciliation.
    20 For Christ, then, are we ambassadors, as of God entreating through us. We are beseeching for Christ's sake, “Be conciliated to God!”
    21 For the One not knowing sin, He makes to be a sin offering for our sakes that we may be becoming God's righteousness in Him.

    It is important that we understand that “God has 'conciliated' the world (all mankind) to Himself through the sacrifice of His Son.
    In the future, He (God) will 'reconciliate' the world (all mankind) to Himself at the consummation, when He (God) will be “ALL IN ALL”. (1Cor.15:28)

    Blessings, Jerry.

    #166504
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi CO,
    God has not reconciled mankind.
    That is why too we are given the task of reconciliation.[2 cor 5.18]

    #166518
    GeneBalthrop
    Participant

    Quote (chosenone @ Dec. 26 2009,17:20)
    NH.
      The meanings of “conciliate” and “reconciliate” are very important in understanding scripture.

    Example: Two are at odds with each other, lets call them 'A' and 'B'.
                'A' relents, forgives, and “conciliates” to 'B', but 'B' does not to 'A'.
                 Now if 'B' decides to forgive as well, Then'A' and “B” have “reconciliated” to each other, a joint reunion so to speak.
      In review:  If one relents and the other doesn't, this is a “conciliation”.
                     If then the other also relents also, this is a “reconciliation”.

    A scripture as in 2Cor.5:18-21   … Yet all is of God, Who conciliates us to Himself through Christ, and is giving us the dispensation of the conciliation,
    19 how that God was in Christ, conciliating the world to Himself, not reckoning their offenses to them, and placing in us the word of the conciliation.
    20 For Christ, then, are we ambassadors, as of God entreating through us. We are beseeching for Christ's sake, “Be conciliated to God!”
    21 For the One not knowing sin, He makes to be a sin offering for our sakes that we may be becoming God's righteousness in Him.

    It is important that we understand that “God has 'conciliated' the world (all mankind) to Himself through the sacrifice of His Son.
    In the future, He (God) will 'reconciliate' the world (all mankind) to Himself at the consummation, when He (God) will be “ALL IN ALL”. (1Cor.15:28)

    Blessings,  Jerry.


    Chosenone………Another good post brother. We are indeed conciliated to GOD through the blood of Jesus. Our passover.

    peace and love to you and yours…………….gene

    #166536
    NickHassan
    Participant

    G,
    Of those waiting for the bridegroom only half go into the wedding feast with him.
    The talent given them produced no profit for the Giver.
    We are given power TO BECOME sons of God.

    #166544
    terraricca
    Participant

    hi nick
    do you know the meaning of the story of the ten vergin ? i would like to know

    #166728
    chosenone
    Participant

    Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 26 2009,17:30)
    Hi CO,
    God has not reconciled mankind.
    That is why too we are given the task of reconciliation.[2 cor 5.18]


    NH.
    Have you not read this post, that is exactly what it says. But what it doesn't say is that “we are given the task of reconciliation”, like your post says!.

    Blessings.

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