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Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 17 2012,12:25)
Annie,
First of all welcomeI would have to say if you came; Healing the sick. Bringing the dead back to life. Healing people who have leprosy. And forcing demons out of people. and told me to celebrate Christmas was wrong I would pay a lot more attention.
Instead you pass judgment on a person
Are you joking?Ok, so let's all go and tell our Kids's that Santa (FATHER Christmas) is real, and He knows everything abotu you, and he will give you gifts if you are good, but will not if you are bad. That he is magic, and can be all over the world – where-ever he wants to be. And then when they beileive you, tell them you were only only lying.
Then tell them to believe in God.
And let's add Jesus to the mix.
Shimmer,
Why would I be joking? She quoted a verse, applying it to another person, but the verse quoted had qualifications to it's use, I was pointing them out.Wm
Shimmer,
I agree we should never teach anything that is not true. We taught our boy's from the beginning that a lot of people teach their kid's that santa is real, but he is only make believe and we taught them the truth. We still celebrate Christmas (although I taught them I believe He was born Sept 11, 3BC) and exchange gifts, using it as a reason to discuss what really happened.Wm
Seeking, firstly, regarding judgment, Apostle Paul says that we are not to judge the world because they have a judge and that is God. But Paul says that in the 'Ecclesias” (Meeting of believers) then we are to judge.
Also it is writen in Acts to abstain from things offered to idols, and blood, and a strangled thing, and whoredom.
So what do you think it is then to try and teach among believers and with great passion (Beware of seducing Spirits) that we should all join in the worlds ways even though God told us NOT TO. And join in the lies and deception which is being forced on our Kid's? You canNOT Mix things. Do we not value our Kid's more than that? Should we not be telling them the truth and keeping them away from the worlds ways.
Do we listen to a person or do we listen to God?
Do we let others teach these things? Or do we fight against it.
What happens to those who believe in a lie or tell lies? The polluted, sorcerers, idolaters, and all liars are thrown in the Lake of Fire.
I know what you are saying about Santa, I have always told my Kid's that Santa is not real. But that is not the point. You cannot MIX things.
Annie and David are spot on. Way to go David and Annie.
Shimmer,
Just one last point from me: Romans 14:10 But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you regard your brother with contempt? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God.I'm fully convinced in my own mind, as are you, so for my part I'll let God sort it out.
Wm
Quote (Lightenup @ Mar. 16 2012,17:11) David,
Are you done?
You have spent quite a lot of time on the internet today for someone who claims to be above being 'a part of the world.' I am going to be quite busy for the next few days at a retreat with the women from my church. I will address your questions later, although it may take me till Easter or even Christmas since you have so many, ha.
Hi LU,
no problem.I find Easter and Christmas 2 subjects that are very easy for me to discuss. I began studying Christmas while in school. I remember spending months at a time during my lunch breaks studying these subjects, just for fun. I made files that were 40 pages long. I tried to include every possible thought.
I realize that I am quite direct when discussing these subjects, and that is because for me, they seem so black and white. I apologize for what may seem to be rudeness. I just don't see how you cannot see what I see. And this frustrates me.
If you could just answer, or give your opinion as to WHY the earliest Christians didn't celebrate Christmas, that would be a good start. For me, it's quite telling. I trust the instincts of the earliest Christians far more than those of today.
Quote (shimmer @ Mar. 17 2012,10:43) Annie and David, I could not agree with you more, way to go. I know that for myself, when I did celebrate Christmas – since knowing God… I stressed out about presents and money. And then I got drunk – two years in a row.
Not for me – that was a sign!
Yes, that aspect, the “exchanging” of presents, as was practiced by the Saturnalia, is quite stressful.What to give and how much, and what will they give me and how will they feel about me based on what I give? Tricky.
If it is wrong to say that you believe that according to scripture something is wrong, then we have all wronged each other thousands of times on here. Virtually every post, is a sin.
Quote (david @ Mar. 17 2012,14:14) I just don't see how you cannot see what I see. And this frustrates me.
Hi David,Join the club.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 17 2012,14:56) Shimmer,
Just one last point from me: Romans 14:10 But you, why do you judge your brother? Or you again, why do you regard your brother with contempt? For we will all stand before the judgment seat of God.I'm fully convinced in my own mind, as are you, so for my part I'll let God sort it out.
Wm
Seeking.Paul was speaking to the ecclesia AT THAT TIME.
We are in a different time now.
“For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own likings, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander into myths”.
And,
“The Spirit expressly says that in later times some will depart from the faith by giving heed to deceitful spirits and doctrines of demons”.
And then there is 2nd Thess 2.I made a post a few pages back about the Kundalini Warning, though off topic.
Anyway, yes, that's all I have to say, too.
“Christians in Antioch in 375 celebrated the birth of Jesus on January 6. Christians in Alexandria did not begin to celebrate Christmas at all until 430. So until Dionysius came along there was confusion over dates, and debates raged, even over the usefulness of celebrating the birth of Jesus at all. What had been universally important for all Christians—the pre-eminent event—was the celebration of Easter.”–article on Dionysius.
The pope got Dionysius to figure out the date of Jesus birth. This was about 500 years after the birth. He was wrong on the date and the year.
But the point is that the earliest chritians didn't celebrate his birth.
And they had reasons.
“Many who are excitedly preparing for their Christmas celebrations would prefer not knowing about the holiday’s real significance. If they do know the history, they often object that their celebration has nothing to do with the holiday’s monstrous history and meaning. “We are just having fun.”
Imagine that between 1933-45, the Nazi regime celebrated Adolf Hitler’s birthday – April 20 – as a holiday. Imagine that they named the day, “Hitlerday,” and observed the day with feasting, drunkenness, gift-giving, and various pagan practices. Imagine that on that day, Jews were historically subject to perverse tortures and abuse, and that this continued for centuries.
Now, imagine that your great-great-great-grandchildren were about to celebrate Hitlerday. April 20th arrived. They had long forgotten about Auschwitz and Bergen Belsen. They had never heard of gas chambers or death marches. They had purchased champagne and caviar, and were about to begin the party, when someone reminded them of the day’s real history and their ancestors’ agony. Imagine that they initially objected, “We aren’t celebrating the Holocaust; we’re just having a little Hitlerday party.” If you could travel forward in time and meet them; if you could say a few words to them, what would you advise them to do on Hitlerday?”
Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 17 2012,10:25) Quote (annie @ Mar. 16 2012,20:43) Quote (shimmer @ Mar. 16 2012,11:26) Hi Annie. Good posts BTW 
Some here like to encourage others to be a part of the world and it's ways. Best to just let them be, they will not see it.
Hi Shimmer,Yes, I agree. They follow the teachings of men but are deceived. If they are stubborn and not open to the truth, they will never see it. All in HIS timing as He knows when and if they will be willing to receive the truth.
“For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own likings, and will turn away from listening to the truth, and wander into myths. As for you, always be steady endure suffering, do the work of an evangelist, fulfill your ministry. 2Tim. 4:3-5
We are to still tell them the truth but if they are not willing to receive it we are to dust off our shoes and move on, as nothing we tell them will make a difference to them. All you end up doing is repeating yourself and in the end they still didn't hear a word you said!
“And if any one will not receive you or listen to your words, shake off the dust from your feet as you leave that house or town.” Matt.10:14
Annie,
First of all welcomeI would have to say if you came; Healing the sick. Bringing the dead back to life. Healing people who have leprosy. And forcing demons out of people. and told me to celebrate Christmas was wrong I would pay a lot more attention.
Instead you pass judgment on a person for Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. while we are told; Who are you to judge someone else’s servant? To their own master, servants stand or fall. And they will stand, for the Lord is able to make them stand.
Wm
The quotes you use have been used previously. You can check out my reply to them. But for now I will say that the scriptures you quote are taken out of context and do not fit this discussion at all as they pertain to something different entirely. Scripture being taken out of context and misinterpreted is a huge problem as unfortunately, it is commonly done and confuses and leads the believer astray.There is a vast difference between judging and rebuking a brother. You would do best to study the scripture you quote and see.
The word 'judge' is used too widely and too frequently. Brothers rebuke brothers when they see they are going AGAINST God according to scripture. Christmas and Easter are very plainly AGAINST God according to scripture, so those who still practice these customs are being REBUKED by their brothers, NOT judged!
Check out the scriptures you use again.
Quote (david @ Mar. 16 2012,13:17) Quote (david @ Mar. 16 2012,12:49) Quote Even the pagans are aware of this because Christians have 'stomped on their parade,' so to speak and they see the difference. They aren't happy about it. Why do you believe this?
You are not stomping on their parade.
YOU ARE ENDORSING IT. YOU ARE PROMOTING IT. YOU ARE COMBINING IT WITH YOUR OWN BELIEFS AND POPULARIZING IT.
The only difference is the name changes to these things. Christmas, Easter, halloween, etc.As has been pointed out, with Easter, you didn't even try to hard. “Easter” comes from the name of a false god.
Is this you stomping on paganism? Or, promoting it?
“3. Do many witches celebrate Christmas (in a secular present-giving way) as well?
[LR] I should think that almost all of them do. Calls to ban Christmas and not celebrate it have always come from within sections of the Christian community (e.g., the Jehovah’s Witnesses) who, quite rightly, see Christmas as a Pagan festival.”http://www.witchology.com/contents/interviews/yule_winter_solstice.php
I'm not sure why you think pagans would be mad that you are popularizing their holiday. The fact that you attached Christ to it, does not bother pagans. It bothers Christ. (See Bible)
You are absolutely right David. By twisting and turning the truth, Lightenup (and other Christians like her), has been able to convince herself that she is following God and giving Him glory and honor when she celebrates these holidays. Unfortunately, all people do by celebrating these pagan customs is giving glory to the ENEMY, not GOD!They refuse to see and hear the truth. The truth is, (actually the RCC doesn't deny this) Christians haven't REPLACED the pagan holidays as Lightenup claims, but have DISGUISED the holidays to look Christian and not pagan. All the RCC did was REPLACE the feasts of God with pagan holidays and DISGUISED them by changing their names and dressing them up in scripture. If you take a dog and dress it up like a cat, under the disguise it is still a dog! Or as the quote says, “a rose by any other name would smell as sweet”, it doesn't matter what you change the name to, it is still a rose! Same for these pagan holidays. No matter how you twist and turn it they are still pagan holidays and they are still looked at by our GOD as pagan holidays. No matter how much they want to argue this is not the truth, unfortunately, according to scripture, their argument is in vain as is their worship.
Quote (seekingtruth @ Mar. 17 2012,10:42) Gene,
I believe Jesus died at the same time as the lamb for passover.Wm
WM…….You have that right brother. It was around 3:00 PM when they Killing the Lambs for the Passover Meal that evening. Jesus was indeed our Passover Lamb , and died at the same time, and we now are Passed over becasue of his sacrifice for us all, if we put His blood on the door posts of our Hearts, just as the Hebrews put the Lambs Blood on the door post of their Houses they lived in. We put Jesus Blood on the door posts of our hearts in these Bodies we live in.Some do not percieve that and are sick and many die as a result when they could be healed. May God help us keep the feast with the Milk of sincerity and truth, Brother. No greater Gift could we have recieved then the one Jesus has given us. God the Father will always honor his sacrifice for us all. IMO
Peace and love to you and yours Wm…………………………….gene
Quote (david @ Mar. 17 2012,13:11) “Many who are excitedly preparing for their Christmas celebrations would prefer not knowing about the holiday’s real significance. If they do know the history, they often object that their celebration has nothing to do with the holiday’s monstrous history and meaning. “We are just having fun.” Imagine that between 1933-45, the Nazi regime celebrated Adolf Hitler’s birthday – April 20 – as a holiday. Imagine that they named the day, “Hitlerday,” and observed the day with feasting, drunkenness, gift-giving, and various pagan practices. Imagine that on that day, Jews were historically subject to perverse tortures and abuse, and that this continued for centuries.
Now, imagine that your great-great-great-grandchildren were about to celebrate Hitlerday. April 20th arrived. They had long forgotten about Auschwitz and Bergen Belsen. They had never heard of gas chambers or death marches. They had purchased champagne and caviar, and were about to begin the party, when someone reminded them of the day’s real history and their ancestors’ agony. Imagine that they initially objected, “We aren’t celebrating the Holocaust; we’re just having a little Hitlerday party.” If you could travel forward in time and meet them; if you could say a few words to them, what would you advise them to do on Hitlerday?”
David,Peter translated Sheol to the pagan Greek word Hades. Hades is the Greek netherworld that takes its name from the Greek god whose land it is.
If you went back in time what would your advise to Peter be?
Kerwin, my advise to Peter would be: Do not disown Jesus. But your point is noted and a good one. I shall add it to my file.
To which i respond: Kerwin, if you lived in the first century, or the second, would you tell the Christians around you that they should no longer avoid celebrating jesus' birthday?
Quote (david @ Mar. 20 2012,07:16) Kerwin, my advise to Peter would be: Do not disown Jesus. But your point is noted and a good one. I shall add it to my file. To which i respond: Kerwin, if you lived in the first century, or the second, would you tell the Christians around you that they should no longer avoid celebrating jesus' birthday?
David,I know of none that celebrated his birthday. If any did; I would advise them that in celebrating it they celebrate it to the Lord.
Many, whatever their claims to the contrary, do not celebrate to the Lord at the present time.
Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 20 2012,16:12) Quote (david @ Mar. 20 2012,07:16) Kerwin, my advise to Peter would be: Do not disown Jesus. But your point is noted and a good one. I shall add it to my file. To which i respond: Kerwin, if you lived in the first century, or the second, would you tell the Christians around you that they should no longer avoid celebrating jesus' birthday?
David,I know of none that celebrated his birthday. If any did; I would advise them that in celebrating it they celebrate it to the Lord.
Many, whatever their claims to the contrary, do not celebrate to the Lord at the present time.
Kerwin, why did they refuse to celebrate it?Or, do you think they just didn't think of it–like it never occured to them?
People did celebrate birthdays back then.
So, Kerwin, why do you think the earliest christians didn't celebrate Christ's birth?
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