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Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2011,07:58) Quote (Pastry @ Aug. 19 2011,15:14) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2011,15:53) Quote (Pastry @ Aug. 19 2011,02:31) Kerwin ! I gave you plenty of Scriptures, its up to you if you believe them or not……Peace Irene
Irene,Do you believe scripture when it states that Jesus' human body is the seed of David?
If you do then you know his body did not change from a spirit body into a human body but is in fact the descendant of David's body.
Do you believe that God will keep his promise to David to have one of his seed sit on the throne of David?
If Jesus' body is a spirit body then it is not a seed of David's body for Davud was bit a spirit being.
Like me, you have more to learn in order to better understand what scripture states so try hard to think outside the box that Satan is always striving to keep us in.
May God reveal all his truth to each of us.
Do you know what it means to be a “SEED” of some man?
Jesus was not procreated by any man, he was created by God, but born of a woman, Mary, who was of the seed of David.
No ordinary human is without sin, therefore no ordinary human could have done what Jesus did.If you would READ the Bible, you would know that. There is no BOX, only the one you put yourself in.
Georg
Georg,Thank you for aiding Irene to answer my post.
Romans 1:3 in the KJV explicitly states Jesus “was made of the seed of David according to the flesh”
I agree that Mary is the seed of David.
So Jesus' tent of flesh was made of the seed of David, who is Mary, Just like Eve's tent of flesh was made of Adam.
Surely you can see that is what Paul was stating about Jesus in Romans 1:3.
I can tell you are NOT interested in truth, or in understanding truth.I was just passing through anyway.
Georg
Pierre,
Quote you mean this;Ro 1:3 regarding his Son, who as to his human nature was a descendant of David,? INV Ro 1:3 Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the seed of David according to the flesh;KJV
are those two scriptures not saying the same thing ?
I am going to let you determine that for your own self but I do believe the NIV translators are biased in there translation of Romans 1:3. Never the less, both interpretations are true.
The translators of Romans 1:3 are showing bias for the teaching that Jesus had two natures. As evidence of this bias I will point to similar scriptures where they did not interpret “sarx” to nature.
Quote Romans 4:1
New International Version (NIV)1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, discovered in this matter?
If they were consistent then they would have instead written “What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the human nature, discovered in this matter?”
Do you see the difference between the two?
Another place they did it is here:
Quote Galatians 4:29
New International Version (NIV)29 At that time the son born according to the flesh persecuted the son born by the power of the Spirit. It is the same now.
If the translators translate “sarx” as they do in Romans 1:3 then it would be “At that time the son born according to the human nature persecuted the son born by the power of the Spirit. It is the same now.”
Now, if you look at Galatians 4:29 then you will see that Isaac who is also a son of Abraham’s flesh is instead referred to as the son born by the power of the Spirit and is compared to Ishmael, who it calls the son of flesh. This is because “The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing” just as Jesus teaches in John 6:63.
Quote do you think that what you mean is the same thing that those scriptures, saying If you look at Romans 4:1 then can see for yourself that I am in agreement with the Greek words behind Romans 1:3.
If you expand the later to Romans 1:3-4 then you will see that Jesus, like Isaac, is a son of David’s body and a son of God’s Spirit though. The difference is that Jesus is the fulfillment and Isaac the shadow of things to come.
Kerwin
Quote Now, if you look at Galatians 4:29 then you will see that Isaac who is also a son of Abraham’s flesh is instead referred to as the son born by the power of the Spirit and is compared to Ishmael, who it calls the son of flesh. This is because “The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing” just as Jesus teaches in John 6:63. first Isaac is born on the promise of God but not from God ,so he is totally flesh ,now the expression “the spirit gives live ” as nothing to do here,
there is only one that is born from God that is Jesus ,and trough his mother he is descended from David,
all the other comments between flesh and nature is to me useless it mean the same and does not alter the all understanding of scriptures,
the understanding is not only of words but of the whole scriptures the message that is ,you are good in finding words and meanings but it seams that you mist the message,
there is only a difference between the spirit nature and the flesh nature or spirit and flesh,same thing right ?
man does not have more than two natures ,flesh or spirit
so it is words or around words that you are placing your understanding ?
do not get me wrong we have to use the right wording ,but with limits to the understanding of the message of the wording.and one more thing Mary could not supply all the chromosomes
for Christ to be a man ,you mixing soul with the flesh and do not understand ,Pierre
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 18 2011,22:35)
I did not receive the gospel from any book, but from Scripture.
That is not an accurate comparison, Kerwin. Because since the compiled scriptures ARE a book, you could NOT say that you did NOT receive your gospel from a book, if in fact you DID receive it from the Bible. That would be a lie.So please DIRECTLY answer the two questions I asked:
1. WHICH men did Paul receive his gospel from?
2. I did not receive my gospel from any man, but from Pat.
Kerwin, do you think of “Pat” as a man or a woman when you read those green words?
Thanks in advance,
mikeQuote (942767 @ Aug. 19 2011,14:55) Hi Mike: There is a difference he now has a spiritual body, and he is the head of the church, and our human masters have a mortal body, and may or not be saved.
See Marty? Your subconscious believes the truth, because you've just distinguished Jesus FROM our “human masters”.
mike
Quote
here is a difference he now has a spiritual body, and he is the head of the church, and our human masters have a mortal body, and may or not be saved.
Marty! Since you believe that Jesus has a Spiritual body now and is seated at the right hand of His Father, do you now see this too??Jhn 17:4 I have glorified thee on the earth: I have finished the work which thou gavest me to do.
Jhn 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
This shows us that Jesus was there with His Father as a Spirit Being before the world was…..Peace Irene
Quote (abe @ Aug. 19 2011,14:52) Nu.23:19 ” God is not a man, that he should lie, nor a son of man, that He should repent. Has He said, and will He not do it? Or has He spoken, and will He not make it good?
Welcome to the forum Abe.Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 20 2011,07:58) Quote (Pastry @ Aug. 19 2011,15:14) Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 19 2011,15:53) Quote (Pastry @ Aug. 19 2011,02:31) Kerwin ! I gave you plenty of Scriptures, its up to you if you believe them or not……Peace Irene
Irene,Do you believe scripture when it states that Jesus' human body is the seed of David?
If you do then you know his body did not change from a spirit body into a human body but is in fact the descendant of David's body.
Do you believe that God will keep his promise to David to have one of his seed sit on the throne of David?
If Jesus' body is a spirit body then it is not a seed of David's body for Davud was bit a spirit being.
Like me, you have more to learn in order to better understand what scripture states so try hard to think outside the box that Satan is always striving to keep us in.
May God reveal all his truth to each of us.
Do you know what it means to be a “SEED” of some man?
Jesus was not procreated by any man, he was created by God, but born of a woman, Mary, who was of the seed of David.
No ordinary human is without sin, therefore no ordinary human could have done what Jesus did.If you would READ the Bible, you would know that. There is no BOX, only the one you put yourself in.
Georg
Georg,Thank you for aiding Irene to answer my post.
Romans 1:3 in the KJV explicitly states Jesus “was made of the seed of David according to the flesh”
I agree that Mary is the seed of David.
So Jesus' tent of flesh was made of the seed of David, who is Mary, Just like Eve's tent of flesh was made of Adam.
Surely you can see that is what Paul was stating about Jesus in Romans 1:3.
Kerwin! You don't believe then that Jesus is a Spirit Being now??? Is that what you are saying to us? All those Scriptures that shows that Jesus was in the form of God before He became a man by Mary… the Son of God and the Son of Man…. That my friend you need to address, which you seem to not want to….Please do your self a favor and take all those Scriptures in the preexisting tread and study them instead of coming up with Scriptures when Jesus was a man… We all know that He did become a man, that is not the question at all…. IreneQuote (mikeboll64 @ Aug. 21 2011,03:07) Quote (942767 @ Aug. 19 2011,14:55) Hi Mike: There is a difference he now has a spiritual body, and he is the head of the church, and our human masters have a mortal body, and may or not be saved.
See Marty? Your subconscious believes the truth, because you've just distinguished Jesus FROM our “human masters”.mike
Hi Mike:Yes, I do believe the truth, and I am trying to teach you so that you will also believe the truth.
Jesus is the Last Adam. Adam = man. He is still a man, but now has a spiritual body, and through the spirit of perfect obedience to God, and by his shed blood, we who are his disciples will also overcome sin, death and the grave, and will be like him at his coming for the church.
I did not mean to imply that he was not still human, but I meant to convey that our masters here on earth have a mortal body, and that some may not be saved.
I believe that the scripture uses “masters after the flesh” rather than human masters, anyway.
Love in Christ,
MartyMarty
Quote Jesus is the Last Adam. Adam = man. He is still a man, but now has a spiritual body, and through the spirit of perfect obedience to God, and by his shed blood, we who are his disciples will also overcome sin, death and the grave, and will be like him at his coming for the church.
you have a couple scripture for the above note,Quote I did not mean to imply that he was not still human, could you decode this ?
Pierre
Hi Mrs:
You say:
Quote Jhn 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
This shows us that Jesus was there with His Father as a Spirit Being before the world was…..Does the scripture state that “he was a spirit being before the world was” or is that your interpretation of what this scripture means?
That the spirit of the Son existed with the Father is true, but he did not exist as a spirit being. The scripture states that he was foreordained, and that is the way that I understand the scripture. God knew that at a particular point in time he would conceive a Son through whom he would reconcile the world unto Himself, and God knew that spirit of Jesus would be formed in him as he learned to apply the Word of God in his daily life. And Jesus obeyed God's Word without sin even unto death of the cross, and having finished the work that God had given him to do, Jesus asks that God glorify him with the glory that God had forseen him having according to God's plan from the beginning of the world.
Quote 1 Peter 1:18For ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, such as silver and gold, from your vain way of living which ye received by tradition from your fathers,
19but with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot,
20who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you.Quote Galatians 3:8And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the heathen through faith, preached beforehand the Gospel unto Abraham, saying, “In thee shall all nations be blessed.” 16Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He saith not, “and to seeds,” as though many; but as though one: “and to thy Seed,” who is Christ.
17And this I say, that the Covenant which was confirmed earlier by God in Christ cannot be annulled by the law, which came four hundred and thirty years after, so as to make the promise of no effect.
18For if the inheritance be of the law, it is no more by promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.Quote Galatians 4:4But when the fullness of the time had come, God sent forth His Son, made of a woman, made under the law, Quote 1 John 1
That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked upon, and our hands have handled, concerning the Word of Life
2(for the Life was manifested, and we have seen it, and bear witness, and show unto you that Eternal Life, which was with the Father and was manifested unto us);These scriptures:
Quote 4I have glorified Thee on the earth; I have finished the work which Thou gavest Me to do.
5And now, O Father, glorify Thou Me with Thine own Self with the glory which I had with Thee before the world was.Are explained by this scripture:
John 17:24″Father, I will that they also, whom Thou hast given Me, be with Me where I am, that they may behold My glory which Thou hast given Me; for Thou loved Me before the foundation of the world.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (942767 @ Aug. 23 2011,21:31)
Jesus is the Last Adam. Adam = man. He is still a man, but now has a spiritual body,
But that's not what the scripture says, Marty. The scripture says the the last Adam BECAME A LIFE-GIVING SPIRT.Quote (942767 @ Aug. 23 2011,21:31)
I did not mean to imply that he was not still human…………..I believe that the scripture uses “masters after the flesh” rather than human masters, anyway.
Can you tell me about any human from the history of existence who WASN'T made of flesh? Human beings consist of flesh bodies, Marty. That's just the way God made us.Marty, notice the difference here:
HUMAN being………………..SPIRIT being. The former is made of flesh, the latter is not. And not only can't flesh inherit the Kingdom of God, but Paul clearly says that the last Adam BECAME a SPIRIT. See? SPIRIT does NOT equate with HUMAN.
Not to mention that Paul also clearly said he received his gospel from Jesus Christ…………………NOT FROM ANY HUMAN BEING.
Perhaps before trying to teach ME the truth, you should first LEARN the truth.
peace,
mikeI did not receive my gospel from any man, but from Pat.
Marty, do you think of “Pat” as a man or a woman when you read those green words?
peace,
mikeHi Mike:
Let's see what the scriptures state relative to this:
Quote Jesus is the Last Adam. Adam = man. He is still a man, but now has a spiritual body, But that's not what the scripture says, Marty. The scripture says the the last Adam BECAME A LIFE-GIVING SPIRT.
Quote 1 Co 15:20But now Christ is risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of those who slept.
20But now Christ is risen from the dead, and become the firstfruits of those who slept.
21For since by man came death, by Man came also the resurrection of the dead.
22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive;
23but every man in his own order: Christ the firstfruits; afterward those who are Christ's at His coming.
26The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death,35But some man will say, “How are the dead raised up? And with what body do they come?”
36Thou fool, that which thou sowest is not quickened, unless it die.
37And that which thou sowest is not that body which shall be, but bare grain, by chance of wheat or of some other grain.
38But God giveth it a body as it hath pleased Him, and to every seed his own body.
41There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars; for one star differeth from another star in glory.
42So also is the resurrection of the dead: It is sown in corruption; it is raised in incorruption.
43It is sown in dishonor; it is raised in glory. It is sown in weakness; it is raised in power.
44It is sown a natural body; it is raised a spiritual body. There is a natural body, and there is a spiritual body.
45And so it is written: “The first man Adam was made a living soul.” The last Adam was made a quickening Spirit.
46However that which is spiritual was not first, but that which is natural, and afterward that which is spiritual.
47The first man is of the earth, earthy; the second Man is the Lord from Heaven.
48As is the earthy, such are they also that are earthy; and as is the heavenly, such are they also that are heavenly.
49And as we have borne the image of the earthy, we shall also bear the image of the heavenly.
50Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God; neither doth corruption inherit incorruption.
51Behold, I show you a mystery: We shall not all sleep; but we shall all be changed
52in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed.
53For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality.
54So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.”
55″O death, where is thy sting? O grave, where is thy victory?”
56The sting of death is sin, and the strength of sin is the law.
57But thanks be to God, who giveth us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ!
Every man has a spirit, but Jesus' spirit was formed in him through perfect obedience to God's Word, and through this spirit of perfect obedience to God, he overcame sin, death, and the grave, and was raised to eternal life, and so, this is the spirit that gives life to the soul.
Maybe this scripture will help you to understand this:
Quote Hebrew 5:8though He were a Son, yet learned He obedience by the things which He suffered.
9And being made perfect, He became the author of eternal salvation unto all those who obey Him,You say:
Quote Marty, notice the difference here: HUMAN being………………..SPIRIT being. The former is made of flesh, the latter is not. And not only can't flesh inherit the Kingdom of God, but Paul clearly says that the last Adam BECAME a SPIRIT. See? SPIRIT does NOT equate with HUMAN.
No, the scriptures do not make this distinction. The first Adam was made a living soul and the last Adam was made a life giving spirit. Last Adam, Mike, still Adam which is man, but his spirit of holiness has given life to his soul.
Quote Romans 1:3concerning His Son Jesus Christ our Lord, who was made of the seed of David according to the flesh,
4and was declared to be the Son of God with power, according to the Spirit of holiness by the resurrection from the dead,And you say:
Quote Not to mention that Paul also clearly said he received his gospel from Jesus Christ…………………NOT FROM ANY HUMAN BEING. I already showed you what was meant by this. He received the revelation of the gospel directly from God through the Lord, and not through any of the disciples before him. For one thing, the Apostles were afraid of him initially, because of the fact that he had been persecuting the church prior to his conversion.
Quote Galatians 1:11But I certify to you, brethren, that the Gospel which was preached by me is not according to man;
12for I neither received it from man, neither was I taught it, but by the revelation of Jesus Christ.
13For ye have heard of my participation in times past in the Jews' religion, how I persecuted the church of God beyond measure and wasted it.
14I profited in the Jews' religion beyond many of my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.
15But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother's womb and called me by His grace,
16to reveal His Son in me, that I might preach Him among the heathen, I conferred not immediately with flesh and blood,
17nor did I go up to Jerusalem to those who were apostles before me, but I went into Arabia and returned again unto Damascus.
18Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.
19But I saw none of the other apostles save James, the Lord's brother.God Himself will show who is teaching the truth.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (terraricca @ Aug. 24 2011,14:51) Marty Quote Jesus is the Last Adam. Adam = man. He is still a man, but now has a spiritual body, and through the spirit of perfect obedience to God, and by his shed blood, we who are his disciples will also overcome sin, death and the grave, and will be like him at his coming for the church.
you have a couple scripture for the above note,Quote I did not mean to imply that he was not still human, could you decode this ?
Pierre
Hi Pierre:Read my most recent post to Mike, and see if there is sufficient scripture given there to satisfy you.
Love in Christ,
MartyMarty
Quote Every man has a spirit, but Jesus' spirit was formed in him through perfect obedience to God's Word, and through this spirit of perfect obedience to God, he overcame sin, death, and the grave, and was raised to eternal life, and so, this is the spirit that gives life to the soul. so what you are saying ,is that god had nothing to do with the birth of Christ ? and so Mary was his mother and Joseph his father and so his born a simple man ? born in sin ?
if God is in fact his father from birth then tell us how is it that that Jesus has to learn to be perfect ? was he not perfect when he was born ? because his father being God ,and would it not be that he was the son before creation ? and that God just made it possible for him to take a flesh body like scriptures is saying ? and that the WORD OF GOD in John1-1 and Revelation 19-are Christ ?and that so he was spirit being and became the son of man when he took the clothing of flesh ?and was also the son of God because his father was God ?
Pierre
Quote (942767 @ Aug. 25 2011,21:14) Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 24 2011,14:51) Marty Quote Jesus is the Last Adam. Adam = man. He is still a man, but now has a spiritual body, and through the spirit of perfect obedience to God, and by his shed blood, we who are his disciples will also overcome sin, death and the grave, and will be like him at his coming for the church.
you have a couple scripture for the above note,Quote I did not mean to imply that he was not still human, could you decode this ?
Pierre
Hi Pierre:Read my most recent post to Mike, and see if there is sufficient scripture given there to satisfy you.
Love in Christ,
Marty
MartyQuote Every man has a spirit, but Jesus' spirit was formed in him through perfect obedience to God's Word, and through this spirit of perfect obedience to God, he overcame sin, death, and the grave, and was raised to eternal life, and so, this is the spirit that gives life to the soul. 1Co 15:35 But someone may ask, “How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?”
1Co 15:36 How foolish! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies.
1Co 15:37 When you sow, you do not plant the body that will be, but just a seed, perhaps of wheat or of something else.
1Co 15:38 But God gives it a body as he has determined, and to each kind of seed he gives its own body.
1Co 15:39 All flesh is not the same: Men have one kind of flesh, animals have another, birds another and fish another.
1Co 15:40 There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies; but the splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another.
1Co 15:41 The sun has one kind of splendor, the moon another and the stars another; and star differs from star in splendor.
1Co 15:42 So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable;
1Co 15:43 it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power;
1Co 15:44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.
If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.
1Co 15:45 So it is written: “The first man Adam became a living being” ; the last Adam, a life-giving spirit.
1Co 15:46 The spiritual did not come first, but the natural, and after that the spiritual.
1Co 15:47 The first man was of the dust of the earth, the second man from heaven.
1Co 15:48 As was the earthly man, so are those who are of the earth; and as is the man from heaven, so also are those who are of heaven.
1Co 15:49 And just as we have borne the likeness of the earthly man, so shall we bear the likeness of the man from heaven.
1Co 15:50 I declare to you, brothers, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God, nor does the perishable inherit the imperishable.
1Co 15:51 Listen, I tell you a mystery: We will not all sleep, but we will all be changed—
1Co 15:52 in a flash, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, the dead will be raised imperishable, and we will be changed.
1Co 15:53 For the perishable must clothe itself with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality.
1Co 15:54 When the perishable has been clothed with the imperishable, and the mortal with immortality, then the saying that is written will come true: “Death has been swallowed up in victory.”
1Co 15:55 “Where, O death, is your victory?
Where, O death, is your sting?”
1Co 15:56 The sting of death is sin, and the power of sin is the law.
1Co 15:57 But thanks be to God! He gives us the victory through our Lord Jesus Christ.
1Co 15:58 Therefore, my dear brothers, stand firm. Let nothing move you. Always give yourselves fully to the work of the Lord, because you know that your labor in the Lord is not in vain.if you read the explanation that Paul gives about the resurrection ,you can understand hid description of how dead came to be in the world and the reason for the second Adam as he call him what in his mind is Christ ,
in this way Paul pointing out that the lost of God blessings and the right to live everlasting was lost trough Adam the man because of his sin of disobedience,
on the other hand Paul mention how trough the obedience of the second Adam (Christ )how God reconcile all men by the faith in the grace provided by God that is the sacrifice of Christ ,1Cor 15;58 stand on his on term
I do not see what you see in those verses ,it is your pure invention
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Aug. 25 2011,14:25) Marty Quote Every man has a spirit, but Jesus' spirit was formed in him through perfect obedience to God's Word, and through this spirit of perfect obedience to God, he overcame sin, death, and the grave, and was raised to eternal life, and so, this is the spirit that gives life to the soul. so what you are saying ,is that god had nothing to do with the birth of Christ ? and so Mary was his mother and Joseph his father and so his born a simple man ? born in sin ?
if God is in fact his father from birth then tell us how is it that that Jesus has to learn to be perfect ? was he not perfect when he was born ? because his father being God ,and would it not be that he was the son before creation ? and that God just made it possible for him to take a flesh body like scriptures is saying ? and that the WORD OF GOD in John1-1 and Revelation 19-are Christ ?and that so he was spirit being and became the son of man when he took the clothing of flesh ?and was also the son of God because his father was God ?
Pierre
Hi Pierre:Of course I am not saying that God had nothing to do with Jesus birth. He was conceived of the Holy Ghost in the womb of the virgin Mary, and was born into this world a man child, a living soul or person just like any other infant.
He was without sin when he was born, but he had to go through many trials and temptations here on earth just like all of us do. The scriptures state that he was tempted every way and that he obeyed God without sin even unto death on the cross.
At the age of 12, the gospel of Luke shows him discussing the scriptures with the Lawyers and the scribes, and the scripture states that he grew in wisdom and in favor with God and man. He studied the Word of God, and was raised parents who were under the Law of Moses.
These scriptures say that he was perfected though the Word of God:
Quote Hebrews 5:8though He were a Son, yet learned He obedience by the things which He suffered. 9And being made perfect, He became the author of eternal salvation unto all those who obey Him,
And this scripture states that he was foreordained. There is no scripture that states that Jesus pre-existed as a sentient person prior to his birth into this world.
Quote 18For ye know that ye were not redeemed with corruptible things, such as silver and gold, from your vain way of living which ye received by tradition from your fathers, 19but with the precious blood of Christ, as of a lamb without blemish and without spot,
20who verily was foreordained before the foundation of the world, but was manifest in these last times for you.
John 1 states the the Word was with God, the Greek for Word is Logos “that which means what God has spoken”. This pertains to Jesus. All things were made by him and for him and without him was nothing made that was made. It is what God has spoken pertaining to Jesus, and that became a reality in John 1:14 when Jesus was born into this world.
The Word of God in the OT beginning in Genesis speaks prophetically of the coming Messiah, and so, this is what God had spoken, and it became a reality in John 1:14.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote Posted: Aug. 24 2011,15:04 QUOTE
Hi Mrs:You say:
Quote
Jhn 17:5 And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was.
This shows us that Jesus was there with His Father as a Spirit Being before the world was…..Does the scripture state that “he was a spirit being before the world was” or is that your interpretation of what this scripture means?
Marty! That Scriptures says He had a glory with His Father before the world was, and to that glory He asked His Father to go back to….
He is a Spirit being now, and that Scripture says He was that before the world was….
It goes really good with all other Scriptures…. God through Jesus created All.Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Jhn 1:3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.
He is the firstborn of all creation, Scriptures already given….
Marty I just read what yous aid about John 1:1-14….. that is not so….
verse 14 says
AND THE WORD BECAME FLESH AND WE BEHELD HIS GLORY, OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN OF THE FATHER, FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH.He was not just foreordained, that is interpreting it to your view, and not according to Scriptures which are plainly written…. open your mind Marty you are adding what it doesn't say….
Jesus existed in the FORM OF GOD, AND THEN MADE HIMSELF INTO THE LIKENESS OF MEN….
Phl 2:6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God:
Phl 2:7 But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men:
You can believe this or not, I don't even care any more…. I said it all….
Peace Irene
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