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Hi H,
No. I am speaking those saved by their works towards the sons of God in Christ as in Matt 25.31f
Matt 10.42
“And whoever in the name of a disciple gives to one of these little ones even a cup of cold water to drink, truly I say to you he will not lose his reward”Do you use anything other then the bible Nick? You have already made it clear you don't believe in fellowship. What else don't you believe in? What do you believe in? Are you a new ager?
Nick, the last thing I want is for you to perish. It is the hope of all who are born again that none should perish, but all be saved, for that is the will of the Father in heaven. I do love you. I don't love your doctrine.
Hi H,
Then make sure of your own salvation before you preach to others.
Put on your own oxygen mask first.
“Seek ye first the kingdom of God and everything else will be added to you”
No man is saved by inviting Jesus into his heart.
That is one of the most popular gospels in town and millions are relying on it. ..sadly.When I ask you questions that need serious answers, you have a tendency to tiptoe around them. I do not know why. What are you trying to hide. I will tell you anything. I have nothing to hide. I have asked you several questions and you go into the secret agent mode. I don't know who or what you are. I would like to believe you are are brother in the Lord who is seeking the face of the Lord, yet, the impression you give me is questions. You doctrine isn't is a mixture of catholic, maybe baptist or church of christ and I can't help but sense some new age.
Nick, if you really are seeking the face of the Lord, you should not feel threatened by me. If you really put your trust in the Lord, he will lead you. Your understanding of John 3 is not right Nick and that is that basis of the faith. One last thing Nick, you write things as a poet, and maybe they have meaning to you, but please be more blunt. Your words are very beautiful. Do you write poetry? If so, I would love to read so.
Hi H,
I am a facilitator to help men search the bible and a signpost to the confused. I am known by God.Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 13 2006,03:43) Hi H,
I am a facilitator to help men search the bible and a signpost to the confused. I am known by God.
Ok Nick I'll bite How does one get saved if not by inviting Jesus into his heart? I know that no one comes to Jesus unless the Father draws him. But the one called still has to invite Jesus. Jesus doesn't just bust in.The parable of the seeds. The seeds are sown but the ones chosen are the ones that take root.
So tell me Nick just what is “your” take on salivation?
Hi kenrch,
The message that Peter gave at Pentecost in Acts 2 38f is still the message of salvation for all mankind.
No scripture says we can hope to be saved by inviting Jesus into our hearts.Galatians tells us we are baptised into Christ and then later says that Christ is born into us. This is the slow work of the Spirit redeeming the hearts and minds according to the Word and reclaiming our occupied territory, that Christ may live and rule in us by his Spirit that we may be vessels for the continuation of his works.
Nick,
Isn't there a beginning to being born again? Doesn't the person have to know about Christ before He ask Jesus in and when he does then he progresses to the next step which is baptism? If a person is drawn by God then when he invites Jesus he will want to be baptized if the witness is following the Holy Spirit. Once baptized with water then the Holy Spirit, he becomes “born again” a child of God!
Did the thief on the cross die before Jesus?
I have to turn in now. Good night.
Hi k,
Show me an example in Acts where anyone was told to invite Jesus into their heart.
Probably the closest would be Acts 22.16
“….be baptised, and wash away your sins calling on His name”But it is only in relationship to baptism and not quite the same.
Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 13 2006,04:43) Hi k,
Show me an example in Acts where anyone was told to invite Jesus into their heart.
Probably the closest would be Acts 22.16
“….be baptised, and wash away your sins calling on His name”But it is only in relationship to baptism and not quite the same.
Nick,Would you please “EXPLAIN” these scriptures. If you have a different view then by ALL means I would like to know what and “Why” you see it that way. If the Lord has given you something then please share it.
And Nick Please explain it in terms “I” can understand.
**Act 2:21 And it shall be, that whosoever shall call on the name of the Lord shall be saved.
**Act 10:43 To him bear all the prophets witness, that through his name every one that believeth on him shall receive remission of sins.**Act 16:31 And they said, Believe on the Lord Jesus, and thou shalt be saved, thou and thy house.
Act 16:32 And they spake the word of the Lord unto him, with all that were in his house.
Act 16:33 And he took them the same hour of the night, and washed their stripes; and was baptized, he and all his, immediately. **First believed on the Lord Jesus Then they were baptized.
**Rom 10:9 because if thou shalt confess with thy mouth Jesus as Lord, and shalt believe in thy heart that God raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved:
**Rom 10:10 for with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; “and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.”Rom 10:12 For there is no distinction between Jew and Greek: for the same Lord is Lord of all, and is rich unto all that call upon him:
**Rom 10:13 for, Whosoever shall ” call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved”.
**Rom 10:14 “How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher”?Since the beginning the name of Jesus has to be preached so that “whoever calls upon the name of the Lord shall be saved”. If the person is sincere he/she will be baptized and receive the Holy Spirit. But First they believe and Call On His Name.
**Joh 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he the right to become children of God, even to them that believe on his name:
If you believed on Jesus' name then you have the Right to become…If you don't believe then you have No Right to become a child of God. Is that what this scripture saying? If not then what is it saying?Hi k,
To whom was the letter of Romans written?
To which time period does the quote from Joel 2 in Romans and Acts 2 belong?
Does “right to become” mean “has become”
Does faith save the demons?[James 2.19]I believe in George Bush. I believe he exists. I do not follow him. I dislike his works. I do not believe I should follow Him. We enjoy no relationship because I know about him and we never will.
Biblical belief entails commitment and baptism seals that choice before God and the angels and men.
Nick,
Romans was written to “all in Rome who are loved by God and called to be saints”. I don't see how this is in conflict with the verses quoted by Kenrch. Also, what really was the point of Jesus dying in your scenario? Did he die only for those who are to be baptized by water into His death so they could enjoy the millenial kingdom? If I am not baptized how can I stand before a Holy God at the final judgement and be granted a pass to heaven? Through God's eternal mercy I suppose. But then what is the point of death on the cross? If I am given a pass to heaven can I rightfully say that I didn't need the grace from death on the cross to get here?Your earlier response about Ephesians being written to and for those who already believed was very good. It doesn't seem like the same logic applies to Romans. If so, please explain how. Also, John 3:16. Whoever believes in Him will have everlasting life. Where am I going wrong here? Thank you again Nick.
God Bless
Hi Jefe,
All the books of the apostles are written to the saved and not the unsaved, including Romans. “The Saints” are the saved. They were not works of outreaching the gospel to the unsaved and establishing communities of faith because that is what they did, but were works of reinforcement and developing the understanding of the way sent to the communities they had already founded in Christ.Christ died that all could be saved.
God wants all to be saved.
But only a few want that salvation.
Few will repent and be baptised for forgiveness into his death and sealed with the Spirit unto eternity in the Son.
Only a few will walk in his steps according to the Spirit-will he find faith on earth when he returns?.
Only some find the narrow path.
Most are godless.
Many will foolishly rely on belief ignorant of the obedience that demands.
Of those who know of Christ most will follow the religious crowds and their leaders into the pit.However none are beyond the mercy of God though but those who are saved in this way as shown in Matt 25.31f will be amazed that they have found that mercy. They have been judged by God as sheep, one with the flock because they have shown love and mercy to the flock.
“When did we see you..?”It is by faith, we are saved, not water baptism. We learn that we are sinners and that God sent his son, Jesus Christ to die for our sin, so that all who believe in him will be saved.
Acts 15:7 And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.
8 And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;
9 And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.
To prove that a man is saved by believing and not by being water baptized, all one has to do is look at what the Lord did with the Gentiles. They believed and then they recieved the baptism of the Holy Spirit as those on the day of Pentecost. Then they went and recieved water baptism. If they were not born again, they would have not been able to have recieve the baptism of the Holy Spirit. God will not put his spirit into an unclean vessel. If a man is not born again, saved, the Holy Spirit cannot come into the man.
KJV: Neither do men put new wine into old bottles: else the bottles break, and the wine runneth out, and the bottles perish: but they put new wine into new bottles, and both are preserved.
Acts 10:44 While Peter yet spake these words, the Holy Ghost fell on all them which heard the word.
45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.
46 For they heard them speak with tongues, and magnify God. Then answered Peter,
47 Can any man forbid water, that these should not be baptized, which have received the Holy Ghost as well as we?
48 And he commanded them to be baptized in the name of the Lord. Then prayed they him to tarry certain days.
Hi H,
They were indeed born of the Spirit.Though they were judged clean by God Peter still baptised them in water for the forgiveness of sin lest Satan have a legal opening to accuse the brethren.
The Pharisees and Scribes could not receive the new wine of the gospel teaching because they had not submitted to the ways of God and let John baptise them.
Lk 7.29f
“And when they heard this, they acknowledged God's justice, having been baptised with the baptism of John. But the Pharisees and lawyers rejected God's purpose for themselves, not having been baptised by John”
Matt 11.19
“yet wisdom is vindicated by her deeds”Only those born of water and the Spirit can see the kingdom. The rest can talk about it in circles. Obedience is proven by new vision. New wine can only be accepted by those who are reborn. Many prefer old wine.
Thanks for another great post. I understand your answer to the purpose of Christ's death on the cross and how it relates to the final judgement and God's mercy. Excellent points. I am still a bit hung up on the Romans question. If it was written to professing Christians who were presumably already saved why does Ephesians say that “it is by faith you have been saved” and not “it is by faith and baptism you have been saved”. As you said faith alone can't save. So why does it say “it is by faith you have been saved”? I guess I'm asking for you to elaborate a little on how and why it matters that Paul's audience is already saved. Thank you very much for responding to me. These forums have been very helpful. I appreciate it.
God Bless
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