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TO ALL:
I don't need to take much space to show that when a person acts in another person's name it means that the person is acting on the authority of the other person. The works that Jesus did in the days of His flesh were in His Father's name. He plainly said so and He meant that He acted on Hs Father's authority.
The works that the apostles did in the book of Acts were “in the name of Jesus”, that is, on the authority of Jesus. This in itself does not prove that Jesus in His exalted condition had equal authority with the Father. But….
Jesus said that the Father would send the Holy Spirit in His name:
25 “These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send IN MY NAME, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26
This is just another scripture that proves that Jesus enjoys a position of EQUALITY at the Father's right hand. For as Jesus acted in the Father's name and on His authority in the days He was a servant, so the Father acts in the name and the authority of the exalted Jesus. This CLEARLY infers Christ's equality with His Father.
So get out your magic wands and wave them over John 14:26 and say the words, “Abra cadabra!”, and the phrase “in my name” will will not mean that the Father sent the Spirit on Christ's authority. Just use your magic and the Usus Loquendi of the idiom “in my name” in John 14:26 will magically change.
thinker
Hi TT,
Those joined with Christ work in his name just as he is in God and worked in His name.
Thus in Christ we are enjoined with God's work.
We are not God and neither is the vineQuote (thethinker @ Jan. 12 2010,11:13) TO ALL: I don't need to take much space to show that when a person acts in another person's name it means that the person is acting on the authority of the other person. The works that Jesus did in the days of His flesh were in His Father's name. He plainly said so and He meant that He acted on Hs Father's authority.
The works that the apostles did in the book of Acts were “in the name of Jesus”, that is, on the authority of Jesus. This in itself does not prove that Jesus in His exalted condition had equal authority with the Father. But….
Jesus said that the Father would send the Holy Spirit in His name:
25 “These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send IN MY NAME, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26
This is just another scripture that proves that Jesus enjoys a position of EQUALITY at the Father's right hand. For as Jesus acted in the Father's name and on His authority in the days He was a servant, so the Father acts in the name and the authority of the exalted Jesus. This CLEARLY infers Christ's equality with His Father.
So get out your magic wands and wave them over John 14:26 and say the words, “Abra cadabra!”, and the phrase “in my name” will will not mean that the Father sent the Spirit on Christ's authority. Just use your magic and the Usus Loquendi of the idiom “in my name” in John 14:26 will magically become an exception.
thinker
Hi thethinker:He is still acting in His Father's name. It is God who exalted him to his position as head of the church. He watches over the Word of God that he obeyed and that was spoken by God to humanity through him while on his ministry on earth to perform it.
When we obey him we are obeying God. There is only “One God”.
And it is He who sits on the throne:
Quote Rev 5:9 And they sang a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll, And to open its seals; For You were slain, And have redeemed us to God by Your blood Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation,
Rev 5:10 And have made us [fn] kings [fn] and priests to our God; And we [fn] shall reign on the earth.”
Rev 5:11 Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne, the living creatures, and the elders; and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands,
Rev 5:12 saying with a loud voice: “Worthy is the Lamb who was slain To receive power and riches and wisdom, And strength and honor and glory and blessing!”
Rev 5:13 And every creature which is in heaven and on the earth and under the earth and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, I heard saying: “Blessing and honor and glory and power [Be] to Him who sits on the throne, And to the Lamb, forever and everLove in Christ,
MartyQuote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 12 2010,11:22) Hi TT,
Those joined with Christ work in his name just as he is in God and worked in His name.
Thus in Christ we are enjoined with God's work.
We are not God and neither is the vine
What's your point. The Father sent the Spirit on the Son's authority.thinker
Quote (942767 @ Jan. 12 2010,11:34) Quote (thethinker @ Jan. 12 2010,11:13) TO ALL: I don't need to take much space to show that when a person acts in another person's name it means that the person is acting on the authority of the other person. The works that Jesus did in the days of His flesh were in His Father's name. He plainly said so and He meant that He acted on Hs Father's authority.
The works that the apostles did in the book of Acts were “in the name of Jesus”, that is, on the authority of Jesus. This in itself does not prove that Jesus in His exalted condition had equal authority with the Father. But….
Jesus said that the Father would send the Holy Spirit in His name:
25 “These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send IN MY NAME, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26
This is just another scripture that proves that Jesus enjoys a position of EQUALITY at the Father's right hand. For as Jesus acted in the Father's name and on His authority in the days He was a servant, so the Father acts in the name and the authority of the exalted Jesus. This CLEARLY infers Christ's equality with His Father.
So get out your magic wands and wave them over John 14:26 and say the words, “Abra cadabra!”, and the phrase “in my name” will will not mean that the Father sent the Spirit on Christ's authority. Just use your magic and the Usus Loquendi of the idiom “in my name” in John 14:26 will magically become an exception.
thinker
Hi thethinker:He is still acting in His Father's name. It is God who exalted him to his position as head of the church. He watches over the Word of God that he obeyed and that was spoken by God to humanity through him while on his ministry on earth to perform it.
When we obey him we are obeying God. There is only “One God”.
And it is He who sits on the throne:
Quote Rev 5:9 And they sang a new song, saying: “You are worthy to take the scroll, And to open its seals; For You were slain, And have redeemed us to God by Your blood Out of every tribe and tongue and people and nation,
Rev 5:10 And have made us [fn] kings [fn] and priests to our God; And we [fn] shall reign on the earth.”
Rev 5:11 Then I looked, and I heard the voice of many angels around the throne, the living creatures, and the elders; and the number of them was ten thousand times ten thousand, and thousands of thousands,
Rev 5:12 saying with a loud voice: “Worthy is the Lamb who was slain To receive power and riches and wisdom, And strength and honor and glory and blessing!”
Rev 5:13 And every creature which is in heaven and on the earth and under the earth and such as are in the sea, and all that are in them, I heard saying: “Blessing and honor and glory and power [Be] to Him who sits on the throne, And to the Lamb, forever and everLove in Christ,
Marty
Hi Marty,You did not address my point at all.
thinker
The Thinker wrote:
Quote Jesus said that the Father would send the Holy Spirit in His name:
It is the same name as the whole family bears God's name.
I am also looking at the possibility the scripture I am referring to is using “name” differently.
John 14:16(NIV) reads:
Quote And I will ask the Father, and he will give you another Counselor to be with you forever—
I am not sure authority is the correct way to define “name” as Jesus states he will ask the Father.
Jesus does tell us that his actions are the actions of the Father and that his words are the words of the Father.
We also know that when we walk according to the ways of the Spirit that we are doing what Jesus would do and saying what Jesus would say.
It looks like I will have to ask God about this and ponder it some more. Thank you.
Thinker………Point is the Son is still under the authority of the FATHER, and always will be. The seven Spirits of GOd in him proven he is still under that authority, He will not stray from them, they are GOD'S Spirits at work (IN) HIM. But none the less they are (GOD'S) SPIRITS not his SPIRIT, and these Spirits (IN) him are effecting GOD the FATHERS WORK in the earth and when he returns these seven Spirits will direct his work in his kingdom. Therefore it is said “thy kingdom O GOD is an everlasting Kingdom”, because GOD (IN) Jesus the Christ is doing and establishing it on earth through Jesus the Christ. “ONE GOD (IN) ALL AND THROUGH ALL”. But that does (NOT) make the Person God is using and working through (A GOD)> Dump the TRINITARIAN GARBAGE Thinker.
Quote (Gene @ Jan. 12 2010,10:25) Thinker………Point is the Son is still under the authority of the FATHER, and always will be. The seven Spirits of GOd in him proven he is still under that authority, He will not stray from them, they are GOD'S Spirits at work (IN) HIM. But none the less they are (GOD'S) SPIRITS not his SPIRIT, and these Spirits (IN) him are effecting GOD the FATHERS WORK in the earth and when he returns these seven Spirits will direct his work in his kingdom. Therefore it is said “thy kingdom O GOD is an everlasting Kingdom”, because GOD (IN) Jesus the Christ is doing and establishing it on earth through Jesus the Christ. “ONE GOD (IN) ALL AND THROUGH ALL”. But that does (NOT) make the Person God is using and working through (A GOD)> Dump the TRINITARIAN GARBAGE Thinker.
GeneQuote (Gene @ Jan. 12 2010,10:25) Thinker………Point is the Son is still under the authority of the FATHER, and always will be.
Paul disagrees with you!Then the end will come, “WHEN HE (JESUS) HANDS OVER THE KINGDOM TO GOD THE FATHER AFTER HE (Jesus) HAS DESTROYED ALL DOMINION, AUTHORITY AND POWER. For he (Jesus) must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. And the last enemy to be destroyed is death. For he “has put everything under his feet.”* Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. “When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all”. 1 Cor 15:24-28
First of all these scriptures say that ‘Jesus has the Kingdom” and in the end will give it to the Father. Jesus has all authority and power and is sitting in the throne of God ruling as God. When are you going to quite making Jesus some sort of puppet on a string Gene? Jesus is no longer servant, but “King of Kings and Lord of Lords” of the universe, a title that belongs to God alone!
Second these scriptures say that Jesus must reign until “HE” Jesus has put all enemies under his feet including death! Then Paul clarifies that the Father is not included in the “everything” that is put under Jesus feet and further clarifies that the Father gave him the power over all things! Gene if the Father gave him all things then he has all things, so why do you continue to make him a servant when the Father has given him all things?
Then Paul says…
When he has done this, “THEN THE SON HIMSELF WILL BE MADE SUBJECT TO HIM” who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all
Open your eyes Gene and see that Jesus has not yet subjected himself to the Father for the last enemy has not been destroyed and all things have not yet been made subject to him, (Jesus).
Jesus is no longer the servant Messiah because he has all things and he sits in the Throne of God ruling as God!
WJ
Quote (Gene @ Jan. 13 2010,02:25) Thinker………Point is the Son is still under the authority of the FATHER, and always will be. The seven Spirits of GOd in him proven he is still under that authority, He will not stray from them, they are GOD'S Spirits at work (IN) HIM. But none the less they are (GOD'S) SPIRITS not his SPIRIT, and these Spirits (IN) him are effecting GOD the FATHERS WORK in the earth and when he returns these seven Spirits will direct his work in his kingdom. Therefore it is said “thy kingdom O GOD is an everlasting Kingdom”, because GOD (IN) Jesus the Christ is doing and establishing it on earth through Jesus the Christ. “ONE GOD (IN) ALL AND THROUGH ALL”. But that does (NOT) make the Person God is using and working through (A GOD)> Dump the TRINITARIAN GARBAGE Thinker.
Gene,
That's YOUR point. The scripture teaches that Jesus has been exalted and is EQUAL in authority with His Father. WJ has answered you from 1 Corinthians 15 for the zillionth time.thinker
Quote (Gene @ Jan. 13 2010,02:25) Thinker………Point is the Son is still under the authority of the FATHER, and always will be. The seven Spirits of GOd in him proven he is still under that authority, He will not stray from them, they are GOD'S Spirits at work (IN) HIM. But none the less they are (GOD'S) SPIRITS not his SPIRIT, and these Spirits (IN) him are effecting GOD the FATHERS WORK in the earth and when he returns these seven Spirits will direct his work in his kingdom. Therefore it is said “thy kingdom O GOD is an everlasting Kingdom”, because GOD (IN) Jesus the Christ is doing and establishing it on earth through Jesus the Christ. “ONE GOD (IN) ALL AND THROUGH ALL”. But that does (NOT) make the Person God is using and working through (A GOD)> Dump the TRINITARIAN GARBAGE Thinker.
Gene,Jesus CLEARLY said that the Father would send the Holy Spirit “in My name.” This means “on My authority.”
Deal with it!
thinker
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 13 2010,05:11) Hi WJ,
So Jesus is given full authority that he hands back to his God.
Why does that make him God?
Because there is no authority higher than FULL authority.
thinker
In the language of the Old Testament there are two distinct forms of the word “lord.”
One means G-d, the other a superior who is not G-d.
The oracle which predicts the Messiah, the Lord Yashuw'ah (Ps. 110:1) gives him the title “lord,” which refers to a person who is not G-d.
To distinguish Deity from non-Deity, the Hebrew Old Testament speaks of the Lord G-d as ADONAI (449 times) and of superiors who are not G-d as ADONI (my lord) 195 times.
In Psalm 110:1 the LORD (here Yahweh, the personal name of G-d) addresses a prophecy to David's lord, the Messiah.
Yashuw'ah and the New Testament writers, as well as the rabbis, knew that this was a prophecy about the Messiah (see the conversation in Matt. 22:41-46).
The “lord” addressed by Yahweh is given the title ADONI (my lord), an address never used of Deity.
Notice how important this Psalm is for New Testament Christianity:
“It is clear from the Apostles' quotation of the Old Testament that they had a strong preference for particular passages – Psalm 110 was the most favored of all”
Constitutionalist said:
Quote To distinguish Deity from non-Deity, the Hebrew Old Testament speaks of the Lord G-d as ADONAI (449 times) and of superiors who are not G-d as ADONI (my lord) 195 times.
Con,You gave Psalm 110:1 as an example of Messiah being called “Adoni” (non-deity). But go to verse 5 where David replied to Jehovah saying, “My ADONAI (God) is at your right hand.”
So David saw His Adoni as his Adonai or God.
thinker
Quote (thethinker @ Jan. 13 2010,11:53) Constitutionalist said: Quote To distinguish Deity from non-Deity, the Hebrew Old Testament speaks of the Lord G-d as ADONAI (449 times) and of superiors who are not G-d as ADONI (my lord) 195 times.
Con,You gave Psalm 110:1 as an example of Messiah being called “Adoni” (non-deity). But go to verse 5 where David replied to Jehovah saying, “My ADONAI (God) is at your right hand.”
So David saw His Adoni as his Adonai or God.
thinker
JackI wonder why the Arians or Unitarians do not translate their own Bible?
Maybe because it would be totally discredited by real Hebrew and Greek scholars!
WJ
Hi TT,
You keep shooting yourself in the foot saying that Jesus is God and also is equal to God.
Make you mind up.On another thread WorshippingJesus said:
Quote Now everything that was in the Fathers name is in Jesus name, Yes and the Father sent the Holy Spirit in Christ's name:
25 “These things I have spoken to you while being present with you. 26 But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send IN MY NAME, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you. John 14:26
thinker
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 14 2010,05:31) Hi TT,
You keep shooting yourself in the foot saying that Jesus is God and also is equal to God.
Make you mind up.
Nick,The apostle John must have shot himself in the foot. He said, “The Word was WITH God and the Word WAS God.”
Explain how the two statements are a violation of the law of non-contradiction.
thinker
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