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Hi All,
I have been wanting to discuss this for the longest time, and havent had the chance to bring it up.
According to scriptures,
Matthew 1:21
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.Exodus 29:45
And I will dwell among the children of Israel, and will be their God.Jesus other alias “Emmanuel” means “God with us”.
And I believe that “Jesus” means “The Lord is Salvation”Do you realize that God makes many and many promises of Dwelling with us to be OUR GOD and being our one and only Savior?
Emmanuel I believe proves that Jesus is “God with us” which scripture itself interpreted the meaning of the name.
Its so clear and direct, and whats even better that the interpretation of the name is already given.What say you?
SF: Very powerful stuff isn't it? Mary named the child, Yeshua, which translated became Jesus that is true. The people around him or his followers called him “Emmanuel” or made reference to him as “God with us” that was not his birth given name. It was a reflection of what those around him thought of him. He represented God Almighty in the flesh.
I believe Jesus came to reveal the truth to us that God always lived within mankind! Since the begining when God created Adam and breathed into him life I find no place where the breath of life left mankind.
Mans ideas or religion has said that since man chose to believe in evil that somhow that changed the nature or essence of a man. I do not see that as truth. I do see the first man passing down messages about God to his sons and daughters and eventually all mankind that was not truth of God. Adam was halfway in error of his mind when he accepted evil as another source to believe. There was only good before, then there was good and evil being taught from Adam to mankind. To me that was the beginning of sin/error. Wrong thinking that man was evil and could be separated from God. If God/Spirit is taken away from a human he has no life! The connection with God is all in the mind/heart of man. So, sin/error/wrong thinking, that man could be apart from God, proliferated throughout the ages.
So enters Jesus into the world to tell us the original truth of God, our source of life, dwelling in mankind. That belief was totally lost from the minds of men. Religion had totally destroyed mans mind with doctrines of degradation like unworthy, defiled, unclean, unrighteous, unwhole etc.! Jesus was the embodiment of God as all others were but he had not believed the lies of destruction. Jesus had not believed the deceptive, untruth of man created religion. Jesus mind was clean, whole, righteous, undefiled and pure connection to God/light.
The mission of Jesus was to try to get across to mankind that the Kingdom of God which is the ruling power of God which is the whole spirit of God dwells inside of each human being as God's words of knowledge with understanding. If one believes that truth it effectuates the beginning of the power of God in that persons life. Jesus started his ministry just after John came “Baptising” with water to symbolically wash away the old sinful thinking of mankind. To clean out of the mind all religion, rules, lies, do's and don'ts, rituals and most of all, the degrading doctrines of worthlessness that religion had put on Gods chosen vessels of life.
John washed their minds clean with physical, H2O water, as a picture of Jesus refilling them with the Spirit of God, which are the words of God. This is how Jesus led mankind back to God. The way back to God was through the truth/words of Jesus that he got from God. Jesus taught us (spiritually speaking) to eat(partake) his flesh, the true food of God, and drink (spiritually speaking) his blood which is true/drink. Hearing, understanding, and filling a human being with pure, clean, undefiled, whole/undevided, sinless, perfect words of God unto the fulness of the stature of Jesus our leader.
Its time to wake up to the truth given by Jesus. Still the first thing that must happen is removal of the old beliefs. So to be “poor in spirit”. One who thinks he knows the truth has no room for the real truth to establish. We must come as children, mourning and striving for the truth. They will be comforted. Those who hunger and thirst after Jesus/righteousness, will be filled. We must pay full attention to the truth from Jesus to be pure in heart. Pure because he has made you pure with his words, not based on anything we do or don't do.
There is a guarantee that come with beliving God and you are becoming ONE! The religious ones will persecute you for righteousness sake or your stand in righteousness. Consider yourself blessed when men shall revile you, and persecute you and shall say all manner of evil against you FALSELY for your pure, perfect stand with Jesus. Rejoice for so it has always been for the prophets before and Jesus himself whom religion killed.(Matt.5:11)
Let us all rise up in the truth of Jesus unto the fullness of the stature of Christ. When we see him, we will be like him, for as he is, so are we, in this world!! IMO, TK
Wm: I agree. Lets take your thought or the thought of the Fathers vicarious living through his Son, to its fullest level. The Father or God is able to experience every possible combination of experience that there is by living vicariously in every son of God or human being that has ever lived or ever will live. Every experience that could be or has been lived has been or is being vicariously lived by God in his creation, Man!!
If you think about it for a moment it could make sense. If God is ONE and everything that exists came from God and every thing is in God
God, how could God experience life. God is life. If there is no death to experience then how can one know life. You cannot experience hot without the relative experience of cold. You can't experience good if there is no bad. How would you know if it was good or bad. I believe that may be the reason God created the Earth in relative, physical, duality. Universal forces are split into opposing parts. NOT GOOD AND EVIL just opposites. There is positive and negative. In union together they are harmonized and work to perfection. If they become imbalanced, to much negative or to much positive, frictions, pains, problems etc., arrize.God experiencing life/every aspect of himself, through his creation,(5billion people or so) how perfect. Although God has not been able to express his nature or the essence of himself which is love because we drive the vehicle. To make the choices both ways we had to be given free will to choose. We are in the drivers seat. We are in control (good or bad) God is along for the experience'es! Interesting thoughts, yes? Just my opinion, Bless all, TK
Hi Dennison
Good post. We spend a lot of time here telling people Jesus is “God with us” but all the anti-Jesus is God folks spend all their time telling us Jesus is not “God with us”.
God alone is our Savour as you say yet Jesus is our Savour, not by proxy like all those that came before him.
while we wait for the blessed hope—the glorious appearing of our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ, who gave himself for us to redeem us from all wickedness and “TO PURIFY FOR HIMSELF A PEOPLE THAT ARE HIS VERY OWN“, eager to do what is good. Titus 2:13, 14
WJ
Tim Kraft,
IMO Im sure there is more to it than just a flawed belief system. I think thats where we differ. Your belief of the fall of mankind and Jesus's purpose are different from mine.WJ,
I was going to bring up Titus 2:13, 14!!!!
I was going to make a thread about it but i forgot, im glad you brought it up.Its a good proof text for this subject
Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 26 2011,12:40) Hi All, I have been wanting to discuss this for the longest time, and havent had the chance to bring it up.
According to scriptures,
Matthew 1:21
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.Exodus 29:45
And I will dwell among the children of Israel, and will be their God.Jesus other alias “Emmanuel” means “God with us”.
And I believe that “Jesus” means “The Lord is Salvation”Do you realize that God makes many and many promises of Dwelling with us to be OUR GOD and being our one and only Savior?
Emmanuel I believe proves that Jesus is “God with us” which scripture itself interpreted the meaning of the name.
Its so clear and direct, and whats even better that the interpretation of the name is already given.What say you?
God is with us throught his Spirit just as Scripture states. God is also in Jesus through his Spirit.Quote Ephesians 2:22 (New International Version) 22 And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.
Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 27 2011,11:31) Tim Kraft,
IMO Im sure there is more to it than just a flawed belief system. I think thats where we differ. Your belief of the fall of mankind and Jesus's purpose are different from mine.
SF & All: I no that we have been taught that sin is more that just a flawed belief system but admit we have been given a lot of error/sin by religion. If you ponder it honestly it makes more sense than teaching that an act of some sort, done by one son of God could somehow effect all other sons of God.The only way sin could be passed from one to another is by one person believing the other person and making it truth to himself. Beliefs are not forced they are chosen and accepted.
It would not be proper or legal or fair to have one man believe incorrectly or sin and thereby infect or separate all mankind from God. Yet all we like sheep are great followers of one another. If one person tells a story of a terrible situation we are inclined to believe that story and pass it on without any further verification.
First thing I say is sin did not happen in the Garden of Eden. If you hand a Bible to an honest, unbiased, unindoctrinated individual and as him to read the Adam and Eve story they could not even refer to the word sin as it was not in the
story. The word sin was not used until the fourth chapter of Gen. when Adam preferred one boys offering over the others offering. They weren't sin offerings. It seems to me the envy, and hate and wrothful anger toward his brothers' offering was the sin that led to death.
Really no matter, the word “sin” became a major religious doctrine that meant doing something that caused separation from perfect union with God.
This much I know. Nothing can separate me or anyone from God because God is ONE, WHOLE, UN-SEPARATED, force that is everywhere. God is absolute. God has no opposite. God is light. Light is! There is no darkness without covering light. Darkness is not in God. God is all inclusive life. Everything that lives is in God. God is source of life.
Since man cannot really be separated from God then when man thinks he is separated for some reason it is an illusion of truth. In truth he is one with God. In his mind illusion, he is still one in God but he believes he is separated. If one believes a lie the lie becomes truth to that man. It is not God/Truth. Yet to the man himself that believes it, it is his illusion of truth.
One last thing, I believe Jesus purpose was exactly what he came to do. Tell mankind the truth of where God is(and has always been) and what he has given to his creation/mankind.
Jesus came to lead us to Christ. This he did yet there are many who still believe they are unworthy, unrighteous, sinners, impure and imperfect unto God. These are they that missed Jesus teachings. IMO, TK
Quote (kerwin @ May 27 2011,16:04) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 26 2011,12:40) Hi All, I have been wanting to discuss this for the longest time, and havent had the chance to bring it up.
According to scriptures,
Matthew 1:21
And she shall bring forth a son, and thou shalt call his name JESUS: for he shall save his people from their sins.Matthew 1:23
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us.Exodus 29:45
And I will dwell among the children of Israel, and will be their God.Jesus other alias “Emmanuel” means “God with us”.
And I believe that “Jesus” means “The Lord is Salvation”Do you realize that God makes many and many promises of Dwelling with us to be OUR GOD and being our one and only Savior?
Emmanuel I believe proves that Jesus is “God with us” which scripture itself interpreted the meaning of the name.
Its so clear and direct, and whats even better that the interpretation of the name is already given.What say you?
God is with us throught his Spirit just as Scripture states. God is also in Jesus through his Spirit.Quote Ephesians 2:22 (New International Version) 22 And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.
Kerwin: Powerful Post! Right on target. Nothing feels as good as the truth of God when recognized and accepted within.As we hear Gods truth and accept and believe it we are building our Temple/House/Body/Abode of/for God/Jesus through Gods words which are spirit, truth and life.
I see this as the same thing as being filled with the Holy Spirit.
As we are filled with the spirit words of God/truth we become one with God. This is being filled with every good and perfect gift from above. Gods words through Jesus, cleanse us toperfection, wash us clean, make us whole and fill us with love for one another. What a joy that truth creates within. We are judged by the word of God/Jesus as perfect unto the father.
1John4:17….that we may have boldness in judgment because as he is, so are we, in this world!! God Bless you, TKHebrews 12:2
Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Another question, If Jesus is the Author than what is God if he is seperate being from christ?Tim Kraft,
Tell me what yuou think about this link:
http://www.thepathoftruth.com/teachings/restitution/reconciliation.htm
hit me up asap and tell me what you think.
SF: Just finished your referred writing. Very strong and quite accurate. One of the more accurate overviews I have read. I especially liked,
…. “All have been in rebellion and have feasted on being independent of God. All will be subdued. Not by men's scare tactics but by experience of evil and revelation of the righteous God Who came as a man and gave Himself for us that we might have Life. We then no longer eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil, which brings death, but live in and by the Tree of Life, the Lord Jesus Christ Who said, “Truly, truly I say to you, Except you eat the flesh of the Son of Man, and drink His blood, you have no life in you” (John 6:53).”
I thought that was very well put but at the end of Mr.Cohen's writing I had some minor disagreement. Most people talk of Gods “soverignty” as though God like a “King” on earth can call for a beheading and it must be performed. Religion calls God “all powerful” and “almighty” yet God is also bound by his word! What ever God says or promises cannot ever be broken. The reason man can totally trust God is his absolute word of Truth. God has given mankind freewill choice of life. God gave mankind the earth and its fulness.
God is not in charge of the earth. Man is! Thats why it is in the mess that it is in. God didn't create all the evil, death, and destruction. Mankind had the power to create what he chose to create and still has the same power. Darkness is a covering or blocking of light/truth. Its temporary not eternal. It is a creation of man which is an illusion of truth that is believed by man or it already was and man/Adam accepted it.
Anyway I believe man is totally in charge of his life on earth. Through his powerful mind of Christ his imaginations and contemplations draw like energies to his surroundings creating the circumstances of life he experiences. The power of God gives man the desires/thoughts of his heart. Whatsoever a man thinketh, in his heart, he shall have. We are made in the image of God our father. We create our lives in the same way our Father creates life.
Here is the kicker (or problem). Our powerful minds are darkened and hindered from wrong thinking. If one could wash out of his mind every blockage or thought of, can't, won't, shouldn't, wrong, sinful, bad, weak, sick, unclean, ungodly, unrighteous, and imperfect thought he would then be “limit less”! Dark thoughts are “limiting” the power of God from our minds.
This is why deception and lies are attempting to control our lives. Without us they have no expression. If we pay no attention to evil, destruction, sickness and death they then have no expression in life. They are not a part of life, why should they con mankind into expressing evil in life? See no evil, Hear no evil, and speak no evil, and there will be no evil in your experience on earth!! IMO, TK
Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2011,14:10) Hebrews 12:2
Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Another question, If Jesus is the Author than what is God if he is seperate being from christ?
God is the Inspiration of the Author and the Strategist behind the plan that is finished by Jesus.Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2011,03:10) Hebrews 12:2
Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Another question, If Jesus is the Author than what is God if he is seperate being from christ?
Hi DennisonExcellent Point.
But it is overlooked by those who insist that Jesus is merely a funnel of some kind, or a puppet on a string who has no substance of his own.
Everything that comes to us from God comes from Jesus to us and that makes him our source as well as the Father. For Jesus said “ALL THINGS ARE IN MY HANDS” AND “ALL THAT THE FATHER HAS IS MINE”. John 3:35 – John 10:28 – John 16:15 – Luke 10:22 – Matt 28:18
Therefore every thing that I recieve from God I recieve from Jesus. Hello?
Jesus said he is the “LIFE”. John 14:6
We exist because of Jesus. 1 Cor 8:6
IMO you have to be blind to not see who and what Jesus really is. Oh thats right Jesus said they would be blind and die in their sins unless they repent and believe that he is “I Am”.
If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me. (John 5:46)
In the old testament, Moses was clearly writing about The Lord God (Jehovah). Yet Jesus clearly states Moses was writing about himself.
So many scriptural proof texts that Jesus is God.
Blessings!
Keith
Quote (kerwin @ June 01 2011,01:08) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2011,14:10) Hebrews 12:2
Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Another question, If Jesus is the Author than what is God if he is seperate being from christ?
God is the Inspiration of the Author and the Strategist behind the plan that is finished by Jesus.
Kerwin,
Thats not quoted in scripture.Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2011,03:14) Tim Kraft, Tell me what yuou think about this link:
http://www.thepathoftruth.com/teachings/restitution/reconciliation.htm
hit me up asap and tell me what you think.
Hi DennisonGood link and I agree!
WJ
Hi Tim Kraft,
I also have alot to say but im short on time, and either way my explainations would be long and wordy so if you dont mind, ill make some short responses and refer some articles that answer your doubts and than you tell me what you think? Is that cool?
1. Sovereign http://www.thepathoftruth.com/teachin….god.htm
God does everything to glorify himself for our sake. Its all for his Glory. Thats what the book of Romans talks about. And God word comes from God, so whatever he does, is beyond our comprehension, as scripture also states that “his thoughts are higher than ours” “his weakness is greater than our strength”Quote God is not in charge of the earth. Man is! Thats why it is in the mess that it is in. God didn't create all the evil, death, and destruction. Mankind had the power to create what he chose to create and still has the same power. Darkness is a covering or blocking of light/truth. Its temporary not eternal. It is a creation of man which is an illusion of truth that is believed by man or it already was and man/Adam accepted it.
2. Freewill-http:1. http=://www.thepathoftruth.com/falsehoodexposed/freewill/whosewillisfree.htm
2. http://www.thepathoftruth.com/falseho….ill.htm
According to scripture Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
God did create evil. http://www.thepathoftruth.com/teachings/purposeevil.htmAnd also how can you believe in “freewill” and yet you dont believe in “sin”? Freewill isnt found in scriptures so why do you believe in it? its something someone has taught you Tim, not that its scriptureal, at all.
3. Also its imperative that you understand that Man has no power without God. All authority comes from above as Jesus said himself.
Also look at what Kieth wrote in his post above, all things are in the hands of WHO? Jesus, and THROUGH him we receiev redemption.
My friend the law was created to expose Sin, without the law there is no such thing as Sin. The Law made NOTHING perfect but exposed our IMPERFECTION and need of a Savior, Which God did send, not to free the minds of the people but to liberate them from the living hell here and now.
Jesus didnt just preach, he LIVED and DIED and RESSURECTED to save us, not for a religious idea of “sin”.
I feel like you belitttle the gospel when you speak of sin as simply a belief, when there is so much more.
Its like you heard of pie, but you havent tasted it yet.
I think if you continue you will be closer to what you search for.IF anything, you can ignore my quick response, and disorganized speech and at least read the links.
Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 31 2011,02:10) Hebrews 12:2
Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
Another question, If Jesus is the Author than what is God if he is seperate being from christ?
You post a scripture that clearly lists Jesus as someone OTHER THAN GOD, and then ask that question? Too funny.D, GOD is the One whose right hand Jesus is sitting at. Do you think GOD is sitting at His own right hand?
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