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I am a she too, not a he.
Quote (katjo @ Aug. 30 2009,04:03) I am a she too, not a he.
Great another Lady!!!!!!
The Subject on hand is interesting to me. My Husband says that we are a Soul. God gave us the Breath of Life, Spirit, and His Spirit at Baptism. We could not understand the things of God
without it. Scriptures says that there is a Spirit in man. I think that we are a Soul, have a Spirit and at Baptism receive God's Holy Spirit.
Peace and Love IreneQuote (katjo @ Aug. 29 2009,12:39) Nick , you posted God can. are you talking about what I posted to Jodi? I was telling her your soul is what goes to heaven or hell. Yes God can and scripture says in hell.Does your Matthew 10:28 say, fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul;but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell. Did you read the scripts I posted for ya?
kejo There is no hell, there is however a Lake of Fire. After the Millenium, all those who cannot follow God and Anti-Christ will be thrown into the lake of Fire Revelation says. The last to be destroyed is Death, and who caused death, Satan. All will burn up. Read Malachi. It is good to read it all, it only has 4 Chapters.
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Cindy @ Aug. 30 2009,04:19) Quote (katjo @ Aug. 30 2009,04:03) I am a she too, not a he.
Great another Lady!!!!!!
The Subject on hand is interesting to me. My Husband says that we are a Soul. God gave us the Breath of Life, Spirit, and His Spirit at Baptism. We could not understand the things of God
without it. Scriptures says that there is a Spirit in man. I think that we are a Soul, have a Spirit and at Baptism receive God's Holy Spirit.
Peace and Love Irene
Irene……..Georg is right we (ARE) a SOUL, we consist od a BODY and SPIRIT, that equals a SOUL. when we die the spirit go back to him who gave it, the body corrupts and turns back to dust, we have then parished. 'WHEN A MAN DIES HIS THOUGHT PARISH” . IF GOD WERE TO LEAVE US IN THE GRAVE WE WOULD NO LONGER EXIST. I order for us to continue to exist He must create another body and install spirit back into it and at that time we again become a living soul. Jesus perished on the cross He no longer existed until GOD the FATHER resurected HIM, and gave Him a new body fashioned after the appearance of his previous body. A 100% man who had flesh and bone (not blood), Had GOD left him in the grave He still would have been in a dead state, until resurected. IMOWhat i have seen Here is People do not (KNOW) what SPIRIT really is. They are fooled into thinking SPIRIT is a BEING, when in fact it is what animates the Being and if a spirit is in a Body and animates it it is them a LIVING SOUL. Body + Spirit= SOUL, Georg is right. IMO
peace and love ………….to you and Georg……………..gene
G,
So when the body rots and the spirit returns to God you do not have a soul?
Take SOUL out of scripture and it will be full of holes.G,
So resurrection is really not resurrection but recreation?
God recreated a torn and tattered body for Jesus exactly like the one he died in?
What of Acts 2-3?You really do wander far into speculation do you not?
NIck……….Not really, Jesus was resurrected with his same body except it was a regenerated one, it had power to regenerate and was flesh and Bone, as He said it was.Don't you believe what He said His body was?. A resurected body is a recreated one (YES) because the old body goes back to the dust and is corrupted and no longer lives unless it is regenerated by a new creation. So in order for us to Live again we must be given (NEW) Bodies the will (NOT) corrupt, “for the corruption must put on incorruption and this mortal must put on mortality. WE do (NOT) have that NOW we are temporal in these bodies. Your problem is you Keep thinking that a SOUL means , a body , a spirit, and a soul of some kind, but you have (NO) scripture to back you up. that is just you speculations, and as you say that is not helpful is it. Scripture says when GOD took the body and breath into Him He became a living SOUL, and we KNOW it was SPIRIT (INTELLECT) He put into HIM. If GOD were to retract His Spirit (ALL SOULS) would Parish. Both animal and Man. WE are simply Bodies with Spirit (intellect) in them. Nothing else. IF so then you are under obligation to Prove it by Scripture. IMO
peace and love…………………..gene
G,
If it was not his original body then he did not fulfill scripture.
His body did not see corruption.1 thess 5
Body . soul . spirit.
heb 4
Soul . spirit. No speculationYour intellect theory is unbiblical so is not a helpful addition.
To All. Don't you understand what a ransom is? It is an exchange. Christ physical body for Adams Body, Jesus Physical Body had to remain in the grave, because it put on all of our Sins, and Adam was released from the grave. Had Jesus been resurrected bodily it would have made His sacrifice for us void. The penalty for sins is death, Period. Therefore Jesus physical Body had to remain in the grave.
If dying for your sins and being resurrected again, is all it took, Jesus would not have had to die for us.
Jesus was resurrected with a Spirit Body, His true nature which He laid down for us so that He could die for us.
If you remember Maria- Madeleine thought He was the Gardener, and none of the Apostles, recognized Him by sight.
God simply disposed of the Human Body in the grave, for it was no longer needed.
Your are right Nick, the Spirit that goes back to God at death, is His Holy Spirit that He gave us.
At death you know nothing, you are aware of nothing, you hear and see nothing, you are sleeping you are asleep. The reason the Bible calls death sleeping is, there is an awakening from that sleep.By the way Nick, your reasoning is full of holes.
Georg
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 30 2009,08:20) G,
If it was not his original body then he did not fulfill scripture.
His body did not see corruption.1 thess 5
Body . soul . spirit.
heb 4
Soul . spirit. No speculationYour intellect theory is unbiblical so is not a helpful addition.
This is funny because my Husband said the same thing, we were writing at the same time, but Georg had more to say, so it took us longer.
IreneDoes the Bible not say he was raised a spirit? A spirit can take on human form, can it not? Did not angels do this in the Hebrew scriptures?
Quote So resurrection is really not resurrection but recreation?
And those who have been dead for a thousand years? What of them Nick? You know Nick, you, are not actually “you” of a few years ago. Is God going to collect all the atoms that are all over the earth of a single person and re-unite them? Can't he just go off the DNA?MARK 16:12 KING JAMES
“After that he appeared in another form unto two of them, as they walked, and went into the country.”
Mark 16:12 DOUAY VERSION
“And after that he appeared in another shape to two of them walking, as they were going into the country.”Sounds like something a spirit would do, does it not?
2 CORINTHIANS 5:16
“Even if we have known Christ according to the flesh, certainly we now know him so no more.”
ACTS 13:34:
“He [God] resurrected him [Jesus] from the dead destined no more to return to corruption.”JOHN 6:51: “I am the living bread that came down from heaven; if anyone eats of this bread he will live forever; and, for a fact, the bread that I shall give is my flesh in behalf of the life of the world.”
(Having given it, Jesus does not take it back again. He does not thereby deprive mankind of the benefits of the sacrifice of his perfect human life.)Anyway, no matter, the Bible is clear:
1 CORINTHIANS 15:45
“It is even so written: “The first man Adam became a living soul.” The last Adam became a life-giving spirit.”
1 TIM 3:16
“‘He was made manifest in flesh, was declared righteous in spirit, ”
1 PETER 3:18 (NASB)
“For Christ also died for sins once for all, the just for the unjust, so that He might bring us to God, having been put to death in the flesh, but made alive in the spirit;”
(At his resurrection from the dead, Jesus was brought forth with a spirit body. In the Greek text the words “flesh” and “spirit” are put in contrast to each other, and both are in the dative case; so, if a translator uses the rendering “by the spirit” he should also consistently say “by the flesh,” or if he uses “in the flesh” he should also say “in the spirit.”)Luke 24:36-39: “While they [the disciples] were speaking of these things he himself stood in their midst and said to them: ‘May you have peace.’ But because they were terrified, and had become frightened, they were imagining they beheld a spirit. So he said to them: ‘Why are you troubled, and why is it doubts come up in your hearts? See my hands and my feet, that it is I myself; feel me and see, because a spirit does not have flesh and bones just as you behold that I have.’”
Humans cannot see spirits, so the disciples evidently thought they were seeing an apparition or a vision that had appeared in this locked room. (Compare Mark 6:49, 50.) Jesus assured them that he was no apparition; they could see his body of flesh and could touch him, feeling the bones; he also ate in their presence. Similarly, in the past, angels had materialized in order to be seen by men; they had eaten, and some had even married and fathered children. (Gen. 6:4; 19:1-3)Following his resurrection, Jesus did not always appear in the same body of flesh (perhaps to reinforce in their minds the fact that he was then a spirit), and so he was not immediately recognized even by his close associates. (John 20:14, 15; 21:4-7) However, by his repeatedly appearing to them in materialized bodies and then saying and doing things that they would identify with the Jesus they knew, he strengthened their faith in the fact that he truly had been resurrected from the dead.
And, the kicker:
Several times he manifested himself and WAS RECOGNIZED, NOT BY HIS APPEARANCE, BUT BY HIS WORDS AND ACTIONS. (Lu 24:15, 16, 30, 31, 36-45; Mt 28:16-18)JOHN 21:4-7,12
“However, just as it was getting to be morning, Jesus stood on the beach, but THE DISCIPLES DID NOT, OF COURSE, discern that it was Jesus. Then Jesus said to them: “Young children, YOU do not have anything to eat, do YOU?” They answered “No!” to him. He said to them: “Cast the net on the right side of the boat and YOU will find [some].” Then they cast it, but they were no longer able to draw it in because of the multitude of the fishes. Therefore that disciple whom Jesus used to love said to Peter: “It is the Lord!” Hence Simon Peter, upon hearing that it was the Lord, girded about himself his top garment, for he was naked, and plunged into the sea. . . .Jesus said to them: “Come, take YOUR breakfast.” Not one of the disciples had the courage to inquire of him: “Who are you?” because they knew it was the Lord.”WHY WOULD THEY HAVE TO ASK: ‘WHO ARE YOU?’ OR NEED THE COURAGE TO ASK THIS IF HE HAD HIS FLESHLY BODY THAT WAS RECOGNIZABLE? THERE WOULD BE NO REASON TO ASK: WHO ARE YOU? The reason they knew it was the Lord, wasn’t because he appeared as he did before his death–they recognized him because he performed the miracle.
Quote (david @ Aug. 30 2009,08:50) Does the Bible not say he was raised a spirit? A spirit can take on human form, can it not? Did not angels do this in the Hebrew scriptures? Quote So resurrection is really not resurrection but recreation?
And those who have been dead for a thousand years? What of them Nick? You know Nick, you, are not actually “you” of a few years ago. Is God going to collect all the atoms that are all over the earth of a single person and re-unite them? Can't he just go off the DNA?
Hi David,
You have wandered from revelation into gross JW speculation.Jesus denied he was a spirit when he showed them his damaged flesh and bone body.[Lk 24.39]
Was he lying do you think?
Quote Hi David,
You have wandered from revelation into gross JW speculation.Jesus denied he was a spirit when he showed them his damaged flesh and bone body.[Lk 24.39]
Yes, that's one scripture which people take incorrectly.
And the other 14 that you ignore. What of them Nick?Luke 24:39 (New International Version)
Look at my hands and my feet. It is I myself! Touch me and see; a ghost does not have flesh and bones, as you see I have.”I believe, given the weight of the evidence (the other scriptures which most ignore) a word we would understand today would be “apparition.”
The Greek word phan′ta·sma occurs only in the two accounts of Jesus’ walking over the waters of the Sea of Galilee to his disciples who were in a boat. (Mt 14:26; Mr 6:49) The frightened disciples are quoted as saying: “It is an apparition!” The word phan′ta·sma is variously translated as “spirit” (KJ), “ghost” (AS, AT, RS, Mo), “phantom” (Fn), “false vision” (La), and “apparition” (Da, ED, Dy, Kx, MR, NW).
An apparition is an illusion; something actually not present but temporarily believed in because of excited imagination or other cause. Assuring the disciples that such was not the case and that he was real, Jesus said: “It is I; have no fear.”—Mt 14:27; Mr 6:50.
This was, therefore, a different situation from the occasion when the resurrected Jesus suddenly appeared in the midst of his disciples, causing them to imagine they beheld “a spirit [Gr., pneu′ma].” (Lu 24:36, 37) Jesus’ words in this situation evidently were not designed to convince them merely of his reality but to assure them that he was appearing before them in a fleshly human form and not in spirit form; hence, he told them to “feel me and see, because a spirit does not have flesh and bones just as you behold that I have.” (Lu 24:38-43; compare Ge 18:1-8; 19:1-3.)
“And they handed him a piece of broiled fish; and he took it and ate it before their eyes.“–Luke 24:42,43
Although the scriptures indicate he was raised a spirit and did not take back his human sacrifice, Jesus’ words in this situation (Luke 24) evidently were not designed to convince them merely of his reality but to assure them that he was appearing before them in a fleshly human form and not in spirit form.
Spirits (angels) have taken on human form before.
what is gross J.W. speculation?
David………A SPIRIT is (NOT) a being it is what is in the being. Jesus had a flesh body and still does which has the seven spirits of God now in it. A soul is BODY + SPIRIT (INTELLECT) existing together. Nothing more , nothing less. IMO
peace and love……………………gene
To all,
I believe a person is their soul, spirit, who lives in the tent of their body. This scripture seems to support that belief.
2 Peter 1:13(KJV) reads:
Quote Yea, I think it meet, as long as I am in this tabernacle, to stir you up by putting you in remembrance;
and
2 Peter 1:13(NIV) reads:
Quote I think it is right to refresh your memory as long as I live in the tent of this body,
A ghost would be a spirit, soul without their tent.
Jesus appears to have had a new imperishable tent for his soul when he was resurrected from the grave since it did not perish despite the wounds it bore.
Quote (Gene @ Aug. 31 2009,02:32) David………A SPIRIT is (NOT) a being it is what is in the being. Jesus had a flesh body and still does which has the seven spirits of God now in it. A soul is BODY + SPIRIT (INTELLECT) existing together. Nothing more , nothing less. IMO peace and love……………………gene
G,
So 1cor 15 is wrong and flesh has inherited the kingdom?Does he still need to eat and do all the other things flesh must do?
Is his flesh still torn and full of those holes?
Will we be like him when he returns.
Is intellect in scripture?
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