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Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 28 2010,02:11) Shimmer……….I agree with you that Love is most certainly a feeling. I once heard a an Hour sermon on how Love is and intelligent choice and emotion had nothing to do with love he said, Pure hog wash. “For God Pities us as a father pities his childern.” and again ” for you are sorrowed unto rightness”, and again “For godly sorrow works repentance not to be repented of”, and again “JESUS WEPT”
In fact i believe true Love is PURE EMOTION This emotion causes us to forgive and have compassion on others , it reconciles both man and GOD , GOD (IS) LOVE> We are so blessed to have a Heavenly Father with such great Emotions of LOVE. “For the love of GOD is Shed around in our hearts”. IMOpeace and love to you and your…………………………..gene
Your the best Gene, I always thought you were cool !Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 28 2010,19:47) David, I cant reply till later I have thing's to do.
Shimmer,That's okay, thanks for the heads up.
David,
It say's Adam and Eve HEARD God walking through the garden
God is spirit,
Spirit is like the wind, it blows where it wants,
The Spirit where he willeth doth blow, and his voice thou dost hear, but thou hast not known whence he cometh, and whither he goeth; thus is every one who hath been born of the Spirit.” John 3
“In the beginning of God's preparing the heavens and the earth — the earth hath existed waste and void, and darkness is on the face of the deep, and the Spirit of God fluttering on the face of the waters, and God saith, 'Let light be;' and light is.
YHVH spoke through Prophets, Angels, Woman, Kings,
“In many parts, and many ways, God of old having spoken to the fathers in the prophets, in these last days did speak to us in a Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He did make the ages; who being the brightness of the glory, and the impress of His subsistence, bearing up also the all things by the saying of his might — through himself having made a cleansing of our sins, sat down at the right hand of the greatness in the highest, having become so much better than the messengers, as he did inherit a more excellent name than they.” Hebrews 11 Corinthians 2
“The natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know them, because spiritually they are discerned;”
'What eye did not see, and ear did not hear, and upon the heart of man came not up, what God did prepare for those loving Him — '
“But to us did God reveal them through His Spirit, for the Spirit all things doth search, even the depths of God, for who of men hath known the things of the man, except the spirit of the man that is in him? so also the things of God no one hath known, except the Spirit of God. And we the spirit of the world did not receive, but the Spirit that is of God, that we may know the things conferred by God on us, which things also we speak, not in words taught by human wisdom, but in those taught by the Holy Spirit, with spiritual things spiritual things comparing, and the natural man doth not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for to him they are foolishness, and he is not able to know them, because spiritually they are discerned; and he who is spiritual, doth discern indeed all things, and he himself is by no one discerned; for who did know the mind of the Lord that he shall instruct Him? and we — we have the mind of Christ”.“There cometh an hour, and it now is, when the true worshippers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for the Father also doth seek such to worship him; God is a Spirit, and those worshipping Him, in spirit and truth it doth behove to worship.' John 4
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Worship The Father in spirit and in truth, it says.
'Thou shalt love the Lord thy God out of all thy heart, and out of all thy soul, and out of all thy strength, and out of all thy understanding,
Quote..”Worship (PROSKUNEO) is a conscious glorification of God flowing from an inner attitude of lowly submission to His authority and awe at His majesty. This glorification can be expressed by prostration and by words. Since God can hear the thoughts of the heart, the words do not have to be audible.
“The basic meaning of the word for 'worship' (PROSKUNEO) is to express, by words or by bowing down, profound and submissive respect or adoration.”,,unquoteJesus told us to pray to the Father, as He did,
Our Father who art in Heaven
But this is just how I see things, everyone is different.
Quote (kerwin @ Aug. 27 2010,16:40) Worshipping Jesus, I am not sure why you consider that statement a circular argument as its conclusion is not its premise. I do assume that it is true that a human being can and will stop sinning and thus urged you to believe it for your own good. I also used scripture, in my plea, that does a similar thing though the scripture is addressing those that the author assumes already believes.
I placed Jesus in the category of being a human being which is not the same as being a sinner though all human beings but him have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God. God did not create human beings to be sinners but humans went in search of many schemes, Ephesians 7:29. Jesus chose not to go in search of any schemes. That is why Jesus was made King of everything in heaven and on earth once made perfect, Hebrews 7:26-28. So Jesus is set apart from sinners though he is a human being.
I do not think you understand what I meant by Jesus was tempted by sin to the same degree as we are but without sin. I meant that his temptations were as intense as our own temptations even though they may not have been the exact same. So the answer to your question is that I simply do not know what particular temptations Jesus faced in his life beyond those that are mentioned while he fasted 40 days in the desert after being immersed in the Jordon River by John the Baptist. I know those were not the only ones because Scripture states Satan tempted him at other times. As I told you in my earlier post my opinion is that we are each tempted in according to our weaknesses.
Do you have another way to interpret Hebrews 4:15 to render it true? Here is for you to contemplate.
Hebrews 4:15(NIV) reads:
Quote For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet was without sin. If so please share your interpretation with us.
Hi Kerwin, Jesus – as you said, overcame the world, ' no-one was found worthy to open the scroll, John wept, but hey – weep not, for behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, he has overcome,To overcome something, there needs to be something to overcome, though Jesus faced temptations he sinned not. In the end he was whipped, laughed at, spat on, though he had a crown of thorns stuck into his head, though his hands and feet were nailed to the stake, he remained silent, like a lamb to the slaughter, though he could have called legions of Angels to come to his aid, he remained with God's will, not his own.
Gods word and truth were in him, he was born not of man but of spirit, as many others also can be born again not of man but spirit. He was raised to a position of Power and Authority, because he overcome. Just as scripture says many can, if we too overcome as he did.
From what I understand
Shimmer ……….Right on……….Many do not understand we must overcome (AS) or the Way Jesus overcame. Jesus is our Brother an (exact) likeness of us and we can overcome Just as He did that is to say the same way He did. But when people push his exactness away from there own the think Jesus had Special powers not available to them so , they worship him thinking He did it all for them and they lose site of the fact they themselves must overcome also (the way Jesus did) the same way. With the help of God the Father and His Holy Spirit existing (IN) them as it did Jesus, causing him to seek and do the Will of the Father, not his own will. Shimmer good post.
peace and love to you and yours………………………gene
I agree Gene, also many come through the great tribulation, whatever and whenever that will be, Others also believe they will be raptured away from that before it happens so when it does, they will not be ready, we should be ready for whatever happens, whenever it happens. Just as Jesus was.
Quote (shimmer @ Aug. 29 2010,00:27) I agree Gene, also many come through the great tribulation, whatever and whenever that will be, Others also believe they will be raptured away from that before it happens so when it does, they will not be ready, we should be ready for whatever happens, whenever it happens. Just as Jesus was.
Shimmer ……….Amen to that,peace and love………………………gene
Hi Shimmer and Gene,
Gen 3:8 They heard the sound of the LORD God WALKING in the garden in the cool of the day, and the man and his wife HID themselves from the PRESENCE of the LORD God “among the trees” of the garden.
Please look at the three all cap words:
WALKING
HID
PRESENCEYou take things literally when they aren't and ignore the literal when it is and insert what you want to believe.
If God is spirit and is blowing around as you say, then how did the hear Him walking?
If God is spirit and is everywhere how could they hide?
More specifically, how do you hide from God's presence if spirit is everywhere?
Presence is the state or fact of being present, as with others or in a place.Here is a verse that you probably won't like either:
Psa 51:11 Do not cast me away from Your presence And do not take Your Holy Spirit from me.
Two different people here, YHWH (Presence) and Holy Spirit. YHWH is not “spirit” as you claim.
Shimmer,
You said:
Quote Hi Kerwin, Jesus – as you said, overcame the world, ' no-one was found worthy to open the scroll, John wept, but hey – weep not, for behold, the Lion of the tribe of Judah, he has overcome,
To overcome something, there needs to be something to overcome, though Jesus faced temptations he sinned not….
Excellent! Applause!!! To all,
I am just learning. To me these sorts of discussions such as did Jesus pre-exist ,etc, they are just thing's which are interesting sometimes to think about but I don't believe they are the big deal people make them out to be. Which is exactly my point,
Does it really matter if someone believes in the Trinity or not ?
No, I don't believe it does matter. Antichrist is he who denies the Father and the Son. Neither does this.
Just say a person was a Christian, they went through a hard time, and they gave up on all that they believed, after a while they come back, and reconcile with God, there is rejoicing in heaven over one lost who is found. Should a person come down on them because they believe in the Trinity or not? No.
If a person is on their deathbed and they give their heart to the Lord, truly repent for all they have done wrong, and then they are gone, What did Jesus say to the thief on the cross ? Did He need to study the scriptures and get everything right ? No.
However, I believe we need to remain in a state of being teachable. Otherwise we are teachers and James say's not all should be teachers.
Loving God and loving neighbour are what Jesus told us to do, and to believe in him the son of God. And the Father who sent him. To have faith and works as well.
We should always be carefull how we treat others, we never know what stage they are at, what is happening in their lives, etc. Love one another.
Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 29 2010,01:34) Hi Shimmer and Gene, Two different people here, YHWH (Presence) and Holy Spirit. YHWH is not “spirit” as you claim.
Hi DBF,John 4:24 God is Spirit: and they that worship him must worship in spirit and in truth.
Eph.4:4-6 There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling; One Lord,
one faith, one baptism, One God and Father of all, who
is above all, and through all, and in you all.Deut.6:4 Hear, O Israel: The LORD our God is one LORD:
“ONE SPIRIT: GOD”=151
YHVH GOD is One=151 (Deut.6:4 / Eph.4:6)
The LORD JEHOVAH=151 (Isaiah 12:2, 26:4)
LORD of Hosts=151 (AKJV Bible)
Jesus Christ=151 (New Testament)
Holy Spirit=151 (Old & New Testament)Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (davidbfun @ Aug. 29 2010,02:34) Hi Shimmer and Gene, Gen 3:8 They heard the sound of the LORD God WALKING in the garden in the cool of the day, and the man and his wife HID themselves from the PRESENCE of the LORD God “among the trees” of the garden.
Please look at the three all cap words:
WALKING
HID
PRESENCEYou take things literally when they aren't and ignore the literal when it is and insert what you want to believe.
If God is spirit and is blowing around as you say, then how did the hear Him walking?
If God is spirit and is everywhere how could they hide?
More specifically, how do you hide from God's presence if spirit is everywhere?
Presence is the state or fact of being present, as with others or in a place.Here is a verse that you probably won't like either:
Psa 51:11 Do not cast me away from Your presence And do not take Your Holy Spirit from me.
Two different people here, YHWH (Presence) and Holy Spirit. YHWH is not “spirit” as you claim.
David,Adam and Eve heard God walking in the garden. God is spirit so the scriptures say.
The spirit which is spoken about as being like the wind, that is the Holy Spirit. According to scripture, the spirit comes from God, there is God, there is the Holy Spirit, and there is the word of God, which is the son, from what I understand.
Adam and eve were with God, it would have been different.
I don't study scripture as much as most here. I'm only learning ?
Shimmer……….what you have said is true to a point, But remember these concepts effect our minds in who we see the salvation process. If you view Jesus as a (speacial preexisting being) having all the spical past associtions and knowledge. How do we truly relate with Him.
One is He is a GOD that Created everything …….Trinity Doctrine
One is He had all kind of past advantages by…….a Prexistence
One is to understand Jesus did (NOT) have (ANY) advantage over Us his Brother and Sisters, except He was the (First) from the creation to become a true son of GOD. He was preplanned by GOD to be the First HUMAN to Achieve that Goal from among many brothers. When we consider Jesus as one of Us humans and see how God the Father took a Son of MAN like us and perfected Him a man who had the (EXACT) same temptations as we do and taught Him to obey Him and overcome sin by His reliance of the Father , we gain much more Hope by understand that, Then those who separate Jesus' EXACT likeness from themselves. IMO
peace and Love to you and yours…………………………gene
Gene, it's funny, I used to say you were wrong with that, I can see where you and other's are coming from now, I don't know 100% if you are right or wrong, but I do see some thing's, how it fits in to the picture, kind of.
But still, if the world were to end today, whoever does the will of God has done all they can. Someone could have all the knowledge in the world but do nothing, feel nothing, God know's the intentions of the heart.
I could go to church, pray, do great thing's, but, if I have no true love in my heart, I have nothing. How could I love if I believe that all those who don't believe as I do, will go to a fiery hell to be tormented forever, while I go to heaven ? That's not love.
The will of God is a state of heart, and mind, Toward our creator and toward other people.
We can be whatever we want to be though sometimes a change is needed, one which often only is possible through God.
Iv said all I need to in this thread, I have other thing's I need to find out !
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ Aug. 29 2010,14:44) Shimmer……….If you view Jesus as a (speacial preexisting being) having all the spical past associtions and knowledge. How do we truly relate with Him. …IMO
peace and Love to you and yours…………………………gene
Hi Gene,The same way Jesus relates to God; because we all preexisted. (Jer.1:5 / John 15:27)
John 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that
they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgEd, as I just said to you, I don't know what to believe half the time ?
Why is Christianity so confusing and why are there so many opinions ?
Sometimes like lately, I think I have it all figured, then, I don't know.
I suppose God reveals what he will, when he will, to whom he will.
Also, Jesus said, you don't have because you don't ask ?
Quote (Ed J @ Aug. 29 2010,17:48) The same way Jesus relates to God; because we all preexisted. (Jer.1:5 / John 15:27)
John 17:21 That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that
they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me.
Hi Ed. If those verses are proof that we all pre-existed, don't you have more than that ? Aren't those verses talking about those who followed Christ. What does that have to do with 'we all pre-existed' ?EDJ…………..You have not (PROVED) that we preexisted in any Past life as Beings of any kind, that is all speculations on you part. We could have Just existed like Jesus in the plan and will or foreknowledge of GOD before we were ever brought into existence. God plans out things and them cause them to come about. A plan always preexists its existence. IMO
peace and love………………………….gene
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