Does hebrews 2:17 tell us jesus is created?mqa

[kerwin]

Quote (banana @ Jan. 06 2010,18:22)

kerwin “””I want to point out that according to scripture he is still a human being.””” This is what you said, referring to Jesus, after his resurrection. SHOW ME THE SRIPTURE!! Georg

1 Timothy 2:5(NIV) reads:

Quote

For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus,

1 Timothy 2:5(KJV) reads:

Quote

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

1 Timothy 2:5(ASV) reads:

Quote

For there is one God, one mediator also between God and men, himself man, Christ Jesus,

[kerwin]

Quote (uoflfan @ Jan. 07 2010,03:25)

Jesus had God in Him a different way than us he was a spirit before he was a man. But he had all the Power of God while on the earth. When He says when you see Me you see the Father, you are because He did the Will of the Father. He says I do not speak on my own initiative. The works are not his own but the Father's. The important this is our God and Father and His God and Father is being worshiped. God Bless

Believers have God in them because they have Jesus in them so his was more direct.  You could state that believers are a copy of an exact copy.  Other than that, there is no difference.

John 17:20-22(NIV) reads:

Quote

My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, 21that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me. I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one:

As you can see Jesus specifically states in his prayer that he wanted his believers to be one with God and himself just as he is one with God.

[peace2all]

without god nothing would be or will become.

from god came jesus who in total unity with god in nature,spirit,word.

this is a great example of how complex in unity god is. this does not sound like things so different and seperate and unlike in would be.

to think that our undersatanding of his unity is so nice that it fits in our pretty little box is funny.

how dare god to think he can be at two places at the same time and still want only the father figure in the “relationship” be worshiped.

how else would you like god to describe his complex unity and ways of communication. should he not use things we can relate to with illistration.

god has always been and always will be. he is the sole source of all. nothing that is or will be without his doing.

god and his spirit created all. genesis in plain reading with unbias view tells us this.

[banana]

Quote (Gene @ Jan. 06 2010,23:53)

Georg………”when the SON OF MAN returns will he find FAITH on the EARTH”. There are more that say He is still Son of MAN. That would make him a human being right?

Gene

No it would not.
Jesus was both; he was the son of God because God gave him life, brought him into existence.
He was also the son of man, meaning mankind, because he was born by a woman when he became man.

Georg

[banana]

Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 07 2010,11:46)

Quote (banana @ Jan. 06 2010,18:22) kerwin “””I want to point out that according to scripture he is still a human being.””” This is what you said, referring to Jesus, after his resurrection. SHOW ME THE SRIPTURE!! Georg 1 Timothy 2:5(NIV) reads: Quote For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 1 Timothy 2:5(KJV) reads: Quote For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 1 Timothy 2:5(ASV) reads: Quote For there is one God, one mediator also between God and men, himself man, Christ Jesus,

kerwin

And that is your prove?
If you don't know the meaning of that scripture, you don't deserve me wasting my time explaining it to you, because I think your pulling my leg; you can't pretend to be that dumb.

Look up, and see what I said to Gene.

Georg

[kerwin]

Quote (banana @ Jan. 07 2010,08:21)

Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 07 2010,11:46) Quote (banana @ Jan. 06 2010,18:22) kerwin “””I want to point out that according to scripture he is still a human being.””” This is what you said, referring to Jesus, after his resurrection. SHOW ME THE SRIPTURE!! Georg 1 Timothy 2:5(NIV) reads: Quote For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 1 Timothy 2:5(KJV) reads: Quote For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 1 Timothy 2:5(ASV) reads: Quote For there is one God, one mediator also between God and men, himself man, Christ Jesus, kerwin And that is your prove? If you don't know the meaning of that scripture, you don't deserve me wasting my time explaining it to you, because I think your pulling my leg; you can't pretend to be that dumb. Look up, and see what I said to Gene. Georg

Are you dancing around the subject? The scripture clearly states Jesus is a man, i.e. human being.

The purpose of the scripture is to instruct Timothy that Jesus a human being will bring about a settlement between God and mankind. In Hebrews we are told we required a human to do this.

Jesus, a human being, qualifies because he was tempted even as we are but without sinning.

Like the Trinitarians you are stating Jesus is a hybrid. Do you believe Jesus is 100% the Son of God and 100% man or 50% each?

Is the Son of God a different kind of being than human, phantasm, angel, animal, God?

[peace2all]

Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 07 2010,17:22)

Quote (banana @ Jan. 07 2010,08:21) Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 07 2010,11:46) Quote (banana @ Jan. 06 2010,18:22) kerwin “””I want to point out that according to scripture he is still a human being.””” This is what you said, referring to Jesus, after his resurrection. SHOW ME THE SRIPTURE!! Georg 1 Timothy 2:5(NIV) reads: Quote For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 1 Timothy 2:5(KJV) reads: Quote For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 1 Timothy 2:5(ASV) reads: Quote For there is one God, one mediator also between God and men, himself man, Christ Jesus, kerwin And that is your prove? If you don't know the meaning of that scripture, you don't deserve me wasting my time explaining it to you, because I think your pulling my leg; you can't pretend to be that dumb. Look up, and see what I said to Gene. Georg Are you dancing around the subject?   The scripture clearly states Jesus is a man, i.e. human being. The purpose of the scripture is to instruct Timothy that Jesus a human being will bring about a settlement between God and mankind.  In Hebrews we are told we required a human to do this.   Jesus, a human being, qualifies because he was tempted even as we are but without sinning. Like the Trinitarians you are stating Jesus is a hybrid.  Do you believe Jesus is 100% the Son of God and 100% man or 50% each? Is the Son of God a different kind of being than human, phantasm, angel, animal, God?

kerwin, jesus could not have been tempted to do anything.

as he states he can only do the fathers works,words.

that he and the father are one, they are both in each other.

verse after verse after verse talks about how so they are unified in every ascpect.

does this sound as a completly seperate entity and having no unity with the father at all?

the telling of how unified they are in nature,spirit and words cannot get any more specific.

he is what the invisible god is, makes no difference of he was placed in womb unto woman from his own spirit and bringing forth a flesh being. it is what it is. its you fault for not wanting to accept it.

he was giving flesh but born of god's spirit, he was given

god is complex and stop trying to stuff him in your nice little box.

[GeneBalthrop]

Quote (banana @ Jan. 07 2010,13:09)

Quote (Gene @ Jan. 06 2010,23:53) Georg………”when the SON OF MAN returns will he find FAITH on the EARTH”. There are more that say He is still Son of MAN. That would make him a human being right? Gene No it would not. Jesus was both; he was the son of God because God gave him life, brought him into existence. He was also the son of man, meaning mankind, because he was born by a woman when he became man. Georg

Georg………Scripture shows we are exactly like Jesus, as concerning being sons of GOD.

1John 3:2…..> Beloved, (NOW) are we the sons of GOD, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be, but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is.

Another word we shall be exactly like him when he appears.

and verse 1…> Behold, what manner of love the Father has bestowed upon us, that we should be called the son of GOD (NOW): therefore the world knows us not because it knew him not.

Georg, are we not also sons of GOD (AND)  Sons of Man. Jesus and we are the exact same, except He is the First born into the Kingdom of GOD, but we are given (JOINT) inheritance and Joint promises, we are called his brothers, He being the first of (MANY) Brethern, I see Jesus as family and do not separate Him from MY Identity in any way, except in authority given (by the FATHER).  That is the problem with TRINITARIAN AND PREEXISTENCE THEOLOGY it cause a separation of our and His identity with US. IMO

peace and love to you and Irene………..gene

[peace2all]

Quote (Gene @ Jan. 08 2010,03:30)

Quote (banana @ Jan. 07 2010,13:09) Quote (Gene @ Jan. 06 2010,23:53) Georg………”when the SON OF MAN returns will he find FAITH on the EARTH”. There are more that say He is still Son of MAN. That would make him a human being right? Gene No it would not. Jesus was both; he was the son of God because God gave him life, brought him into existence. He was also the son of man, meaning mankind, because he was born by a woman when he became man. Georg Georg………Scripture shows we are exactly like Jesus, as concerning being sons of GOD. 1John 3:2…..> Beloved, (NOW) are we the sons of GOD, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be, but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. Another word we shall be exactly like him when he appears. and verse 1…> Behold, what manner of love the Father has bestowed upon us, that we should be called the son of GOD (NOW): therefore the world knows us not because it knew him not. Georg, are we not also sons of GOD (AND)  Sons of Man. Jesus and we are the exact same, except He is the First born into the Kingdom of GOD, but we are given (JOINT) inheritance and Joint promises, we are called his brothers, He being the first of (MANY) Brethern, I see Jesus as family and do not separate Him from MY Identity in any way, except in  authority given (by the FATHER).  That is the problem with TRINITARIAN AND PREEXISTENCE THEOLOGY it cause a separation of our and His identity with US.  IMO peace and love to you and Irene………..gene

no seperation, it only draws him closer that god instead of keeping those writen laws & written words, he brought to us it in form of flesh.

those words of god's were given to us now in person. a tangable ,seeable way.

this only draws him closer not further. why do you think it is for all man and thus has brought together peoples from al over the globe.

you are so mistaken

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 07 2010,01:22)

Is the Son of God a different kind of being than human, phantasm, angel, animal, God?

No he is both, God according to his Spirit and man according to his flesh.

Son of God, Son of Man!

If he is just a “mere man” then why the virgin birth?

WJ

[banana]

Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 07 2010,17:22)

Quote (banana @ Jan. 07 2010,08:21) Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 07 2010,11:46) Quote (banana @ Jan. 06 2010,18:22) kerwin “””I want to point out that according to scripture he is still a human being.””” This is what you said, referring to Jesus, after his resurrection. SHOW ME THE SRIPTURE!! Georg 1 Timothy 2:5(NIV) reads: Quote For there is one God and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus, 1 Timothy 2:5(KJV) reads: Quote For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus; 1 Timothy 2:5(ASV) reads: Quote For there is one God, one mediator also between God and men, himself man, Christ Jesus, kerwin And that is your prove? If you don't know the meaning of that scripture, you don't deserve me wasting my time explaining it to you, because I think your pulling my leg; you can't pretend to be that dumb. Look up, and see what I said to Gene. Georg Are you dancing around the subject?   The scripture clearly states Jesus is a man, i.e. human being. The purpose of the scripture is to instruct Timothy that Jesus a human being will bring about a settlement between God and mankind.  In Hebrews we are told we required a human to do this.   Jesus, a human being, qualifies because he was tempted even as we are but without sinning. Like the Trinitarians you are stating Jesus is a hybrid.  Do you believe Jesus is 100% the Son of God and 100% man or 50% each? Is the Son of God a different kind of being than human, phantasm, angel, animal, God?

kerwin

The scripture clearly states that Jesus WAS a man, and he WAS all man. The hybrids you are referring to were the once produced by angels marrying woman, which God destroyed by a flood.
What are you talking about; “settlement between God and mankind?”
Jesus came to die for OUR sins, WHY? because the penalty for sin is death. In other words, if you die in your sins there would be no way for you to ever live again. Jesus, who was a spirit being, came as a man, WHY? because spirit beings can not die. God changed his spirit nature into a human nature by impregnating Mary, not the way we do it; he then was born a human being, 100% man, but what was the same was his mind, he knew who he was, God's son; he knew where he came from, heaven; he knew why he had come, to die for us; and he knew the message God had given him to deliver.
Jesus not having sinned, did not deserve death, but he became our substitute, he died for us, for our sins. What does that mean? Your sins is what would have kept you in your grave; Jesus took your sins, and mine, removed them from you, and placed them on himself; he freed you from your sins; now you will have a chance to live again, by a resurrection.
Now, if it makes sense to you that your sins would have kept you in the grave for ever, should it not make equal sense that now Jesus flesh body, which took on all of our sins, should remain in the grave? That is why Jesus had to become a human in the first place, so that he COULD die for us.
When God resurrected Jesus he gave him back his spirit nature while his human, flesh body, sinful body, had to remain in the grave; that is what a ransom is, an exchange, his body for ours.

You are being ridiculous, or totally ignorant to ask this:

“””Like the Trinitarians you are stating Jesus is a hybrid. Do you believe Jesus is 100% the Son of God and 100% man or 50% each? Is the Son of God a different kind of being than human, phantasm, angel, animal, God?”””

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

WJ……….So then what are we, are we not the same as He is. We are both son of Man and Son of GOD also , it we have the FATHER SEED in US we are His SONS and DAUGHTERS, (NOW), as John SAID. Why do you TRINITARIANS,and PREEXISTENCES, CONTINUALLY TRY TO SEPARATE JESUS FROM OUR (EXACT) IDENTITY. Changing the MAN Jesus into very GOD is IDOLATRY WJ.

[banana]

Quote (Gene @ Jan. 08 2010,03:30)

Quote (banana @ Jan. 07 2010,13:09) Quote (Gene @ Jan. 06 2010,23:53) Georg………”when the SON OF MAN returns will he find FAITH on the EARTH”. There are more that say He is still Son of MAN. That would make him a human being right? Gene No it would not. Jesus was both; he was the son of God because God gave him life, brought him into existence. He was also the son of man, meaning mankind, because he was born by a woman when he became man. Georg Georg………Scripture shows we are exactly like Jesus, as concerning being sons of GOD. 1John 3:2…..> Beloved, (NOW) are we the sons of GOD, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be, but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. Another word we shall be exactly like him when he appears. and verse 1…> Behold, what manner of love the Father has bestowed upon us, that we should be called the son of GOD (NOW): therefore the world knows us not because it knew him not. Georg, are we not also sons of GOD (AND)  Sons of Man. Jesus and we are the exact same, except He is the First born into the Kingdom of GOD, but we are given (JOINT) inheritance and Joint promises, we are called his brothers, He being the first of (MANY) Brethern, I see Jesus as family and do not separate Him from MY Identity in any way, except in  authority given (by the FATHER).  That is the problem with TRINITARIAN AND PREEXISTENCE THEOLOGY it cause a separation of our and His identity with US.  IMO peace and love to you and Irene………..gene

Gene

It is obvious that people love the idea to become a spirit being, I mean, who wouldn't like to fly around like superman; but that's not the way it is.
Is John talking to the whole Jewish community, or only to believers?
Jesus is no longer a human; read what I said to kerwin.
When John said, “we will be like him”, ask yourself, what is Jesus like, now? he is a spirit being; and the saints that will come up in the first resurrection, will be like him, will be spirit beings. Only those that do come up in the first resurrection will see him as he is, only they will be the sons of God.
WE and Jesus are not even close to be the same. WE, who not even understand or believe the word of God, think we will be joint heirs with Christ?
That is the audacity with man, they THINK TO MUCH, instead of looking what the Bible teaches.

Georg

[GeneBalthrop]

Georg………First of all I do not believe in SPIRIT (BEINGS) , except GOD HIMSELF. I believe (BEINGS) HAVE SPIRIT (IN) THEM. And that can Be GOD ALSO, as Jesus Did. Jesus is (NOT) mow a SPIRIT “BEING”, he has flesh and bone (not flesh and blood) He is still son of Man and this body he now has was the same as His resurrected Body. We have no reason to think otherwise. This body is the same as the angles bodies are, they are beings also that have SPIRIT (IN) them. There is no one outside of GOD that exists as a SPIRIT “BEING”, IMO.

[kerwin]

George wrote:

Quote

What are you talking about; “settlement between God and mankind?”

Scripture instructs us that Jesus is the mediator between God and mankind.  The purpose of a mediator is to bring about a settlement between two parties.  The settlement between mankind and God is the new contract which we call a new covenant.

George wrote:

Quote

Jesus came to die for OUR sins, WHY? because the penalty for sin is death.

I agree with those statements.

George wrote:

Quote

In other words, if you die in your sins there would be no way for you to ever live again. Jesus, who was a spirit being, came as a man, WHY? because spirit beings cannot die.

Satan is a spiritual being and he will perish.

George wrote:

Quote

God changed his spirit nature into a human nature by impregnating Mary, not the way we do it; he then was born a human being, 100% man

I understand your point but disagree as that is not what the word “conceive” means.

George wrote:

Quote

Jesus not having sinned, did not deserve death, but he became our substitute, he died for us, for our sins.

Once again I agree.  Though he died for our sins death could not hold onto him because he did not deserve death.

George wrote:

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That is why Jesus had to become a human in the first place, so that he COULD die for us.

I agree with you here though I do not agree that Jesus was originally a spirit being.

George wrote:

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When God resurrected Jesus he gave him back his spirit nature while his human, flesh body, sinful body, had to remain in the grave; that is what a ransom is, an exchange, and his body for ours.

I disagree at this point.  

Angels sinned which implies they have sinful natures despite being spirit beings.  

A human can be a spirit being as it is not our corruptible flesh that makes us human but rather our soul.

I also have a question. Could you please describe what you believe a spirit being is?

[kerwin]

Worshipping Jesus wrote:

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No he is both, God according to his Spirit and man according to his flesh.

I actually agree with you words but I doubt I would agree with the interpretation you put to them.  Anyone who has the Holy Spirit is God according to his Spirit.  I do not consider that makes them God but rather it is God that is living in them and doing his works through them.

Worshipping Jesus wrote:

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Son of God, Son of Man!

God is Spirit and does not have either spiritual or unspiritual flesh. His children are thus children of his Spirit and Jesus is his first fruits.

Worshipping Jesus wrote:

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If he is just a “mere man” then why the virgin birth?

Why not?   I would say it was a sign.  It also prevented Jesus from being a descendant of a king God declared would never have any offspring sit on the throne of David.   We will probably have fatherless children in the future through cloning.  Those children will just be mere human beings.

[kerwin]

Peace2All wrote:

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kerwin, jesus could not have been tempted to do anything.

That is an interesting statement as it contradicts what scripture clearly states.

Hebrews 4:15(NIV) reads:

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For we do not have a high priest who is unable to sympathize with our weaknesses, but we have one who has been tempted in every way, just as we are—yet was without sin.

Peace2All wrote:

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as he states he can only do the fathers works, words.

I assume you are referencing John 10:37-38 which reads:

John 10:37-38(NIV) reads:

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Do not believe me unless I do what my Father does. But if I do it, even though you do not believe me, believe the miracles that you may know and understand that the Father is in me, and I in the Father.”

Temptation does not equal works.  Jesus was tempted to disobey God but he chose to do God’s will instead of his own and thus manifested the works of the Spirit and not of the flesh.

Peace2All wrote:

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that he and the father are one, they are both in each other.

He also asked God if his believers could one with him and the Father as he and the Father are one.

John 17:20-23(NIV) reads:

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My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me. I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one: I in them and you in me. May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me.

Peace2All wrote:

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does this sound as a completly seperate entity and having no unity with the father at all?

You can have unity while being a separate entity.

Ephesians 4:1-5(NIV) reads:

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I therefore, the prisoner of the Lord, beseech you that ye walk worthy of the vocation wherewith ye are called, With all lowliness and meekness, with longsuffering, forbearing one another in love;  Endeavouring to keep the unity of the Spirit in the bond of peace. There is one body, and one Spirit, even as ye are called in one hope of your calling;  One Lord, one faith, one baptism,  One God and Father of all, who is above all, and through all, and in you all.

Are the believers separate entities?  According to this scripture they too are in union with God.

Peace2All wrote:

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he telling of how unified they are in nature, spirit and words cannot get any more specific.

Godly nature and spirit are synonyms and words, as a form of works, come from the spirit.  

Peace2All wrote:

Quote

he is what the invisible god is, makes no difference of he was placed in womb unto woman from his own spirit and bringing forth a flesh being. it is what it is. its you fault for not wanting to accept it.

God is in every womb since every individual “lives and moves and has our being in him.” Paraphrased from Acts 17:28

Peace2All wrote:

Quote

god is complex and stop trying to stuff him in your nice little box.

I agree that God is complex but he is not a God of confusion as you believe him to be.

[banana]

Quote (Gene @ Jan. 08 2010,10:24)

Georg………First of all I do not believe in SPIRIT (BEINGS) , except GOD HIMSELF. I believe (BEINGS) HAVE SPIRIT (IN) THEM. And that can Be GOD ALSO, as Jesus Did.  Jesus is (NOT) mow a SPIRIT “BEING”, he has flesh and bone (not flesh and blood) He is still son of Man and this body he now has was the same as His resurrected Body. We have no reason to think otherwise. This body is the same as the angles bodies are, they are beings also that have SPIRIT (IN) them. There is no one outside of GOD that exists as a SPIRIT “BEING”, IMO.

Gene

If you don't believe in spirit beings, you don't believe the Bible, so there is no point in talking to you any further.
Yes, we have a spirit in us, Paul says so, but he is referring to our mind.
If you believe Jesus has the same body as he had before, you don't understand the ransom.
I can tell you this; Satan's spirit has done a real number on you.

Georg

[kerwin]

Quote (banana @ Jan. 08 2010,16:30)

Quote (Gene @ Jan. 08 2010,10:24) Georg………First of all I do not believe in SPIRIT (BEINGS) , except GOD HIMSELF. I believe (BEINGS) HAVE SPIRIT (IN) THEM. And that can Be GOD ALSO, as Jesus Did.  Jesus is (NOT) mow a SPIRIT “BEING”, he has flesh and bone (not flesh and blood) He is still son of Man and this body he now has was the same as His resurrected Body. We have no reason to think otherwise. This body is the same as the angles bodies are, they are beings also that have SPIRIT (IN) them. There is no one outside of GOD that exists as a SPIRIT “BEING”, IMO. Gene If you don't believe in spirit beings, you don't believe the Bible, so there is no point in talking to you any further. Yes, we have a spirit in us, Paul says so, but he is referring to our mind. If you believe Jesus has the same body as he had before, you don't understand the ransom. I can tell you this; Satan's spirit has done a real number on you. Georg

I did not state I do not believe in spirit beings but rather I asked you what you defined a spirit being as.  The understanding I have received may be different than yours and it helps us to know what each is stating when they say someone is a spirit being.

Oops! Sorry! I see that is addressed to Gene. If you could be so kind as to describe what a spirit being is then I believe it would further our conversation.

[banana]

Quote (kerwin @ Jan. 08 2010,16:38)

George wrote: Quote What are you talking about; “settlement between God and mankind?” Scripture instructs us that Jesus is the mediator between God and mankind.  The purpose of a mediator is to bring about a settlement between two parties.  The settlement between mankind and God is the new contract which we call a new covenant. George wrote: Quote Jesus came to die for OUR sins, WHY? because the penalty for sin is death. I agree with those statements. George wrote: Quote In other words, if you die in your sins there would be no way for you to ever live again. Jesus, who was a spirit being, came as a man, WHY? because spirit beings cannot die. Satan is a spiritual being and he will perish. George wrote: Quote God changed his spirit nature into a human nature by impregnating Mary, not the way we do it; he then was born a human being, 100% man I understand your point but disagree as that is not what the word “conceive” means. George wrote: Quote Jesus not having sinned, did not deserve death, but he became our substitute, he died for us, for our sins. Once again I agree.  Though he died for our sins death could not hold onto him because he did not deserve death. George wrote: Quote That is why Jesus had to become a human in the first place, so that he COULD die for us. I agree with you here though I do not agree that Jesus was originally a spirit being. George wrote: Quote When God resurrected Jesus he gave him back his spirit nature while his human, flesh body, sinful body, had to remain in the grave; that is what a ransom is, an exchange, and his body for ours. I disagree at this point.   Angels sinned which implies they have sinful natures despite being spirit beings.   A human can be a spirit being as it is not our corruptible flesh that makes us human but rather our soul. I also have a question.   Could you please describe what you believe a spirit being is?

kerwin

Settlement; you have a strange way of describing Christs sacrifice.
Yes, Satan will perish, but only by God's hand.
Why do you stumble over words, they don't change the overall picture of things.
You say death could not hold him; why then did Jesus have to die in the first place? did he not come to take our place in the grave? die in our stead? It is because he did not deserve death, but gave his life for ours, that made him our savior.
If God resurrected his now sinful body, why did he not do that with us; Jesus would not have to die then.
If Jesus was not a spirit being before he became man; then what was he?
Yes, a third of the angels sinned when they followed Satan in his rebellion. By the way, the Bible says everything was created by Jesus, including angels, if you don't think Jesus was a spirit being, then what do you think is an angel?
You're mistaken to think you have a soul, we are a soul; all animals are souls, the difference is; we have a mind, Paul calls it a spirit because this mind/spirit is not physical, it is what sets us apart from the animals. God gave us this mind so that he can communicate with us and we with him.
A spirit being is an angel, angels are spirit beings, so called because you can't see them but they can see you.

Georg

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