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hi Gene
i believe that Christ the first of God creation,and only begotten Son,has been created spirit with a body(not flesh and bones)but like Paul says a heavenly body.and so God the father uses him to create all other things ,this is why he was by is position the only one able to do the sacrifice to save Gods creation,he is not God he is the instrument of GodQuote (terraricca @ Jan. 04 2010,05:33) hi Gene
i believe that Christ the first of God creation,and only begotten Son,has been created spirit with a body(not flesh and bones)but like Paul says a heavenly body.and so God the father uses him to create all other things ,this is why he was by is position the only one able to do the sacrifice to save Gods creation,he is not God he is the instrument of God
god is the first of all things and him placing his spirit seed into womb thus born to man the firtborn of all creation.jesus was not born in heaven nor was he created, bible states that jesus was always with god. is eternal and also alpha and omega.
they are same source and nature always having been
Terraricca……..that term “first of all creation” is a not well understood term, as it can as imply First in RANK and many think that is the implied meaning, i also believe that is what is being implied there , and if we apply it to first created in creation it must mean, first raised from mankind created into the kingdom of GOD. He certinally is the first raised from the dead to inherit eternal life from man kind, that is a fact. There are terms in scriptures that can be taken several way that is for sure. Like when he said he is the first and the last, Obviously he is not God himself, so how could he be First and Last, the only way i can understand this is that he is saying He is the first of Man to enter the Kingdom of GOD and the Last is Just like HIM. again MY OPINION. Again no scripture says that , but then again non denies it either. IMO
HI GENE
first God kingdom start not on the planet earth ,it starts with his first creation ,in heaven and it will never end ,because there is no end to the kingdom of God.and sinse Christ is the beginning of the kingdom he will be also the end as far as to bring everything under God rules,see end of the book of Revelation were Christ turn over all things to his father.Quote (peace2all @ Jan. 04 2010,01:19) Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 04 2010,05:33) hi Gene
i believe that Christ the first of God creation,and only begotten Son,has been created spirit with a body(not flesh and bones)but like Paul says a heavenly body.and so God the father uses him to create all other things ,this is why he was by is position the only one able to do the sacrifice to save Gods creation,he is not God he is the instrument of God
god is the first of all things and him placing his spirit seed into womb thus born to man the firtborn of all creation.jesus was not born in heaven nor was he created, bible states that jesus was always with god. is eternal and also alpha and omega.
they are same source and nature always having been
How do you reconcile your beliefs that scripture clearly states Jesus is a human being?Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 04 2010,00:33) hi Gene
i believe that Christ the first of God creation,and only begotten Son,has been created spirit with a body(not flesh and bones)but like Paul says a heavenly body.and so God the father uses him to create all other things ,this is why he was by is position the only one able to do the sacrifice to save Gods creation,he is not God he is the instrument of God
So do you believe Jesus lived in his resurrected body before he was conceived in Mary's womb where it was transformed to a “worldly” body and regressed to a conceptus?Hi Kerwin:
Jesus is the first born of God. The first of the new creation. He is still a man, but he is the last Adam who is like God both like the first Adam having a mind, a free will, and emotions, that is he is a living person, but the last Adam is like God in that he is a spirit of love. His spirit has been formed by God as he learned to apply the Word of God in his daily life. Thus Jesus said: “he who has seen me has seen the Father”.
Quote Eph 2:13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ.
Eph 2:14 For He Himself is our peace, who has made both one, and has broken down the middle wall of separation,
Eph 2:15 having abolished in His flesh the enmity, [that is], the law of commandments [contained] in ordinances, so as to create in Himself one new man [from] the two, [thus] making peace,
Eph 2:16 and that He might reconcile them both to God in one body through the cross, thereby putting to death the enmity.Quote Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation. Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created that are in heaven and that are on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or principalities or powers. All things were created through Him and for Him.
Col 1:17 And He is before all things, and in Him all things consist.
Col 1:18 And He is the head of the body, the church, who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead, that in all things He may have the preeminence.
Col 1:19 For it pleased [the Father that] in Him all the fullness should dwell,
Quote 1Cr 15:45 And so it is written, “The first man Adam became a living being.” [fn] The last Adam [became] a life-giving spirit. 1Cr 15:46 However, the spiritual is not first, but the natural, and afterward the spiritual.
1Cr 15:47 The first man [was] of the earth, [made] of dust; the second Man [is] the Lord [fn] from heaven.
1Cr 15:48 As [was] the [man] of dust, so also [are] those [who are] [made] of dust; and as [is] the heavenly [Man], so also [are] those [who are] heavenly.
1Cr 15:49 And as we have borne the image of the [man] of dust, we shall also bear [fn] the image of the heavenly [Man].
Love in Christ,
Martyhi kw
Jn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Jn 1:2 He was with God in the beginning.
Jn 1:3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
Jn 1:4 In him was life, and that life was the light of men.
Jn 1:5 The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it.
Jn 1:6 There came a man who was sent from God; his name was John.
Jn 1:7 He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all men might believe.
Jn 1:8 He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light.
Jn 1:9 The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world.
Jn 1:10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him.
Jn 1:11 He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him.
Jn 1:12 Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—
Jn 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.
Jn 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
Jn 1:15 John testifies concerning him. He cries out, saying, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.’ ”
Jn 1:16 From the fullness of his grace we have all received one blessing after another.
Jn 1:17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
Jn 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father’s side, has made him knownthis is why i say Christ is the first born in heaven and on earth
Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 04 2010,09:16) hi kw
Jn 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Jn 1:2 He was with God in the beginning.
Jn 1:3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made.
Jn 1:4 In him was life, and that life was the light of men.
Jn 1:5 The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it.
Jn 1:6 There came a man who was sent from God; his name was John.
Jn 1:7 He came as a witness to testify concerning that light, so that through him all men might believe.
Jn 1:8 He himself was not the light; he came only as a witness to the light.
Jn 1:9 The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world.
Jn 1:10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him.
Jn 1:11 He came to that which was his own, but his own did not receive him.
Jn 1:12 Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—
Jn 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.
Jn 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
Jn 1:15 John testifies concerning him. He cries out, saying, “This was he of whom I said, ‘He who comes after me has surpassed me because he was before me.’ ”
Jn 1:16 From the fullness of his grace we have all received one blessing after another.
Jn 1:17 For the law was given through Moses; grace and truth came through Jesus Christ.
Jn 1:18 No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the Father’s side, has made him knownthis is why i say Christ is the first born in heaven and on earth
so in the begining when there was god, jesus(the word)w as there. and that the word(jesus) is god.so jesus wasn't made or created becasue he always was and is also god.
thats good to know
the old testament (the word) the creation was by the word of god”and god said let there be light”
the scriptures are also known as the word.
in the begining with god – there enternitiy and fellowship are mentioned here as equal.
the word was god – this too showss the unity
this all tells the unity and complexity of god.
the great complexity and wonderous WISDOM of god.
jesus is the th expression(works) and communcation of god's word(preaching)
jesus being the visible showing of the invisible god is the incarnate and the inspired word all in one.
he is what god is but in flesh and he only knew the word of god.
v14 – the word was made flesh –
jesus was incarnate of god's words & wisdom that was put here by god .
that is why all that jesus is , is wht god is , thats why all the works done were the fathers works, thats why he is given the titles that god has
.the salvation and light and mighty god etc. etc.
same source same essence.
he is the only tru god to worship. the father, god jehovah.
for all was because of him, he is always and forever
hi P2A
so your comments are reflecting what the scriptures are saying
?i don't think so ,you give your interpretation of those scriptures you twist them for your trinity and no blame for all,
this is not Bible truth ,you are not true ,to the word of God,so i can not accept your personal version of events.
2Pe 1:16 We did not follow cleverly invented stories when we told you about the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but we were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
2Pe 1:17 For he received honor and glory from God the Father when the voice came to him from the Majestic Glory, saying, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”
2Pe 1:18 We ourselves heard this voice that came from heaven when we were with him on the sacred mountain.2Pe 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2Pe 2:2 Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
2Pe 2:3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleepingi do not mean that you are the origin of those wrong teachings ,but they are lies according to the scriptures.
the scriptures can not be broken; this is how you know that someone try to bring false teachings in to the truth.
Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 04 2010,11:37) hi P2A so your comments are reflecting what the scriptures are saying
?i don't think so ,you give your interpretation of those scriptures you twist them for your trinity and no blame for all,
this is not Bible truth ,you are not true ,to the word of God,so i can not accept your personal version of events.
2Pe 1:16 We did not follow cleverly invented stories when we told you about the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but we were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
2Pe 1:17 For he received honor and glory from God the Father when the voice came to him from the Majestic Glory, saying, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”
2Pe 1:18 We ourselves heard this voice that came from heaven when we were with him on the sacred mountain.2Pe 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2Pe 2:2 Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
2Pe 2:3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleepingi do not mean that you are the origin of those wrong teachings ,but they are lies according to the scriptures.
the scriptures can not be broken; this is how you know that someone try to bring false teachings in to the truth.
personal version?they are scriptures from the bible not my words.
i am not making anything up.
read the scriptures.
if your so in tune with teh scriptures as you say, you know you are wrong and that god has communicated with his people since the time of adam.
god spoke to adam all the time.
you are not a versed as you think you are, but thats ok, we all have lots to learn.
watch that video
Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 04 2010,11:37) hi P2A so your comments are reflecting what the scriptures are saying
?i don't think so ,you give your interpretation of those scriptures you twist them for your trinity and no blame for all,
this is not Bible truth ,you are not true ,to the word of God,so i can not accept your personal version of events.
2Pe 1:16 We did not follow cleverly invented stories when we told you about the power and coming of our Lord Jesus Christ, but we were eyewitnesses of his majesty.
2Pe 1:17 For he received honor and glory from God the Father when the voice came to him from the Majestic Glory, saying, “This is my Son, whom I love; with him I am well pleased.”
2Pe 1:18 We ourselves heard this voice that came from heaven when we were with him on the sacred mountain.2Pe 2:1 But there were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you. They will secretly introduce destructive heresies, even denying the sovereign Lord who bought them—bringing swift destruction on themselves.
2Pe 2:2 Many will follow their shameful ways and will bring the way of truth into disrepute.
2Pe 2:3 In their greed these teachers will exploit you with stories they have made up. Their condemnation has long been hanging over them, and their destruction has not been sleepingi do not mean that you are the origin of those wrong teachings ,but they are lies according to the scriptures.
the scriptures can not be broken; this is how you know that someone try to bring false teachings in to the truth.
jesus said the scriptures cannot be broken when talking to the pharesees and you know what, he said to them that god had in law said that they were gods and that scriptures cannot be broken and that I SAID you were gods.jesus clearly says that those laws from god that declared them gods was from he. I SAID you were gods.
why is it yuor scriptures are just and true yet the ones shown to you that show you different are then wrong
is god a liar if its his words. i didn't write them
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.”
–John 1:1-4, 14
hi P2A
you said ;Jesus said the scriptures cannot be broken when talking to the pharisees and you know what, he said to them that god had in law said that they were gods and that scriptures cannot be broken and that I SAID you were gods
why you don't show the scripture in question to prove your point.
and also the scripture in reference to the one Christ is quoting so we can see your reasoning.Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 04 2010,14:21) hi P2A you said ;Jesus said the scriptures cannot be broken when talking to the pharisees and you know what, he said to them that god had in law said that they were gods and that scriptures cannot be broken and that I SAID you were gods
why you don't show the scripture in question to prove your point.
and also the scripture in reference to the one Christ is quoting so we can see your reasoning.
your so versed as you say, are you telling me than i lie and you never have read this verse?And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: GOD was manifest in the FLESH, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, BELIEVED ON in the world, RECEIVED UP into glory.”
–1 Timothy 3:16“But unto the SON he saith, 'Thy throne, O GOD, is for ever and ever: a sceptre of righteousness is the sceptre of thy kingdom'…And, 'Thou, LORD, in the beginning hast laid the foundation of the earth; and the heavens are the works of thine hands.'”
— Hebrews 1:8, 10
“I and my Father are ONE.”
–Jesus Christ, John 10:30
“…CHRIST JESUS…being in the FORM OF GOD, thought it not robbery to be EQUAL WITH GOD: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross.”
–Philippians 2:5-8
“For there are three that bear record in heaven, the FATHER, THE WORD, AND THE HOLY GHOST: and THESE THREE ARE ONE.”
–1 John 5:7
“… feed the church of GOD, which he hath purchased with his OWN BLOOD.”
–Acts 20:28
“Hereby perceive we the love of GOD, because he LAID DOWN HIS LIFE for us…
–1 John 3:16
“And they stoned Stephen, calling upon GOD, and saying, LORD JESUS, receive my spirit.”
–Acts 7:59
“For unto us A CHILD IS BORN, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counsellor, THE MIGHTY GOD, THE EVERLASTING FATHER, The Prince of Peace.”
–Isaiah 9:6
“And Thomas answered and said unto him [JESUS], My Lord and MY GOD.”
–John 20:28
“In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and THE WORD WAS GOD. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made. In him was life; and the life was the light of men. And THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH, AND DWELT AMONG US, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) full of grace and truth.”
–John 1:1-4, 14
“Philip saith unto him, 'Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.' Jesus saith unto him, 'Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me Philip? HE THAT HATH SEEN ME HATH SEEN THE FATHER; and how sayest thou then, 'Shew us the Father?''”
— John 14:8-9
“…CHRIST, who is the IMAGE OF GOD…”
–II Corinthians 4:4
“…glory of GOD in the FACE OF JESUS CHRIST.”
–II Corinthians 4:6
“GOD…hath in these last days spoken unto us by his SON…who being the brightness of his glory, and the EXPRESS IMAGE OF HIS PERSON…”
–Hebrews 1:1-3
Colossians 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
1:15 WHO IS THE IMAGE OF THE INVISIBLE GOD, the firstborn* of every creature:
1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
1:19 For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;*firstborn: pre-eminence in rank more than to priority in time. This can be shown in passages where the term 'firstborn' is used of the pre-eminent son who was not the eldest, e.g. Psalm 89:27, where David is called 'firstborn' although he was actually the youngest son.
——————————————————————————–
“For in [Jesus] dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.”
— Colossians 2:9
——————————————————————————–
“…they shall call his name EMMANUEL, which being interpreted is, GOD WITH US.”
–Matthew 1:23
——————————————————————————–
“The voice of him [John the Baptist] that crieth in the wilderness, PREPARE ye the way of the LORD, make straight in the desert a highway FOR OUR GOD.”
— Isaiah 40:3
——————————————————————————–
THESE PEOPLE DID NOT UNDERSTAND THAT JESUS WAS GOD AND THOUGHT HE BLASPHEMED WHEN HE TOLD THE TRUTH.
“The Jews answered [Jesus], saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.”— John 10:33
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Addenda from justbible.com–
Some cults teach that Jesus was God's first Creation, and that Christ then Created the universe we know. This is a verse cults use to support their false doctrine.
(“Revelation 3:14 And unto the angel of the church of the Laodiceans write; These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God;”)
This verse also.
(“John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. “)
They say, “See, he was in the beginning with God.”
They will even use this verse.
(“Proverbs 8:22 The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. 23 I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.”)
____
Now for the Truth, from God's word, let's compare Scripture with Scripture.
If you only read this verse, you might think it was talking about Jesus, and that he was set up.
But if you read the chapter, you will realize who or what it is talking about.
(“Proverbs 8:12 I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions.”)
Wisdom, not Christ. The whole chapter is about wisdom personified. To make it even more clear that it is not Christ, wisdom is spoken of as female.
(“Proverbs 8:2 She standeth in the top of high places,…”)
————–
don't cut and past certain words from different scriptures then think they are valid. Don't use scriptures when they do not pertain to topic. if its a message /answer that is resanant through scriptures do not ignore, remember it is god's words and you are being shown the truth because you seek itjohn 10:25 to the end of the chapter.
funny how jesus never said he was not god but did just the opposite and thats why he was sought after by the jews,
he claimed to be god many times and they thought he blasphemed, becasue he was in form of man.
but one who speaks truth cannot blasphemy, and thats excaltey what his responses were always saying.
these are god's words god's scriptures not mine nad i am not interpreting them but reading them for what they said.
plain as day!
he was telling them that he is not blasphemed because he is I AM
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