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David wrote:
Quote ok, when did the new covenant come into effect.
Scripture tells us a will cannot come into effect until the death of the one who made which means it could not be put into effect before Jesus’s death.
Hebrews 9:16(NIV) wrote:
Quote In the case of a will, it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it,
We are also told that Jesus is the mediator of the New Covenant and he could not do that until he was resurrected and ascended to heaven.
Hebrews 8:6(NIV):
Quote But the ministry Jesus has received is as superior to theirs as the covenant of which he is mediator is superior to the old one, and it is founded on better promises.
In any case no one could enter the New Covenant until the Spirit of God came at Pentecost.
Acts 1:8-9(NIV) reads:
Quote But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you; and you will be my witnesses in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and to the ends of the earth.” After he said this, he was taken up before their very eyes, and a cloud hid him from their sight.
I would say that the New Covenant took effect between the time Jesus died and the time the disciples received the Spirit of God and at the time it did the Old Covenant was rendered obsolete though still in effect. The New Covenant covered both the Hebrew people who were still obliged to the obsolete Old Covenant and the Gentiles who were not obliged the Old Covenant. Still not all Hebrew people are obliged to the Old Covenant as actions from Peter and Paul show and Gentiles can choose to oblige themselves to it though that is not necessary for salvation.
Kerwin ……why would anyone want to back to the old covenant, when they have the New Covenant , why go back to the weak and beggarly things. A covenant the they nor their Father could Keep. The New far exceed the Old Covenant, with far better Promises , one being of eternal life and a eternal inheritance with Christ, Which the Old never Promised. In fact the Old Covenant was designed to work through law (forced compliance) because they were carnal minded and did Not have the Spirit of GOD in them. Those who have the Spirit of GOD in them have a different mindset then the Carnal Mindset. IMO
peace……………………………..gene
Gene said to Kerwin:
Quote Kerwin ……why would anyone want to back to the old covenant, when they have the New Covenant , why go back to the weak and beggarly things. A covenant the they nor their Father could Keep. The New far exceed the Old Covenant, with far better Promises , one being of eternal life and a eternal inheritance with Christ, Which the Old never Promised. In fact the Old Covenant was designed to work through law (forced compliance) because they were carnal minded and did Not have the Spirit of GOD in them. Those who have the Spirit of GOD in them have a different mindset then the Carnal Mindset. IMO You're absolutely correct Gene. Moreover, Paul taught that the old covenant condemns and that no one under the old covenant can be justified in God's sight.
thinker
thethinker……….Amen brother, Paul also said whosoever that under Law (forced compliance) is under a curse. We are under a NEW and LIVING WAY.
Love and peace to you and yours………………………….gene
Gene said:
Quote Paul also said whosoever that under Law (forced compliance) is under a curse. We are under a NEW and LIVING WAY. Gene,
You're right again. It's all so simple. I think we come to the Scripture with childhood baggage that prevents us from seeing these things. Paul said that the old covenant was for “children”.Quote Even so we, when we ere children were in bondage under the elements of the world. But when the fulness of time had come, God sent forth His Son…to redeem those under the law, that we might receive the adpotion as sons (Gal. 4:3-5). The law is for children. The “elements of the world” are for children. Therefore, the “elementary principles of Christ” are for children because they are the same things as the “elements of the world”. But God redeemed us to make us “sons”. And the expression “sons” in context means full grown sons. It means that God redeemed us to make us ADULTS.
Under the new covenant God treats us like adults. But many Christians want to remain children and do those law things. That's just the way we are. We were treated like children growing up. We carry that baggage into our marriages and treat our spouses like children too. And we think that God wants to treat us like children.
thinker
Gene and The Thinker,
You sit there siding with those who accused Paul.
Acts 21:20-21(NIV) reads:
Quote When they heard this, they praised God. Then they said to Paul: “You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of them are zealous for the law. They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs
James certainly did not agree with the accusers as he gave Paul this advice
Acts 21:22-24(NIV) reads:
Quote What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have made a vow. Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay their expenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everybody will know there is no truth in these reports about you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law.
Obviously you are misunderstanding since Paul himself believed that he was being accused falsely since he heeded James advice.
Acts 21:26(NIV) reads:
Quote The next day Paul took the men and purified himself along with them. Then he went to the temple to give notice of the date when the days of purification would end and the offering would be made for each of them.
This is Paul’s second trip to Jerusalem for he obtained a letter from the council to the Gentiles as we hear in this scripture:
Acts 21:25(NIV) reads:
Quote As for the Gentile believers, we have written to them our decision that they should abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality.”
Later in his letter to the Galatians he writes:
Galatians 2:6(NIV) reads:
Quote As for those who seemed to be important—whatever they were makes no difference to me; God does not judge by external appearance—those men added nothing to my message
So it is clear that his gospel and that of those he meant in Jerusalem agreed.
In fact later in the same chapter of his letter to the Galatians he writes:
Galatians 2:14(NIV) reads:
Quote When I saw that they were not acting in line with the truth of the gospel, I said to Peter in front of them all, “You are a Jew, yet you live like a Gentile and not like a Jew. How is it, then, that you force Gentiles to follow Jewish customs?
So why should a Gentile force Jews to follow Gentile customs? If a Jew can choose to live like a Gentile then why can’t a Gentile choose to live like a Jew? Who cares what a person chooses to eat or if they choose to get circumcised or not. Is this not what Romans 14 is all about? If you are pledged to do something for God then do not break your pledge, unless you pledged to do sin for that would be a false pledge you should beg God to forgive.
Whether you are choose to live by Jewish or Gentile customs you should still live by the spirit even as it is written:
Galatians 2:15-16(NIV) reads:
Quote “We who are Jews by birth and not 'Gentile sinners' know that a man is not justified by observing the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in Christ and not by observing the law, because by observing the law no one will be justified.
It is not the law Paul is speaking against but attempting to do God’s will by human effort instead of by God’s effort. He states as much as follows.
Galatians 3:3(NIV) reads:
Quote Are you so foolish? After beginning with the Spirit, are you now trying to attain your goal by human effort?
Kerwin……..And you sit on the side of those who accuse us. We uphold the teachings of Paul , you on the other don't , you cant even see there was a difference between what Paul taught and what the Jew were teaching. Paul plainly said whosoever is under the the LAW is UNDER Curse. GO figure out what that means. Trying to say what the Jews taught and what Paul taught was the same is not true. The Jews came from the perspective of being under (LAW) force compliance through the medium of FEAR. Ex 20:20 While Paul taught repetitiousness was attained through the GRACE of GOD and the Law had nothing to do with it. No Law of fear compliance can make anyones Heart right and can Not Justify anyone before GOD as Paul plainly said. You can't have it both way. IMO
peace…………………………gene
Gene Balthrop wrote:
Quote Paul plainly said whosoever is under the the LAW is UNDER Curse.
You are correct that he did say:
Galatians 3:10(NIV) reads:
Quote All who rely on observing the law are under a curse, for it is written: “Cursed is everyone who does not continue to do everything written in the Book of the Law.”
But you obviously misunderstand it for he also said:
Galatians 3:12(NIV) reads:
Quote The law is not based on faith; on the contrary, “The man who does these things will live by them.”
In other words the law is based on human effort, a point I have already made using Galatians 3:3.
I am also not saying that Gentiles need to live by the Jewish customs written into the law but rather they need to manifest the righteous requirements of the law just as it is written.
Romans 8:4(NIV) reads:
Quote in order that the righteous requirements of the law might be fully met in us, who do not live according to the sinful nature but according to the Spirit.
Of course the only way you can do that is if you live by the Spirit God gives you and the only way you can do that is if you first obtain that Spirit by obeying the Jesus’ teachings. If you obey his teaching then your faith will be true and if you persevere in that faith then you will live by the Spirit and so not sin for it is written.
Galatians 5:16(NIV) reads:
Quote So I say, live by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the sinful nature.
Indeed the righteous do live by faith and not by human effort; but by God’s effort that lives in their flesh.
Gene Balthrop wrote:
Quote trying to say what the Jews taught and what Paul taught was the same is not true.
So you call Paul a liar because he clearly stated they added nothing to his message. In addition when in Jerusalem scripture tells us he did practice Jewish customs according to the Law’s requirements, in order to persuade the Jews he was not a threat to their culture.
You really do need to get beyond the denial that blocks you from the truth.
Hi KW,
You say
“Still not all Hebrew people are obliged to the Old Covenant as actions from Peter and Paul show and Gentiles can choose to oblige themselves to it though that is not necessary for salvation.
Back to top “It still exists.
For Jews to go bak to it is to cut themselves off from Christ.
And it has been fulfilled perfectly and now has been tightened to require impossible perfection.There is now no true sacrifice for sin under it as the priesthood and temple are changed so those now submitting to it must die in their sins so it is not a suitable option for anyone
Galatians 5:3
And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law.James 2:10
For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of allNick……….Amen, if your going to keep the Law you better do it all. Paul did not teach what the Jews were teaching< Paul even went so far as saying Law was for the UNGODLY, and SINNERS. I am not saying the ten commandments are, because they are spiritual and must be spiritually Keep. Law (forced compliance through the medium of FEAR) never makes a person right in their Hearts and minds and Paul full well know that. If we try to fulfill the commandments through the operation of (LAW) forced compliance , we will also fail as they did also. We Keep the commandments through the Operation of GOD Spirit in our hearts and minds by the Hand of GOD the FATHER. The question of should we keep the commandments is never and option , Just the way its done is what counts. Though the flesh, or through the Spirit. Love fulfills (the) Law(the ten commandments). IMO
love and peace to you and yours…………………………gene
Nick Hassan quoted:
Quote Galatians 5:3
Quote And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law.
I am circumcised as is the customs of my people but I am a Gentile and not a Jew. Do I have to become a Jew and keep the whole Law as I was circumcised as a baby? If not then am I not violating this instruction?
Still let’s look at the whole context.
Galatians 5:3-4(NIV) reads:
Quote Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law. You who are trying to be justified by law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.
“You who are trying to be justified by law” are the key words that corrupt and ignorant people think is speaking of God works but which are instead speaking of human effort.
Galatians 5:5(NIV) reads:
Quote But by faith we eagerly await through the Spirit the righteousness for which we hope.
It is by faith and the pursuit of true righteousness by that faith.
Galatians 5:6(NIV) reads:
Quote For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision has any value. The only thing that counts is faith expressing itself through love.
Since circumcision is a custom and not a righteous requirement it is irrelevant to the gospel itself. It becomes relative if someone foolishly believes that they need to get circumcised to be “saved”. Paul was addressing such foolishness among the Galatians.
Nick Hassan quoted:
Quote James 2:10
Quote For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all
You really misunderstand this scripture which is not speaking of the Law of Mosses but rather of the Law of Love your neighbor as yourself. In fact it is urging Christians not to sin in any way as such will violate the Law of Love.
Nick Hassan wrote:
Quote For Jews to go back to it is to cut themselves off from Christ.
And it has been fulfilled perfectly and now has been tightened to require impossible perfection.I certainly do not remember anywhere in scripture where Jews are forbidden to be Jews. That sounds rather oppressive and the gospel is not oppressive. I assure you Jews can adhere to their culture and still be Christians just as Paul did when in Jerusalem.
Kerwin…….Why did Paul call it the administration of DEATH?
2 Cor 3:4-7….> Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think any thing as from ourselves; but our sufficiency is from GOD; ..6..> Who also has made us able ministers of the New Testament; (NOT) of the letter, but of the Spirit. For the letter KILLS, but the Spirit gives life…7..> But if the MINISTRATION of DEATH, written and engraved in stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not steadfastly behold the face of Moses for the glory of his countanance; which glory was to be (DONE AWAY): …8..> How shall not the administration of the Spirit be more Glorious? ..9..> For if the ministration of (CONDEMNATION) be glory, MUCH more doth the ministration of righiousness exceed in glory…10.. For even that which was made gloriious had (NO GLORY) by readon of the glory that excelleth. ..11..> For the which is (DONE AWAY) was glorious, much more that which (REMAINETH) is glorious.
Also…2 Cor 14..> But their minds were blinded: for until this day remains the same veil untaken away in the reading of the Old Testament; which is DONE AWAY THROUGH THE ANOINTING. OR CHRIST.
2 Cor 3: 18………..But we all, with open face beholding as in a Glass (mirror) the Glory of the LORD (GOD), are being transformed or changed into the (SAME IMAGE) from glory to glory, as by the (SPIRIT OF THE LORD).
That is the gospel message , Paul never taught the Old Covenant< He taught a (NEW AND LIVING WAY)
love and peace to you and yours………………………..gene
Hi KW,
You say
“I certainly do not remember anywhere in scripture where Jews are forbidden to be Jews. That sounds rather oppressive and the gospel is not oppressive. I assure you Jews can adhere to their culture and still be Christians just as Paul did when in Jerusalem. “Do their cultural activities include their traditions and religion?
Galatians 3:28
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is neither male nor female: for ye are all one in Christ Jesus.Colossians 3:11
Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.Nick Hassan wrote:
Quote Do their cultural activities include their traditions and religion?
It sure does but considering the true Christian religion and the true Jewish religion are the same religion I see no problem with either. In fact those Jews who say they worship God as their fathers did but deny Jesus is the Messiah are heretics just like those Christians who practice a gospel other that that taught by the Jesus and his apostles.
The problem I see you having is that you fail to understand the law which includes more than one type of legislation. The only part that is dangerous to practice that I can think of offhand is sacrificing animals or grain for sin as Jesus is our sacrifice for sin. I see that as a danger equivalent to eating meat from an animal or plant sacrificed to an idol in that you can do it without sinning but if those who see you do it are weak in the faith they may be tempted to do the same even though believing it to be a sin.
1 Corinthians 8(NIV) reads:
Quote Now about food sacrificed to idols: We know that we all possess knowledge. Knowledge puffs up, but love builds up. The man who thinks he knows something does not yet know as he ought to know. But the man who loves God is known by God.
So then, about eating food sacrificed to idols: We know that an idol is nothing at all in the world and that there is no God but one. For even if there are so-called gods, whether in heaven or on earth (as indeed there are many “gods” and many “lords”), yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.
But not everyone knows this. Some people are still so accustomed to idols that when they eat such food they think of it as having been sacrificed to an idol, and since their conscience is weak, it is defiled. But food does not bring us near to God; we are no worse if we do not eat, and no better if we do.
Be careful, however, that the exercise of your freedom does not become a stumbling block to the weak. For if anyone with a weak conscience sees you who have this knowledge eating in an idol's temple, won't he be emboldened to eat what has been sacrificed to idols? So this weak brother, for whom Christ died, is destroyed by your knowledge. When you sin against your brothers in this way and wound their weak conscience, you sin against Christ. Therefore, if what I eat causes my brother to fall into sin, I will never eat meat again, so that I will not cause him to fall.Why I say that doing such things is fine is because a person can make a pledge to God and Jews often may look at themselves as having made such a pledge as regards the Law and Gentiles or Jews that convert to be Gentiles would be sinning to convince them to violate their conscious.
Numbers 30:2(N!V) reads:
Quote When a man makes a vow to the LORD or takes an oath to obligate himself by a pledge, he must not break his word but must do everything he said.
A lot of the Law, such as the cleansing ritual Paul did, is merely Jewish customs as legislated by God. Jews believe they are just to be ceremonial cleanses and not in reality which is done by the blood of Jesus.
The Law also has a criminal code which is modified under the New Covenant for a variety of reasons such as obeying the authority God has put over us and the criminal code was a compromise with Hebrew people who were still slaves to sin and thus makes allowances for that state.
I hope I am not making this too complicated. In case I am I will try to give an example. One Christian has made a pledge to God to eat no meat and to drink no wine. If you force him to break his pledge then you cause him to sin and Jesus said:
Mark 9:42(NIV) reads:
Quote “And if anyone causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to be thrown into the sea with a large millstone tied around his neck.
On the other hand to teach that making such a pledge is necessary to salvation would be adding to the message of Gospel and adding or subtracting to God’s word is addressed with these words.
Deuteronomy 4:2(NIV) reads:
Quote Do not add to what I command you and do not subtract from it, but keep the commands of the LORD your God that I give you.
What I hear is that many believe that Jesus violated God’s word and subtracted from God’s word or in some cases added. That idea is absurd. Jesus has become the sacrifice for the people of God and his sacrifice far secedes the sacrifice of grain and animals. Living by the spirit enables one to actually fulfill the righteous requirements of the Law. More is expected of those that live by the Spirit and so the criminal code is changed to reflect what God really wants from His people. The laws that are legislated customs for the Hebrew people never applied to the Gentiles in the first place and still do not.
Hi KW,
Paul, the pharisee, showed the way.
2Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.3For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.
4Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
5Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
6Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
7But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
10That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
11If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
12Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
13Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
Phil3
2Beware of dogs, beware of evil workers, beware of the concision.3For we are the circumcision, which worship God in the spirit, and rejoice in Christ Jesus, and have no confidence in the flesh.
4Though I might also have confidence in the flesh. If any other man thinketh that he hath whereof he might trust in the flesh, I more:
5Circumcised the eighth day, of the stock of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, an Hebrew of the Hebrews; as touching the law, a Pharisee;
6Concerning zeal, persecuting the church; touching the righteousness which is in the law, blameless.
7But what things were gain to me, those I counted loss for Christ.
8Yea doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
9And be found in him, not having mine own righteousness, which is of the law, but that which is through the faith of Christ, the righteousness which is of God by faith:
10That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death;
11If by any means I might attain unto the resurrection of the dead.
12Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
13Brethren, I count not myself to have apprehended: but this one thing I do, forgetting those things which are behind, and reaching forth unto those things which are before,
No belt and braces
Gene Balthrop wrote:
Quote Why did Paul call it the administration of DEATH?
That is very clear in scripture and I have been making the same point. The law required it’s adherents to fulfill its requirements by human effort which can never free you from slavery to sin while those that are both “zealous for the law” and are in the New Covenant are freed from slavery to sin and so can fulfill it’s requirements by the power of God. Still if you try to please God by using human effort, whether you follow Jewish customs or not, then you will once again make yourself a slave to sin and so bind yourself to death because “the wages of sin is death“. In addition if you do not try to please God because you believe Jesus hides you from God’s wrath then you are still a slave to sin and so also under the administration of Death.
Gene Balthrop wrote:
Quote Paul never taught the Old Covenant< He taught a (NEW AND LIVING WAY)
I have never said that Paul taught the Old Covenant. What I said is you misunderstand what Paul is teaching and so have gone astray. I am also pointing out that your understanding is inconsistent with scripture and I have pointed out scriptures that make that claim self evident.
Nick Hassan wrote:
Quote Paul, the Pharisee, showed the way.
You make it difficult for me by merely quoting scriptures since I know what I understand from those scripture but not what you understand from the same scriptures as I cannot read your mind. This means that you quoting those scriptures confirms what I understand and does not make your case.
But a good scripture to support what you are saying though perhaps not what you mean is
Acts 21:20-26(NIV) reads:
Quote When they heard this, they praised God. Then they said to Paul: “You see, brother, how many thousands of Jews have believed, and all of them are zealous for the law. They have been informed that you teach all the Jews who live among the Gentiles to turn away from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or live according to our customs. What shall we do? They will certainly hear that you have come, so do what we tell you. There are four men with us who have made a vow. Take these men, join in their purification rites and pay their expenses, so that they can have their heads shaved. Then everybody will know there is no truth in these reports about you, but that you yourself are living in obedience to the law. As for the Gentile believers, we have written to them our decision that they should abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality.”
The next day Paul took the men and purified himself along with them. Then he went to the temple to give notice of the date when the days of purification would end and the offering would be made for each of them.So is Paul a hypocrite as so many seem to be accusing him of being?
Hi KW,
Paul was focusssed on preaching the gospel.To this end he became as a jew for the Jews and a gentile for the gentiles in the hope that divisions did not get in the way of what was of a higher priority. Satan is always busy inciting divisions among carnal men and distracting folk from the task at hand.
1Cor9
20And unto the Jews I became as a Jew, that I might gain the Jews; to them that are under the law, as under the law, that I might gain them that are under the law;21To them that are without law, as without law, (being not without law to God, but under the law to Christ,) that I might gain them that are without law.
22To the weak became I as weak, that I might gain the weak: I am made all things to all men, that I might by all means save some.
23And this I do for the gospel's sake, that I might be partaker thereof with you.
But with the brothers he was more direct.
Galatians 2:14
But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?Kerwin ………Show where i misunderstand what Paul was teaching, No my friend it's you , who preach FEAR as a means of obedience not I , in my opinion you are trying to play both sides of this discussion, If i miss represent what Paul said Prove it, Don't Just accuse me. Show me Scripture I have misquoted or misinterpreted . Make foolish accusation is only Smoke and Mirrors, which hide you lack of understanding.
IMOpeace………………………….gene
Thank you for clarifying your thoughts on the matter.
Nick Hassan wrote:
Quote Paul was focuses on preaching the gospel.
To this end he became as a Jew for the Jews and a gentile for the gentiles in the hope that divisions did not get in the way of what was of a higher priority. Satan is always busy inciting divisions among carnal men and distracting folk from the task at hand.
In the account from Acts I cited he was among Jews who adhered to the gospel but whom practiced their customs and so were also “zealous for the law”. He was showing that he was not threatening the Jewish culture that so many of them adhered to just as I have been saying.
Nick Hassan wrote:
Quote But with the brothers he was more direct.
Galatians 2:14
Quote
But when I saw that they walked not uprightly according to the truth of the gospel, I said unto Peter before them all, If thou, being a Jew, livest after the manner of Gentiles, and not as do the Jews, why compellest thou the Gentiles to live as do the Jews?Which proves my point that a Christian has no business compelling a Jew to live like a Gentile or a Gentile to live like a Jew.
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