Born of water.

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 10 2013,11:50)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,18:26)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 10 2013,10:55)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,13:38)

But ye are not in the flesh…………………

Ed,

Was Paul writing these words to people who WERE still in their flesh bodies? Or did he write these words to SPIRIT BEINGS who were dwelling on earth without one ounce of flesh?

Which one, please?

Paul was writing those words to people who were still in their flesh bodies.

But he said they were NOT in the flesh, right? Hmmm…………. perhaps then Paul was speaking metaphorically in this case?

Hi Mike,

Perhaps he was instead speaking of “God's Spiritual Kingdom”,
which the soul can enter into while still existing in the flesh.

“For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this
mortal must put on immortality.” (1Corinthians 15:53)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 10, 2013 at 3:02 am#327283

Participant

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 10 2013,12:16)

edj

Quote

What's stopping YOU from entering the “Kingdom of God” now?

the full course of our lives has to completed ,and it is at the resurrection in the first that those in Christ will receive what they have believed in ,God promise ,through Christ ,

Hi Pierre,

So you're saying (in essence) that you being alive is
preventing you from entering the kingdom of God now? (would that be a yes or a no?)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 10, 2013 at 3:02 am#327284

Blocked

Pierre,

It is no longer clear to me what point you are even arguing for or against. At first, I thought you were like Ed, saying that we can enter God's Kingdom right now – since we've been “born again”.

But now, it seems like that is NOT what you were saying.

What are you trying to show me? I haven't seen anything in your posts that would make me change my mind about what Jesus told Nicodemus in John 3.

I take his words literally, and you apparently don't. What more is there to say about it?

January 10, 2013 at 3:06 am#327285

Blocked

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,19:57)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 10 2013,11:50)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,18:26)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 10 2013,10:55)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,13:38)

But ye are not in the flesh…………………

Ed,

Was Paul writing these words to people who WERE still in their flesh bodies? Or did he write these words to SPIRIT BEINGS who were dwelling on earth without one ounce of flesh?

Which one, please?

Paul was writing those words to people who were still in their flesh bodies.

But he said they were NOT in the flesh, right? Hmmm…………. perhaps then Paul was speaking metaphorically in this case?

Hi Mike,

Perhaps he was instead speaking of “God's Spiritual Kingdom”,
which the soul can enter into while still existing in the flesh.

“For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this
mortal must put on immortality.” (1Corinthians 15:53)

What question was Paul answering in 1 Cor 15:53? (Check verse 35 for the answer)

Besides, how does your answer actually address my point? If Paul said the words, “You are NOT in the flesh” to people who WERE in the flesh, then isn't it obvious to you that the teaching was metaphorical?

January 10, 2013 at 3:22 am#327287

Participant

How great to see Terra writing down those words.

*2nd resurrection*
The 2nd resurrection,consist of all people of all generations,and of all kinds of religions.

They will be judged by the books,each one of them has their works recorded during their life time.
This is when the sheep and the goats will be seperated.
———————————————————————
*RE' THE 1ST. RESURRECTION*.

1.The saints will be resurrected in a glorified body(spirit body).

2. The jews will be brought back in the flesh,by choice.
Of all generations. they will live in paradise restored.
The land of milk and honey.where the lion will eat
straw like it was in paradise before.Job will be there.

3. The resurrected saints will rule over them for a
1000yrs,and teach them the gospels for a 1000yrs
Because they also have to go through Christ.

No man can come to the Father but BY ME.

So there will be two different kinds of resurrections.

1. The dry bones; flesh put on them.(brought back to live).
2. The flesh quickened into spirit,as the angels.

The resurrected saints would have inherited all.
But not yet for the jews;they have to learn first, and
then resurrected in the 2nd resurrection.

And so will also many outside the camp learn,and accept the Lord.

Once the 1000yrs are expired;satan will be let loose for a season,to draw all the unbelievers to one place to be destroyed.

After this comes the 2nd resurrection,as above.

wakeup.

January 10, 2013 at 3:37 am#327291

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 10 2013,13:06)

If Paul said the words, “You are NOT in the flesh” to people who WERE in the flesh, then isn't it obvious to you that the teaching was metaphorical?

Hi Mike,

“Ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. (Romans 8:9)

“ye are not in the flesh” means that the spirit is now piloting the vessel of your flesh.
The “Spirit of God” within them means that they have entered into God's kingdom.

Spiritual understanding is tough for the flesh mind.
Romans 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Mike, are you suggesting that since you still exist in the flesh you cannot please God?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 10, 2013 at 4:45 am#327301

Participant

Quote (mikeboll64 @ Jan. 10 2013,08:02)

Pierre,

But now, it seems like that is NOT what you were saying.

What are you trying to show me? I haven't seen anything in your posts that would make me change my mind about what Jesus told Nicodemus in John 3.

I take his words literally, and you apparently don't. What more is there to say about it?

Mike

no,i do not believe what edj believe ,the kingdom is in heaven for the redeemed of the earth so they HAVE TO DIE TO BE WITH CHRIST ,but for the ones in Christ it is on earth but also at the resurrection (first one)because they have already been judged by their faith in Christ ,

while all others only coming to live after the 1000 years and are then judged,

Phil 3:1 Finally, my brothers, rejoice in the Lord! It is no trouble for me to write the same things to you again, and it is a safeguard for you.
Phil 3:2 Watch out for those dogs, those men who do evil, those mutilators of the flesh.
Phil 3:3 For it is we who are the circumcision, we who worship by the Spirit of God, who glory in Christ Jesus, and who put no confidence in the flesh—

what I try to explain in my poor English ,is that from the day we ear the gospel and until we die that his our tribulation ,stay faithful to Christ and our God in learning all the thing he as written for us ,and apply then ,because this will be what will remain forever but learning to live a godly live and acquire the practice of the Love of God in our live is not that easy ,DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT KIND OF LOVE IS GODLY LOVE ???this will be in practice as only rule in the kingdom of God, ,this is why we need to be born again means start from scratch ,drop the flesh and start anew in the spirit of Gods will ,so that we can be acceptable to become children of God ,

this is an example ; imagine that we are told unless we become masters in the ability of communicating with our mind wirelessly (no more talking writhing)we will never have a job ,but we are also told how to achieve it ;so what would be the next step learn it right YES and so born again would be equal to those changes that we have to make so drastic they may be ;changing from the flesh to the spirit .

January 10, 2013 at 4:47 am#327302

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,08:02)

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 10 2013,12:16)

edj

Quote

What's stopping YOU from entering the “Kingdom of God” now?

the full course of our lives has to completed ,and it is at the resurrection in the first that those in Christ will receive what they have believed in ,God promise ,through Christ ,

Hi Pierre,

So you're saying (in essence) that you being alive is
preventing you from entering the kingdom of God now? (would that be a yes or a no?)

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

edj

first any qualify person MUST FIRST DIE ,BUT THEN ALSO THE RETURN OF CHRIST AS TO OCCUR ,IF NOT THEN NO RESURRECTION RIGHT YES.

January 10, 2013 at 4:54 am#327303

Participant

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 10 2013,08:22)

How great to see Terra writing down those words.

*2nd resurrection*
The 2nd resurrection,consist of all people of all generations,and of all kinds of religions.

1.The saints will be resurrected in a glorified body(spirit body).

3. The resurrected saints will rule over them for a
1000yrs,and teach them the gospels for a 1000yrs
Because they also have to go through Christ.

No man can come to the Father but BY ME.

So there will be two different kinds of resurrections.

1. The dry bones; flesh put on them.(brought back to live).
2. The flesh quickened into spirit,as the angels.

The resurrected saints would have inherited all.
But not yet for the jews;they have to learn first, and
then resurrected in the 2nd resurrection.

And so will also many outside the camp learn,and accept the Lord.

Once the 1000yrs are expired;satan will be let loose for a season,to draw all the unbelievers to one place to be destroyed.

After this comes the 2nd resurrection,as above.

wakeup.

WUP

Quote

How great to see Terra writing down those words.

*2nd resurrection*
The 2nd resurrection,consist of all people of all generations,and of all kinds of religions.

They will be judged by the books,each one of them has their works recorded during their life time.
This is when the sheep and the goats will be seperated.

THE FIRST RESURRECTION AS NOTHING TO DO WITH THE SECOND RESURRECTION

Rev 20:4 I saw thrones on which were seated those who had been given authority to judge. And I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded because of their testimony for Jesus and because of the word of God. They had not worshiped the beast or his image and had not received his mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

==============================
Rev 20:5 (The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended.) This is the first resurrection.
===================================

this now is the second resurrection that take place ;;
———————————————————
Rev 20:7 When the thousand years are over, Satan will be released from his prison
Rev 20:8 and will go out to deceive the nations in the four corners of the earth—Gog and Magog—to gather them for battle. In number they are like the sand on the seashore.
Rev 20:9 They marched across the breadth of the earth and surrounded the camp of God’s people, the city he loves. But fire came down from heaven and devoured them.
Rev 20:10 And the devil, who deceived them, was thrown into the lake of burning sulfur, where the beast and the false prophet had been thrown. They will be tormented day and night for ever and ever.

Rev 20:11 Then I saw a great white throne and him who was seated on it. Earth and sky fled from his presence, and there was no place for them.
Rev 20:12 And I saw the dead, great and small, standing before the throne, and books were opened. Another book was opened, which is the book of life. The dead were judged according to what they had done as recorded in the books.
Rev 20:13 The sea gave up the dead that were in it, and death and Hades gave up the dead that were in them, and each person was judged according to what he had done.
Rev 20:14 Then death and Hades were thrown into the lake of fire. The lake of fire is the second death.
Rev 20:15 If anyone’s name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire

January 10, 2013 at 5:14 am#327305

Participant

I am in total agreement, I can see the same,and this is the truth.

Praise the most high God.

wakeup.

January 10, 2013 at 5:33 am#327308

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,13:37)

Hi Mike,

“Ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. (Romans 8:9)

“ye are not in the flesh” means that the spirit is now piloting the vessel of your flesh.
The “Spirit of God” within them means that they have entered into God's kingdom.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi Wakeup,

Are you in agreement with this post as well?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 10, 2013 at 5:50 am#327310

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,15:33)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,13:37)

Hi Mike,

“Ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. (Romans 8:9)

“ye are not in the flesh” means that the spirit is now piloting the vessel of your flesh.
The “Spirit of God” within them means that they have entered into God's kingdom.

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

Hi Wakeup,

Are you in agreement with this post as well?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

EDJ.

I agree, it is in the flesh that we should please God.
So we will get our reward.

wakeup.

January 10, 2013 at 6:11 am#327314

Participant

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 10 2013,15:50)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,15:33)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,13:37)

Hi Mike,

“Ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. (Romans 8:9)

“ye are not in the flesh” means that the spirit is now piloting the vessel of your flesh.
The “Spirit of God” within them means that they have entered into God's kingdom.

God bless
Ed J

Hi Wakeup,

Are you in agreement with this post as well?

God bless
Ed J

EDJ.

I agree, it is in the flesh that we should please God.
So we will get our reward.

wakeup.

Hi Wakeup,

So you agree with me then that the word “Flesh” used in Rom 8:8
means to be carnally minded rather than alive in a flesh body, right?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 10, 2013 at 9:17 am#327319

Participant

Edj.

Agree.

wakeup.

January 10, 2013 at 9:29 am#327322

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,11:11)

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 10 2013,15:50)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,15:33)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,13:37)

Hi Mike,

“Ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. (Romans 8:9)

“ye are not in the flesh” means that the spirit is now piloting the vessel of your flesh.
The “Spirit of God” within them means that they have entered into God's kingdom.

God bless
Ed J

Hi Wakeup,

Are you in agreement with this post as well?

God bless
Ed J

EDJ.

I agree, it is in the flesh that we should please God.
So we will get our reward.

wakeup.

Hi Wakeup,

So you agree with me then that the word “Flesh” used in Rom 8:8
means to be carnally minded rather than alive in a flesh body, right?

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

edj

and wup

Ro 8:7 the sinful mind is hostile to God. It does not submit to God’s law, nor can it do so.
Ro 8:8 Those controlled by the sinful nature cannot please God.
Ro 8:9 You, however, are controlled not by the sinful nature but by the Spirit, if the Spirit of God lives in you.

Jn 4:23 Yet a time is coming and has now come when the true worshipers will worship the Father in spirit and truth, for they are the kind of worshipers the Father seeks.
Jn 4:24 God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in spirit and in truth.”

Jn 1:9 The true light that gives light to every man was coming into the world.
Jn 1:10 He was in the world, and though the world was made through him, the world did not recognize him.

Jn 1:12 Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—
Jn 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.

all those scriptures are talking about the transformation from one live (in the flesh) to another live (in the spirit )

this is called rebirth or reborn ,NO ONE CAN BECOME A CHILD OF GOD UNLESS HE HIS REBORN BY THE WILL OF GOD ,

AND BEING REBORN MEAN TO STOP LIVING ACCORDING TO THE FLESH BUT NOW LIVING ACCORDING TO THE SPIRIT (WILL) OF GOD ,THE LOVE OF GOD ,MEAN YOU DO NOT LIVE FOR YOURSELF BUT FOR OTHERS,AND THE OTHERS LIVE FOR YOU AND SO ON ,

Lk 22:26 But you are not to be like that. Instead, the greatest among you should be like the youngest, and the one who rules like the one who serves.
Lk 22:27 For who is greater, the one who is at the table or the one who serves? Is it not the one who is at the table? But I am among you as one who serves.

Lk 22:29 And I confer on you a kingdom, just as my Father conferred one on me,
Lk 22:30 so that you may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom and sit on thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.

January 10, 2013 at 9:40 am#327327

Participant

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 10 2013,19:17)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,16:11)

Hi Wakeup,

So you agree with me then that the word “Flesh” used in Rom 8:8
means to be carnally minded rather than alive in a flesh body, right?

God bless
Ed J

Edj.

Agree.

wakeup.

Hi Wakeup

Why don't you then apply the same definition to 1Cor.15:50? It is the very same word as in Rom 8:8.
“Now this I say, brethren, that flesh and blood cannot inherit the kingdom of God;” (1 Cor 15:50)

Know with certainty that it is the same Greek word used three times here:

Romans 8:6-8 For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.
7 Because the carnal mind is enmity against God: for it is not subject to the law of God,
neither indeed can be. 8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.

Therefore 1 Cor 15:50 is not talking about the physical,
but instead is talking about the carnal mind as well!
The carnal mind must be transformed to enter!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

January 10, 2013 at 1:33 pm#327341

Participant

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,19:40)

Quote (Wakeup @ Jan. 10 2013,19:17)

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 10 2013,16:11)

Hi Wakeup,

So you agree with me then that the word “Flesh” used in Rom 8:8
means to be carnally minded rather than alive in a flesh body, right?

God bless
Ed J

Edj.

Agree.

wakeup.

Hi Wakeup

Know with certainty that it is the same Greek word used three times here:

Therefore 1 Cor 15:50 is not talking about the physical,
but instead is talking about the carnal mind as well!
The carnal mind must be transformed to enter!

God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

EDJ.

Basically you have to think like Jesus to please God.
And when the time comes for the reward,you will receive your reward.

wakeup.

January 11, 2013 at 2:29 am#327388

Blocked

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 09 2013,21:45)

DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT KIND OF LOVE IS GODLY LOVE ?

1 Corinthians 13

Quote (terraricca @ Jan. 09 2013,21:45)

this is why we need to be born again means start from scratch ,drop the flesh and start anew in the spirit of Gods will ,so that we can be acceptable to become children of God ,

Pierre,

I believe we all now agree that Peter and Paul speak METAPHORICALLY about being “born again”, and “living in spirit”, etc. I have no disagreement with your claim that you have been METAPHORICALLY “born again”.

The disagreement stems from one simple thing: I don't believe Jesus was also speaking METAPHORICALLY to Nicodemus……….. and you do.

Here is why I believe Jesus was speaking of a LITERAL rebirth: He linked being “born again” with “entering heaven”.

So while you may be METAPHORICALLY “born again”, you cannot right now, in your flesh, enter heaven, right? Therefore, I believe the rebirthing that Jesus was speaking to Nicodemus about was a LITERAL rebirthing – one that is required before any of us are allowed to enter heaven.

I believe Jesus was talking about our bodies being changed like his was.

I do now understand why some Christians call themselves “Born Again Christians”. They are (hopefully) speaking in the same METAPHORICAL sense that Peter spoke of being “born again” – and not in the LITERAL sense of being able to enter heaven in their flesh bodies.

January 11, 2013 at 2:51 am#327396

Blocked

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,20:37)

“ye are not in the flesh” means that the spirit is now piloting the vessel of your flesh.

So then it DOESN'T mean that Paul was talking to spirit beings? And therefore, the teaching is METAPHORICAL, and not LITERAL, right?

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,20:37)

The “Spirit of God” within them means that they have entered into God's kingdom.

I disagree.

Quote (Ed J @ Jan. 09 2013,20:37)

Romans 8:8 So then they that are in the flesh cannot please God.
Mike, are you suggesting that since you still exist in the flesh you cannot please God?

Ed, once again, Paul is speaking METAPHORICALLY.

Galatians 5
19 The acts of the sinful nature are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the sinful nature with its passions and desires.

Note: What the NIV translates as “sinful nature”, the KJV translates as “flesh”.

In Romans 8:8, Paul is NOT saying that a flesh human being cannot please God. Nor is he saying that he, or anyone else to whom he was writing, was a spirit being.

“In the flesh” is an IDIOM for “acting according to our sinful, fleshly desires”.

“In the spirit” is an IDIOM for “acting according to God's will – as being led by spirit from above”.

Read the passage above, Ed. In verses 19-21, Paul is speaking about things that those “in the flesh” do, and warning that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

In verses 22-23, Paul is explaining the fruits of those who are “in the spirit”.

And in verse 24, he explains that those who are “in the spirit” have METAPHORICALLY crucified their own flesh.

Ed, have you LITERALLY crucified your flesh? If not, then you need to start understanding METAPHORICAL IDIOMS in the scriptures for what they are.

January 11, 2013 at 2:55 am#327398