- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2011,03:35) Ed, I'm not asking for a link to where I have to sort through thousands of words just to find out that you are spreading gossip about children of God.
I'm asking for YOU to post a DIRECT QUOTE from the JW organization where they claim to be the ONLY Christians or the ONLY ones who will be saved.
mike
Hi Mike,Do you know what the word 'gossip' means?
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2011,03:59) “ALL PEOPLE NAMED 'ED J' ARE IDIOTS!” Quote (Ed J @ Sep. 30 2011,15:49) Remember, sarcasm, criticism and ridicule are the tools of the devil. Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 01 2011,11:32) if you do not want to investigate it more then it is not my problem to go and force anything on others,
The accused party does not have to bend over backwards to prove their innocence. The ACCUSER is the one who must show proof of his claim.If you have no PROOF of your claim, then I will consider it unfounded gossip, and not give it another thought.
People are individuals, Pierre. So if certain PEOPLE told you this, why would you hold the whole organization at fault? Or did you hear this from the HEAD of the JW organization?
Look at us here on HN. People from the outside looking in would think that Jesus IS God if they read WJ's posts. They would think that Jesus didn't pre-exist if they read Paladin's posts.
Does the fact that Paladin is wrong make ALL CHRISTIANS wrong? Does the fact that Keith is wrong make the whole Church and Body of Christ wrong?
If not, then why would one JW telling you that they have the only way to everlasting life make you think that is the OFFICIAL JW position?
Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 01 2011,11:37) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2011,03:35) Ed, I'm not asking for a link to where I have to sort through thousands of words just to find out that you are spreading gossip about children of God.
I'm asking for YOU to post a DIRECT QUOTE from the JW organization where they claim to be the ONLY Christians or the ONLY ones who will be saved.
mike
Hi Mike,Do you know what the word 'gossip' means?
God bless
Ed J
Ed,Can you show PROOF of your claim about the JWs? If not, then pipe down about it.
Hi Mike,
I showed you where the proof is.
And Pierre has confirmed it; so has “dirtyknections” and “betweenchristendomandjws”.
There are “three” witness for you to corroborate the truth of this;
do you doubt all three of their testimonies?God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgThose are three GOSSIPS, Ed. If none of them have shown WRITTEN PROOF where any JW claimed what you say they claim, then it is merely GOSSIP.
Hi Mike,
Do you even know what “gossip” really is? These are “FACTS” about the JW's and confirmed as true!
Gossip(N): Casual or unconstrained conversation or reports about other people,
typically involving details that are not confirmed as being true.God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgOkay Ed,
Then simply do what I've been asking you to do all along: CONFIRM FOR ME THAT IT IS THE JW OFFICIAL STANCE THAT ONLY JWs WILL GAIN EVERLASTING LIFE.
If you can CONFIRM your claim, then I will stand up WITH you and Pierre and condemn them for that ONE action.
But if you CANNOT CONFIRM your claim with FACTS (not hearsay from others), then you fit directly into the definition of “gossip” that you just listed.
CONFIRM IT or SHUT UP about it. That's all I'm saying.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2011,05:23) Okay Ed, CONFIRM FOR ME THAT IT IS THE JW OFFICIAL STANCE THAT ONLY JWs WILL GAIN EVERLASTING LIFE.
mike
Hi Mike,Why are you changing the words? I asked David, our JW member…
“Is it not true that your organization teaches that non-members are non-Christians?”
This is what the JW's “DO” teach, and it is confirmed by three others besides me (listed in a prior post).God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2011,11:41) Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 01 2011,11:32) if you do not want to investigate it more then it is not my problem to go and force anything on others,
The accused party does not have to bend over backwards to prove their innocence. The ACCUSER is the one who must show proof of his claim.If you have no PROOF of your claim, then I will consider it unfounded gossip, and not give it another thought.
People are individuals, Pierre. So if certain PEOPLE told you this, why would you hold the whole at fault? Or did you hear this from the HEAD of the JW ?
Look at us here on HN. People from the outside looking in would think that Jesus IS God if they read WJ's posts. They would think that Jesus didn't pre-exist if they read Paladin's posts.
Does the fact that Paladin is wrong make ALL CHRISTIANS wrong? Does the fact that Keith is wrong make the whole Church and Body of Christ wrong?
If not, then why would one JW telling you that they have the only way to everlasting life make you think that is the OFFICIAL JW position?
Mikewhat I have said i testified to be true and give you the book to check it ,I have give you also a connection to check it out because I do not keep the JW literature but I use to have it covering 20 years or so have trow it away long ago,
Mike do you have access to the book SALVATION ?
if yes why do you not read it ,
and so what you say is that what i have witness and heard I can not speek about because that would be gossips ??
just remember I will not spare my own head from the sword,
of truth but I will not spear any other neither.in this way I am like David.
and one more thing I do not accuse them for doing anything ,I just bring to your attention that ,that is what they say or have said or do or did not do ,if you want to believe it or not that is entirely upon you,if you are content with what you know about them ,this does not give or take away something of me.
I have read their literature for years and read their books ,
I know were they come from and how they works,
I have known many high leaders,and show them scriptures that they do not accept and teach otherwise ,and they told me to keep silent until the WT comes out and say otherwise,when you can not trust the leaders and there literature what is there to trust GOD but then what is someone doing in that organization ???I do not sit with liars,
it is hard enough to fight the outside world and also fight the inside of so called Gods holy people ,I do not think so,Ac 10:34 Then Peter began to speak: “I now realize how true it is that God does not show favoritism
Ac 10:35 but accepts men from every nation who fear him and do what is right.so like I say you do not have to believe me ,but I am by nature not a liar ,all we know comes because we are interested in it ,so it is up to you to take it further or not ,
you will never have say Pierre I read it it is or it is not true you own it to you not to me ,same with all truth and believes trinity,circumcision ,baptism,freewill,the search for the true God , origin,creation,ect….again this should close this argument
as for Paladin ,he only talks for himself just like all of us,here
but when you are a Representative of an organization then you talk and speak for that organization ,because you have been trained to do so ,and what your editor is writing in your literature is also in the name of that organization,(faithful slave)and what the ORG, say and what scriptures say should be the same if God is to be recognize as true ,but it does not ,
they are clever minded leaders of people ,
so all responsibility falls on the organization,who are people
but all is done for the organization, (Gods organization they say)and one more thing ;no one can tell lies and call themselves to be directed or guided by Gods spirit .
Hi Pierre,
Thank you for your testimony in this matter!
Your brother
in Christ, Jesus.
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Oct. 01 2011,12:50) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2011,05:23) Okay Ed, CONFIRM FOR ME THAT IT IS THE JW OFFICIAL STANCE THAT ONLY JWs WILL GAIN EVERLASTING LIFE.
mike
Hi Mike,Why are you changing the words? I asked David, our JW member…
“Is it not true that your organization teaches that non-members are non-Christians?”
This is what the JW's “DO” teach, and it is confirmed by three others besides me (listed in a prior post).God bless
Ed J
Ed,You keep telling me the question you ASKED David, as if you asking the question is the equivalent of him answering “YES!” to it.
WHAT did David ANSWER to your question? Did he answer “YES” or “NO”?
And are EITHER OF YOU TWO able to actually produce JW literature in which they claim to be the ONLY way to salvation?
If not, then Pierre is right that YOU TWO should let this subject drop. It is not for ME to let it drop, since it is TO ME that YOU TWO made the claim in the first place.
I suggest that if YOU TWO can produce no solid evidence to support your claim, then YOU TWO should not only let it drop for now, but NEVER make your UNFOUNDED claim to anyone again.
(Of course, like I said before, if you ARE able to eventually show solid support to what you've claimed, I will stand both corrected and with you on this matter.)
peace,
mikeQuote (terraricca @ Oct. 01 2011,17:43) when you can not trust the leaders and there literature what is there to trust GOD but then what is someone doing in that organization ???I do not sit with liars,
So now they are not flawed men like us who have made mistakes? They are instead “LIARS”? Hmmmmm………That doesn't sound like something the Pierre I've come to know would say.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2011,11:39) Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 01 2011,17:43) when you can not trust the leaders and there literature what is there to trust GOD but then what is someone doing in that ???I do not sit with liars,
So now they are not flawed men like us who have made mistakes? They are instead “LIARS”? Hmmmmm………That doesn't sound like something the Pierre I've come to know would say.
Mikethere is a difference between a man errors and leaders errors
Moses pay quite of a price for losing his temper and so made that mistake that cost him not to enter the promised land,
their are plenty other examples for leaders to be better than others ,when a leader talk with foolishly he also take the ones who depend on him for guidance ,
I am looking for the truth ,not opinions,I have those in quantity
Rev 14:4 These are those who did not defile themselves with women, for they kept themselves pure. They follow the Lamb wherever he goes. They were purchased from among men and offered as firstfruits to God and the Lamb.
Rev 14:5 No lie was found in their mouths; they are blameless.the JW have as they say members of the 144k see what Rev 14;5 says
Liar ,to me mean some one who convince me of something being true based on my trust in him, and what he told me was not true ,
if this is different with you what is then
First of all, they don't think the 144,000 was made of of ONLY JWs, because they realize some of them have been accepted as part of the 144,000 long before the JW Organization even existed.
Pierre, they believe they are speaking God's spiritual truth on all matters scriptural. Just like all Christians believe when they talk to non-Christians. When you, as a Christian, say that only those who accept Christ will gain salvation, what does the non-Christian you're speaking to think? Does he feel left out, as if you think you have an exclusive club?
Tell me what makes you think that the 144,000 WON'T BE only JWs? How do YOU know they're wrong in the first place? After all, they ARE the ones following the scriptures and the commands of Jesus to go out door to door and village to village fishing for new disciples, right? And aside from thinking Michael is Jesus, I can't think of many scriptural issues I disagree with them about.
So, what is it with you? If they are doing everything right according to the scriptures, and then say that you must also do the things they're doing to gain salvation, are they wrong? How so?
Don't you do the same thing with the Trinitarians? Don't we both tell them that they are in error by worshipping more than one God against all scriptural teaching? Don't we both, in our heart of hearts, have a feeling that they will be the ones to whom Jesus says, “Away from me evildoers, I never knew you”? Does that make you and me and Irene and t8 an “exclusive club” that is telling others they won't get to heaven?
I hope you see my point. The JWs are saying, “Hey guys, we are doing everything correctly and by the Book. We know that by doing this, WE will gain salvation. Please join us so that YOU too can gain salvation.” Now what is wrong with that?
Okay, now that I've posted all of this, it doesn't really matter anyway. Because I have NEVER heard of an OFFICIAL STATEMENT from the JWs where they claim to be the ONLY ones to gain salvation. And THAT is really what this discussion has been about. It has been about people making claims against the JWs without being able to show any proof OF those claims.
And THAT is something I won't tolerate silently. Put up or shut up is what I say.
peace,
mikeOkay, if we are now done with the GOSSIP portion of this thread, perhaps someone is finally ready to show me a scripture that the NWT “BLATANTLY CORRUPTED”? That is, after all, the title of the thread, right?
Mike
Quote Pierre, they believe they are speaking God's spiritual truth on all matters scriptural. Just like all Christians believe when they talk to non-Christians. When you, as a Christian, say that only those who accept Christ will gain salvation, what does the non-Christian you're speaking to think? Does he feel left out, as if you think you have an exclusive club? you are twisting what I was saying ;what is a non Christian ? to the JW it is any one that is not WJ; any way that the way it was in the 50s and 60s they may have modernized sins then,
and I know what they believe but so are many other denominations I know.
but you tell me ;what are the reason of an ORGANIZATION in this world when your faith is in GOD and his SON who said that he would be with the faithful believers always
(this goes for any organization in religion)
is now acceptable by you to be part of both world ,Satan and God ??
Quote So, what is it with you? If they are doing everything right according to the scriptures, and then say that you must also do the things they're doing to gain salvation, are they wrong? How so?
how do you know the do everything right it seems to me you do not know anything about them,you have showed me you haven read any of there books ,Quote Don't you do the same thing with the Trinitarians? Don't we both tell them that they are in error by worshipping more than one God against all scriptural teaching? Don't we both, in our heart of hearts, have a feeling that they will be the ones to whom Jesus says, “Away from me evildoers, I never knew you”? Does that make you and me and Irene and t8 an “exclusive club” that is telling others they won't get to heaven? NO it is not the same we do not have built an empire in this world to benefit of all the world run offs/they are not they only ones ,but they are part of them.God is the name used but all are proselytize of the organization club,freedom in Christ
all is has the WTTS as determined,Quote Because I have NEVER heard of an OFFICIAL STATEMENT from the JWs where they claim to be the ONLY ones to gain salvation. If you will not investigate what I have given you, you will never see it because even I send you a copy of there book you could tell me that it is falsified ,and so always refusing to see ,
Quote It has been about people making claims against the JWs without being able to show any proof OF those claims. If you want you can google WJ contradictions and you can find there books ,quotes and what not ,IF YOU WANT ,but this is something you have to do ,just as you study scriptures and Hebrew,and Greek,and history.
Mike my love in Christ for you has not moved an hair
Pierre
Mike
this is a start ;GOSPEL: The Watchtower Society admits that their “gospel” is not the same gospel that has historically been preached by Christendom.
“…compare…the gospel of the Kingdom done by the religious systems of Christendom during all the centuries with that done by Jehovah’s Witnesses….They are not one and the same kind.” —The Watchtower, May 1, 1981, p. 17
The Society’s “gospel” is a gospel of faith + works. They teach that there are 4 requirements for salvation:
“…taking in knowledge….of God and of Jesus Christ.”
“…obey God’s laws, yes, to conform one’s life to the moral requirements set out in the Bible.”
“…be associated with God’s channel, his organization….we must identify that organization and serve God as part of it.”
“…connected [to God’s organization] with loyalty.”—The Watchtower, February 15, 1983, p. 12
“And while now the witness yet includes the invitation to come to Jehovah’s organization for salvation.”—The Watchtower, November 15, 1981, p. 21“It is for the reward of eternal life that every last person on earth should now be working. Are you?” —The Watchtower, Aug. 15, 1972, p. 492
“When we accept this invitation, we must be prepared to do so ‘continually,’ not because there is some special merit in self-denial, but because one moment’s indiscretion, one lapse in good judgment, may undo all that has been built up, even jeopardizing our eternal welfare. Spiritual progress is usually made at a rather slow pace, but how quickly it can be nullified if we are not on guard constantly!”—The Watchtower, August 1, 1992, p. 17
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2011,04:35) Quote (Ed J @ Oct. 01 2011,12:50) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2011,05:23) Okay Ed, CONFIRM FOR ME THAT IT IS THE JW OFFICIAL STANCE THAT ONLY JWs WILL GAIN EVERLASTING LIFE.
mike
Hi Mike,Why are you changing the words? I asked David, our JW member…
“Is it not true that your organization teaches that non-members are non-Christians?”
This is what the JW's “DO” teach, and it is confirmed by three others besides me (listed in a prior post).God bless
Ed J
Ed,(1)You keep telling me the question you ASKED David, as if you asking the question is the equivalent of him answering “YES!” to it.
WHAT did David ANSWER to your question? Did he answer “YES” or “NO”?
(2)And are EITHER OF YOU TWO able to actually produce JW literature in which they claim to be the ONLY way to salvation?
(3)If not, then Pierre is right that YOU TWO should let this subject drop. It is not for ME to let it drop, since it is TO ME that YOU TWO made the claim in the first place.
(4)I suggest that if YOU TWO can produce no solid evidence to support your claim, then YOU TWO should not only let it drop for now, but NEVER make your UNFOUNDED claim to anyone again.
(5)Of course, like I said before, if you ARE able to eventually show solid support to what you've claimed, I will stand both corrected and with you on this matter.)
peace,
mike
Hi Mike,1) He didn't answer “NO”!
2) That is not what we are discussing.
3) We are only talking about this because you asked.
4) You choose not to look at the evidence; have you forgotten already?
5) All you have to do is examine the evidence yourself as both me and Pierre pointed out.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 03 2011,13:11) Okay, if we are now done with the GOSSIP portion of this thread, perhaps someone is finally ready to show me a scripture that the NWT “BLATANTLY CORRUPTED”? That is, after all, the title of the thread, right?
Hi Mike,I will wait until another N.W.T verse comes up, until then I will pause.
God bless
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
