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Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,12:10) What specifically was your second question?
First post on page two, Kathi.
Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,11:54) BD,
There is one Lord and that is Jesus. Do you think that means that the Father is not our Lord also?
But there is not literally one Lord, is there? In fact, Paul begins his statement by saying there are many gods and many lords, both in heaven and on earth.In 1 Cor 8, Paul is placing Jesus and his own God and Lord in a “pecking order”, if you will. For us, there is one God – above ALL things, including Jesus. And one Lord – above everything his Father, Lord, and God placed under his feet. (Paul is quick to point out in 1 Cor 15 that “everything” obviously doesn't include Jesus' own God, who is the One who placed all those other things under him in the first place.)
Kathi, Paul also wrote these words:
1 Corinthians 11:3
Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.1 Corinthians 3:22-23
all things belong to you, and you belong to Christ; and Christ belongs to God.Surely, if you read any of Paul's words in the scriptures, you would not be able to make a claim that he thinks the Son is the God he is the Son of. Many times he thanks the God and Father OF his Lord Jesus Christ.
What do you think words like that mean?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 28 2012,13:40) Quote (Lightenup @ May 28 2012,12:32) Mike,
Our ONE God Almighty is both God of gods and Lord of lords.
I agree.And it seems we both agree that we have but ONE God Almighty.
Next question:
Does our ONE God Almighty have a Son named Jesus? YES or NO?
Our One God Almighty is both a Father and a Son and the Son is named Jesus. Our one God Almighty is a unity of both persons. So, yes our one God Almighty has a Son named Jesus.As one God Almighty, They made man in Their image.
Gen 1:26
Then God said, “Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them rule over the fish of the sea and over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 29 2012,17:14) Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,11:54) BD,
There is one Lord and that is Jesus. Do you think that means that the Father is not our Lord also?
But there is not literally one Lord, is there? In fact, Paul begins his statement by saying there are many gods and many lords, both in heaven and on earth.In 1 Cor 8, Paul is placing Jesus and his own God and Lord in a “pecking order”, if you will. For us, there is one God – above ALL things, including Jesus. And one Lord – above everything his Father, Lord, and God placed under his feet. (Paul is quick to point out in 1 Cor 15 that “everything” obviously doesn't include Jesus' own God, who is the One who placed all those other things under him in the first place.)
Kathi, Paul also wrote these words:
1 Corinthians 11:3
Now I want you to realize that the head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God.1 Corinthians 3:22-23
all things belong to you, and you belong to Christ; and Christ belongs to God.Surely, if you read any of Paul's words in the scriptures, you would not be able to make a claim that he thinks the Son is the God he is the Son of. Many times he thanks the God and Father OF his Lord Jesus Christ.
What do you think words like that mean?
Mike,
I do not believe that Paul is making a pecking order, he instead is stressing that Christ is essential to us having a relationship with God because God is who Christ belongs to and is directed by. The people, if they truly knew that Christ was truly from God, then they could believe everything about Him.The Father and the Son are both heads over us. Thomas calls the Son, his “Lord” and his “God.”
There may be several lords, Mike, but for us there is only one Lord and that is Jesus Christ and He is the Lord of lords.
Quote (bodhitharta @ May 29 2012,15:49) Quote (Lightenup @ May 30 2012,04:54) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 29 2012,01:21) There is ONLY ONE TRUE GOD according to HIS Christ Jesus, that means that even Jesus is not a TRUE GOD. There can be ONLY ONE
BD,
There is one Lord and that is Jesus. Do you think that means that the Father is not our Lord also? I don't think so. Neither do I think that just because the Bible says that there is one God, the Father, that means that Jesus is not God. In another place Jesus is called God (even Jehovah) by the Father and also by apostles.1 Cor. 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.
Jesus tells us that He and the Father are one.
Deuteronomy tells us that Jehovah is the one God who is God of gods and Lord of lords.
Revelations tells us that Jesus is the Lord of lords.
Corinthians tells us that our one Lord is Jesus.
Hebrews quotes the Father showing us that the Son is Jehovah that laid the foundation of the earth and that the heavens are the works of His hands.
Jehovah is a name indicating eternal existence and is given to the Father and the Son and the unity they make.
When the Bible says that Jehovah is one God, that one God is both God of gods and Lord of lords…a unity which contains a Father and a Son. One of the members was sent by the other to become flesh so that His flesh could be sacrificed and blood shed for the remissions of sin for mankind. While He was walking in the flesh, He explained the Father and brought a new covenant to provide salvation to both believing Jews and Gentiles. In His explanation of the Father, He explained that He and the Father were in unity and that He did nothing outside of that unity. His words and actions are in agreement with what the Father would have Him say and do.
Now we have salvation in the name of Jesus. Our hope is not that we will be able to be righteous in our own strength like Jesus but our righteousness comes by being in Jesus. We have that righteousness when we accept Him as our Lord and Savior and walk in that belief.
God bless!
HiThe problem with you statement is Jesus was the One who said that the father was the ONLY TRUE GOD o if you disagree it's not with me it's with Jesus.
Other people were referred to as god even Moses was referred to as a “god” by God.
There is ONLY ONE TRUE GOD and LORD
BD,You say there is only one true God and Lord.
Is Jesus Christ your Lord and Savior?
Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,17:41) Mike,
I do not believe that Paul is making a pecking order, he instead is stressing that Christ is essential to us having a relationship with God because God is who Christ belongs to and is directed by.
I agree that only through Christ can any of us come to God – this is scriptural. But think about it, we go THROUGH Christ to get TO God. Are we going through God to get to the One we just went through?And look at the bolded words in your quote above, Kathi. According to your own words, Christ is ONE, who BELONGS TO and is DIRECTED BY the one you call “God”. How can Christ be the very one he belongs to and is directed by?
Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,17:41) There may be several lords, Mike, but for us there is only one Lord and that is Jesus Christ and He is the Lord of lords.
Then who is this “Lord” in Rev 4?
“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord God Almighty, who was, and is, and is to come.You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive glory and honor and power, for you created all things, and by your will they were created and have their being.”
The context tells us that these words are said/sung to “him who sits on the throne”. Is this Jesus? Apparently not, for Jesus is the slaughtered Lamb who takes the scroll from the right hand of “him who sits on the throne”.
Who is this Lord?
Revelation 21:22
I did not see a temple in the city, because the Lord God Almighty and the Lamb are its temple.This speaks of two, one of whom is “the Lord God Almighty”, and the other of whom is “the Lamb”.
Who is this “Lord”?
Luke 1:32
He will be great and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father DavidOr this one?
Matthew 11:25
At that time Jesus said, “I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children.Or this one?
Acts 17:24
“The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by hands.Who are the lords mentioned here by Paul?
Ephesians 6:5
Slaves, obey your earthly lords with respect and fear, and with sincerity of heart, just as you would obey Christ.How could Paul be telling CHRISTIANS to obey other lords, when Jesus is the “only” Lord for us?
Kathi, I believe you are purposely taking the words “one Lord” in 1 Cor 8 literally, simply because you want it to teach what your itching ears are dying to hear. But you can see from those many scriptures that it doesn't really teach what you want it to.
Look, you don't have to respond to all these scriptures, because there's really no scriptural rebuttal you could make to them anyway. Instead, just answer these two simple questions, and that should be the end of it:
Kathi, is God the Father the Lord of heaven and earth? Is He your Lord?
Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,17:33) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 28 2012,13:40) Quote (Lightenup @ May 28 2012,12:32) Mike,
Our ONE God Almighty is both God of gods and Lord of lords.
I agree.And it seems we both agree that we have but ONE God Almighty.
Next question:
Does our ONE God Almighty have a Son named Jesus? YES or NO?
Our One God Almighty is both a Father and a Son and the Son is named Jesus. Our one God Almighty is a unity of both persons. So, yes our one God Almighty has a Son named Jesus.
So you believe that Jesus is the Son of the unity of the Father and the Son?Wouldn't that mean that Jesus is his own Son, and therefore his own Father too?
My understanding is this:
If our ONE and ONLY God Almighty has a Son named Jesus, and Jesus DOESN'T have a Son named Jesus, then Jesus cannot possibly BE our ONE and ONLY God Almighty.But apparently you think Jesus is his own Father and his own Son. Do I have that right?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 29 2012,20:02) Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,17:33) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 28 2012,13:40) Quote (Lightenup @ May 28 2012,12:32) Mike,
Our ONE God Almighty is both God of gods and Lord of lords.
I agree.And it seems we both agree that we have but ONE God Almighty.
Next question:
Does our ONE God Almighty have a Son named Jesus? YES or NO?
Our One God Almighty is both a Father and a Son and the Son is named Jesus. Our one God Almighty is a unity of both persons. So, yes our one God Almighty has a Son named Jesus.
So you believe that Jesus is the Son of the unity of the Father and the Son?Wouldn't that mean that Jesus is his own Son, and therefore his own Father too?
My understanding is this:
If our ONE and ONLY God Almighty has a Son named Jesus, and Jesus DOESN'T have a Son named Jesus, then Jesus cannot possibly BE our ONE and ONLY God Almighty.But apparently you think Jesus is his own Father and his own Son. Do I have that right?
Mike,
Jesus isn't the name of the unity, He belongs to the unity as a Son. The Father also belongs to this unity as the Father. Jesus is the part of the unity that is the Son. The Father is the other part of the unity. The Father begat the Son. One part of the unity begat the other part of the unity.Let's use your situation:
The Mike Boll's family (a unity)= a father and a son.
Cody is the son of the Mike Boll's family but he is not his own father.
Mike is the father of the Mike Boll's family.Do you get it now? Is it just semantics that is the problem?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 30 2012,12:02) Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,17:33) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 28 2012,13:40) Quote (Lightenup @ May 28 2012,12:32) Mike,
Our ONE God Almighty is both God of gods and Lord of lords.
I agree.And it seems we both agree that we have but ONE God Almighty.
Next question:
Does our ONE God Almighty have a Son named Jesus? YES or NO?
Our One God Almighty is both a Father and a Son and the Son is named Jesus. Our one God Almighty is a unity of both persons. So, yes our one God Almighty has a Son named Jesus.
So you believe that Jesus is the Son of the unity of the Father and the Son?Wouldn't that mean that Jesus is his own Son, and therefore his own Father too?
My understanding is this:
If our ONE and ONLY God Almighty has a Son named Jesus, and Jesus DOESN'T have a Son named Jesus, then Jesus cannot possibly BE our ONE and ONLY God Almighty.But apparently you think Jesus is his own Father and his own Son. Do I have that right?
Brilliant!Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 30 2012,12:11) Hey Asana, I'm truly glad you came back.
God Bless
I must admit I don't know for how long but I definitely had to support some of these insightful posts you are writingQuote (Lightenup @ May 30 2012,12:56) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 29 2012,20:02) Quote (Lightenup @ May 29 2012,17:33) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 28 2012,13:40) Quote (Lightenup @ May 28 2012,12:32) Mike,
Our ONE God Almighty is both God of gods and Lord of lords.
I agree.And it seems we both agree that we have but ONE God Almighty.
Next question:
Does our ONE God Almighty have a Son named Jesus? YES or NO?
Our One God Almighty is both a Father and a Son and the Son is named Jesus. Our one God Almighty is a unity of both persons. So, yes our one God Almighty has a Son named Jesus.
So you believe that Jesus is the Son of the unity of the Father and the Son?Wouldn't that mean that Jesus is his own Son, and therefore his own Father too?
My understanding is this:
If our ONE and ONLY God Almighty has a Son named Jesus, and Jesus DOESN'T have a Son named Jesus, then Jesus cannot possibly BE our ONE and ONLY God Almighty.But apparently you think Jesus is his own Father and his own Son. Do I have that right?
Mike,
Jesus isn't the name of the unity, He belongs to the unity as a Son. The Father also belongs to this unity as the Father. Jesus is the part of the unity that is the Son. The Father is the other part of the unity. The Father begat the Son. One part of the unity begat the other part of the unity.Let's use your situation:
The Mike Boll's family (a unity)= a father and a son.
Cody is the son of the Mike Boll's family but he is not his own father.
Mike is the father of the Mike Boll's family.Do you get it now? Is it just semantics that is the problem?
You speak of unified “Membership” God PERSONALLY says:Isaiah 45:5
I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:Isaiah 45:6
That they may know from the rising of the sun, and from the west, that there is none beside me. I am the LORD, and there is none else.Isaiah 45:18
For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else.Isaiah 45:22
Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.Isaiah 46:9
Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is none like me,And this is how HE was known:
Deuteronomy 4:39
Know therefore this day, and consider it in thine heart, that the LORD he is God in heaven above, and upon the earth beneath: there is none else.1 Kings 8:60
That all the people of the earth may know that the LORD is God, and that there is none else.Deuteronomy 4:35
Unto thee it was shewed, that thou mightest know that the LORD he is God; there is none else beside him.There is no scripture whatsoever that supports your MULTIGOD theory what do you think it means when God says “I am God, and there is none like me” Aren't the words I and me SINGULAR. He uses the terms “am” and “is” hese are SINGULAR not there “are” none like me but there “is” non like me. “Me” is not a membership
Jesus said: my Father is greater than I
Jesus said about The Almighty: John 17:3
And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.Notice that Jesus spoke of himself here as something seperate from “GOD” using “and” if Jesus was part of a membership called God he could not have said some other being is THE ONLY TRUE GOD but he was telling you the truth and he is not God but he was sent by THE ONLY TRUE ONE GOD no membership
BD,
you said:Quote Jesus said about The Almighty: John 17:3
And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.Notice that Jesus spoke of himself here as something seperate from “GOD” using “and” if Jesus was part of a membership called God he could not have said some other being is THE ONLY TRUE GOD but he was telling you the truth and he is not God but he was sent by THE ONLY TRUE ONE GOD no membership
In this context Jesus calls the Father, the only true God but includes Himself as one that 'they' may know. And who is Jesus…our one Lord. So Jesus is telling the Father that He prays that 'they' would know the only true God, the Father and Himself, the one Lord. That goes right with 1 Cor 8:6 doesn't it.
yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.That also goes along with Deut 10:17
“For the LORD your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God who does not show partiality nor take a bribe.BTW, BD, you can have different levels of authority within a compound unity so the Father is greater than the Son by position of Father to Son, not by nature/kind.
Examples of scripture that shows a compound unity of God and the church, etc. using singular pronouns to represent them:
Quote Look at these two verses together through the eyes of God, in His fullness, being a unity of the Father and the Son as the one Jehovah. Romans 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways! 34For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, OR WHO BECAME HIS COUNSELOR? 35Or WHO HAS FIRST GIVEN TO HIM THAT IT MIGHT BE PAID BACK TO HIM AGAIN? 36For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things. To Him be the glory forever. Amen.
1 Cor 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.
Regarding the Son:
Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities– all things have been created through Him and for Him.Regarding the Word that was in the beginning with God:
John 1:3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.Romans 11 seems to talk about Jehovah in the fullest sense and 1 Cor 8:6 seems to talk about the members within the unity of the fullness of Jehovah.
Quote To the Church in Laodicea Rev 3:14“To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God’s creation. 15I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! 16So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth. 17You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked. 18I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see.
Do you see how it says that the church says “I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.”
That is a perfect example of something that is a compound unity using singular pronouns and saying things with singular pronouns. All of the 'you' words are singular in the Greek when referring to the church in this passage.Quote “He has blinded THEIR minds and hardened THEIR hearts, lest THEY should see with THEIR eyes, lest THEY should understand with THEIR hearts and THEY should turn and I should heal THEM.” John cited Isaiah 6:10 which in the Online Hebrew Interlinear all singular pronouns are used:
“Make the heart of this people fat, and make HIS ears heavy, and shut HIS eyes; lest HE see with HIS eyes, and hear with HIS ears, and understand with HIS heart, and convert, and be healed.”
Quote Eph 2:14 For He Himself is our peace, who made both groups into one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, 15by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace, 16and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity. Quote Here is another compound unity, the temple in the city of Heaven is the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb. The two are one temple. Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple in the city, for its temple is the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb.
Interesting how the believer's make up the body of Christ, the church and the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb make up the temple for the church. In this manner, the believers are in them yet the believers are not the temple but those who enter into the temple. This temple is where we worship…the temple of the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb.
So, BD, scripture does support the compound unity and shows the use of singular pronouns.
Please read carefully
KathiQuote (Lightenup @ May 31 2012,14:03) BD,
you said:Quote Jesus said about The Almighty: John 17:3
And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.Notice that Jesus spoke of himself here as something seperate from “GOD” using “and” if Jesus was part of a membership called God he could not have said some other being is THE ONLY TRUE GOD but he was telling you the truth and he is not God but he was sent by THE ONLY TRUE ONE GOD no membership
In this context Jesus calls the Father, the only true God but includes Himself as one that 'they' may know. And who is Jesus…our one Lord. So Jesus is telling the Father that He prays that 'they' would know the only true God, the Father and Himself, the one Lord. That goes right with 1 Cor 8:6 doesn't it.
yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.That also goes along with Deut 10:17
“For the LORD your God is the God of gods and the Lord of lords, the great, the mighty, and the awesome God who does not show partiality nor take a bribe.BTW, BD, you can have different levels of authority within a compound unity so the Father is greater than the Son by position of Father to Son, not by nature/kind.
Examples of scripture that shows a compound unity of God and the church, etc. using singular pronouns to represent them:
Quote Look at these two verses together through the eyes of God, in His fullness, being a unity of the Father and the Son as the one Jehovah. Romans 11:33 Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways! 34For WHO HAS KNOWN THE MIND OF THE LORD, OR WHO BECAME HIS COUNSELOR? 35Or WHO HAS FIRST GIVEN TO HIM THAT IT MIGHT BE PAID BACK TO HIM AGAIN? 36For from Him and through Him and to Him are all things. To Him be the glory forever. Amen.
1 Cor 8:6 yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.
Regarding the Son:
Col 1:16 For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities– all things have been created through Him and for Him.Regarding the Word that was in the beginning with God:
John 1:3 All things came into being through Him, and apart from Him nothing came into being that has come into being.Romans 11 seems to talk about Jehovah in the fullest sense and 1 Cor 8:6 seems to talk about the members within the unity of the fullness of Jehovah.
Quote To the Church in Laodicea Rev 3:14“To the angel of the church in Laodicea write:
These are the words of the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the ruler of God’s creation. 15I know your deeds, that you are neither cold nor hot. I wish you were either one or the other! 16So, because you are lukewarm—neither hot nor cold—I am about to spit you out of my mouth. 17You say, ‘I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.’ But you do not realize that you are wretched, pitiful, poor, blind and naked. 18I counsel you to buy from me gold refined in the fire, so you can become rich; and white clothes to wear, so you can cover your shameful nakedness; and salve to put on your eyes, so you can see.
Do you see how it says that the church says “I am rich; I have acquired wealth and do not need a thing.”
That is a perfect example of something that is a compound unity using singular pronouns and saying things with singular pronouns. All of the 'you' words are singular in the Greek when referring to the church in this passage.Quote “He has blinded THEIR minds and hardened THEIR hearts, lest THEY should see with THEIR eyes, lest THEY should understand with THEIR hearts and THEY should turn and I should heal THEM.” John cited Isaiah 6:10 which in the Online Hebrew Interlinear all singular pronouns are used:
“Make the heart of this people fat, and make HIS ears heavy, and shut HIS eyes; lest HE see with HIS eyes, and hear with HIS ears, and understand with HIS heart, and convert, and be healed.”
Quote Eph 2:14 For He Himself is our peace, who made both groups into one and broke down the barrier of the dividing wall, 15by abolishing in His flesh the enmity, which is the Law of commandments contained in ordinances, so that in Himself He might make the two into one new man, thus establishing peace, 16and might reconcile them both in one body to God through the cross, by it having put to death the enmity. Quote Here is another compound unity, the temple in the city of Heaven is the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb. The two are one temple. Rev 21:22 And I saw no temple in the city, for its temple is the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb.
Interesting how the believer's make up the body of Christ, the church and the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb make up the temple for the church. In this manner, the believers are in them yet the believers are not the temple but those who enter into the temple. This temple is where we worship…the temple of the Lord God the Almighty and the Lamb.
So, BD, scripture does support the compound unity and shows the use of singular pronouns.
Please read carefully
Kathi
God is the title of the Position. The Father is THE GOD that is why in Islam HE is called THE GOD it is His position His Title that is why you read Jehovah God.Jesus does not have the Title of God this is why Jesus calls the Father the ONLY TRUE GOD because He is the only one worthy of the Rank and Title andthis is also why there can never be more than ONE GOD
Even someone very near to him such as Jesus cannot ever have His Sovereign Position EVER and this is what you keep missing God is GOD ALMIGHTY, He is THE MOST HIGH in the words of the Quran:
Allah! There is no god but He,-the Living, the Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him nor sleep. His are all things in the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence except as He permitteth
? He knoweth what (appeareth to His creatures as) before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass aught of His knowledge except as He willeth. His throne doth extend over the heavens and the earth, and He feeleth no fatigue in guarding and preserving them for He is the Most High, the Supreme (in glory).
( سورة البقرة , Al-Baqara, Chapter #2, Verse #255)Raised high above ranks (or degrees), (He is) the Lord of the throne (of Authority): by His Command doth He send the Spirit (of inspiration) to any of His servants he pleases, that it may warn (men) of the Day of Mutual Meeting,-
( سورة غافر , Ghafir, Chapter #40, Verse #15)Jesus does have the title of God, BD.
Acts 20:28 “Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of (the) God which He purchased with His own blood.
If you look in the Greek, you will see the article 'the' is before the word 'God' and should read 'the God.' Now unless you believe that the Father shed His own blood, then you will see that the Son has the title of the God here. Both carry that title.
Also, your Quran or the Bible refers to God with singular pronouns and adjectives, but that doesn't mean He is not a compound unity. Go back and read my last post here and see all the examples of singular pronouns and adjectives for a unity.
Please remember that this thread is not about what the quaran has to say.
Quote (Lightenup @ May 30 2012,23:13) Acts 20:28 “Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of (the) God which He purchased with His own blood.
Or……………. “the church of the God, which He purchased with the blood of His own”.Romans 8:32
He who did not spare his ownSon, but gave him up for us allYou can see how Romans 8:32 tells the same message as Acts 20:28; the word “son” is the only difference. And even if you omit the word “son” in 8:32, or add it in 20:28, both messages will still be the same, and both will still align perfectly with the entire teaching of the NT: God sent His Son to die, not God Himself came to die.
Quote (bodhitharta @ May 30 2012,09:53) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 30 2012,12:02)
My understanding is this:
If our ONE and ONLY God Almighty has a Son named Jesus, and Jesus DOESN'T have a Son named Jesus, then Jesus cannot possibly BE our ONE and ONLY God Almighty.
Brilliant!
Thanks, Asana.I didn't really understand how Kathi's response addressed this simple fact.
Kathi, do you agree that there exists only ONE God Almighty? Do you agree that that ONE has a Son named Jesus?
Quote (Lightenup @ May 30 2012,21:03) BD,
you said:Quote Jesus said about The Almighty: John 17:3
And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent.Notice that Jesus spoke of himself here as something seperate from “GOD” using “and” if Jesus was part of a membership called God he could not have said some other being is THE ONLY TRUE GOD but he was telling you the truth and he is not God but he was sent by THE ONLY TRUE ONE GOD no membership
In this context Jesus calls the Father, the only true God but includes Himself as one that 'they' may know. And who is Jesus…our one Lord. So Jesus is telling the Father that He prays that 'they' would know the only true God, the Father and Himself, the one Lord. That goes right with 1 Cor 8:6 doesn't it.
yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom are all things and we exist for Him; and one Lord, Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we exist through Him.
Kathi,Is God the Father your Lord? Is He the Lord of all heaven and earth, like Jesus says?
Quote (Lightenup @ May 31 2012,16:13) Jesus does have the title of God, BD. Acts 20:28 “Be on guard for yourselves and for all the flock, among which the Holy Spirit has made you overseers, to shepherd the church of (the) God which He purchased with His own blood.
If you look in the Greek, you will see the article 'the' is before the word 'God' and should read 'the God.' Now unless you believe that the Father shed His own blood, then you will see that the Son has the title of the God here. Both carry that title.
Also, your Quran or the Bible refers to God with singular pronouns and adjectives, but that doesn't mean He is not a compound unity. Go back and read my last post here and see all the examples of singular pronouns and adjectives for a unity.
Please remember that this thread is not about what the quaran has to say.
I won't disregard the Quran because you don't read it that would be silly, I am a Muslim take The Torah , The Gospel and the Quran into consideration before coming to a conclusion or viewpoint. Also, although God has a Unity of Purpose with all those who are His it does not mean thay are Him or that they are God.Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 01 2012,10:25) Quote (bodhitharta @ May 30 2012,09:53) Quote (mikeboll64 @ May 30 2012,12:02)
My understanding is this:
If our ONE and ONLY God Almighty has a Son named Jesus, and Jesus DOESN'T have a Son named Jesus, then Jesus cannot possibly BE our ONE and ONLY God Almighty.
Brilliant!
Thanks, Asana.I didn't really understand how Kathi's response addressed this simple fact.
Kathi, do you agree that there exists only ONE God Almighty? Do you agree that that ONE has a Son named Jesus?
Her idea issimply that the word of God has no sovereign meaning. She is sing yes Jesus has a God but he is also a God to her the word God is like the word Human. There are humans and there are gods but God the Father is the head of all the gods, this is how I believe she believes but she can't seem to grasp when Jesus says that Tha Father is THE ONLY TRUE GOD it literally excludes all others whereas you cannot use this idea with Humans who is the only true human?She worships Jesus as God and not God Almighty as GodMost High
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