- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Dinah,
The masonic idolatry only started in the middle ages. It's occult nature and demon worship is an extreme fruit of the Whore.The whore is the mother of harlots who cames from way back and masonry is one of her daughters in my opinion..The Statue of Liberty is a man made object but hills are the work of God and cannot be interpreted as man made object.The gross excesses of the USA are also the fruit of the Whore and her false worship system.
What happened on 9/11 I believe to be part of the punishment of the whore as all the attacks happened “In a single hour” Rev 18.10 [58 mins between the first and the last plane crash] We will see much more in the near future I expect and not just in the USA.
The Russian meaning of Chernobyl is also Wormwood and that disaster has poisoned many rivers.
The reaol sign we need to be on the watch for is the abomination of desolation [mt 24.15]as it kicks off the final days.
Who can tell us more about this?hey nick and dinah (and anyone else),
i just thought i'd add my own thoughts here (which aren't many, but…)
the harlot is named mystery babylon… my first thought is that this is a description of her behaviour, rather than the identification of an “order” or a “city”… correct me if i'm wrong, but babylon is derived from babel, which means confusion: so she could be said to be confusing the true faith with other religions…
babylon is also known as the “gate of the gods” (in mesopotmian history), which could signify that (as befits her occupation) the woman “plays the harlot” with the kings (or gods, if you would) of the earth.
my bible knowledge is a bit sketchy at the moment, but one of the prophets (isaiah or ezekial i think) mention two sisters – one plays the harlot and the other plays the faithful bride… i think there is a direct link between these two scriptures (ie the prophet and revelations). the scarlet woman is any “christian organisation” which compromises itself with the world, and the spotless bride keeps herself pure – another perspective is the “christian city” and the “city of god” as related in the vision by …? (sorry, can't remember his name – it was the 80's, and i think there is a link somewhere on this sight)…
well, it doesn't really give any definite answers, but i hope it helps…
cheers,
nate.
Hi nate,
I tend to think along these lines myself, because Babylon the city was destroyed forever and Mystery Babylon cannot be talking about that city. So I think it is her influence that lives on. Saddam even tried to rebuild it and got part of the way there and then the Gulf War. So I guess God meant what he said when she would be destroyed.
Yes Babel is the root to Babylon and if we think about it, they tried to build a tower to reach the heavens in their own strength and it has been mentioned before that perhaps the tower could also been a refuge from another flood if God decided to judge the earth again.
Either way, Babels big mistake was going their own way, not Gods. Self glorification and perhaps self salvation was in their hearts and God sent delusion in the form of divided languages, so that they could not unite in this iniquity again. So the impact of mans iniquity was lessened but new problems also were created such as ethos against ethos. Some people also think that the original Tower of Babel was pyramid as they seem to have heavenly paths mapped out. So they are built up to the heavens or map the heavens. Not the heavens literally.
Just a side note: The country where i come from (New Zealand) built it's parliament based on the Tower of Babel or at least a 17th century painting of it. View it here and let me know what you think.
http://www.vnz.co.nz/photos/cities/wellington/046k.shtml
Anyway, what I think it is interesting is when you draw parallels with the denominational system with Babel and Babylon. It could be said that the denominations have also built their cathedrals (towers) up to heaven (the steeples use to be the highest point around so they could be seen) and they believed that these buildings was where God lived rather than in his people.
So what is God to do when his people build buildings in their own name e.g. Catholic etc. He divides them into different languages. The languages of Christianity are the denominations and they serve as divisions lest they unite in their works of iniquity.
This is why I believe it is wrong to try and unite the denominations. There has been great effort to get the larger denominations to unite back to the Roman Catholic Church. I believe however that true unity is built on truth and the foundation for the denominations is actually the Trinity of which the Catholics can take credit for. Athanasuis the main promoter of the Trinity doctrine back in 300 whatever, is even known as the Father of the Catholics by the Catholics.
Yes we should come out of that system and not partake in her sins lest we be judged along with her as God will certainly judge her for misrepresenting him. How long will God allow men to teach lies in his name and to give a bad name to God when their scandals are written all over the worldly newspapers. Money, sex, child abuse and other misuses of power are reported all the time. Do we really want to be part of that.
Also I know from experience that many peoples hearts are hardened to the gospel in the light (or darkness) of so-called Church history. How many people have you heard say “religion causes wars”. In fact this was the main reason why I wasn't a christian most of my life. I just couldn't believe that the Church could be right, especially when you looked at her history. Of course I didn't know what the real meaning of Church was. That is why I often say that we need a real revelation of who and what the Church is.
To Nick,
I just want to say that I appreciate your posts. I can see that you are one who seeks the truth and is zealous for truth. I admire those qualities and encourage you to never give up your zeal for God and for the truth.
About New York city:
It is a popular belief that New York is Babylon because Babylon was the centre of commerce and made up of many peoples. It also seems relevant when we look at the recent terrorist attacks and could imagine one day that she may fall. New York is the centre for the World Bank and the United Nations which some say is a kind of Babel.I still really do not know who Babylon really is, but I know certain things about her. She is about idolatory and she makes the whole world drunk on her wine.
Well has America made the whole world drunk? Perhaps. Has the false religious system made the world drunk? I would say yes. Is is New York or Rome? or somewhere else. Who knows, but I don't think that New York is known as the City of the 7 hills. I went there once and it was kind of flat. But I know that Rome is known by that title even to this day. Although there are other cities in the world that are called by this title.
New York maybe the centre of commerce, but Rome is the centre for the biggest idolatory in the world.
In Babylon they worshipped a Trinity and they even worshipped the Mother of God. Sounds familiar doesn't it.
hey t8,
there's a couple of artists representations of babel at this site:
http://www.gatewaystobabylon.com/
as well as a few insights into ancient mesopotamian culture… several years ago i tried to write an allegory based around the babylonian imagery in the bible (and certain experiences i'd had within the church), but could never get the right “feel”… i guess that's probably a good thing – would've ended up more as mud-slinging than anything – but i did have some clear insights at the time… i'd relate them now, but it's late and i'm tired… maybe later – if anyone's interested…
cheers,
nate.
Hi Nate,
The 2 sisters are in Ez 23 and they are both harlots-Oholah an Oholibah and they represent Samaria and Jerusalem.God regards idolatry and reliance on men rather than Him as harlotry. He is a jealous God and that is His right.
Thanks t8.I will be overseas for 6 weeks so keep stirring the pot as I believe this is a good forum for learning truth and encouraging one another to keep on safe paths.
that's right – ezekial that wily old file!!
yeh, they were both harlots – don't know where i got that other idea… anyway, so oholibah lusted after the babylonians – interesting!!
can't remember if i mentioned this before – but i also see a parallel between mystery babylon and jezebel (as far as imagery goes) – they are both guilty of sexual immorality, and both try to pass themselves off as leaders within the body. now jezebel (the first jezebel) is the wife of ahab in the time of elijah, who causes israel to sin… the second jezebel is in one of the churches at the start of revelations. she passes herself off as a prophetess, and (though it's a little vague) seems to be leading the church into sexual immorality (or idolatry?)… she is also associated with a group called the “nicolaitans” who seem to be some sort of early gnostics (nicolaitan means “above the laity” or something like that)… a key to their identity might lie in john's accusation of diotrephes – who loves to have the pre-emminence… but it might not, also…
i think that there is a direct relation between the harlot (babylon; jezebel) and the churches – if the harlot is “in” the churches, then some of the church's sins should be the same as those of babylon… also, if babylon is guilty of loving the world, her opposite can be seen in another of the letters of john, when he says to the church, don't be surprised if the world hates you… and jesus said, if they hated me, how much more will they hate you… so if the church seeks recognition from the world, perhaps she is exibiting the “spirit of babylon”… but if the world hates her and persecutes her then maybe she is of god…
of course, does that mean that “come out of her, my people,” means leaving the church? i don't know… i haven't been to church for a long time, so my impressions are distant memories, and probably prone to bias…
cheers,
nate.
I am going to toss in some more thoughts about revelation for all to kick around and see what we can find.
Rev 12. Satan and his hordes are cast to earth . The woman [ Israel] gave birth to Jesus and the Child is the Body of Christ. At the Rapture[1 thess 4] the body of Christ is taken to safety to the wedding feast. The jews who heed Jesus's warning of Mt 24 .15 are also taken to a safe place for the tribulation [God's Wrath 3 and a half years]
Then Satan goes after the remainder-“the rest of her offspring”-“God's people” -“the holy ones” ie jews and believers left behind because they were not ready.
They will suffer greatly and may die for their faith through the trial of the Great Tribulation of Mt 24 and will be saved if they have their name written in the book of life.
Satan becomes incarnate as a man, The first Beast, the man of lawlessness of 2 Thess, the antichrist, a political figure, and he is given world leadership. He demands total control and worship.
Because God's people do not worship or obey him they are rescued at the return of Jesus and spared the final expression of God's wrath,the seven bowls, that inflict those remaining in th Beast' s entourage.Then there is the final conflict of this age-the Harvest of the earth.
The Beast initially supports the devoted whore, whose followers worship him till he betrays her ,turns on her and totally destroys her.
I don't think this is all correct so I would like help in clarifying it for all our sakes.
I do know in God's plan we will see none of this. His plan is that we are as the wise bridesmaids…. but only half were wise.
to all who have posted on topic……I agree with a little of everything….It!s the last verse in Rev 17-18, and no one has adressed that…..And the woman which thou sawest is that great city which reigneth over the Kings of the earth……
Everything that goes on in this world,,,[,like the old saying with the Roman Empire, all roads lead to Rome,,] sarts with New York City…..WHAT SHE STANDS FOR '''' IDOLITRY''''''
AND THE WAYS OF MANKIND…….WHO SHE STANDS FOR IS THE LEADER OF THE PACK…….NEW YORK CITY……John did not know who New York City was,,,,but he did know there was going to be one,,, and she could be identified by what she was doing to the world……..The prostitute of the world…….How much money did Bush offer Turkey to be able to use Turkish soil….
In Johns time ….Rome and the Church ……stood for the Idolitry of the world…… the Angel mentions that in the seven hills……but Rome has come and gone and now it is a Mystery…….The Angel makes it very clear,,,,who…..and what she is….BABYLON,,,,,,THAT MANKIND COULD RULE ITSELF WITHOUT GOD,,,,,,THE MOTHER OF ALL WHORES,,,THE PROSTITUTE OF THE WORLD……..Washington calls it Foreign Aid…….but if you feed a Nation long enough ,,THEY WILL OWE YOU…….
This Nation ” which is still at the moment ……” UNDER GOD”
the most Protestant Nation in the world,,,,,will be the most willing to see GOD leave, from its Flag, its government, and from the hearts and minds of its Citizens……This Nation that is leading the Worlds goverments to its ultimate goal,,,,a ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT…..SATANS GOVERNMENT……..THIS NATIONS……DENOMINATIONAL BLASPHEMY OF GOD……
GOD DOES NOT HAVE 15 DIFFERENT WAYS TO WORSHIP HIM
PROTESTANT AND CHRISTIAN AMERICA WORSHIP THEIR GOVERNMENT MORE THAN THEY WORSHIP GOD…….They have been made drunk from the wine of cup filled with the abomination and the filthiness of her fornicationsWhat President Bush and the Congress has done to America. brings tears to my eyes,,,,In order to install a government of Satan…….you have to destroy America and the very Foundation it was built on…… GOD…….put the wealth of the earth in one hand ……and put GOD in the other………and see which one you have the most of………..We the people are ready now ……we have drank from the CUP …..long enough……the wars and the rumors of have been fought…..
and there will be little or no resistence to the Anti-Christ…..The greatest and most brilliant deception ever performed on mankind has and is being played out by the greatest and most brilliant actors in the greatest theator in the world,,,,,,,THE WHITEHOUSE AND THE CONGRESS OF THE UNITED STATES…
The Fallen Angels will be bound for a 1000 years,,,,or as ENOCH says 70 generations….because they took for themselves wives and begat giants …..then turned loose for a little while……..and now they have begat the worlds politicians……….George Bush is a direct decendent of Satan!s as have they all…….
NO NICK,,,,,,I DISAGREE……READ YOUR MASONRY………THEY ARE THE '''''''''''' SONS OF GOD'''''''''''AND THEY HAVE BEEN HERE SINCE THE BEGINNING…….You!ve only known about them since 1717……the first Masonic Lodge of the free and accepted masons………..
How else can mankind keep a 5000 year old conspiracy alive and well?
??? from generation to generation,,,,without the blood of the ……..MASTER CONSPIRATOR…………You see Nick……that is how you can blind the the very eyes of Christianity itself……..with the truth …….GOD tells us who they are……..and St, John the DiVine tells us ,,,,what and where they are…….Masonic Washington………..the Beast and the False Prophet……
I watched them murder a President one day, when I was 24 years old, …..and a Chief Justice of the United States Supreme Court told me a LIE……..The Word of GOD is the truth…………the word of Satan is a lie………Very simple Nick ,,,,,,,,Both Washington and Satan are Liars,,,,,,,,,and where ever Satan is…………….GOD ISN!T………
You deceive mankind with the ….TRUTH……because the TRUTH is the most difficult to believe……..to expose Satan to mankind is…..lunacy……..how much more brilliant can you be than that? regards Duane [ Dinah]
hey guys,
continuing in my jerusalem/babylon frame of thought…
jesus laments over jerusalem, “you who killed the prophets”… i wonder if persecution of the “true” saints, is another key aspect of the spirit of babylon?
just pondering….
cheers,
nate.
I would advise anyone that is looking into this.
It doesnt matter even if one of the beast's was in existance. Nothing you can do about it, you can not avoid it, GoD has said it will come to pass.
Although there are extreamly obvious sighns, like a 3rd of the waters in blood, and 2 prophets who the world knows about because they block the sky from rain and prophecy. And then the beast raises and Destroys them. It obvious.
All we can do is continue in what Christ has Left us, To believe in him and to suffer for him, set our minds on doing good, as we wait for our new life. Love enemies, return insult with blessing, correct our brothers. And encourage those who arnt believer,, to do good, so that GoD may grant them repentance. Whoever lends to the poor, lends to the lord. Remember, The first Gentile that was permitted to believe and recieve the Holy Spirit, was a gentile who,, gave alms to the poor, and those alms, along with the mans prayers, came up before god as a memorial offering to that man. Likewise for any unbeliever.
I hope this has helped you.
Jesus told us we are not to be alarmed. The end is still yet to come. Take comfert in that fact, That GoD told him that we are to Just trust in GoD and also in Jesus.
Laterz Peeps ^_^
hey ringo,
i think the importance is in being able to discern the deceptions of the beast – my understand of this whole section is that babylon was mesmerised by the beast and carried along in its deceit. when the red army took control of china, a large proportion of the church was indoctrinated into its message (ie communism), and helped to spread the propaganda. there were a few who resisted (like watchman nee), or spoke out against the injustices, but these were either imprisoned or forced to leave (or silenced). in time – after it had fulfilled its purpose – the church was phased out. a similar thing happened with the christians in nazi germany – the majority supported the governmnent's genocidal reign, the minority who resisted were silenced, and then the church was phased out. i think these are just examples of what will happen more and more as we draw near the end. it is important to understand what we're up against so we can be part of the remnant, not the deceived.
we are told that even the elect will be deceived!! i think that we have to be watchful what “causes” we support. i think that anything which advocates “necesary evils” that good will result, whould instantly grab our attention – and we should not support it…
what i was actually going to say here was that the main entrance to babylon was through the gate of ishtar. ishtar or inanna was the mesopotamian precursor to aphrodite and venus. she was the goddess of erotic love (or lust)… i find this interesting in the context of babylon the harlot, and jezebel… but i think its more important at this stage to emphasise the need to be “watchful” – though not to see a demon in every shadow.
cheers,
nate.
Hmm, im triing to see a connection here. To me the following Words of Jesus fit best.
There will be wars and rumors of wars, the end is still to come.
So many wars, so many, I see Many people who look into the beast, and mark it as an all important talk about all the time event. Saying alll kinds of misguided accusations that, this ones the beast and that ones the beast, promote's hysteria in people, which others use, and im shure is a satanic plan. (even if it was true, should one simple thing rule your life? Who shall we fear? What can anyone do to the one who trusts GoD? They are permitted to torchour you, they are permitted to kill you, but GoD saves your soul, and theyre soul is cast into torment unless they repent)
The overpromotion and fearing events, and not being in peace trusting GoD, is a satanic plan, to make believers stumble, as ive said promote's hysteria, so that people will drop theyre guard and stop listening to the holy spirit who tells them to “return insult for blessing” and to live out your days doing good as you wait for the promise. For as it seems, many are believing that it is theyre christian duty to 'Stop the beast', such people persuaded of that belief, are calling GoD a liier, it is a promise from GoD that the beast will come.
Ive had, especially Jehovah's whitness people come up and all excited saying, “The UN is the BeasT!!!!” Im like….. so what?? even if your right. What are you doing in obediance to god??
thats far more important. And besides, its obvious that the beast is not a nation, nor is there just one beast, but that there are a few beasts.
Who come after eachother, one who kills the prophets, one who is healed, by another beast. blah blah blah, obvious when they come.Lets not get carried away by hysteria. But have sober thinking. ^_^
We can talk about our different beliefs, but lets not give satan room in our hearts, by setting ourselves against GoD, by not being in obediance to the Jesus, who GoD sent, to show us the new order of things. That is, GoD is our power GoD is our strength, That we are to be innocent as Doves and shrewed as Snakes, led as lambs to the slaughter. Leave room for GoD's Judgement(Vengence), For GoD says “I will repay”
For the suffering, Kingdom and patient endurence which are ours in Jesus.
hey ringo,
i understand your point – its important not to be led astray be rumours or conspiracies. i agree that there's no point saying “this is the beast,” or “over there”, just as we shouldn't say this of jesus… but there's a different between being tossed to and fro, and being watchful – we can't stop the beast, but we can make sure we're not deceived.
jesus told us to look out for the signs of the end, so that we'd be ready – and, according to revelations, one of those signs is the emergence of the beast, and of false prophets, and of the antichrist. but john said there are many antichrists, and that we must be aware of them, because many christians will be deceived. we must remain vigilant so that “we” are not deceived, because “they came from among us, but they weren't of us”
personally i don't think that the deception will be at all obvious, except to those that are watchful. i think we must be like ezekiel on the wall, watching for the enemy. we must be prepared to warn the body when the enemy approaches – to save as many as will listen. i don't think there will be just one deception, i think there will be many. i think the enemy will try to lull us with deceiving words in sooting tones… i think the enemy will also try to turn us against each other – “son against father, and father against son…” this happened in china, and it also happened in germany. i think that sets a precedent! i agree that it does no good to point the finger, or jump to conclusions, but we must be watchful…
cheers,
nate.
Hey, yer its, more important to be on your guard, You say be on your guard from the beast?? What do you mean by that?? What more would you do?? And there isnt just one beast, there are many who come after each other.
You should allready be on your guard, and be mindfull of what Jesus has left you. Right?? To love as he has loved. How could a beast highten your need to be on guard?? When,,.. Satan, the most powerfull of all beings opposing GoD is at the pressent circling like a roaring lion, ready to devour us at any seccond. Now is more important!!!
*It is very obvious, when beast comes.
*As you will see, I was going to break it apart to get to the point, But most of Rev is straight to the point.
*Seals broken way before the beast's come.
REV 6
1 I watched as the Lamb opened the first of the seven seals. Then I heard one of the four living creatures say in a voice like thunder, “Come!” 2I looked, and there before me was a white horse! Its rider held a bow, and he was given a crown, and he rode out as a conqueror bent on conquest.
3When the Lamb opened the second seal, I heard the second living creature say, “Come!” 4Then another horse came out, a fiery red one. Its rider was given power to take peace from the earth and to make men slay each other. To him was given a large sword.
5When the Lamb opened the third seal, I heard the third living creature say, “Come!” I looked, and there before me was a black horse! Its rider was holding a pair of scales in his hand. 6Then I heard what sounded like a voice among the four living creatures, saying, “A quart[1] of wheat for a day's wages,[2] and three quarts of barley for a day's wages,[3] and do not damage the oil and the wine!”
7When the Lamb opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say, “Come!” 8I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.
9When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain because of the word of God and the testimony they had maintained. 10They called out in a loud voice, “How long, Sovereign Lord, holy and true, until you judge the inhabitants of the earth and avenge our blood?” 11Then each of them was given a white robe, and they were told to wait a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and brothers who were to be killed as they had been was completed.
12I watched as he opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, 13and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as late figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind. 14The sky receded like a scroll, rolling up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.
15Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and every slave and every free man hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17For the great day of their wrath has come, and who can stand?”*The first few seals will not be that obvious to all people, that men are killing eachother. But more is to obvious things are to come.
*As you see, all this will be obvious, everyone on the earth abandon theyre homes for mountains.
*It does not end here, there is much more to happen before the first beast arises.
*Notice the seals are in order.
Revelation 7.
*Seals placed on foreheads of tribes of Israel.
*Not much else in sighns for us, so I'll skip it. Shows it still in continuation of order of events.
Revelation 8
The Seventh Seal and the Golden Censer
1When he opened the seventh seal, there was silence in heaven for about half an hour.
2And I saw the seven angels who stand before God, and to them were given seven trumpets.
3Another angel, who had a golden censer, came and stood at the altar. He was given much incense to offer, with the prayers of all the saints, on the golden altar before the throne. 4The smoke of the incense, together with the prayers of the saints, went up before God from the angel's hand. 5Then the angel took the censer, filled it with fire from the altar, and hurled it on the earth; and there came peals of thunder, rumblings, flashes of lightning and an earthquake.The Trumpets
6Then the seven angels who had the seven trumpets prepared to sound them.
7The first angel sounded his trumpet, and there came hail and fire mixed with blood, and it was hurled down upon the earth. A third of the earth was burned up, a third of the trees were burned up, and all the green grass was burned up.
8The second angel sounded his trumpet, and something like a huge mountain, all ablaze, was thrown into the sea. A third of the sea turned into blood, 9a third of the living creatures in the sea died, and a third of the ships were destroyed.
10The third angel sounded his trumpet, and a great star, blazing like a torch, fell from the sky on a third of the rivers and on the springs of water— 11the name of the star is Wormwood.[1] A third of the waters turned bitter, and many people died from the waters that had become bitter.
12The fourth angel sounded his trumpet, and a third of the sun was struck, a third of the moon, and a third of the stars, so that a third of them turned dark. A third of the day was without light, and also a third of the night.
13As I watched, I heard an eagle that was flying in midair call out in a loud voice: “Woe! Woe! Woe to the inhabitants of the earth, because of the trumpet blasts about to be sounded by the other three angels!”* As you see, it is a very striaght and clear order. It says, a 3rd of ships in the ocean Destroyed, a 3rd of sea creatures dead. If that was the only sighn before the beasts come. Then that would be enough to proove it. But there is so many more sighns than that. Yes it is extreamly obvious!!
*and more sighns come.
Revelation 9
1The fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from the sky to the earth. The star was given the key to the shaft of the Abyss. 2When he opened the Abyss, smoke rose from it like the smoke from a gigantic furnace. The sun and sky were darkened by the smoke from the Abyss. 3And out of the smoke locusts came down upon the earth and were given power like that of scorpions of the earth. 4They were told not to harm the grass of the earth or any plant or tree, but only those people who did not have the seal of God on their foreheads. 5They were not given power to kill them, but only to torture them for five months. And the agony they suffered was like that of the sting of a scorpion when it strikes a man. 6During those days men will seek death, but will not find it; they will long to die, but death will elude them.
7The locusts looked like horses prepared for battle. On their heads they wore something like crowns of gold, and their faces resembled human faces. 8Their hair was like women's hair, and their teeth were like lions' teeth. 9They had breastplates like breastplates of iron, and the sound of their wings was like the thundering of many horses and chariots rushing into battle. 10They had tails and stings like scorpions, and in their tails they had power to torment people for five months. 11They had as king over them the angel of the Abyss, whose name in Hebrew is Abaddon, and
in Greek, Apollyon.[1]
12The first woe is past; two other woes are yet to come.
13The sixth angel sounded his trumpet, and I heard a voice coming from the horns[2] of the golden altar that is before God. 14It said to the sixth angel who had the trumpet, “Release the four angels who are bound at the great river Euphrates.” 15And the four angels who had been kept ready for this very hour and day and month and year were released to kill a third of mankind. 16The number of the mounted troops was two hundred million. I heard their number.
17The horses and riders I saw in my vision looked like this: Their breastplates were fiery red, dark blue, and yellow as sulfur. The heads of the horses resembled the heads of lions, and out of their mouths came fire, smoke and sulfur. 18A third of mankind was killed by the three plagues of fire, smoke and sulfur that came out of their mouths. 19The power of the horses was in their mouths and in their tails; for their tails were like snakes, having heads with which they inflict injury.
20The rest of mankind that were not killed by these plagues still did not repent of the work of their hands; they did not stop worshiping demons, and idols of gold, silver, bronze, stone and wood–idols that cannot see or hear or walk. 21Nor did they repent of their murders, their magic arts, their sexual immorality or their thefts.*It will be so obvious!!! especially when locusts go about and do not care about the grass, and just go for men, and especially leave those who GoD had been marked with a seal, not being touched.
*Rev 9:15 A third of mankind is then Just killed by Angels. a thirds allot, like probs 3 billion ppl, so obvious.
*There's still more.
Revelation 10
1Then I saw another mighty angel coming down from heaven………………
*No events that are sighns in this passage, just a continuation, and things in heaven the vision holder is seeing.
* Now finally , after many things have past. Remember the Abyss from which the locusts came?? Well, thats from where the first beast rises. Notice its the Seventh trumpet, all these events have been in succession. This happens after all else has happened.
Revelation 11
The Two Witnesses
1I was given a reed like a measuring rod and was told, “Go and measure the temple of God and the altar, and count the worshipers there. 2But exclude the outer court; do not measure it, because it has been given to the Gentiles. They will trample on the holy city for 42 months. 3And I will give power to my two witnesses, and they will prophesy for 1,260 days, clothed in sackcloth.” 4These are the two olive trees and the two lampstands that stand before the Lord of the earth. 5If anyone tries to harm them, fire comes from their mouths and devours their enemies. This is how anyone who wants to harm them must die. 6These men have power to shut up the sky so that it will not rain during the time they are prophesying; and they have power to turn the waters into blood and to strike the earth with every kind of plague as often as they want.
7Now when they have finished their testimony, the beast that comes up from the Abyss will attack them, and overpower and kill them. 8Their bodies will lie in the street of the great city, which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt, where also their Lord was crucified. 9For three and a half days men from every people, tribe, language and nation will gaze on their bodies and refuse them burial. 10The inhabitants of the earth will gloat over them and will celebrate by sending each other gifts, because these two prophets had tormented those who live on the earth.
11But after the three and a half days a breath of life from God entered them, and they stood on their feet, and terror struck those who saw them. 12Then they heard a loud voice from heaven saying to them, “Come up here.” And they went up to heaven in a cloud, while their enemies looked on.
13At that very hour there was a severe earthquake and a tenth of the city collapsed. Seven thousand people were killed in the earthquake, and the survivors were terrified and gave glory to the God of heaven.
14The second woe has passed; the third woe is coming soon.The Seventh Trumpet
15The seventh angel sounded his trumpet, and there were loud voices in heaven, which said:
“The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of his Christ,
and he will reign for ever and ever.” 16And the twenty-four elders, who were seated on their thrones before God, fell on their faces and worshiped God, 17saying:
“We give thanks to you, Lord God Almighty,
the One who is and who was,
because you have taken your great power
and have begun to reign.
18The nations were angry; and your wrath has come.
The time has come for judging the dead,
and for rewarding your servants the prophets
and your saints and those who reverence your name,
both small and great–
and for destroying those who destroy the earth.”
19Then God's temple in heaven was opened, and within his temple was seen the ark of his covenant. And there came flashes of lightning, rumblings, peals of thunder, an earthquake and a great hailstorm.* As you see, the prophets prophecy, people who want to harm them devoured by fire, the beast rizes up out of the abyss, then kills them. They raise from the dead, and an earthquake kills 7000 people.
*These events are obvious. Chronological order, explicitly literal in events. The Seven trumpet blasts.
*I could go through the rest, After all this we have the other beasts, then the mark of beast, the beast who is healed , and so on. But as for the immediate purpose of understanding, that the first beast is far off yet.
Hope this is helpfull. l8rz ^^;;
hey ringo,
that's a very comprehensive interpretation – but it is also very literal… it may even be as obvious as you say, but things are rarely obvious when you're in the midst of them – i know this from personal experience: i've been deceived before, and all the while i was able to convince myself that i was serving god!! its only in retrospect that things become obvious.
btw. i didn't say we should be on guard from the beast, but from deception. jesus told us to be careful lest we be deceived… so i think we should.
anyway, relating back to babylon – she can be seen as following in the deceptions of the world (and of subsequently of the beast), and we are told to come out of babylon lest we be caught in her sins. why would we be told this, if it was obvious? surely this is a warning to remain alert – i don't mean in trying to identify the beast, but in avoiding deception.
cheers,
nate.
you should always be on your guard, stay alert, because when you get saved, your not going to be leading a life where there are no troubles or anything. You are going into a life where there is war. It's not always easy, it shouldn't be.
if your playing football, and you don't have the ball, and your stopped watching the cheerleaders or hot guys or somethign, the players arent going to come after you. But if you have the ball and are doing your job, then they ARE and WILL come and try to tackle you and stuff. and you have to be alert and also doing your job…like when your a christian, believer in Christ…Nate you wrote
Quote
i understand your point – its important not to be led astray be rumours or conspiracies. i agree that there's no point saying “this is the beast,” or “over there”, just as we shouldn't say this of jesus… but there's a different between being tossed to and fro, and being watchful – we can't stop the beast, but we can make sure we're not deceived.It is what you said, so.. Anyway if you believe the beast is around before two prophets that kill ppl with fire, are killed by a beast. Then that person is decieved. It is a long drawn out process.
As for anti-christs. It says anyone who does not believe Jesus is the Christ, is an anti-christ. It has been a hollywood conception that there is only one or two antichrists. Or maybe something Satan triies to make ppl believe. I remember when I thought I would grow horns, that i was the antichrist. but no, anyone who does not believe is an antichrist.
hey t8,
how are you coming along with that babylon essay?
ringo,
this is getting pretty old, but i only just read your post, so… i re-iterate that i did not say to be on guard from the beast, but from deception. as you have said, my exact words were, “we can't stop the beast, but we can make sure we're not deceived.” and deception comes in many forms. i also re-iterate that we need to be watchful… because deception comes in many forms. see how easy it is for you to twist my words to mean what you want them to mean? people do the same with the bible, with news and events, with history. so i re-iterate deception comes in many forms. i'm sorry for repeating myself so often, but i want you to understand what i'm saying. the beast is just one of those forms which deception takes – many will follow the beast, and bow down to the image of the beast, even christians… why? because, while they may have been on guard against the “beast”, they were not on guard against “deception”. i hope i've made myself clear – i don't want you to misunderstand me.
cheers,
nate.
Nate
Quote
this is getting pretty old, but i only just read your post, so… i re-iterate that i did not say to be on guard from the beast, but from deception. as you have said, my exact words were, “we can't stop the beast, but we can make sure we're not deceived.” and deception comes in many forms. i also re-iterate that we need to be watchful… because deception comes in many forms. see how easy it is for you to twist my words to mean what you want them to mean? people do the same with the bible, with news and events, with history. so i re-iterate deception comes in many forms. i'm sorry for repeating myself so often, but i want you to understand what i'm saying. the beast is just one of those forms which deception takes – many will follow the beast, and bow down to the image of the beast, even christians… why? because, while they may have been on guard against the “beast”, they were not on guard against “deception”. i hope i've made myself clear – i don't want you to misunderstand me.Say what you mean. I did not read into or expound, It was your own very words. Use the language correctly. It is good to say, No, I didnt mean it like that. What i meant to say was this. Which you have done. But then you try and say that I was reading into it what i wanted??? It would seem to me, as i want people to know the truth, that if i was reading things to say what i wanted them to say, then… I would have read it to agree with my own views. But as it happens, I did not. You should be more carefull what you say, and not try and blame others for your own mistakes.
Deception is a lie, satan has been liing from the beggining, and not Deception being in the form of anyone and anything.
Now i want you to clarify here….Quote
i did not say to be on guard from the beast, but from deception.
but we can make sure we're not deceived.” and deception comes in many forms.
the beast is just one of those forms which deception takes –
they were not on guard against “deception”.Do you mean that Deception is a being or entity or some kind of force outside Other beings?? For as it clearly states, It is a beings act that is called deception. And not that deception takes the form of Satan!! and Deception becomes the form of the Beast!!
For if i were an onlooker, that wanted to warp sober thinking, like satan does, It could be derrived from you useing the phrase of this likeness 'Deception comes in many forms' may give air to another deception. Like people thinking that there is a force called deception, and anyone that does what is evil, is not really a person, but they are the force known as deception, who has taken theyre likeness. And so on.
Fully, im not triing to crush you, Im just like.. seeing stuff, and telling you.So peace out bro ^-^ Please mean what you say, take more carefull attention ^_^
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
