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Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2011,17:22)
What about him being “our blood relative redeemer”?
I'm sorry, I didn't consider you to be serious about that translation you posted, and that's why I didn't respond.
Could you tell me which Bible you quoted?Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2011,17:22)
You say Jesus is not a human so who has put their foot in their mouth? How can Jesus be your brother if he is not human?
I see, God Himself can be our brother, but Jesus can't if he's not a human being anymore?
The hope is that we will some day be LIKE Jesus now is. The hope is NOT that Jesus is still a human being like we are. We hope to be given new glorious bodies like Jesus has now, and become like he is. That is why he will THEN be the firstborn of many brothers, and God will be the adoptive Father to many sons.Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 26 2011,17:22)
God can come in the likeness of sinful flesh if he wants and of course he has.
No man has seen God AT ANY TIME. (John 1:18) Keith, where do you even get this stuff? Not from scriptures, that's for sure. Do you really think mere mortal men could torture and kill our very own God who created us? Do you think God could take sin upon Himself and DIE?Man, you guys are really out there.
Now…………WHERE'S THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS WE CAN BE BROTHERS OF GOD?
mike
Can God give you a high five like a brother?
God is an eternal spirit. Come on, there is no sense in pretending that God is a man or is contained solely in some kind of finite space like a body.
If anyone thinks that they can see an infinite God as he is, then surely you would have to be eternal yourself to see him for a start and secondly, you would have to see outside the universe too.`
God is not and will never be your brother.
He is the Father.
Quote (t8 @ Mar. 28 2011,05:11) Can God give you a high five like a brother?
An infinite God can do whatever he wants!WJ
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2011,22:19) Now…………WHERE'S THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS WE CAN BE BROTHERS OF GOD?
Define what a brother is Mike!Where is the scripture that says someone can be our brother who is not human?
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 29 2011,07:38) Quote (t8 @ Mar. 28 2011,05:11) Can God give you a high five like a brother?
An infinite God can do whatever he wants!WJ
God CANNOT lie.God is not a man.
God is invisible.
So any god that can high five you cannot be the invisible God of whom Jesus is the visible image of.
Any God that is a man cannot be the true God.
So yes he can do what he wants. But because he doesn't lie, then we can assume that if he says that he is without limit and is not a man, then we should believe that.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2011,14:40) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2011,22:19) Now…………WHERE'S THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS WE CAN BE BROTHERS OF GOD?
Define what a brother is Mike!Where is the scripture that says someone can be our brother who is not human?
WJ
I would say two of the same Father. Now if we can be adopted SONS of God, then how can we also be BROTHERS of Him?But forget my “definition” of brother, for that is a diversion to not answer my question.
Show me the scripture that supports your own words that you are a brother of God.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 28 2011,20:30) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2011,14:40) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2011,22:19) Now…………WHERE'S THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS WE CAN BE BROTHERS OF GOD?
Define what a brother is Mike!Where is the scripture that says someone can be our brother who is not human?
WJ
I would say two of the same Father. Now if we can be adopted SONS of God, then how can we also be BROTHERS of Him?But forget my “definition” of brother, for that is a diversion to not answer my question.
Show me the scripture that supports your own words that you are a brother of God.
mike
I don't have any!But neither do you have a scripture that says men are brothers to any creature but humans do you?
WJ
Quote (t8 @ Mar. 28 2011,19:46) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 29 2011,07:38) Quote (t8 @ Mar. 28 2011,05:11) Can God give you a high five like a brother?
An infinite God can do whatever he wants!WJ
God CANNOT lie.God is not a man.
God is invisible.
So any god that can high five you cannot be the invisible God of whom Jesus is the visible image of.
Any God that is a man cannot be the true God.
So yes he can do what he wants. But because he doesn't lie, then we can assume that if he says that he is without limit and is not a man, then we should believe that.
t8You are right, God cannot lie and the scriptures tell us that the “Word who was God” came in the likeness of sinful flesh.
He is Emmanuel which means he is God with us, but you keep saying he is not God with us.
You think God cannot be seen, isn't that right?
WJ
Worshipping Jesus,
You wrote to T8:
Quote t8
You are right, God cannot lie and the scriptures tell us that the “Word who was God” came in the likeness of sinful flesh.
He is Emmanuel which means he is God with us, but you keep saying he is not God with us.
You think God cannot be seen, isn't that right?
WJ
God does not speak untruths but your understanding of his words can certainly be untrue.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 30 2011,11:43) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 28 2011,20:30) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2011,14:40) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2011,22:19) Now…………WHERE'S THE SCRIPTURE THAT SAYS WE CAN BE BROTHERS OF GOD?
Define what a brother is Mike!Where is the scripture that says someone can be our brother who is not human?
WJ
I would say two of the same Father. Now if we can be adopted SONS of God, then how can we also be BROTHERS of Him?But forget my “definition” of brother, for that is a diversion to not answer my question.
Show me the scripture that supports your own words that you are a brother of God.
mike
I don't have any!But neither do you have a scripture that says men are brothers to any creature but humans do you?
WJ
WJJn 1:12 Yet to all who received him, to those who believed in his name, he gave the right to become children of God—
Jn 1:13 children born not of natural descent, nor of human decision or a husband’s will, but born of God.Heb 2:12 He says,
“I will declare your name to my brothers;
in the presence of the congregation I will sing your praises.”
Heb 2:17 For this reason he had to be made like his brothers in every way, in order that he might become a merciful and faithful high priest in service to God, and that he might make atonement for the sins of the people.Heb 3:1 Therefore, holy brothers, who share in the heavenly calling, fix your thoughts on Jesus, the apostle and high priest whom we confess.
Mt 12:48 He replied to him, “Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?”
Mt 12:49 Pointing to his disciples, he said, “Here are my mother and my brothers.those are some to look at.
what are chidren ? are they not sons and daugthersPierre
Good post, Pierre.
10 In bringing many sons and daughters to glory, it was fitting that God, for whom and through whom everything exists, should make the pioneer of their salvation perfect through what he suffered. 11 Both the one who makes people holy and those who are made holy are of the same family. So Jesus is not ashamed to call them brothers and sisters.
We will be “of the same family”, but as SONS to God and BROTHERS to Jesus.
I think if there aren't any scriptures claiming that we will be brothers to God, but there are scriptures claiming we are brothers to Jesus and sons to God, and joint heirs of God along with our brother Jesus, then two things are evident:
1. Keith has misspoken by claiming he is a brother to God.
2. Jesus cannot possibly be God.Keith, thank you for your honest and direct reply. This thread has served its purpose. As for your question, I believe Pierre has answered it with scriptures. All you need to do is add to his scriptures, the scriptures that clearly teach us Jesus is not a human anymore.
Your friend Jack will be happy to help you along with this scriptural truth. I will too, if you need me to.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 31 2011,21:06) Good post, Pierre. 10 In bringing many sons and daughters to glory, it was fitting that God, for whom and through whom everything exists, should make the pioneer of their salvation perfect through what he suffered. 11 Both the one who makes people holy and those who are made holy are of the same family. So Jesus is not ashamed to call them brothers and sisters.
We will be “of the same family”, but as SONS to God and BROTHERS to Jesus.
I think if there aren't any scriptures claiming that we will be brothers to God, but there are scriptures claiming we are brothers to Jesus and sons to God, and joint heirs of God along with our brother Jesus, then two things are evident:
1. Keith has misspoken by claiming he is a brother to God.
2. Jesus cannot possibly be God.Keith, thank you for your honest and direct reply. This thread has served its purpose. As for your question, I believe Pierre has answered it with scriptures. All you need to do is add to his scriptures, the scriptures that clearly teach us Jesus is not a human anymore.
Your friend Jack will be happy to help you along with this scriptural truth. I will too, if you need me to.
mike
Mike Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 30 2011,00:27) Worshipping Jesus, You wrote to T8:
Quote t8
You are right, God cannot lie and the scriptures tell us that the “Word who was God” came in the likeness of sinful flesh.
He is Emmanuel which means he is God with us, but you keep saying he is not God with us.
You think God cannot be seen, isn't that right?
WJ
God does not speak untruths but your understanding of his words can certainly be untrue.
KerwinMy understanding of the words are true.
Hebrew names were given to portray the nature of the one who bore it.
Emmanuel is a Divine name given supernaturally to Jesus by an “Angel of God”.
The message from the Angel to us is Jesus is “God with us” in nature and in name.
WJ
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 30 2011,22:06) Keith, thank you for your honest and direct reply. This thread has served its purpose. As for your question, I believe Pierre has answered it with scriptures. All you need to do is add to his scriptures, the scriptures that clearly teach us Jesus is not a human anymore.
MikeNo, the scriptures Peirre quoted are all speaking of human beings who were sons and daughters.
“Is there a scripture anywhere that says Jesus is no longer a man or human?”
“How can Jesus still be the High Priest if he is not a man?”
For “EVERY HIGH PRIEST IS TAKEN FROM AMONG THE PEOPLE” and appointed to represent them before God, to offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins. Heb 1:5 NET
The Net says…
from among men,” but since the point in context is shared humanity (rather than shared maleness), the plural Greek term ἀνθρώπων (anqrwpwn) has been translated “people.”
For one to be able to minister priestly duties he had to be human. The scriptures also say he is the Priest after the order of Melchisedec the King of Salem and we know he was human.
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ April 01 2011,05:58) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 30 2011,22:06) Keith, thank you for your honest and direct reply. This thread has served its purpose. As for your question, I believe Pierre has answered it with scriptures. All you need to do is add to his scriptures, the scriptures that clearly teach us Jesus is not a human anymore.
MikeNo, the scriptures Peirre quoted are all speaking of human beings who were sons and daughters.
“Is there a scripture anywhere that says Jesus is no longer a man or human?”
“How can Jesus still be the High Priest if he is not a man?”
For “EVERY HIGH PRIEST IS TAKEN FROM AMONG THE PEOPLE” and appointed to represent them before God, to offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins. Heb 1:5 NET
The Net says…
from among men,” but since the point in context is shared humanity (rather than shared maleness), the plural Greek term ἀνθρώπων (anqrwpwn) has been translated “people.”
For one to be able to minister priestly duties he had to be human. The scriptures also say he is the Priest after the order of Melchisedec the King of Salem and we know he was human.
WJ
Keith,Mike thinks that a glorfied man is not still a man. But Paul said that we will bare the image of the second MAN (1 Corinthians 15.)
Mike's beliefs are so anti-christian and anti-God that I hate to see what God has in store for him.
Jack
Jack
Correct! Jesus could not still be the Jesus that hung on the cross because that Jesus was human and it is through the cross that the Gospel is preached. Paul even said he was determined to “only” preach Jesus Christ and him crucified.
Not to mention the Throne of David was to belong to one of his sons after the flesh. If Jesus no longer has the flesh of David (Glorified body) then he could not fulfill the everlasting Prophesy for the line would be broken if Jesus is no longer human.
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 31 2011,12:58) “Is there a scripture anywhere that says Jesus is no longer a man or human?”
Yes, many. But this should suffice:11 I want you to know, brothers and sisters, that the gospel I preached is not of human origin. 12 I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.
How's that? It covers both your word “human” AND your word “man”.
mike
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 31 2011,12:58) “How can Jesus still be the High Priest if he is not a man?” For “EVERY HIGH PRIEST IS TAKEN FROM AMONG THE PEOPLE” and appointed to represent them before God, to offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins.
Well, Jesus WAS taken from among men and made High Priest. He's not a man anymore, as the scripture I just posted above proves.But why not just cut to the chase? If you are so insistent that Jesus is a man, then you are claiming first that flesh and blood CAN inherit the Kingdom of God, and secondly, that our God Almighty is a MAN.
Sonny, you are sure one confused puppy.
mike
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 03 2011,19:25) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 31 2011,12:58) “Is there a scripture anywhere that says Jesus is no longer a man or human?”
Yes, many. But this should suffice:11 I want you to know, brothers and sisters, that the gospel I preached is not of human origin. 12 I did not receive it from any man, nor was I taught it; rather, I received it by revelation from Jesus Christ.
How's that? It covers both your word “human” AND your word “man”.
mike
Sorry that scripture doesn't say what you imply.That scripture only proves that Paul sees Jesus as God and that the Revelation came from God and not man.
His confession is God gave him the revelation and not man and we no it is Jesus that he is talking about who is the God he received it from.
That is ambiguous at best for you Mike.
Try again by giving us a scripture that says Jesus is some other creature and not a man.
If Jesus is not a man then he cannot be our “mediator”.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, “the man Christ Jesus; Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time. 1 Tim 2:5, 6
Also if he is an “angel” and not a man as you claim, then he cannot still be the Son of Man.
And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto “the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. Rev 14:4
What John saw was not an angel but what looked like the Son of man. Jesus is still the Son of man meaning he is still man.
If he is not a man but is now an angel then how are we still his brothers?
These all continued with one accord in prayer and supplication, with the women, and Mary the mother of Jesus, and “with his brethren“. Acts 1:14
Here we see the writer of Acts (believed to be Luke the Physician that wrote the Gospel of Luke) calling Jesus follower his “brethren” after the resurrection where you claim he is no longer a man but an angel.
For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren. Rom 8:29
We are being transformed into his image which means we are being changed into the image of God.
Jesus is that image. If we are being made into the image of God and Jesus is an angel then the image of God is the image of an angel.
Mike…
Is God's “image” the “image of an angel”?
WJ
Quote (mikeboll64 @ April 04 2011,11:33) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 31 2011,12:58) “How can Jesus still be the High Priest if he is not a man?” For “EVERY HIGH PRIEST IS TAKEN FROM AMONG THE PEOPLE” and appointed to represent them before God, to offer both gifts and sacrifices for sins.
Well, Jesus WAS taken from among men and made High Priest. He's not a man anymore, as the scripture I just posted above proves.But why not just cut to the chase? If you are so insistent that Jesus is a man, then you are claiming first that flesh and blood CAN inherit the Kingdom of God, and secondly, that our God Almighty is a MAN.
Sonny, you are sure one confused puppy.
mike
The scriptures you give imply nothing of the sort. Paul said that we will bear the image of the heavenly MAN (1 Cor. 15). Jesus is not man as we know man to be now but He is still MAN only of a higher order.
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