Answering jodi lee's nonsense

[Is 1:18]

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 09 2010,15:37)

Hi Paul and Kathi, I've been so busy with the prototokos thread that Paul is afraid to step foot on that I forgot I left you both hanging.  I'll try to answer tomorrow.   peace and love, mike

Huh? I didn't realise I had an obligation to follow you around the threads answering your inane and ill-conceived questions. I thought KJ, WJ and LU answered you pretty well, what do you want from me exactly?

I've been waiting for you to prove to me that the El Shaddai references in Genesis speak exclusively of the Father of Yeshua. Where are you at with that?

[KangarooJack]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ June 09 2010,16:36)

Quote (mikeboll64 @ June 09 2010,15:37) Hi Paul and Kathi, I've been so busy with the prototokos thread that Paul is afraid to step foot on that I forgot I left you both hanging.  I'll try to answer tomorrow.   peace and love, mike Huh? I didn't realise I had an obligation to follow you around the threads answering your inane and ill-conceived questions. I thought KJ, WJ and LU answered you pretty well, what do you want from me exactly? I've been waiting for you to prove to me that the El Shaddai references in Genesis speak exclusively of the Father of Yeshua. Where are you at with that?

Paul,

In our debate I asked Mike if he ever takes a break from here. He indicated that for him it is this board or TV. He thinks that the rest of us are idle as well.

Jack

[NickHassan]

Hi Is 1.18,
Do you not know the Almighty and His son?

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2010,00:16)

Hi LU, No Jesus told the Jews THE FATHER was the one they called God[Jn8.54] Was he mistaken or are you?

Nick,
And it was the Father that made His Son both Christ and Jehovah. The Father gave His Son His own name.

Jehovah is Lord! Zech 2

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Where does scripture say Jesus was made his own Father?
The lordship of Jesus began at his anointing by his Lord and God.

[Lightenup]

Nick,
Since when does a son become the father just because the father gives the son his (the father's) name? You question shows that you do not get the idea of two relatives with the same name. Jesus was called Jehovah in the OT long before he was made flesh and baptized. Zech 2

Jehovah is Lord!

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Jesus is Yashua.

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Yes God visited his people in His Son.
But the treasure within was greater than the vessel.

[mikeboll64]

Quote (Is 1:18 @ June 09 2010,16:36)

Huh? I didn't realise I had an obligation to follow you around the threads answering your inane and ill-conceived questions. I thought KJ, WJ and LU answered you pretty well, what do you want from me exactly?

Hi Paul,

I thought you'd never ask!  What I want from you is:  1.  Read

We believe in One God, the Father Almighty, the Maker of all things visible and invisible. And in One Lord Jesus Christ, the Word of God, God from God, Light from Light, Life from Life, Son Only-begotten, first-born of every creature, before all the ages, begotten from the Father,

2.  Answer

Considering the “before all the ages”, do you think that this man who was considered to be “the greatest Greek teacher and most learned theologian” of his day thought “prototokos pasa ktisis” meant (a)”preeminent over mankind” or (b) “firstborn of every creature”?

Considering the use of “genao”, do you think this same man thought “monogenes” meant (a)”unique” or (b) “only begotten”?

Thanks in advance for your HONEST answers.  

You said:

Quote

I've been waiting for you to prove to me that the El Shaddai references in Genesis speak exclusively of the Father of Yeshua. Where are you at with that?

I think it would be an exercise in futility.  You want to say that some of the mentions are of the Son.  I could make the same non-supported claims that some were the pre-flesh Apostle Paul.  Or Melchizadek.  Or Mary the Magdalene.  It's a stupid game, and I don't want to play it.  

There is no basis in scripture at all to assume that Jesus, who was begotten by the Almighty, and the beginning of the creation of the Almighty, and who still is a servant of the Almighty and calls the Amighty our God and his God, the only true God, and in Rev calls the Almighty “my God” could actually BE the Almighty.  

It would be like me asking you to PROVE that every time Jesus is mentioned in the Gospels, it was really him mentioned.

If you want to play this stupid game that will prove nothing for either side, you start.  You show me the “Almighty” that refers to the Son, and I'll see if I agree there is ample scriptural evidence to support that claim.

On the other hand, you have personally claimed to me that “prototokos pasa ktisis” and “monogenes” had nothing to do with the beginning of the Son.  So I feel you are obligated to comment on the Eusebius letter.  And please don't stray or cloud up the issue like those who you think “answered me pretty well” but who, in reality have yet to even answer the questions.  Please just answer the questions based on the letter he wrote.

peace and love,
mike

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Jesus is the Christ the Son of the living God.
His own life comes from His God
The Lord is the Spirit

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
There are many gods and many Lords,
But for us there is one God the Father… and one Lord Jesus Christ.

Does it get any simpler?
Do we need sleuths sniffing around for possible confusing verses?

[Lightenup]

Hi Nick,
I'm not confused…many aren't. There is a reason that you are confused. Truth sets you free. Truth makes it simpler.

Gen 1:26 Let US make man in OUR image.

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
God was not alone.
Who was God speaking with?

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Confusion, by definition, is not disagreement with you that there are two Gods.
My God is not a God of such confusion but of peace.

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2010,22:33)

Hi LU, God was not alone. Who was God speaking with?

Nick,
Exactly, God was not alone…the only unbegotten God was speaking to the only begotten God. See how it all comes back to the start, the foundation.

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2010,22:37)

Hi LU, Confusion, by definition, is not disagreement with you that there are two Gods. My God is not a God of such confusion but of peace.

Nick,
And the God of peace wants to lead you into that peace and out of your confusion. Follow Him.

[mikeboll64]

Hi Kathi,

I have seen how the spirit works through you, I think.  I have had the priviledge of watching you school WJ and Roo in the prototokos thread.  Your arguments are clear and concise and scripturally founded.  I truly believe you are being guided.

Then I come back to this thread and notice that your arguments are silly, nonsensical, and unscriptural.  If you are being guided here, it is not by the same spirit that guides you in the other thread, IMO.

You said:

Quote

Yes, the Father can't save His children without Jesus.

Are you for real?  So God Almighty for whom nothing is impossible couldn't have begat a daughter instead of a son?  He couldn't have begat 4 children and let them all play their roles in the saving of mankind?  You are limiting God to HAVING NO CHOICE but to beget a Son to save the world?  Jesus is the one THROUGH WHOM the Father saved us BECAUSE it was His will to do it that way.  How can you even keep a straight face when you say the Father “can't save His children without Jesus”?

You said:

Quote

The Father alone is not our one true saving God. The Son alone is not our one true saving God. They must be united together to be our saving Godhead.

Is that scriptural?  Jesus says the Father is our only true God.  Paul says we have but one God, the Father.  Kathi says we have but one God, the Father/Son Godhead.     And you didn't spell this part out….Is this Godhead ONE being, or two?  Is Jesus a separate being, or part of the same being as the Father?

You said:

Quote

Do you want to tell us why the name “Jehovah our Righteousness” is given to the Son and the city?

Ummm….because Jerusalem is Jehovah the third?  You tell me how the same phrase that means Jesus has the name Jehovah is also applied to a city.

You said:

Quote

Don't add 'is' to that name because there is no verb in the Hebrew there…otherwise show me the Hebrew word for 'is.'

Online Bible Study Tools translates it the same as the NWT and many other translations.  I don't know how the Hebrew works.  Either way, the same term is used for a city, and there is NO example in the whole Bible where a son has the same name as his father.

You said:

Quote

Like I said, the Father alone is not the only true saving God is He even though He is the only true God?  He and His Son are together the only true saving God.  If He presents Himself and His Son as ONE then I can refer to them as one also.

And like I said, Jesus is the one THROUGH WHOM Jehovah saved us because that's the way He chose to do it. He could have saved us by means of a watermelon if He wanted to. Jesus says, “all things are possible for you” and “nothing is impossible for the Father”.  

I hope you are consistent and worship Cyrus too, for you admit he was “the outstretched arm” of Jehovah, also.  And I hope you'll be okay with worshipping me, for I too will be one with God and His Son.

Nothing but silliness and nonsense that violates direct commandments from THE ONLY TRUE GOD.  

I'm done with this “Jehovah the Son” stuff. It is getting so far from scripture that you are inventing things. No offense, but it is a waste of my time.

peace and love,
mike

[NickHassan]

Hi LU,
Really?

Were the sons of God present when the foundations of earth were being laid?[Jb38]
Did they create together or does the Spirit of God create?[Ps104]

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2010,22:13)

Hi LU, Jesus is the Christ the Son of the living God. His own life comes from His God The Lord is the Spirit

Nick,
Their unity as your head is pertinent to your salvation. One without the other does not allow for your salvation.

Jehovah of hosts and Jehovah Our Righteousness together save those who believe and follow them.

[Lightenup]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 09 2010,23:09)

Hi LU, Really? Were the sons of God present when the foundations of earth were being laid?[Jb38] Did they create together or does the Spirit of God create?[Ps104]

Nick,
The angels were only witnesses to the creation, they did not create. Another thing you are confused about.

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