- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,17:14) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 27 2010,08:52) Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,15:51) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 27 2010,06:28) princess wrote:Triads are not calling him Emanuel, they call him just god. This statement is profound throughout triad's post.
The interpretation is “God with us”. I do not hear anti-trinitarians say Jesus is “God with us” or Emmanuel!The Prophets and Apostles called him God and so do we.
Try again.
WJ
What is meant by try again?You proclaim that you have the truth (ie. triad worship, god in human form) so your jesus god is within you, which by your preachings in turn brings your god amoung us.
Not very hard to understand now is it.
POKNo I proclaim what the scriptures say, and not pick and choose.
Behold, a virgin shall be with child, and shall bring forth a son, and they shall call his name “Emmanuel, which being interpreted is, God with us. Matt 1:23
while we wait for the blessed hope–the glorious appearing of “our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ“, Tit 2:13
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that “Jesus Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?“ 2 Cor 13:5
So whatever you think that means it is not God with a little “G”!
WJ
Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,17:14)
Mar 12:32 And the scribe said to him, `Well, Teacher, in truth thou hast spoken that there is one God, and there is none other but HeTeacher then you cannot be, yes?
No! Is this a riddle?Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,17:14)
1Co 8:4 Concerning the eating then of the things sacrificed to idols, we have known that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is no other God except one; for even if there are those called gods, whether in heaven, whether upon earth–as there are gods many and lords many– yet to us is one God, the Father, of whom are the all things, and we to Him; and one Lord, Christ, through whom are the all things, and we through Him;Scripture tells me that others will believe in so called gods (little g used, by the most noted scholars)
Exactly, little “g” meaning so-called gods and not gods at all. Yet the majority of noted scholars in reference to Jesus used the big “G”.Now as far as your quote above, its says there is only “One Lord” so if Paul is saying that God the Father is exclusively God here, then it must be that God the Father is not “Lord”.
Be consistent, Paul uses the term God the Father mostly because he did not know the exact pronunciation of the Fathers name, except what is given us the one name whereby we must be saved. Matt 28:19 – Acts 4:12
This same Paul also said…
while we wait for the blessed hope–the glorious appearing of “our great God and Savior, Jesus Christ”, Tit 2:13
And…
For certain men whose condemnation was written about* long ago have secretly slipped in among you. They are godless men, who change the grace of our God into a license for immorality “and deny Jesus Christ our only Sovereign and Lord”. Though you already know all this, I want to remind you that “the Lord (same Lord in the previous verse) delivered his people out of Egypt, but later destroyed those who did not believe”. Jude 1:4, 5
Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,17:14)
Fire and brimstone teachings WJ…
Nope not fire and brimstone here!Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,17:14)
..been through it very young
Yep 36 years for me but never have denied my Jesus for another one!Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,17:14) ..over it, degrading comments by using scripture, done it myself, try a little harder there WJ.
So now you degrade without using scripture?Blessings WJ
Quote My point in the “mockery” was to show you that you have no good and reasonable explanation as to why Moses chose the plural “Elohim” instead of the singular “Eloah” in referencing God. No Thinker, your point was to mock, this was established quickly, so your mockery overrides your teachings. Sorry.
Quote Do you believe in verbal inspiration? This means that every word was inspired by God. Moses was inspired by God to write “Elohim”(plural) and not “Eloah” (singular). Thinker, you know all to well, I do not believe your catholic canonized scripture is purely inspired by his divine. Man's minds and hands have been giving their own for some time now. This is an established fact.
You are going to have to go past Pauline Christianity with me Thinker, I don't accept it. Some are gullible enough though to stand fast on this teaching. Do you not think?
I agree with you in regards to triad worship, this will not go away, it has been around for a long time, ancient even.
Give me the scraps of the dogs first before I would bow down to your man god. No way, My divine is a jealous one, no others before him.
Is your god a jealous one, does he share you with others?
Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 27 2010,10:23) Thinker, If you would like start a thread on Etymology, for origins of Words and their meanings, I would encourage this. The discussion that are held with you always come down to triad teachings, which I have no use for, personally I get bored with it quickly.
Anything else you have been studing other than the triad that may be of some interest?
pok,You are the one who denies Moses' use of “Elohim.” So you may start a thread on etymology.
thinker
Quote Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 26 2010,17:14) Mar 12:32 And the scribe said to him, `Well, Teacher, in truth thou hast spoken that there is one God, and there is none other but He
Teacher then you cannot be, yes?
Quote
WJ responseNo! Is this a riddle?
No WJ, your scholars must have skipped eastern thought and language. Basic 101.
Quote Exactly, little “g” meaning so-called gods and not gods at all. Yet the majority of noted scholars in reference to Jesus used the big “G”. These scholars that you speak of, I can tell you for certain they are trinity based scholars.
You know WJ, when things just start getting a little shaky, you have to find the rock to stand on and then once established place the cornerstone and then continue to build, took me a while to get to the point
Luk 10:21 In that hour Christ glad in the Spirit, and said, `I do confess to thee, Father, Lord of the heaven and of the earth, that Thou didst hide these things from wise men and understanding, and didst reveal them to babes; yes, Father, because so it became good pleasure before Thee.
WJ, if you are going to play with the big boys, learn to handle your own.
So should we expect saint hood soon?
WorshippingJesus said to pok:
Quote Be consistent, Paul uses the term God the Father mostly because he did not know the exact pronunciation of the Fathers name, except what is given us the one name whereby we must be saved. Matt 28:19 – Acts 4:12
Keith,I find this a very interesting point. I have heard this before and I am going to investigate it.
Jack
pok said:
Quote No Thinker, your point was to mock, this was established quickly, so your mockery overrides your teachings. Sorry.
pok,Yeah I know. You are the “intent of the heart” police. You have busted me before. Take the beam out why don't you?
pok:
Quote Thinker, you know all to well, I do not believe your catholic canonized scripture is purely inspired by his divine. Man's minds and hands have been giving their own for some time now. This is an established fact.
Then you cannot prove your beliefs. If it is an “established fact” that the scriptures have been tampered with, then those which you think deny the divinity of Jesus may also have been tampered with.So you should just trash the scriptures and live like the devil.
pok:
Quote You are going to have to go past Pauline Christianity with me Thinker, I don't accept it. Some are gullible enough though to stand fast on this teaching. Do you not think?
I haven't mentioned the teachings of Paul. I was commenting on Moses' use of the plural name “Elohim” in the shema. Are you saying that Paul did indeed teach that Jesus was divine?thinker
Quote (thethinker @ Mar. 27 2010,14:41) pok said: Quote No Thinker, your point was to mock, this was established quickly, so your mockery overrides your teachings. Sorry.
pok,Yeah I know. You are the “intent of the heart” police. You have busted me before. Take the beam out why don't you?
pok:
Quote Thinker, you know all to well, I do not believe your catholic canonized scripture is purely inspired by his divine. Man's minds and hands have been giving their own for some time now. This is an established fact.
Then you cannot prove your beliefs. If it is an “established fact” that the scriptures have been tampered with, then those which you think deny the divinity of Jesus may also have been tampered with.So you should just trash the scriptures and live like the devil.
pok:
Quote You are going to have to go past Pauline Christianity with me Thinker, I don't accept it. Some are gullible enough though to stand fast on this teaching. Do you not think?
I haven't mentioned the teachings of Paul. I was commenting on Moses' use of the plural name “Elohim” in the shema. Are you saying that Paul did indeed teach that Jesus was divine?thinker
Thinker,You hold onto things for way too long.
Which in turn do not answer many questions brought forth, is your god a jealous one, or does he share you with other gods?
Quote (thethinker @ Mar. 27 2010,14:32) WorshippingJesus said to pok: Quote Be consistent, Paul uses the term God the Father mostly because he did not know the exact pronunciation of the Fathers name, except what is given us the one name whereby we must be saved. Matt 28:19 – Acts 4:12
Keith,I find this a very interesting point. I have heard this before and I am going to investigate it.
Jack
Hi Thinker and WJ,This is Atheistic logic (which WJ implements as a habit) at work once again?
How can 'anybody' (including Shaw-ooľ) know more than WJ? (Acts 22:3)Witnessing to the world in behalf of… (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgThinker,
There are at times I miss our Jewish friends.
Shema Yisrael
The first paragraph of the Shema seen in a Torah scroll The first, pivotal, words of the Shema are (keep in mind Hebrew is read from right to left):
שְׁמַע יִשְׂרָאֵל יְהוָה אֱלֹהֵינוּ יְהוָה אֶחָד – Shema Yisra'el YHWH Eloheinu YHWH Echad
Rabbinic Judaism teaches that the Tetragrammaton (י-ה-ו-ה), YHWH, is the ineffable name of God, and as such is not read aloud in the Shema but is traditionally replaced with אדני, Adonai (“Lord”). For this reason, the Shema is recited aloud as:
Shema Yisrael Adonai Eloheinu Adonai Echad – Hear, O Israel: the Lord is our God, the Lord is One
The literal word meanings are roughly as follows:Shema — listen, or hear & do (according to the Targum, accept)
Yisrael — Israel, in the sense of the people or congregation of Israel
Adonai — often translated as “Lord”, it is read in place of YHWH
Eloheinu — our God, the word “El” or “Eloh” signifying God (see also: Elohim), and the plural possessive determiner suffix “-nu” or “-enu” signifying “our”
Echad — the Hebrew word for the number 1, which has the dual meaning “one” and “alone”.
The connective “is” is implied rather than stated as it would be in modern English.
(wiki)Now, what were you saying about the plural of Elohim.
Quote (Ed J @ Mar. 27 2010,03:10) Quote (thethinker @ Mar. 27 2010,14:32) WorshippingJesus said to pok: Quote Be consistent, Paul uses the term God the Father mostly because he did not know the exact pronunciation of the Fathers name, except what is given us the one name whereby we must be saved. Matt 28:19 – Acts 4:12
Keith,I find this a very interesting point. I have heard this before and I am going to investigate it.
Jack
Hi Thinker and WJ,This is Atheistic logic (which WJ implements as a habit) at work once again?
How can 'anybody' (including Shaw-ooľ) know more than WJ? (Acts 22:3)Witnessing to the world in behalf of… (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EdEveryone is entitled to an opinion. Has it come down to just throwing stones for you now?
WJ
POK
Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 27 2010,09:20) Rabbinic Judaism teaches that the Tetragrammaton (י-ה-ו-ה), YHWH, is the ineffable name of God, and as such is not read aloud in the Shema but is traditionally replaced with אדני, Adonai (“Lord”). For this reason, the Shema is recited aloud as:
Watch out you may get a rebuke from Ed Jay for not pronouncing the tetragammation properly!WJ
Quote (thethinker @ Mar. 27 2010,06:21) Quote (princess of the king @ Mar. 27 2010,05:59) Quote (thethinker @ Mar. 27 2010,05:29) Marty said to WJ: Quote Of course, he is not just any man but the Son of the living God, but you said it and the scriptures confirm it, he is a man.
Marty,You speak as if God and man are totally other. Don't forget that man is in the image of God. So for God to become a man is not a problem. He took human form several times in the old testament.
thinker
Thinker, what reasoning can you portray that the divine almighty would need to come to earth?We all are sons and daughters, we are not the begotten, we will not sit at his right, we do have our place within the kingdom.
Portraying(*) the divine as you do, human at times not at other times, is not logically whatsoever. He does not change.
t,
God walked in the garden and communed with Adam and Eve. It says that they heard the “sound” of His walk which means that they were familiar with it and that God had human form.Jacob wrestled with a “man” which he later realized was God. Jacob called the place where he wrestled with God “Peniel” because he had seen God “face to face.”
The anti-trinitarian God is too high and mighty to come down to us. But the God of the scriptures often “stooped down” to be with His people as afather would stoop down to be with his child.
Your God is no earthly good to anyone.
thinker
Hi Thinker,No man has seen God at any time. Do you dispute this?
peace and love,
mikeQuote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 27 2010,06:28) The interpretation is “God with us”. I do not hear anti-trinitarians say Jesus is “God with us” or Emmanuel!
Hi WJ,You act as if Jesus (Jehovah is Salvation) is the only one who had names that referrenced qualities of God. Emmanuel is also correctly translated, “God is with us”. But it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty. Here's some others:
Jehdeiah (possibly, May Jehovah Feel Glad)
Elnathan (God Has Given)
Jeberechiah (Jehovah Blesses)
Jonathan (Jehovah Has Given)
Jehozabad (probably, Jehovah Has Endowed)
Eldad (possibly, God Has Loved)
Abdiel (Servant of God)
Daniel (My Judge Is God)
Jehozadak (probably, Jehovah Pronounces Righteous)
Pelatiah (Jehovah Has Provided Escape)
Abijah (My Father Is Jehovah)
Adonijah (Jehovah Is Lord)So, when you see Emmanuel or “Jehovah is our Righteousness” applied to Jesus, it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty anymore than the above names meant these people were God Almighty.
peace and love,
mikeQuote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2010,11:17) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 27 2010,06:28) The interpretation is “God with us”. I do not hear anti-trinitarians say Jesus is “God with us” or Emmanuel!
Hi WJ,You act as if Jesus (Jehovah is Salvation) is the only one who had names that referrenced qualities of God. Emmanuel is also correctly translated, “God is with us”. But it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty. Here's some others:
Jehdeiah (possibly, May Jehovah Feel Glad)
Elnathan (God Has Given)
Jeberechiah (Jehovah Blesses)
Jonathan (Jehovah Has Given)
Jehozabad (probably, Jehovah Has Endowed)
Eldad (possibly, God Has Loved)
Abdiel (Servant of God)
Daniel (My Judge Is God)
Jehozadak (probably, Jehovah Pronounces Righteous)
Pelatiah (Jehovah Has Provided Escape)
Abijah (My Father Is Jehovah)
Adonijah (Jehovah Is Lord)So, when you see Emmanuel or “Jehovah is our Righteousness” applied to Jesus, it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty anymore than the above names meant these people were God Almighty.
peace and love,
mike
MikeDid you also get that from Watchtower?
The problem with what you are saying is none of those names were given by an Angel during a miraculous birth.
The Angel said they shall call his name “Emmanuel” which is being interpreted “God with us”.
Like I said Jesus is “God with us”!
As an ex JW who has been greatly brainwashed by Watchtower, I do not see why you or they object!
Since their own Bible says Jesus is “a god”, John 1:1.
So do you confess that Jesus is “a god with us” and if he is, is he your god?
WJ
Hi WJ,
God was in him reconciling His people to himself
Jesus was a willing vessel for God.
God visited his people.You know better than this and trying to muddy the water for others will not bring you lasting benefits.
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2010,04:04) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2010,11:17) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 27 2010,06:28) The interpretation is “God with us”. I do not hear anti-trinitarians say Jesus is “God with us” or Emmanuel!
Hi WJ,You act as if Jesus (Jehovah is Salvation) is the only one who had names that referrenced qualities of God. Emmanuel is also correctly translated, “God is with us”. But it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty. Here's some others:
Jehdeiah (possibly, May Jehovah Feel Glad)
Elnathan (God Has Given)
Jeberechiah (Jehovah Blesses)
Jonathan (Jehovah Has Given)
Jehozabad (probably, Jehovah Has Endowed)
Eldad (possibly, God Has Loved)
Abdiel (Servant of God)
Daniel (My Judge Is God)
Jehozadak (probably, Jehovah Pronounces Righteous)
Pelatiah (Jehovah Has Provided Escape)
Abijah (My Father Is Jehovah)
Adonijah (Jehovah Is Lord)So, when you see Emmanuel or “Jehovah is our Righteousness” applied to Jesus, it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty anymore than the above names meant these people were God Almighty.
peace and love,
mike
MikeDid you also get that from Watchtower?
The problem with what you are saying is none of those names were given by an Angel during a miraculous birth.
The Angel said they shall call his name “Emmanuel” which is being interpreted “God with us”.
Like I said Jesus is “God with us”!
As an ex JW who has been greatly brainwashed by Watchtower, I do not see why you or they object!
Since their own Bible says Jesus is “a god”, John 1:1.
So do you confess that Jesus is “a god with us” and if he is, is he your god?
WJ
WJthis shows you are not guided by the holy spirit but by the spirit of bias what is the spirit of the world.
to the world the truth is hidden and no matter what they do they will never come to the true understanding of God,
because of there ego,pride,they refuse to humble themselves to the spirit of truth of God
you and your friend TT always come back to your pagan views ,and you only support each other into that road of perdition who leads away from God,
your interest does not lead to God but to your views in to taking the worshipers ashtray from the truth of God.
it does not matter how smart someone can be ,if he stumble on the way of live that God gives.
Quote (terraricca @ Mar. 27 2010,14:24) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2010,04:04) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2010,11:17) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 27 2010,06:28) The interpretation is “God with us”. I do not hear anti-trinitarians say Jesus is “God with us” or Emmanuel!
Hi WJ,You act as if Jesus (Jehovah is Salvation) is the only one who had names that referrenced qualities of God. Emmanuel is also correctly translated, “God is with us”. But it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty. Here's some others:
Jehdeiah (possibly, May Jehovah Feel Glad)
Elnathan (God Has Given)
Jeberechiah (Jehovah Blesses)
Jonathan (Jehovah Has Given)
Jehozabad (probably, Jehovah Has Endowed)
Eldad (possibly, God Has Loved)
Abdiel (Servant of God)
Daniel (My Judge Is God)
Jehozadak (probably, Jehovah Pronounces Righteous)
Pelatiah (Jehovah Has Provided Escape)
Abijah (My Father Is Jehovah)
Adonijah (Jehovah Is Lord)So, when you see Emmanuel or “Jehovah is our Righteousness” applied to Jesus, it doesn't mean Jesus is God Almighty anymore than the above names meant these people were God Almighty.
peace and love,
mike
MikeDid you also get that from Watchtower?
The problem with what you are saying is none of those names were given by an Angel during a miraculous birth.
The Angel said they shall call his name “Emmanuel” which is being interpreted “God with us”.
Like I said Jesus is “God with us”!
As an ex JW who has been greatly brainwashed by Watchtower, I do not see why you or they object!
Since their own Bible says Jesus is “a god”, John 1:1.
So do you confess that Jesus is “a god with us” and if he is, is he your god?
WJ
WJthis shows you are not guided by the holy spirit but by the spirit of bias what is the spirit of the world.
to the world the truth is hidden and no matter what they do they will never come to the true understanding of God,
because of there ego,pride,they refuse to humble themselves to the spirit of truth of God
you and your friend TT always come back to your pagan views ,and you only support each other into that road of perdition who leads away from God,
your interest does not lead to God but to your views in to taking the worshipers ashtray from the truth of God.
it does not matter how smart someone can be ,if he stumble on the way of live that God gives.
Atacks Atacks!Is that all you know how to do?
You shoud stop judging the hearts of others and attacking the person.
What you are saying is totally circular anyway!
WJ
Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Mar. 28 2010,04:04) Mike Did you also get that from Watchtower?
The problem with what you are saying is none of those names were given by an Angel during a miraculous birth.
The Angel said they shall call his name “Emmanuel” which is being interpreted “God with us”.
Like I said Jesus is “God with us”!
Hi WJ,Must you start all of your posts to me with a Watchtower comment now? Do I say, “Where did you get that from, some Trinitarian biased scholar?
Jesus may be called (although he wasn't actually called that by anyone but that angel) “God is with us”. And that God sent His only begotten Son to earth to atone for mankind's sins is proof that, while existing in heaven, in mind and heart Jehovah was actually still “with us”. He is on our side and has our backs – at least the ones of us who worship and serve ONLY Him as God Almighty, just as His Son, Jesus taught us.
peace and love,
mikeQuote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2010,16:03) Hi WJ, Must you start all of your posts to me with a Watchtower comment now? Do I say, “Where did you get that from, some Trinitarian biased scholar?
Just curious thats all! Did you get your paste from Watchtower and since you believe in most of their teachings why would you be ashamed to say so?Most who copy and paste from another source that is not their own, give credit to where the quote or quotes are from.
It is Plagiarism to not give due credit but act as if it is your own.
Does it offend you that I say “did you get it from Watchtower”?
Sorry if it does, but I remember you telling me it was a compliment to be called a JW in reference to the Trinity!
But no I do not care that you say I got anything from a Trinitararian. For my Bible or Bibles were Translated by them, and in fact most credible Biblical Hebrew and Greek Scholars are Trinitarian. HMMM, Maybe they know something the Anti-Trinitarians who don't know anything about the Hebrew and Greek doesn't!
In fact the Cannon which the JWS also holds to in the NWT was put together by Trinitarians.
How ironic!
Blessings WJ
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Mar. 27 2010,16:03) He is on our side and has our backs – at least the ones of us who worship and serve ONLY Him as God Almighty, just as His Son, Jesus taught us.
MikeFirst of all, Jesus never used the term God Almighty for the Father when he was in the flesh.
Second, Jesus is “Almighty” as I have shown you, and he has “All Authority and Power and all things are in his hands!
Third, Jesus said you can't serve two Masters yet we see that Jesus is our “Only Master and Lord” in scriptures. Jude 1:4, 5
At the very least Jesus is claiming equality and Oneness with the Father here, or he would be contradicting himself when he says we are to lay our lives down for him!
Blessings WJ
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
