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Quote (Gene Balthrop @ May 30 2010,14:44) Quote (SimplyForgiven @ May 28 2010,20:26) afjlsjlf ajfjaslfjlaskjfasj;lfjaslf
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GENE, GENE, GENE!!!
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MY FREE WILLLL, LET LIBERTY BELL RING!!!
dkjafls;lfjas;ljdfafalskfjlasjfljasldjThan who influenced me to do that!
SF…………That post came from you personal (CAPTIVATED) WILL, it is simply what is (INFLUENCING) Your WILL, that is what is CAUSING YOU TO RESPOND THIS WAY. It like GOD'S Will comes from the council of your own mind. That WILL is far from FREE , A will that is (FREE) does not exist in anyone even GOD or angles or mankind. You like many confuse your (CAPTIVATED) WILL with the Liberty GOD gives us to express our (CAPTIVATED) WILLS. What do you think this means , For He came to set the CAPTIVES FREE, CAPTIVES of What?, figure that out and you will have your answer.peace and love……………….gene
You make it seem that capitivated is the limited usage of choices. but the fact is that i have told you many times,there are only two choices in the end, God or not.
every other is either our own. If i decide to flap around and talk like a smurf, i may very well do so, that has nothing to do with my captavited will. This has everythign to do what is of mans.
I have millions of choices….
Angels have no free will, once they sin once, they are gone.again the captives free verese. you dont even qoute the whole scripture, your cutting scripture.
Somethings are of God, Somethings are from evil, and others are just human.
there isnt always a angel or a demon talking in your ear, Adam fell because he made a choice without the influence, evel fell by influence. Man knew better.
AGain, you just have the problem with the word Free will.
Its exaclty what it means, A choice based on ones on perception of things, without God making the choice for you. His will does not force your will to do anything.In Eden, Adam im sure had the time of his life! he ran naked for goodness sake! you think he did this by a captivatied will? just the choices presented in front of us? or in his ability of what he can do.
I cannot choose to fly, i do not have wings. doesnt mean this is based on my captivated will. this is based on exactly that i do not have the means to fly, even if i wished it, so it means that i cannot fly. because i do not have the ability too. there is nothing captive, i have inability. I can still try!!!
Watch me jump off a roof top!!!I cannot walk on water, but it seems Jesus can =)
and he can, i can.
SF………..If I make a Choice based on (PERCEPTIONS) of thing then that means my “WILL was (NOT) FREE but based on (PERCEPTION) of things. GET IT. So now What (CAUSED) those “PERCEPTIONS” , Was it not our past assoications with things, and these form our desires through the knowledge they impart to us. So a WILL is a FORGED thing (NOT FREE AT ALL)> FOR EVER EFFECT THERE WAS A CAUSE. Trying to tare down the partial scripture i quoted as if it somehow does not mean what i have said is dishonest on you part .
Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the (captives), and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at Liberty them that are bruised, 19..> To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Here is the direct Isa translation….> Isa 61:1…> the spirit of the LORD GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the…> (CAPTIVES), AND THE OPENING OF THE PRISON TO THEM THAT ARE BOUND.
Now if you understand what that last part means you should have no problem understanding there is NO Such Thing as a “FREE” WILL. You also have yet to produce ONE SCRIPTURE THAT STATES WE HAVE A “FREE” WILL (IN) US. Nor has anyone else for the matter either.
Peace and love to you and yours………………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ May 31 2010,02:09) SF………..If I make a Choice based on (PERCEPTIONS) of thing then that means my “WILL was (NOT) FREE but based on (PERCEPTION) of things. GET IT. So now What (CAUSED) those “PERCEPTIONS” , Was it not our past assoications with things, and these form our desires through the knowledge they impart to us. So a WILL is a FORGED thing (NOT FREE AT ALL)> FOR EVER EFFECT THERE WAS A CAUSE. Trying to tare down the partial scripture i quoted as if it somehow does not mean what i have said is dishonest on you part . Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the (captives), and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at Liberty them that are bruised, 19..> To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Here is the direct Isa translation….> Isa 61:1…> the spirit of the LORD GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the…> (CAPTIVES), AND THE OPENING OF THE PRISON TO THEM THAT ARE BOUND.
Now if you understand what that last part means you should have no problem understanding there is NO Such Thing as a “FREE” WILL. You also have yet to produce ONE SCRIPTURE THAT STATES WE HAVE A “FREE” WILL (IN) US. Nor has anyone else for the matter either.
Peace and love to you and yours………………gene
I mentioned alot of things gene that you didnt answer.WE cannot do certain things for inability.
i agree with cause and effect, i wrote about it.
i didnt tare down anything. im telling you ur trying to use partial scripture, and it doesnt say to free us from our mind literally.
IT says what it says, to set the captives from from being bound. not from the captivating will your talking abuot or what not.its dishonest in your part for you to believe that i would believe based on partial scripture.
maybe it would be more logical to start with it, and than make your points, explain scripture. than just qouting partial and thinking im going to take that as validation to your claim.
AGain you have a problem with the word free will.
While your add it, find a verse that tells us that we must read from the “Bible” that its holy. And that the “Bible” is the word of God.
Find me a scripture where God in first person says “I love you”.
Find me scriptures such as that,
SF………..It is obvious that the Captivity Here is referencing ones Mental state, an imprisonment of the mind. Jesus said “the words i am telling you are (spirit)” and they are life”. These Spirit word must be Spiritually perceived, you are changing what Jesus and scripture was inferring in Isa 61:I as well as when Jesus quoted them in Luke 4:18 . This is dishonest on your Part not mine SF. If you agree with (cause) and (effect) you should easily see there is Not such thing as a “FREE” WILL then. You as well as Most are confusing GOD allowing us to exercise our (CAPTIVATED WILLS) with us having “FREE WILLS” (IN) US.
As far as your others points they also make no sense, YOU SAY “once a angles sins they are gone for ever” , but scriptures says they are held in Cains reserved for Judgment. The gone for ever is your addition.
You say “I have a problem with “FREE” WILL”, i really do not have that {Problem} because I do not believe in “FREE WILL” as you and other do, so the problem is yours, not mine, as i see it.
You ask show me a Scripture that said GOD Loves YOU……….”GOD SO (LOVED) THE WORLD THAT HE GAVE HIS UNIQUELY BEGOTTEN SO THAT WHOSOEVER BELIEVES ON HIM SHOULD NOT PARISH BUT MAY HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE”.
try John 14:21 if you need more proof.
Most of all your post on this subject is a diversion from the real points to support your own dogmas. IMO.
peace and love……………gene
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 01 2010,02:28) SF………..It is obvious that the Captivity Here is referencing ones Mental state, an imprisonment of the mind. Jesus said “the words i am telling you are (spirit)” and they are life”. These Spirit word must be Spiritually perceived, you are changing what Jesus and scripture was inferring in Isa 61:I as well as when Jesus quoted them in Luke 4:18 . This is dishonest on your Part not mine SF. If you agree with (cause) and (effect) you should easily see there is Not such thing as a “FREE” WILL then. You as well as Most are confusing GOD allowing us to exercise our (CAPTIVATED WILLS) with us having “FREE WILLS” (IN) US. As far as your others points they also make no sense, YOU SAY “once a angles sins they are gone for ever” , but scriptures says they are held in Cains reserved for Judgment. The gone for ever is your addition.
You say “I have a problem with “FREE” WILL”, i really do not have that {Problem} because I do not believe in “FREE WILL” as you and other do, so the problem is yours, not mine, as i see it.
You ask show me a Scripture that said GOD Loves YOU……….”GOD SO (LOVED) THE WORLD THAT HE GAVE HIS UNIQUELY BEGOTTEN SO THAT WHOSOEVER BELIEVES ON HIM SHOULD NOT PARISH BUT MAY HAVE EVERLASTING LIFE”.
try John 14:21 if you need more proof.
Most of all your post on this subject is a diversion from the real points to support your own dogmas. IMO.
peace and love……………gene
Gene.
1. Im not being dishonest, im literaly stating what scirpture says im not adding anything to it. you started with this whole dishonesty trend/namecalling/End it. because I take it personaly.
2.when i mentioned abuot the angels, i met that they cannot be redeemed as we can, as always you dont consider context.
3. lol In first person, God hasnt said that he has loved you. He never told david, nor any of the chosen people, the heros of the bible that he loves them, in other words he shows them that he loves them.lol i made no dogma, you created your captivated dogman beloved brother.
u didnt understand anything i said.
in other words when i mentioned the inability part, its not by a captivated will, its based on inability. God didnt control everyones single movement, its by ability we can do things. and even if we cant, we have every right to try. thats where failure comes in.your sayin captivated will is what makes us do what we do. the set choices.
if i dont like 1. run. 2. walk. 3.jog.
but i choose to fly, this is a choice i make, its not a choice i can actualyl perform. which means since i have the inability to do this, i knwo that i cannot, but i doesnt mean i wont try.thats my basic point. lets focus on that.
lets end the dishonesty comments, because this is not a blood sport,
We are getting off the topic, I'll repeat my early post to try and get us back on track.
After many years, my walk with God has taken me many miles, some pleasant, some unpleasant. In trying to find the truth of God, I found that not only could I not find God by my efforts, but that God had been directing my paths all along. He has revealed to me, and many others, that it was not what I did that would put me in favour with God, but what He (God) has and is doing with me (and all of us). I have concluded, and this not of myself, that “All is of God”.
I can best expain this by comparing Gods work with us as a “play”. God is the Author, and “Creation” is the name of the play, and the earth is the stage, we are the actors.
All is predestined, God has planned the begining to the ending. A good explanaion of this is the the first chapter of “Ephesians”, God is perfecting all mankind for the glorious “consummation”, when God will be “All in all”.
So you see, all mankind, us actors, have been assigned a script, prepared by God, the author, what role we should play. Some are wicked, some are murderers, some decietfull, some good, some sickley, and others healthy. Some rich and some poor. You see “All is of God”.
I know some will think I have drunk too much wine, and my mind is cloudy. But nevertheless, this is how I see it. It is the good Lord working in me that has given me this revelation. All mankind will be saved. 1.Tim.4:9-11 …that we rely on the living God, Who is the Saviour of all mankind.God Bless, Jerry.
Quote (chosenone @ June 05 2010,17:05) We are getting off the topic, I'll repeat my early post to try and get us back on track. After many years, my walk with God has taken me many miles, some pleasant, some unpleasant. In trying to find the truth of God, I found that not only could I not find God by my efforts, but that God had been directing my paths all along. He has revealed to me, and many others, that it was not what I did that would put me in favour with God, but what He (God) has and is doing with me (and all of us). I have concluded, and this not of myself, that “All is of God”.
I can best expain this by comparing Gods work with us as a “play”. God is the Author, and “Creation” is the name of the play, and the earth is the stage, we are the actors.
All is predestined, God has planned the begining to the ending. A good explanaion of this is the the first chapter of “Ephesians”, God is perfecting all mankind for the glorious “consummation”, when God will be “All in all”.
So you see, all mankind, us actors, have been assigned a script, prepared by God, the author, what role we should play. Some are wicked, some are murderers, some decietfull, some good, some sickley, and others healthy. Some rich and some poor. You see “All is of God”.
I know some will think I have drunk too much wine, and my mind is cloudy. But nevertheless, this is how I see it. It is the good Lord working in me that has given me this revelation. All mankind will be saved. 1.Tim.4:9-11 …that we rely on the living God, Who is the Saviour of all mankind.God Bless, Jerry.
I believe that God takes active role in our daily lives.He already knew what imperfect choices one would make,
and has already chosen his perfect reaction to those choices.I believe that God is a personal God, who takes a active role within our lives.
Gods goal, is to save as many as possible, the ones who chose him, and using the ones who didnt choose him, to help gain more of a harvest.
beacuse he loves us.I do not believe that all man kind will be saved. why, becausse. scirpture mentions many times abuot those who will be in hell, and the suffering of hell, and the torture of the second death. being without God. basically.
People who usually believes that all mankind will be saved, are those who have lost someone in their lives, who might have not believed. God does not force people. He can know our actions way before they happend, but he doesnt force it that way. He already knew what you were going to do, thats why he send Jesus.
much love,
Hi SimplyForgiven.
Thanks for your reply.Quote I believe that God takes active role in our daily lives. He already knew what imperfect choices one would make,
and has already chosen his perfect reaction to those choices.I believe that God is a personal God, who takes a active role within our lives.
I agree with your opinion, what I don't agree on is that God cannot save these people. In Eph.1:11 He states that He (God) is operating ALL in accord with His will. I believe He is doing this to teach mankind the knowledge of “good and evil”, we cannot learn of one without the other.Quote Gods goal, is to save as many as possible, the ones who chose him, and using the ones who didnt choose him, to help gain more of a harvest.
beacuse he loves us.
I cannot believe that God is as weak as you portray Him, that He cannot do what He wants to do. In Isaiah 46:11 He states… “All my desires I will do”. I believe that He will accomplish all that He wants to do, and He is “the saviour of all mankind” (1Tim.4:9-11)Quote I do not believe that all man kind will be saved. why, becausse. scirpture mentions many times abuot those who will be in hell, and the suffering of hell, and the torture of the second death. being without God. basically. I don't agree with you that scripture mentions many times about those who will be in Hell. Most scripture tells of mankinds 'destruction', thrown in the 'lake of fire', as well as 'death', etc. But all these are not “eternal”, but punishment. After all, He says… “every knee shall bow, and every tounge shall confess”… And in 1Cor.15:28 that “God will be All in all”.
Quote People who usually believes that all mankind will be saved, are those who have lost someone in their lives, who might have not believed. God does not force people. He can know our actions way before they happend, but he doesnt force it that way. He already knew what you were going to do, thats why he send Jesus. I'm not sure I agree with this statement either, after all, almost all experience death of a loved one in their lives, Mother, father, sister or brother, and other relatives. This is normal for humankind, we all go through this at times.
1Tim.4:9-11…
9 Faithful is the saying and worthy of all welcome
10 (for for this are we toiling and being reproached), that we rely on the living God, Who is the Saviour of all mankind, especially of believers.1Cor.15:22-28…
22 For even as, in Adam, all are dying, thus also, in Christ, shall all be vivified.
23 Yet each in his own class: the Firstfruit, Christ; thereupon those who are Christ's in His presence;
24 thereafter the consummation, whenever He may be giving up the kingdom to His God and Father, whenever He should be nullifying all sovereignty and all authority and power.
25 For He must be reigning until He should be placing all His enemies under His feet.
26 The last enemy is being abolished: death.
27 For He subjects all under His feet. Now whenever He may be saying that all is subject, it is evident that it is outside of Him Who subjects all to Him.
28 Now, whenever all may be subjected to Him, then the Son Himself also shall be subjected to Him Who subjects all to Him, that God may be All in all.)God Bless, Jerry.
hey Co,
be open, as I do consider your points, i hope you can consider mine.
1) teach between good and evil? i think not sir. God made it clear that he did not want man to eat of the fruit. are you saying that God wanted man to be evil? Can you please read my poem for this clarification of what i think about this. here is a question, if i do something that i think is Good, but its agaisnt God, is it good? what God thinks is good is differnt from what Man thinks is good.
2) I didnt say that God couldnt do what he wants to do. He will save the ones who choose him. are you saying that God wants to force those who rejected him to love him? the ones who hated him? that even though he sent his son to die for them, they still hate him? Matthew 17, says that Lord, Lord, did we not prophecy and your name, and cast out demons… and the Lord say depart for i never knew you. Thats is Gods response to those who he never knew. God wants nothing to do with those who dont love him. Do we deserve such a God? think about it. imagine a king in a mighty castle, you think those closest to him are going to be ones to reject him? and when the King advances and conquers his enemies, he will make them bow and kiss his feet, and than send them to their doom. This is not weakness in contrary Gods will is to save for those who are willing to choose him.God chooses those who love him. not who will forever reject him. even though he will conquer them.
3) What do you think hell is? a place where the devil tortures you? noo, God is the consuming fire, with holy hatred. the is for eternity. its say forever and ever. does it not? you cant take one scripture without the others. God is all in all. the bible says do not be afraid of those who kill the body, be afraid of the one who can cast you into hell. God wants glory in everything, even his holy hatred, and anger as punishment for eternity. the choice is between God love, or hatred.
4) When i state that, im talking about christians. Some christians who have a unbelieving family member or friend die, have a very hard time the chance that they are in hell. This is where most of these aspects started from.
God bless you,
I hope you can consider my points, i do consider yours.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ May 31 2010,02:09) SF………..If I make a Choice based on (PERCEPTIONS) of thing then that means my “WILL was (NOT) FREE but based on (PERCEPTION) of things. GET IT. So now What (CAUSED) those “PERCEPTIONS” , Was it not our past assoications with things, and these form our desires through the knowledge they impart to us. So a WILL is a FORGED thing (NOT FREE AT ALL)> FOR EVER EFFECT THERE WAS A CAUSE. Trying to tare down the partial scripture i quoted as if it somehow does not mean what i have said is dishonest on you part . Luke 4:18 The Spirit of the Lord is upon me, because he hath anointed me to preach the gospel to the poor; he has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, to preach deliverance to the (captives), and recovering of sight to the blind, to set at Liberty them that are bruised, 19..> To preach the acceptable year of the Lord.
Here is the direct Isa translation….> Isa 61:1…> the spirit of the LORD GOD is upon me; because the LORD hath anointed me to preach good tidings unto the meek; he has sent me to bind up the brokenhearted, to proclaim liberty to the…> (CAPTIVES), AND THE OPENING OF THE PRISON TO THEM THAT ARE BOUND.
Now if you understand what that last part means you should have no problem understanding there is NO Such Thing as a “FREE” WILL. You also have yet to produce ONE SCRIPTURE THAT STATES WE HAVE A “FREE” WILL (IN) US. Nor has anyone else for the matter either.
Peace and love to you and yours………………gene
It is an excellent post brother Gene. I fully endorse your views above.Love and peace to you
AdamChosen one and Gene
I have looked at both of these points, in the past.
I went through a stage thinking God would save the whole world.
But one thing I didnt get, what was the lake of fire, the second death? Do you have the answer to that?
With this Universal salvation thing, it doesnt match up with scripture.
Yes, God is a consuming fire, God destroys. And God makes alive, those he wants to.
As our creator He has the right and ability.
He desires what is good. We have free will, we choose good or bad… was anyone but Noah and His family saved from the flood?
All through the bible is words such as death, second death, destroy, destruction, perish etc.
So, why would the Bible say one thing, and mean something else?
On saying that though im curious because the Orthodox church teaches something similar though different, I need to look it up.
Karmaire……….The lake of Fire is symbolic language and simply means intense Judgements, Scripture say GOD is the Consuming Fire and we are tried by fire, as Peter said, Jesus came and baptized with spirit and Fire. Taking the word Fire as literial fire is not what scripture is implying , things are purified by fire like GOLD or Silver or other Precious metals are. Man is purified by the intense Judgements of GOD, fire is used in scripture symbolic for intense Judgements, and should not be looked at as a literial fire. God is not going to Burn up his created childern by throwing them into a literial fire and destroying them for ever, as false religions say, How could a GOD of LOVE do that when he has the power to change and cleans them from their sins and to bring anyone to repentance. Fear mongers and “FREE WILLER'S” preach a literial fire and try to make salvation a matter of a Persons own self, they are self trusting and only profess GOD but are far from truly believing in Him and Knowing Him they only deceive themselves and Have No (TRUE) relationship with HIM or they could Produce the Proofs of that relationship. God (IS) LOVE and LOVE does not through his childern into any LITERAL FIRE and BURN them UP FOREVER. They have a demented view of GOD and His Work. But in a Spiritual sense there is a Fiery Judgments of GOD for the purpose of cleanse and purifying us and GOD is very capable of cleansing (ALL) of HIS creation. Not because of who we are , but because of what we mean to HIM and His LOVE for us. The only condemners of Man is Man Himself and even Jesus did not come to condemn anyone , GOD the FATHER and Jesus are both about salvation not condemnation, While they do condemn the deed of some they do not condemn the person, as self reliant “FREE WILLED” fear monger do. They preach GOD but (DENY) the POWER there of , as scripture say they do. These are self centered individuals truly caring about no one but them selves, clouds without water, vessels tossed about with the tempest always seeking but never coming to the truth of GOD , void of the Spirit (intellect) of GOD. GOD (IS) LOVE, and What is LOVE it is written and explained clearly by Paul. We (ALL) have more going for us them we realize , not because of who were are but who God the Fathers is . IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………….gene
Gene, thanks for that, I understand what your saying.
Heres some Orthodox views.
Bishop Timothy Ware (of the Greek Orthodox Church) wrote:
….we must not despair of anyone's salvation, but must long and pray for the reconciliation of all without exception. No one must be excluded from our loving intercession. “What is a merciful heart?” asked Isaac the Syrian. “It is a heart that burns with love for the whole of creation, for humans, for birds, for the beasts, for the demons, for all creatures.” (The Orthodox Church, New Edition., p. 262)
Eastern Orthodox questions and answers ..
“Certainly, Christ made the perfect and universal sacrifice for all mankind, indeed for all of creation itself and nobody, least of all me, would argue that Christ does not desire us all to be saved. Therefore, the idea of “universal salvation” is true in the sense that salvation is indeed universally available for all who choose to accept it. But I am sure that the Church does not accept the idea that salvation is universally unavoidable, that we will be saved whether or not we want to be. God works through us and with us in cooperation in as much as we allow Him to. But it is always our choice, whether to choose God's way or our own way, and there are consequences for our decisions. We are free to accept or reject God's gift. He will not force it upon us”.
Quote (Gene Balthrop @ June 12 2010,01:41) Karmaire……….The lake of Fire is symbolic language and simply means intense Judgements, Scripture say GOD is the Consuming Fire and we are tried by fire, as Peter said, Jesus came and baptized with spirit and Fire. Taking the word Fire as literial fire is not what scripture is implying , things are purified by fire like GOLD or Silver or other Precious metals are. Man is purified by the intense Judgements of GOD, fire is used in scripture symbolic for intense Judgements, and should not be looked at as a literial fire. God is not going to Burn up his created childern by throwing them into a literial fire and destroying them for ever, as false religions say, How could a GOD of LOVE do that when he has the power to change and cleans them from their sins and to bring anyone to repentance. Fear mongers and “FREE WILLER'S” preach a literial fire and try to make salvation a matter of a Persons own self, they are self trusting and only profess GOD but are far from truly believing in Him and Knowing Him they only deceive themselves and Have No (TRUE) relationship with HIM or they could Produce the Proofs of that relationship. God (IS) LOVE and LOVE does not through his childern into any LITERAL FIRE and BURN them UP FOREVER. They have a demented view of GOD and His Work. But in a Spiritual sense there is a Fiery Judgments of GOD for the purpose of cleanse and purifying us and GOD is very capable of cleansing (ALL) of HIS creation. Not because of who we are , but because of what we mean to HIM and His LOVE for us. The only condemners of Man is Man Himself and even Jesus did not come to condemn anyone , GOD the FATHER and Jesus are both about salvation not condemnation, While they do condemn the deed of some they do not condemn the person, as self reliant “FREE WILLED” fear monger do. They preach GOD but (DENY) the POWER there of , as scripture say they do. These are self centered individuals truly caring about no one but them selves, clouds without water, vessels tossed about with the tempest always seeking but never coming to the truth of GOD , void of the Spirit (intellect) of GOD. GOD (IS) LOVE, and What is LOVE it is written and explained clearly by Paul. We (ALL) have more going for us them we realize , not because of who were are but who God the Fathers is . IMO peace and love to you and yours……………….gene
In Order for God to love, He must HATE.
Love whats holy and hate everything that is not.LOVE CANNOT FORCE PEOPLE TO CHOOSE, BECAUSE LOVE IS BASED ON A CHOICE OF LOVE!!!!
THAT WHY THERE NEEDS TO BE A HELL!
GOD IS LOVE, therefore he cannot force us.
You think that we deserve Gods love?we are ants, disgusting beasts.
and yet he chose to make us, and we reject him?
what would you do with a girl who has left you for someone disgusting? that anger that fire would build and unless she repented or you would unleash a wrath.the effect of a fear to lose God, makes a cause not to sin, and to get closer to him. a True relationship is based on love and fear.
when you get married you fear to do certain things that your spouse dont want you doing, bc you know if you did, she might leave you.
therefore its the same with God.
Love cannot force. Therefore God deserves the right, for us to choose him. HE is not some whatever guy, who is broken hearted and forces us becaue he cant seem to convince us to choose him.No he has every right to be angry. because he is so wonderful and beautiful, and the perfect romantic gentlemen that why WOULDNT WE CHOOSE GOD. imagine an ant choosing to swim in water rather to be in your hands. we would say stupid ant, it will die in the water.
We choose to die, we choose to reject God. and God respects that. He hates it. He hates the things we do.
what more wrath can someone have for someone they love, when they rather choose death, than to be with the perfect love.
This is why christ came!! to free us. to have this oppurtunity to simply believe and have the forgiveness of sins.
Christ spent more time talking about hell than anything else!
1 corinthians 13. what is love.
ex: I love children, therefore i hate abortion.God is not willing to save all, but to save the ones who love him.
You speak of things not in scripture by the way. to say that the lake of fire is symbolic is saying that Jesus is lying. You make claims and conclusions that are not biblical.
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