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Hi Wakeup:
Unfortunately, no one can repent for him. He has to first acknowledge that he has sinned and say that he is sorry, and indicate with that confession that he is going to stop accusing and judging us just because he may have a different understanding of the scriptures.
But it is quite obvious what was said, and that not only you and I have had problems with the way that he has addressed us, but probably everyone on this site except t8 and Mike.
But I am going to forgive him, and move on. I have given him and opportunity to repent, and he states that he did not call me a fool. God knows his heart, and I am not going to let him become a burden in my life.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (942767 @ Sep. 28 2013,14:39) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 29 2013,07:22)
David started the psalm by asking that question, and then went on to describe the terrible state he (or Jesus on the stake) was in, and then concluded in the end that God had never actually forsaken him.Jesus didn't say those words to convey that he actually believed God had forsaken him. Instead, it was to let the witnesses of his death know that Psalm 110 was one more prophecy he came to fulfill.
With his dying breath, he pointed people to a scripture that had been written many years earlier, but described the very moment that was currently happening.
No, this was actually being fulfilled in his life.Psalm 22? Not 110.
Love in Christ,
Marty
You are correct that it is Psalm 22, not 110. Sorry.But you are incorrect if you seriously believe God really ever forsook His only begotten Son.
Jesus was trying to point people to Psalm 22, in an effort to make them realize that what was happening to him had been foretold through David many, many years earlier.
Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 28 2013,18:40) Mike. You and your word inside you is one/ one Mike.
No Wakeup.Any time you can use the words “my”, “mine”, “of”, “his”, “hers” or an apostrophe-s, we are talking about a possession OF you, and not you yourself.
For instance, “the Word OF God” is not God, but something God POSSESSES. Hence the word “OF”.
“MY body” is something I POSSESS, and not the entirety of Mike Boll, hence the word “MY”.
“God's Holy Spirit” is something God POSSESSES, and not God Himself, hence the apostrophe-s.
Wakeup, did you read in that post about the King of Abyssinia, and his spokesman who is called “the word of the king”? Is this spokesman actually the king himself, or a servant that the king POSSESSES?
Also, do you understand the word “with”? Something that can be WITH Mike can't also BE Mike.
And finally, your understanding calls for one of two things to have occurred:
1. Jesus truly IS Jehovah God Himself.
2. Something that WAS Jehovah became someone who CEASED TO BE Jehovah.
Which one of these do you believe?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,09:00) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 28 2013,14:39) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 29 2013,07:22)
David started the psalm by asking that question, and then went on to describe the terrible state he (or Jesus on the stake) was in, and then concluded in the end that God had never actually forsaken him.Jesus didn't say those words to convey that he actually believed God had forsaken him. Instead, it was to let the witnesses of his death know that Psalm 110 was one more prophecy he came to fulfill.
With his dying breath, he pointed people to a scripture that had been written many years earlier, but described the very moment that was currently happening.
No, this was actually being fulfilled in his life.Psalm 22? Not 110.
Love in Christ,
Marty
You are correct that it is Psalm 22, not 110. Sorry.But you are incorrect if you seriously believe God really ever forsook His only begotten Son.
Jesus was trying to point people to Psalm 22, in an effort to make them realize that what was happening to him had been foretold through David many, many years earlier.
Hi Mike:You made a mistake once?
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,09:00) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 28 2013,14:39) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 29 2013,07:22)
David started the psalm by asking that question, and then went on to describe the terrible state he (or Jesus on the stake) was in, and then concluded in the end that God had never actually forsaken him.Jesus didn't say those words to convey that he actually believed God had forsaken him. Instead, it was to let the witnesses of his death know that Psalm 110 was one more prophecy he came to fulfill.
With his dying breath, he pointed people to a scripture that had been written many years earlier, but described the very moment that was currently happening.
No, this was actually being fulfilled in his life.Psalm 22? Not 110.
Love in Christ,
Marty
You are correct that it is Psalm 22, not 110. Sorry.But you are incorrect if you seriously believe God really ever forsook His only begotten Son.
Jesus was trying to point people to Psalm 22, in an effort to make them realize that what was happening to him had been foretold through David many, many years earlier.
Hi Mike:You made a mistake once?
The following scripture states that “God loosed the pains of death”, but he died on the cross, and suffered all this, and so, what pains were loosed?
Quote Acts 2 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: 24 whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,09:27) Quote (Wakeup @ Sep. 28 2013,18:40) Mike. You and your word inside you is one/ one Mike.
No Wakeup.Any time you can use the words “my”, “mine”, “of”, “his”, “hers” or an apostrophe-s, we are talking about a possession OF you, and not you yourself.
For instance, “the Word OF God” is not God, but something God POSSESSES. Hence the word “OF”.
“MY body” is something I POSSESS, and not the entirety of Mike Boll, hence the word “MY”.
“God's Holy Spirit” is something God POSSESSES, and not God Himself, hence the apostrophe-s.
Wakeup, did you read in that post about the King of Abyssinia, and his spokesman who is called “the word of the king”? Is this spokesman actually the king himself, or a servant that the king POSSESSES?
Also, do you understand the word “with”? Something that can be WITH Mike can't also BE Mike.
And finally, your understanding calls for one of two things to have occurred:
1. Jesus truly IS Jehovah God Himself.
2. Something that WAS Jehovah became someone who CEASED TO BE Jehovah.
Which one of these do you believe?
MikeB.first; you are correct.
God possesses his Word,I thought I made that clear.1.What is Mike without a mind?
Is there a word without the mind?2.Is Mikes image not projected by what he says?
3.Is mike's word not in his mind? silent.
4.Does his word not come out, after he thinks and decide what to say?
5.Is his word not stored in his mind?
waiting for an order to come out.6. If Mike could bring forth his word standing next to him,
is not his word *with* Mike?7.Does he then become a seperate person,and not Mike?
Mike his word. Mike's mind is in charge.Mike's word can not tell Mike what to do,therfore Mike is in charge.8. If mike brings back *in him* his word; is he not back in the mind of Mike?
9.Is Mike then not one?
10.There is no other but Mike and his mind,or is his mind seperate?
Possession:
Mike possesses his heart,lungs kidneys,bone blood
belly,arms legs,head,eyes,hair.
so who is Mike? which part of the body is Mike?Re' the word of the king.
He sends a person to speak in his behalf.
That person carries the massage of his king,
But he is not the king himself.
There are two persons involved.
The king and his messenger.In the case of God,is only one involved: God.
God and his mind are *not* two seperate entities.
His Word is the projection of his mind.wakeup.
Quote (942767 @ Sep. 30 2013,17:23) Hi Mike: You made a mistake once?
The following scripture states that “God loosed the pains of death”, but he died on the cross, and suffered all this, and so, what pains were loosed?
I've made many mistakes, Marty.As for your point that Jesus suffered pain on the stake, what does that have to do with God FORSAKING him?
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 01 2013,05:23) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,09:00) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 28 2013,14:39) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 29 2013,07:22)
David started the psalm by asking that question, and then went on to describe the terrible state he (or Jesus on the stake) was in, and then concluded in the end that God had never actually forsaken him.Jesus didn't say those words to convey that he actually believed God had forsaken him. Instead, it was to let the witnesses of his death know that Psalm 110 was one more prophecy he came to fulfill.
With his dying breath, he pointed people to a scripture that had been written many years earlier, but described the very moment that was currently happening.
No, this was actually being fulfilled in his life.Psalm 22? Not 110.
Love in Christ,
Marty
You are correct that it is Psalm 22, not 110. Sorry.But you are incorrect if you seriously believe God really ever forsook His only begotten Son.
Jesus was trying to point people to Psalm 22, in an effort to make them realize that what was happening to him had been foretold through David many, many years earlier.
Hi Mike:You made a mistake once?
The following scripture states that “God loosed the pains of death”, but he died on the cross, and suffered all this, and so, what pains were loosed?
Quote Acts 2 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: 24 whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it
Love in Christ,
Marty
Martythis version seems a little better no
Ac 2:22 “Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know.
Ac 2:23 This man was handed over to you by God’s set purpose and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross.
Ac 2:24 But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep its hold on him.
Ac 2:25 David said about him:
“ ‘I saw the Lord always before me.
Because he is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
Ac 2:26 Therefore my heart is glad and my tongue rejoices;
my body also will live in hope,
Ac 2:27 because you will not abandon me to the grave,
nor will you let your Holy One see decay.
Ac 2:28 You have made known to me the paths of life;Lk 24:25 He said to them, “How foolish you are, and how slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!
Lk 24:26 Did not the Christ have to suffer these things and then enter his glory?”what is your take on this
Wakeup,
If he is the Word OF God, and can be WITH God, then he is not actually God Himself.
To me, this is simple God-given common sense.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,11:52) Wakeup, If he is the Word OF God, and can be WITH God, then he is not actually God Himself.
To me, this is simple God-given common sense.
True:He is Jehovah's Word and always will be.
Because we and the angels are commanded to worship
him; Does not make him Jehovah.
We have Jehovah;we have his Word; we have jehovah's Word,we have Jehovah.You have the Father;you have the Son;
you have the Son,you have the Father.
One can not worship Jehovah,but trample on his Word.
As the muslems do.wakeup.
Quote (terraricca @ Oct. 01 2013,06:46) Quote (942767 @ Oct. 01 2013,05:23) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,09:00) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 28 2013,14:39) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Sep. 29 2013,07:22)
David started the psalm by asking that question, and then went on to describe the terrible state he (or Jesus on the stake) was in, and then concluded in the end that God had never actually forsaken him.Jesus didn't say those words to convey that he actually believed God had forsaken him. Instead, it was to let the witnesses of his death know that Psalm 110 was one more prophecy he came to fulfill.
With his dying breath, he pointed people to a scripture that had been written many years earlier, but described the very moment that was currently happening.
No, this was actually being fulfilled in his life.Psalm 22? Not 110.
Love in Christ,
Marty
You are correct that it is Psalm 22, not 110. Sorry.But you are incorrect if you seriously believe God really ever forsook His only begotten Son.
Jesus was trying to point people to Psalm 22, in an effort to make them realize that what was happening to him had been foretold through David many, many years earlier.
Hi Mike:You made a mistake once?
The following scripture states that “God loosed the pains of death”, but he died on the cross, and suffered all this, and so, what pains were loosed?
Quote Acts 2 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: 24 whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it
Love in Christ,
Marty
Martythis version seems a little better no
Ac 2:22 “Men of Israel, listen to this: Jesus of Nazareth was a man accredited by God to you by miracles, wonders and signs, which God did among you through him, as you yourselves know.
Ac 2:23 This man was handed over to you by God’s set purpose and foreknowledge; and you, with the help of wicked men, put him to death by nailing him to the cross.
Ac 2:24 But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep its hold on him.
Ac 2:25 David said about him:
“ ‘I saw the Lord always before me.
Because he is at my right hand,
I will not be shaken.
Ac 2:26 Therefore my heart is glad and my tongue rejoices;
my body also will live in hope,
Ac 2:27 because you will not abandon me to the grave,
nor will you let your Holy One see decay.
Ac 2:28 You have made known to me the paths of life;Lk 24:25 He said to them, “How foolish you are, and how slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!
Lk 24:26 Did not the Christ have to suffer these things and then enter his glory?”what is your take on this
Ac 2:24 But God raised him from the dead, freeing him from the agony of death, because it was impossible for death to keep its hold on him.by reading the context it become obvious to me that this verse does not talk about the “pain of death of Christ ” but the pain of dead of men in general “
because of Christ we have received (those who believe that is )the hope of eternal life ;and so the pain of death has been reduced for all of us that believe ,
this goes well with what David says as well
Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 01 2013,03:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,11:52) Wakeup, If he is the Word OF God, and can be WITH God, then he is not actually God Himself.
To me, this is simple God-given common sense.
True:Because we and the angels are commanded to worship
him; Does not make him Jehovah.
You're confusing me, Wakeup. Do you believe the Word IS Jehovah, or someone other than Jehovah?It seems that you are saying each one of those things in various posts.
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,11:44) Quote (942767 @ Sep. 30 2013,17:23) Hi Mike: You made a mistake once?
The following scripture states that “God loosed the pains of death”, but he died on the cross, and suffered all this, and so, what pains were loosed?
I've made many mistakes, Marty.As for your point that Jesus suffered pain on the stake, what does that have to do with God FORSAKING him?
Hi Mike:About making mistakes, I make them all the time, and I do not know if I am right or wrong about God forsaking Jesus in this situation as he died for us on the cross, but I believe it because Jesus said it. And I believe it because, he was crucified which is a sign of someone dying accursed or dying spiritually separated from God. He was accused of blasphemy which is unpardonable sin.
Here is another scripture which gives credence to my believing what I do:
Quote
2Cr 5:21For he hath made him to be sin for us, who knew no sin; that we might be made the righteousness of God in him.
But I said what I did about you making mistakes, because when you address me you emphatically say “you are incorrect..”, but you are not the authority, are you? You may disagree and believe that I am wrong, but it may be you that is incorrect as you were when you gave me the wrong psalm relative to the quote about God forsaking him.
Love in Christ,
MartyNo, Pierre, I disagree that this scripture refers to loosing the pains of death for men in general, because the scripture states that he (Jesus)
was not possible that he should be holden of it.Quote Acts 2 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: 24 whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it
Love in Christ,
MartyHi Marty,
1 Corinthians 12:3
……that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed……But also consider the NETNotes on this following verse:
Deuteronomy 21:23
His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God;) that thy land be not defiled, which the Lord thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.The idea behind the phrase cursed by God seems to be not that the person was impaled because he was cursed, but that to leave him exposed there was to invite the curse of God upon the whole land.
Why this would be so is not clear, though the rabbinic idea that even a criminal is created in the image of God may give some clue.
Paul cites this text (see Gal 3:13) to make the point that Christ, suspended from a cross, thereby took upon himself the curse associated with such a display of divine wrath and judgment.
I see the point you are making, and the reasons and scriptures behind it. But I personally believe Jesus began to quote Psalm 22 to point people to the fact that the prophecy in that psalm was being fulfilled before their very eyes.
Nor will I ever believe that God would forsake His only begotten Son – who had done nothing but faithfully follow God's commands.
Once again, we interpret scripture differently.
Quote (942767 @ Oct. 02 2013,03:13) No, Pierre, I disagree that this scripture refers to loosing the pains of death for men in general, because the scripture states that he (Jesus)
was not possible that he should be holden of it.Quote Acts 2 Ye men of Israel, hear these words; Jesus of Nazareth, a man approved of God among you by miracles and wonders and signs, which God did by him in the midst of you, as ye yourselves also know: 23 Him, being delivered by the determinate counsel and foreknowledge of God, ye have taken, and by wicked hands have crucified and slain: 24 whom God hath raised up, having loosed the pains of death: because it was not possible that he should be holden of it
Love in Christ,
Marty
Martythe way you have it it seems like Christ ad received a benefit ;but according to his own teachings
Lk 24:25 He said to them, “How foolish you are, and how slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken!
Lk 24:26 Did not the Christ have to suffer these things and then enter his glory?”;he did not benefit of anything but accomplish what it takes to save us ;and yes to us it is a benefit that Christ died,and yes it ad made the pain of dead to all believers less painful,knowing that we have the hope that Christ provided through his own death ,
to me it is not about us or Christ but about God because God his the ultimate savior ,we know he has allowed his son to do what he did ,for us men to benefit from it ,so I believe that that scripture should refer to our death and not Christ death,Mt 20:27 and whoever wants to be first must be your slave—
Mt 20:28 just as the Son of Man did not come to be served, but to serve, and to give his life as a ransom for many.”to really understand those scriptures we have to look at the very reason of why “THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD WAS THE ONLY POSSIBLE CANDIDATE TO BRING THIS MISSION TO ITS CONCLUSION “
Christ 1) first of God creation;
2) Col 1:19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him,3)Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy.
4)Col 1:22 But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation—
5)Col 1:23 if you continue in your faith, established and firm, not moved from the hope held out in the gospel. This is the gospel that you heard and that has been proclaimed to every creature under heaven, and of which I, Paul, have become a servant.
Hi Pierre:
Your post above has nothing to do with what I am discussing with mike.
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2013,08:21) Hi Marty, 1 Corinthians 12:3
……that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed……But also consider the NETNotes on this following verse:
Deuteronomy 21:23
His body shall not remain all night upon the tree, but thou shalt in any wise bury him that day; (for he that is hanged is accursed of God;) that thy land be not defiled, which the Lord thy God giveth thee for an inheritance.The idea behind the phrase cursed by God seems to be not that the person was impaled because he was cursed, but that to leave him exposed there was to invite the curse of God upon the whole land.
Why this would be so is not clear, though the rabbinic idea that even a criminal is created in the image of God may give some clue.
Paul cites this text (see Gal 3:13) to make the point that Christ, suspended from a cross, thereby took upon himself the curse associated with such a display of divine wrath and judgment.
I see the point you are making, and the reasons and scriptures behind it. But I personally believe Jesus began to quote Psalm 22 to point people to the fact that the prophecy in that psalm was being fulfilled before their very eyes.
Nor will I ever believe that God would forsake His only begotten Son – who had done nothing but faithfully follow God's commands.
Once again, we interpret scripture differently.
Hi Mike:Look at what is in the parenthesis of the verse that you quoted, and here is another scripture:
Quote
Gal 3:13Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:
Love in Christ,
MartyQuote (942767 @ Oct. 02 2013,05:39) Hi Pierre: Your post above has nothing to do with what I am discussing with mike.
Love in Christ,
Marty
i understand
Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 02 2013,07:54) Quote (Wakeup @ Oct. 01 2013,03:36) Quote (mikeboll64 @ Oct. 01 2013,11:52) Wakeup, If he is the Word OF God, and can be WITH God, then he is not actually God Himself.
To me, this is simple God-given common sense.
True:Because we and the angels are commanded to worship
him; Does not make him Jehovah.
You're confusing me, Wakeup. Do you believe the Word IS Jehovah, or someone other than Jehovah?It seems that you are saying each one of those things in various posts.
Don be confused/it will get clearer.Jehovah's Word,**remains** Jehova's word,for ever.
Jehovah possesses his Word inside his mind.
Jehovah created all things not with his hands;
but with just *commanding* it to to be. By just willing it.
And his Word will say it.(LET THERE BE LIGHT; AND THERE WAS LIGHT).
(JEHOVAH'S IMAGE SPOKE AT JEHOVAH'S *WILL* ONLY).But before all things; He brought forth out of himself
his Word, and made *Him* at will,*his image*.The image of Jehovah was brought *out* of Jehovah,at will.
And He is Jehovah's *LIVING* Word. All things are made
by/through Him.His power is Jehovah's will. Without Jehovah's will
He can not do anything.
Then; Jehovah will's him to come down to earth as a simple man. And also speaks AT Jehovah's will,and *DOES* at Jehovah's will. It is *He* that died on the cross.Not Jehovah.It will be *HIM* coming back in the clouds,at Jehovahs will. (Sit thou at my right hand untill; I(Jehovah) MAKE YOUR ENEMIES YOUR FOOTSTOOL.
He is waiting for the command to come down again with
the wrath of Jehovah.If it's still not clear,let me know.
It took me many years,before I could see.wakeup.
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