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Quote (kerwin @ Nov. 21 2009,10:33) Ed J, By restricting God's Law to the Ten Commandments you are violating God's command not to add or take away from the law. That is not wise.
Galatians 5:19-21(KJV) reads:
Quote Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,
Idolatry, witchcraft, hatred, variance, emulations, wrath, strife, seditions, heresies,
Envyings, murders, drunkenness, revellings, and such like: of the which I tell you before, as I have also told you in time past, that they which do such things shall not inherit the kingdom of God.
I ask you “where is drukeness, revellings, wrath, strife, seditions, witchcraft, hatred, uncleanness, and lasciviousness banned in the Ten Commandments?”
You have a valid point there.Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 20 2009,20:16) Were the 10 commandments done away with? Of course NOT!
Deut.6:1-2 Now these are the “commandments”, the “statutes”, and the “judgments”,
which the LORD(YHVH) your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it:
That thou mightest fear the LORD thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments,
which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.In the mount of transfiguration we find three people who illustrate these three.
Moses: The Commandments; “10” in Old Testament, “2” in New Testament.
Elijah: The Judgments; rewards and punishments.
Jesus: The Statues; Jesus fulfilled the statues(contained in ordinances), and done away with them.Eph.2:15: Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace.
God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Did he do away with the law itself or the “EMNITY” of the law?Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 21 2009,03:42) Quote (georg @ Nov. 21 2009,17:56) Exodus 34:28 So He was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights, He neither ate bread or drank water. And He wrote the words of the covenant the Ten Commandments.
We are under a New Covenanat in
Luke 22:19 …”This cup is the new covenant in My Blood, which is shed for you.”
And He gave us the greatest commandments in
Math. 22:37 “You shall love your God with all of your heart and all of your soul, and all of your mind.
verse 38
“This is the first and great commandment.
verse 39
“And the second is like it;” You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”
verse 40
“On these two commandments hang all of the Law and the Prophets.”
These commandments are all that Jesus gave us, are the same as the old covenant except the Sabbath. We were never under that commandment. It was a sign between God and Israel.
Exodus 31:16 “Therfore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath throughout their generation as a perpetual covenant.
verse 17
“It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever….
There you have it.
Peace and Love Irene
Hi Irene,With Love in our hearts, the 10 commandments can be illustrated as Jesus taught by only 2;
and they are easy to keep because it is our hearts desire to keep them!Heb.10:15-17 Whereof the Holy Spirit also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,
This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord,
I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Cool,Quote (georg @ Nov. 20 2009,22:56) Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 21 2009,15:16) Were the 10 commandments done away with? Of course NOT!
Deut.6:1-2 Now these are the “commandments”, the “statutes”, and the “judgments”,
which the LORD(YHVH) your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it:
That thou mightest fear the LORD thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments,
which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.In the mount of transfiguration we find three people who illustrate these three.
Moses: The Commandments; “10” in Old Testament, “2” in New Testament.
Elijah: The Judgments; rewards and punishments.
Jesus: The Statues; Jesus fulfilled the statues(contained in ordinances), and done away with them.Eph.2:15: Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace.
God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Exodus 34:28 So He was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights, He neither ate bread or drank water. And He wrote the words of the covenant the Ten Commandments.
We are under a New Covenanat in
Luke 22:19 …”This cup is the new covenant in My Blood, which is shed for you.”
And He gave us the greatest commandments in
Math. 22:37 “You shall love your God with all of your heart and all of your soul, and all of your mind.
verse 38
“This is the first and great commandment.
verse 39
“And the second is like it;” You shall love your neighbor as yourself.”
verse 40
“On these two commandments hang all of the Law and the Prophets.”
These commandments are all that Jesus gave us, are the same as the old covenant except the Sabbath. We were never under that commandment. It was a sign between God and Israel.
Exodus 31:16 “Therfore the children of Israel shall keep the Sabbath throughout their generation as a perpetual covenant.
verse 17
“It is a sign between Me and the children of Israel forever….
There you have it.
Peace and Love IreneQuote Reflections on G-d's Law 1. Do not have other gods.
Who is like G-d? He knows everything. He knows what happened in the past and what will happen in the future. He hears all of our thoughts. There was never a time when He did not exist. He is everywhere, and yet He is present with us in a personal way. He provides for all our needs. His plans for us are all good. He is our Father. We are His beloved children. Do not have other gods.
2. Do not have idols.
An idol is anything other than G-d that we worship and reverence. An idol is anything that we allow to supplant G-d's rightful place in our life. We have chosen an idol when we follow someone who tells us to do something that is against what G-d has told us in the Bible. We have chosen an idol when we give the first fruits of our labor to anything other than G-d. Having an idol is like someone who is married who takes a ring from someone other than their spouse and places it on one of their fingers. Do not have idols.
3. Do not misuse the Lord's name.
G-d's name represents His character. To use His name along with unclean or careless expression is no different than what the Babylonians did when they filled the golden utensils from G-d's temple with beer and wine, and then drank from them during their partying. They had no knowledge of or respect for G-d. God's name is something Christians take on in the same way a wife takes on the name of her husband. Misusing G-d's name occurs when we claim to be a Christian, but we live a life contrary to His character. Do not misuse the Lord's name.
4. Keep the 7th-day Sabbath (Saturday) holy.
The Sabbath is a weekly remembrance of G-d as the Creator. As we reflect on the wonders of His creation, we more fully appreciate His unseen qualities. The Sabbath is a day to set aside the cares and demands of the world and to rest in the spiritual dimension–a dimension that is sadly repressed during the other days of the week. The Sabbath is a day for family bonding and collective worship. The Sabbath is a day for healing and ministry to those who are in need. The Sabbath is a day for sharing the knowledge of G-d with those who do not know Him. G-d separated the 7th day for a holy purpose, a regular period of spiritual refreshment. Seventh-day Sabbath keeping is an identification mark of God's remnant people. Keep the 7th-day Sabbath holy.
5. Honor your parents.
The parent-child relationship is a significant part of G-d's creative plan. We are deeply thankful for the love and joy of this sacred heritage. Our parents have cared for us tenderly and unwaveringly. When we disappoint them or rebel, they are always ready to forgive and to restore. Who we are and what we know has been deeply shaped by their loving influence. They have nourished us with our most precious treasure–our personal knowledge of Jesus. Honor your parents.
6. Do not kill.
The greatest gift of all is the gift of life, which we have all received from G-d the Creator. From the infant in her mother's womb to the aged man who is in the grip of death, life is sacred. The greatest form of robbery is to take someone's life. We would not want someone to come and kill us. How brutal and beastly that would be. Likewise, we must be careful that we do not kill another. The Bible tells us that hate is a form of murder. The only difference between a seed and the grown tree is time. Do not kill.
7. Do not commit adultery.
During the first week, when G-d instituted the weekly Sabbath remembrance, He also instituted the marriage relationship between a man and a woman. In the Bible, G-d tells us that the relationship between a husband and his wife is patterned after the relationship that Jesus has with His bride–the church. Just like we are to be faithful to G-d, so are we to be faithful to our spouse. Jesus told us that lustful thoughts are a form of adultery. A husband and a wife are not to have a marriage kind of relationship with anyone else. To help prevent problems, the Bible tells us that husbands and wives are to continue to be kind and loving to each other so that neither feels neglected. Do not commit adultery.
8. Do not steal.
The 4th commandment tells us we are to work six days every week. G-d provides for all our needs, but He does expect us to do our part through working. If we need something, we are to work for it, rather than taking it by force or in secret. We would not want someone to take something from us that we had worked very hard to earn. Neither should we steal from another person. The first fruits of all our labors are to be given back to G-d. If we neglect to do this, then we are stealing from G-d. God has also given us talents that we are to use to help build His kingdom. If we keep them buried and idle, then we are also stealing from G-d. Do not steal.
9. Do not give false testimony.
We are not to tell lies or make up false stories about other people. Neither should we participate in conversations where these kinds of stories are being promote
d. If we do not know whether something we hear is true or not, we should not spread it around to others. Sometimes, when we do something wrong, we try to place the blame on someone else. This is wrong. Do not give false testimony.10. Do not covet.
Coveting is selfish and greedy. We should not want to get something that belongs to someone else. We should not want anything that God has forbidden. Coveting leads to stealing, adultery, false witness, disobedience of authority, and murder. Coveting is the root cause of all sin. We should be thankful for and satisfied with what G-d has provided for us. We should make the most of what we have. Do not covet.
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 21 2009,16:38) hi to all Group: Members
Posts: 222
Joined: Oct. 2009 Posted: Nov. 22 2009,11:29——————————————————————————–
hi to all,first to Const.in your statement i understand “that some folks ad access to the holy spirit of christ “under the law or before christ coming.
i agree with that.now you also said if i understand it correctly that the sabath as to be observed as christian,here i disagree with you.
you also said that the new convenant as nothing to do with the old one or moses law or convenant,
so this is wath i believe;
first Jesus said he came and fullfill the law,
secondly Jesus said that not yota from the law will be taking away, this seams contredict in a sense,it does totaly not contredict it self because Christ is talking of two different laws,
1) the law of Moses implying the ten commandements.
2) wen he talks abode that, he came to fullfill the law, this was the law of resque,to safe man from the condemnation to deth herithen from adam,now the prophetes have written abode all the things the the messaia will have to go trough ,this is so that the true believer may recognise the Christ, wath they did, in the law it is said that the one who accomplish the law will live through te law,this is wath christ came to accomplish,regarding the law of moses ten commandement ,well someone all ready mention that for Chritians (true)walking in the spirit will free you from the law ,this does not mean that the law is abolished ,it means that the is made for the sinners,and will be applied if required,but as for christians righteousness they are not under the law because of there good deeds according to the spirit of Christ.
now as for the sabath ;the sabath in law was introdused by God to free man for one full day and in that day do not anything for themselfs
but think abode there devotion in God.so for christians the sabath is 24/7 nite and day at the service of God trough Christ there is no more separation in your labor ,your thinking or anything else,you are totaly comitted to God,(or should be )so observing the moses sabath is reducing your comittement to God.
if anyone can prove otherwise please let me know,I be glad to improve the truth in my heart.
————–
PR
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Report this post to a moderator115 replies since Oct. 25 2009,08:01
The Fourth Commandment (Keep Seventh-day Sabbath (Saturday))Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy G-d: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it. (Ex 20:8-11)
“Remember”
The Sabbath commandment is the only one that includes a special admonition to remember it.
In spite of this warning, the Sabbath commandment is now widely misunderstood and abandoned.
“keep it holy”
The Sabbath is kept holy by setting aside the usual secular activites.
We are to set aside work. (Ex 16:4,5,19-30,35, Ex 20:10, Ps 46:10, Jer 17:21,22)
We are to set aside buying and selling. (Ne 10:29-31, Ne 13:15-22)
We are to set aside worldly pleasure. (Isa 58:13)
The Sabbath is kept holy by focusing on spiritual activites.
We are to focus on our relationship with Yeshua. (Mt 11:28,29)
We are to worship together with our family and other believers. (Lev 23:3)
Note on Lev 23:3: Convocation – “An assembly.” (Webster's Dictionary 1828)
Doing good deeds is OK, this is not considered work. (Mt 12:9-12, Mk 1:21,29-31, Mk 3:1-5, Lk 13:10-16, Lk 14:1-6)
Work that is absolutely necessary is OK. (Mt 12:11, Mk 2:23-27, Lk 13:15, Lk 14:5, Jn 5:8-11)
As much as possible, we are to prepare ahead of time so that Sabbath work is avoided. (Ex 16:22,23, Lk 23:54, Mk 15:42)
“the seventh day”
The Sabbath is the seventh day (Saturday).
There has never been a change to the calendar that has altered which day is the seventh day of the week.
There is no command in the Bible to change the Sabbath from Saturday to Sunday.
Gd intended the Sabbath to be an eternal memorial of the creation. (Ex 31:16,17)
The Sabbath will continue to be kept in Heaven. (Isa 66:22,23)
Biblical days go from sundown to sundown. (Ge 1:5,8,13,19,23,31, Lev 23:27,32, Nu 19:16,19 compare Lev 22:6,7, Ne 13:19, Mk 1:21,29,32 compare Mt 12:10)
The Sabbath begins at sundown Friday and ends at sundown on Saturday.
Yeshua kept the Sabbath. (Lk 4:16)
Yeshua was crucified on Friday, the day of preparation for the Sabbath. (Lk 23:52-54)
Yeshua “rested” in the grave on the Sabbath. (Lk 23:55,56)
Yeshua rose to work on Sunday, the first day of the week. (Mk 16:9, Lk 24:1,2)
The Apostles Kept the Sabbath
The apostles kept the Sabbath while Yeshua was on the earth, since they followed Yeshua.
The apostles continued to keep the Sabbath after the resurrection. (Ac 13:13,14,42,44, Ac 16:13-15, Ac 17:2, Ac 18:4,11)
Yeshua indicated that the Sabbath would still be kept after His resurrection. (Mt 24:7,8,20)
The Early Church Kept the Sabbath
Upon being threatened by the Jewish leaders, the early church quoted in unison from the 4th commandment. (Ac 4:21-24)
The controversy over circumcision is mentioned in the new testament. (see Ac 15:1-31)
No controversy, whatsoever, is reported about Sabbath observance in the new testament.
“blessed the sabbath day”
G-d made the Sabbath day a unique day of blessing and joy. (Isa 56:2, Isa 58:13,14, Jer 17:24,25)
“hallowed the sabbath day”
G-d made the Sabbath day a unique holy day, to be different from the other days. (Lev 10:10, Eze 22:26, Eze 44:23,24)
The punishment for disobedience is death. (Ex 31:14,15, Ex 35:2, Nu 15:32-36, Ro 6:23, Jas 2:10)
As our substitute, Yeshua paid the penalty for our sins. (Isa 53:6, Jn 1:29, Eph 5:2, Heb 7:27, Heb 10:5-10)
The Sabbath Commandment Proclaims G-d as the Creator
The Sabbath commandment proclaims G-d as the Creator. (Ex 20:11, Ps 19:1, Ps 97:6, Rev 14:6,7)
The Sabbath Commandment Builds our Relationship with Yeshua
The Sabbath commandment builds our relationship with Yeshua. (Mt 11:28,29, Mk 2:27, Jn 17:3)
G-d prescribed two extra sacrificial lambs, representing a double gift of Yeshua, on each Sabbath. (Nu 28:1-10)
The Sabbath Commandment Identifies G-d's Remnant People
The Sabbath commandment identifies G-d's remnant people. (Eze 20:12,20, Ex 31:13,16,17, Jn 14:15, 1Jn 2:3,4, 1Jn 5:3, Rev 12:17, Rev 14:12, Rev 22:14)
Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: But the seventh day is the sabbath of the LORD thy G-d: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: For in six days the LORD made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.
The Seventh Day is the Sabbath
The seventh day is the Sabbath. (Ex 20:10)
The forty year double miracle of manna (Ex 16:4,5,19-30,35)
We must distinguish between the holy and the common. (Eze 22:26,31)
Any other day is not acceptable.
hi to all
Col 2:14 having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross.
Col 2:15 And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.
Col 2:16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Col 2:17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in ChristCould you explain to me how to understand this scripture from Paul ??
Quote (Constitutionalist @ Nov. 23 2009,12:42) Quote (Ed J @ Nov. 20 2009,20:16) Were the 10 commandments done away with? Of course NOT!
Deut.6:1-2 Now these are the “commandments”, the “statutes”, and the “judgments”,
which the LORD(YHVH) your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it:
That thou mightest fear the LORD thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments,
which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.In the mount of transfiguration we find three people who illustrate these three.
Moses: The Commandments; “10” in Old Testament, “2” in New Testament.
Elijah: The Judgments; rewards and punishments.
Jesus: The Statues; Jesus fulfilled the statues(contained in ordinances), and done away with them.Eph.2:15: Having abolished in his flesh the enmity, even the law of commandments contained in ordinances; for to make in himself of twain one new man, so making peace.
God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
Did he do away with the law itself or the “EMNITY” of the law?
Hi Irene,He didn't do away with ANY PART of the law, with the only acceptation showing that The Sabbath
was a Spiritual rest rather that a physical one; we have two days a week rest in this country.He fulfilled the “statutes” contained in “ordinances”(like the blood ordinance); because they were a description of Him(Jesus).
He also instituted the New “Testament”=117 of “GOD The Father”=117;
because “Jesus Christ”=151 was “the testator”=151!This was first spoken of by Jeremiah the profit, and was fulfilled in the writings of the Apostle Paul in Hebrews!
Jer.31:33-34 But this shall be the covenant(Testament) that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD,
I will put my law(the whole law) in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and “will be”=63 their God(YHVH=63), and they shall be my people.
And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me,
from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.Heb.10:15-19 Whereof the “Holy Spirit”=151 also is a witness to us(John 5:32,5:36):
for after that he had said before(Jer.31:33-34), This is the covenant(Testament) that I will make with them after those days,
saith the Lord, I will put my laws(the whole law) into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;
And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more. Now where remission of these is, there is no more offering for sin.
Having therefore, brethren, boldness to enter into the holiest by the blood of “Jesus”=74(God blood=74).God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 23 2009,16:48) Hi ED,
You mean the law that God gave to the Jews?
Hi Nick,By laws, do you mean the “Commandments”?
By laws, do you mean the “Judgments”?
By laws, do you mean the “statutes” contained in “ordinances”?There are three different aspects of “The Law”; they are…
Deut.6:1-2 Now these are the “commandments”, the “statutes”, and the “judgments”,
which the LORD(YHVH) your God commanded to teach you, that ye might do them in the land whither ye go to possess it:
That thou mightest fear the LORD thy God, to keep all his statutes and his commandments,
which I command thee, thou, and thy son, and thy son's son, all the days of thy life; and that thy days may be prolonged.In the mount of transfiguration (the three aspects of the law) were illustrated in three people.
Moses: The Commandments; “10” in Old Testament, “2” in New Testament.
Elijah: The Judgments; rewards and punishments.
Jesus: The Statues; Jesus fulfilled the statues(contained in ordinances), and done away with them.So Jesus “only” done away with the “statues” (part of the law) contained in ordinances;
though He(Jesus) fulfilled all three aspects of “The Law”.This point very few “Christians” are aware of; that’s why I started the thread!
God bless
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgEd J……….The commandments will never be done away with, they are the way life works for ever, they are fulfilled by the Spirit of GOD. When we are impregnated with His Seed (holy spirit) it begins to Produce His life in us, and doing the commandments is the natural fruit of that life. “For all the commandments IE (the law) are fulfilled in one word You shall Love your neighbor”. Love fulfills every requirement in the Law Perfectly. Love does not do away with them, it fulfills them. If you have been given GOD seed in you (IT) will produce His nature in you, you then have been born from above, Your thinking has been changed you can say with Jesus we are from above and indeed you who have His seed in you are born from above. IMO
love and peace to you and yours…………………gene
Quote (Gene @ Nov. 24 2009,03:17) Ed J……….The commandments will never be done away with, they are the way life works for ever, they are fulfilled by the Spirit of GOD. When we are impregnated with His Seed (holy spirit) it begins to Produce His life in us, and doing the commandments is the natural fruit of that life. “For all the commandments IE (the law) are fulfilled in one word You shall Love your neighbor”. Love fulfills every requirement in the Law Perfectly. Love does not do away with them, it fulfills them. If you have been given GOD seed in you (IT) will produce His nature in you, you then have been born from above, Your thinking has been changed you can say with Jesus we are from above and indeed you who have His seed in you are born from above. IMO love and peace to you and yours…………………gene
Hi Gene,You help add clarity to the point.
I think this thread was necessary;
as most Christians lack clarity on this issue.God Bless you Gene, thanks.
Ed J
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgG,
Only those who produce a profit on what God invests in them are useful to Him.
We must be soil that soaks up the rain and does not shed it.
Dead branches are cut off.To All,
The Law is not imposition to those who walk according to the ways of the Spirit as the fruit of the spirit is obedience to the commandments of God.
The problem is that the letter kills and the spirit gives life. If you adhere to the letter of the law to the point where you violate its spirit then you are disobeying God. That is why God states that he desires love and not Sacrifice.
Quote (kerwin @ Nov. 24 2009,10:29) To All, The Law is not imposition to those who walk according to the ways of the Spirit as the fruit of the spirit is obedience to the commandments of God.
The problem is that the letter kills and the spirit gives life. If you adhere to the letter of the law to the point where you violate its spirit then you are disobeying God. That is why God states that he desires love and not Sacrifice.
Hi Kerwin,Do you think this thread is helpful?
Your last sentence is from Hosea 6:6…
“For I desired mercy, and not sacrifice;
and the knowledge of God more than burnt offerings.”hi gene here is my response
2Ti 3:1 But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days.
2Ti 3:2 People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy,
2Ti 3:3 without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good,
2Ti 3:4 treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God—
2Ti 3:5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
2Ti 3:6 They are the kind who worm their way into homes and gain control over weak-willed women, who are loaded down with sins and are swayed by all kinds of evil desires,
2Ti 3:7 always learning but never able to acknowledge the truth.
This is what I found in the scriptures ;
Sinse we are looking at what is true ;gene you have told me this
All……….many find trouble with the Sabbath commandment, because they look at it from a Physical stand point, and fail to see the spiritual significance of it, The Sabbath (SPIRITUALLY) picture the salvation process, we all must enter in our rests in order to be saved. What do i mean by that? It is God must put our wills to death and cause (HIS WILL) to be done in our Hearts and Minds, “FOR IT IS GOD WHO WORKS IN YOU (BOTH) TO (WILL) AND DO OF HIS GOOD PLEASURE. Notice who is doing the work in you (GOD) so two Wills cant be done at the same time right, so when are will are put to (rest) and God's will is working in us , then we are following Him and His will is being done. remember when Jesus said they (kingdom) come (how?), by THY WILL being DONE. Get it? The Sabbath picture this Spiritual process and is never done away with it is how salvation operates it is eternal. IMOpeace amd love to you all…………………….gene
terraricca………..No the is not it, You couldn't be further from the truth. GOD is the beginning of (EVERYTHING) THAT EXISTS, NO MATTER WHAT OR WHO IT IS. GOD created (ALL) GOOD and EVIL (KNOWLEDGE) and placed in front of Man. And all of man by His so-called “free will Choices” , which was not (FREE at ALL) but (INFLUENCED) Choice buy the INFLUENCED will of an ADVERSARIAL SPIRIT. Man did not have the character or Knowledge to resist that (influenced will). Free Will theology is False there is no such thinf as free will, If i offer you a peace of Cherry or Apple Pie for you to chose from , which ever one you chose is (Not) the result of (FREE) Will its the result of the most influenced in you that causes you to Chose , you chose the one you liked the best , Nothing Free at all about that . Just preexisting Knowledge guiding you through and you will. All Will are (INFLUENCED WILLS That sums it up in a nut shell. IMO
I will start with this verse of the bible
2Co 11:3 But I am afraid that just as Eve was deceived by the serpent’s cunning, your minds may somehow be led astray from your sincere and pure devotion to ChristAnd Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner
This to me shows they were influents’ but they ad the power and will to not lessen and not to follow, Adam decision to eat the fruit was is own free will (free meaning he was not forced into it by anyone )and his own decisionJas 1:13 When tempted, no one should say, “God is tempting me.” For God cannot be tempted by evil, nor does he tempt anyone;
Jas 1:14 but each one is tempted when, by his own evil desire, he is dragged away and enticed.
Jas 1:15 Then, after desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, gives birth to death.
Jas 1:16 Don’t be deceived, my dear brothers.
Jas 1:17 Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights, who does not change like shifting shadows.
Jas 1:18 He chose to give us birth through the word of truth, that we might be a kind of first fruits of all he created
Because of man sin, God locked men into a world of vanity ,until God time, to bring salvation trough is son Jesus Christ.Jas 1:21 Therefore, get rid of all moral filth and the evil that is so prevalent and humbly accept the word planted in you, which can save you.
Jas 1:22 Do not merely listen to the word, and so deceive yourselves. Do what it says.
Jas 1:23 Anyone who listens to the word but does not do what it says is like a man who looks at his face in a mirror
Jas 1:24 and, after looking at himself, goes away and immediately forgets what he looks like.
Jas 1:25 But the man who looks intently into the perfect law that gives freedom, and continues to do this, not forgetting what he has heard, but doing it—he will be blessed in what he does
And this is what Peter as to say;precious to him— 1Pe 2:4 As you come to him, the living Stone—rejected by men but chosen by God and
1Pe 2:5 you also, like living stones, are being built into a spiritual house to be a holy priesthood, offering spiritual sacrifices acceptable to God through Jesus Christ
They stumble because they disobey the message2Th 2:14 He called you to this through our gospel, that you might share in the glory of our Lord Jesus Christ.
2Th 2:15 So then, brothers, stand firm and hold to the teachings we passed on to you, whether by word of mouth or by2Th 3:6 In the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, we command you, brothers, to keep away from every brother who is idle and does not live according to the teaching you received from us.
Tit 3:1 Remind the people to be subject to rulers and authorities, to be obedient, to be ready to do whatever is good
2Ti 2:15 Do your best to present yourself to God as one approved, a workman who does not need to be ashamed and who correctly handles the word of truth
2Ti 2:19 Nevertheless, God’s solid foundation stands firm, sealed with this inscription: “The Lord knows those who are his,” and, “Everyone who confesses the name of the Lord must turn away from wickedness.”
2Ti 3:1 But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days.
2Ti 3:2 People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy,
2Ti 3:3 without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good,
2Ti 3:4 treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God—
2Ti 3:5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with them.
2Ti 3:6 They are the kind who worm their way into homes and gain control over weak-willed women, who are loaded down with sins and are swayed by all kinds of evil desires,
2Ti 3:7 always learning but never able to acknowledge the truth.So gene ,
Your theory that there is no will of choice in your decision making is wrong.
The apostels request that you should obey ,or there will be no blessing from GodSo look in to it ,
terricca……….Do you profess GOD and then Deny HIS Power , by saying it is up to Us to (Chose) righteousness by our (OWN so-called “FREE WILL” choices. AS if GOD is really unable to Produce HOLY Righteous Character in US BY the (POWER) of HIS Spirits. ARE you letting this mind be in YOU that was in Christ Jesus our Lord, when you attribute you salvation to (YOUR) Works of “FREE WILL”> If you are follwing Jesus then YOU will put YOUR WILL to DEATH as HE did. If this (MIND) be in you it will also quicken you Mortal body. Just like (IT) did Jesus. If you are born from above you nature has been changed and you have been transformed by the renewing of you mind (thinking), you new Nature consents to the will of GOD. Just that simple. why make so difficult on yourself and others.
You have listed a hold bunch of conditions of People in the latter days, BUT the question remains who are these people are the those Born from above (NO) they are of the earth earthly and do the thing of the carnal minds in them, it is what is influencing them. Not so-called free wills at work at all, they are held captive by there natures they can't escape there condition no matter how hard they try, until the are born from above, neither can we if we are not born from above. Paul was describing the condition the world be in to Timothy in the latter days, and that condition does already exist even now.
Terraccia…………Where did i say no WILL of Choice was not involved? What i said was there is no Such thing as FREE WILL Choice, your mixing up my word , we certainly have Choice of Will, If God's will is in you It will (cause ) you to choose what GOD would Choose. But these are all (CAUSED) WILL CHOICES Not “FREE WILL” Choices at all. Pride in man wants His success to be based on His decisions rather then GOD”S Decision. So they Attribute their works to the own (FREE WILL) Choices, and leave GOD out of the Picture as if they attained there own salvation.
You seem to continue to try to Justify (SELF) Works, as if some how i am saying we should not walk in Gods commandments, How can we Help not walking in the way of GOD, if GOD Seed Has be deposited (IN) you, you new nature will influence YOU , The love of GOD shed around in our Hearts (CAUSES) us to Produce fruits of the Spirit, None of our So-Called (FREE) Will choices exist, Just influenced Choices exist.
terraricca………..There is no point of our discussion if you fail to acknowledge the Posted Scripture i posted for you, You seem to just ignorer them and continue with your personal belief system. IMO
peace and love to you and yours……………..gene
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Nov. 22 2009,18:09) Hi CON,
Does it seem right to impose OT law on those led by the Spirit?
It is not an imposition.Only you make it out as one.
Quote (terraricca @ Nov. 22 2009,19:25) hi to all Col 2:14 having canceled the written code, with its regulations, that was against us and that stood opposed to us; he took it away, nailing it to the cross.
Col 2:15 And having disarmed the powers and authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them by the cross.
Col 2:16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Col 2:17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in ChristCould you explain to me how to understand this scripture from Paul ??
Colossians 2:14-17 Deals with the “Ceremonial” law.The “law of commandments contained in ordinances” refers to the ceremonial law. (compare Ex 12:43, Nu 9:12, Col 2:14,17)
The law “abolished in his flesh” refers to the ceremonial law. Yeshua is the sole sacrifice for sin to Whom it pointed. (Jn 1:29, Heb 10:1-4,11,19,20, 1Pe 2:24)
The “handwriting of ordinances” clearly identifies this law as the ceremonial law.
The remark that this law was “against us” further identifies this as the ceremonial law.
The ceremonial law written by Moses was placed on the side of the ark. (Dt 31:24-26)
The stone tablets, moral law, written by God's own finger, was placed inside the ark. (Ex 40:20, Heb 9:4)
The post-context remarks that this law was a “shadow of things to come” and “the body is of the Messiah” further identifies this as the ceremonial law. (Col 2:14,17)
Is the law the old covenant? (Heb 8:1-13) No
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