Are there two Spirits or One?

The Holy Spirit is a spirit, but is the Father also a spirit?

Well we know that the Father is God and God is spirit. The Father is the Father of all spirits and life. The Father is also the father of our Lord Jesus Christ? But the gospels tell us that the Holy Spirit came upon Mary and because of this, the child was to be called the Son of God. So who is the Father of the Lord Jesus Christ, the Father or the Holy Spirit?

Luke 1:35
The angel answered and said to her, “The Holy Spirit will come upon you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you; and for that reason the holy Child shall be called the Son of God.

The answer is that both are the father if the Trinity Doctrine is to be believed. However, I will demonstrate that the Spirit of God is the Father’s own spirit and is not another person as many believe.

1 Peter 1:14-16
Be obedient to God, and do not allow your lives to be shaped by those desires you had when you were still ignorant. Instead, be holy in all that you do, just as God who called you is holy. The scripture says, “Be holy because I am holy.”

John 4:24
God is spirit, and his worshipers must worship in the Spirit and in truth.”

So God is holy and God is a spirit, thus he can be described as a holy spirit. However, we are also taught that there is one spirit, so God is more correctly called ‘the Holy Spirit’, not as one holy spirit among two or many. If the Trinity Doctrine were true, then there would be two Spirits, the Father and the Holy Spirit. But scripture tells us there is but one Spirit.

Ephesians 4:4-6
There is one body and one Spirit, just as you were called to one hope when you were called; 5 one Lord, one faith, one baptism; one God and Father of all, who is over all and through all and in all.

Further, scripture clearly says that “The LORD is the Spirit”, thus the Father who is God is the Spirit. Most agree that the Father is the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit took part in his conception with Mary. If the Holy Spirit was another person, then Jesus would have two fathers, the Father and the Holy Spirit. That is if the Trinity Doctrine was a true doctrine.

2 Corinthians 3:17
Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom.

Also, if God is Spirit and he imparts his spirit into redeemed vessels, and if he will eventually be in all and through all, then that would suggest that God the Father will inhabit all by his own spirit. And we know he is the God of the living not the dead, so his spirit is life and the source of all life for his creation and also for his son. So creation is not inhabited by two spirits but one, that is God’s own spirit.

1 Corinthians 15:28
When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

Luke 20:38
He is not the God of the dead, but of the living, for to him all are alive.”

John 6:63
The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing.

Finally, we are taught in scripture that he is the Father of spirits.

Hebrews 12:9
Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live!

For me I think of this in this way.

Q: Who is God?
A: The Father?

Q: What is God?
A: He is spirit

God is the Father and God is the Holy Spirit. This is not two persons but two aspects of the same God. While God is in heaven, he can inhabit all creation by his own spirit. Just as the sun is located in the centre of the Solar System, its rays shine out to all the Solar System. Similarly, our Heavenly Father can inhabit all creation by his spirit. However as an aside, God’s own creation is not even big enough to contain him. He exists outside the cosmos too.

1 Corinthians 15:27-28
For he “has put everything under his feet.” Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

1 Kings 8:27
“But will God really dwell on earth? The heavens, even the highest heaven, cannot contain you. How much less this temple I have built!

So God the Father can inhabit his creation by his own spirit.

This also makes sense when we read the following:

Matthew 12:32
Anyone who speaks a word against the Son of Man will be forgiven, but anyone who speaks against the Holy Spirit will not be forgiven, either in this age or in the age to come.

It is worse to speak against the Spirit than it is against the Son. This demonstrates to us that God is above the son and even his Spirit is above his son because the Spirit of God is God and the son of God is the Son and we know that the head of Christ is God in the same way that the head of man is Christ.

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Posts
August 4, 2015 at 8:09 am#801630
terraricca
Participant
Princess
in all honesty T once I pulled away from Christianity is when the running around like a chicken with it’s head cut off stopped!
well ,I stop running when I stop going to religion for the true knowledge ;
today I Have acquired enough knowledge (what increase continuously)that I don’t worry about tomorrow,and believe all those fake stories and never float in uncertainty ,do not fear dead, only my God and his son lost of love
August 4, 2015 at 10:13 am#801647
GeneBalthrop
Participant
Kerwin……I can honor anyone that does not mean I worship them. I believe T8 is wrong. I realize worship contains honor, in some aspects, but it certainly is not the exact same word. I don’t believe you believe it is either. IMO
peace and love to you and yours…………….gene
August 4, 2015 at 10:21 am#801648
kerwin
Participant
Gene,
It is not the same word but rather it means the same thing as honor in some uses. A thesaurus will reveal that much.
In this verse worship is used to mean honor as David is not God.
1 Chronicles 29:20Authorized (King James) Version (AKJV)
20 And David said to all the congregation, Now bless the Lord your God. And all the congregation blessed the Lord God of their fathers, and bowed down their heads, and worshipped the Lord, and the king.
August 4, 2015 at 1:04 pm#801663
Proclaimer
Participant
Let test your words @GeneBalthrop.
Kerwin……I can honor anyone that does not mean I worship them. I believe T8 is wrong. I realize worship contains honor, in some aspects, but it certainly is not the exact same word. I don’t believe you believe it is either. IMO
While you already understand that the word worship contains honour, let’s look at legitimate uses of the word ‘worship’ as it is scripturally applied to both God and Man.
Old Testament
God
‘Shachah’ is translated as worshiped in the following verse:
Genesis 24:26
Then the man bowed down and worshiped the LORD,
Man
‘Shachah’ is also used in relation to bowing down to King David in 1 Kings 1:23.
And they told the king, saying, Behold Nathan the prophet. And when he was come in before the king, he bowed himself before the king with his face to the ground.
New Testament
God
‘proskuneo’ is translated as worship in the following verse:
Revelation 7:11
All the angels were standing around the throne and around the elders and the four living creatures. They fell down on their faces before the throne and worshiped God,
Jesus
‘proskuneo’ is also translated as worshiped in the following verse:
Matthew 14:33
Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God.
Man
‘proskuneo’ is again translated as worshipped in the following verse:
Revelation 3:9
Behold, I will make them of the synagogue of Satan, which say they are Jews, and are not, but do lie; behold, I will make them to come and worship before thy feet, and to know that I have loved thee.
You see Gene. I didn’t come up with this stuff myself. It is simply observance of scripture and not trying to change the truth of that. It is the same word worship applied legitimately to God, Jesus, and man. Translators often use different English words for the same word ‘proskuneo’.
I await your rebuttal or admittance that you are wrong on this. Please don’t ignore it. It is good to get a resolution. People can learn from that.
Thanks.
August 4, 2015 at 1:15 pm#801665
princess
Participant
lost of love
the most beautiful words I have read. harmony when you speak them T, it is a truth just those words are not in scripture T……now what do we do?

August 4, 2015 at 1:34 pm#801671
terraricca
Participant
those words are in scriptures they are even part of the first commandment ,and
RO 8:35 Who will separate us from the love of Christ? Will tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
RO 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other created thing, will be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord
August 5, 2015 at 1:14 pm#801752
princess
Participant
T, you are a dear, the words are not found in scripture. it could be how you feel or express your love for Christ & God. does that make the words less truthful because they are not found in scripture? for some most definitely, for others they could relate, to some they may think you have gone mad. All in all T, it is you, who you are how you express your thought (in pure form).
parroting is for the birds, tell me what is your hearts desire that is where the real truth lays. Not chapter and verse. Truth has no age, no form of writing. it just is. we know it when we read it, hear it, sense it. we are human not in the flesh, human in nature.
August 5, 2015 at 1:35 pm#801753
terraricca
Participant
Princess
the truth is something we can live by if we do then we can talk and understand God words ,we are living in the flesh for our soul is of the spirit type ,so we have to make a choice living by the flesh or by the spirit ,the nature of human is a expression invented by those that live according to the flesh and enjoy it and so find satisfaction in it ,but this is not the truth and so not living by the truth ,you have to pick living by the spirit to come to the truth ,our senses are only tools just like our hands and legs
August 6, 2015 at 12:09 pm#801810
princess
Participant
when you speak of the flesh T, what do you mean?
the hand doesn’t steal, the foot doesn’t take the wrong path. to not have your spirit and flesh in line with each other, you will be in a constant Pauline state.

August 6, 2015 at 12:26 pm#801811
kerwin
Participant
Princess the conscious, subconscious. and unconscious minds but even they are linked to other parts of the physical, soulish, and spiritual human being.
August 6, 2015 at 1:31 pm#801812
terraricca
Participant
princess
the flesh is the external shell that needs to be taken care of ;like eating/sleeping/drinking/think/work/build/reproduction/socialise/communicate/remember things/defend from others/wear cloths/need shelter/live to stay alive ,and the alikes
the spirit soul in that flesh does not need any of those items except one THE FLESH BODY for without it the soul is dead (sleeps) the above items can make people slaves to their direct needs and wants and so live to what is called according to the flesh ,while living according to the spirit is doing for others what you want others do for you even if they do not do it ,resist the will and needs /wants of the flesh ,obey your creator for he knows what his creation needs above all things,true life
August 9, 2015 at 11:14 pm#801929
Proclaimer
Participant
the spirit soul in that flesh does not need any of those items except one THE FLESH BODY for without it the soul is dead (sleeps)
The spirit gives the soul life and the living soul animates the body. A body without a soul is a hunk of dad flesh. A soul without the spirit is not a living soul.
August 10, 2015 at 1:42 am#801935
wilsunphi
Participant
“If the Holy Spirit fathered Jesus”
Hi t8,
It has been a while. How have you been? (Congrats on the upgraded site btw.)
I was just skimming through the pages when i noticed the above quote. I feel using the word ‘fathered’ here is unbiblical because even though Mary became pregnant through the power of the Holy Spirit, the Father is the one who fathered Jesus. May seem like nitpicking, but felt using the word ‘fathered’ was wrong.
Wilson
August 10, 2015 at 4:39 am#801936
terraricca
Participant
t8

the soul is the spirit given by God to us all the living man or angels ,the body is to bring that soul to life ,

this is why it says “the soul that sin will die ” this is also why it says “do not live by the flesh wants” but by the spirit for either one can take over the soul,it is up to us to make the choice which
August 10, 2015 at 8:17 pm#801981
Proclaimer
Participant
terraicca, if we are to live by either the spirit or the flesh and can be led by either, then what part of us exactly can be led by the Spirit or by the flesh if we are only composed of spirit and flesh? Is the spirit led by itself and if the flesh dominates our life, then is the spirit led by the flesh? Or what?
August 10, 2015 at 8:21 pm#801982
Proclaimer
Participant
@wilsunphi
Yes I upgraded the site partially with some help from code that I was able to purchase. But there is a speed issue when lots of people are logged on at the same time. I am working through these issues one at ta time to get the site faster.
August 10, 2015 at 8:25 pm#801983
Proclaimer
Participant
Hi wilsunphi.
Yes I can see your point about the word fathered, because to father someone can mean to treat with the protective care associated with a father or assign the paternity of a child. (http://www.oxforddictionaries.com/definition/english/father)
Do you have a suggestion as to what word I could use?
The angel answered, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. So the holy one to be born will be called the Son of God.
Actually I am glad you brought this up because I noticed that it says, “the power of the Most High”. Is that a reference to the Holy Spirit or is the Holy Spirit and power of God two rather than the same?
August 11, 2015 at 1:11 am#801986
terraricca
Participant
led by the spirit of truth of God that is ;you seem mixing the spirit soul of man with the spirit of God ,
August 11, 2015 at 4:35 am#801988
wilsunphi
Participant
Hi t8,
The word fathered usually means that one person can be called the father of another. I felt i should point out that statement since only God the Father is called the father of Jesus in the Bible. We see in the Bible that in many places the Holy Spirit comes with the power of God. I haven’t arrived at a conclusion about the separate personhood of the Holy Spirit. From the Bible we see that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father, proceeds from the Father and rests on the Son. I prefer to closely stick to the text and not read beyond it, to prevent blaspheming. I also think taking a position on this matter is not necessary for salvation. As the Bible says
‘This is eternal life, that they may know You, the only true God, and Jesus Christ whom You have sent.’
August 11, 2015 at 9:16 am#801992
Proclaimer
Participant
Good stuff wilsunphi. I then just need a word that describes the Holy Spirit as replacing a natural father in the conception of the messiah. I chose fathered, but as you point out it can mean a number of things.
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