1 Peter 2: 6-8

1 Peter 2
6 For in Scripture it says: “See, I lay a stone in Zion, a chosen and precious cornerstone, and the one who trusts in him will never be put to shame.”
7 Now to you who believe, this stone is precious. But to those who do not believe, The stone the builders rejected has become the cornerstone,”
8 and,“A stone that causes people to stumble and a rock that makes them fall.”

The argument made here is that this text read with Isaiah 8:12-15 shows that Jesus is God. So let’s look at that scripture:

Isaiah 8:12-15
11 For Jehovah spake thus to me with a strong hand, and instructed me not to walk in the way of this people, saying,
12 Say ye not, A conspiracy, concerning all whereof this people shall say, A conspiracy; neither fear ye their fear, nor be in dread thereof .
13 Jehovah of hosts, him shall ye sanctify; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread.
14 And he shall be for a sanctuary; but for a stone of stumbling and for a rock of offence to both the houses of Israel, for a gin and for a snare to the inhabitants of Jerusalem.
15 And many shall stumble thereon, and fall, and be broken, and be snared, and be taken.

Okay so the argument is made that Jesus is called a stone and so is God.

The first obvious thing to point out is that when God decides to become something such as a rock of offense, he personally doesn’t turn up as that rock, but sends a messenger. We see in other scriptures that God is light, yet he sends Jesus into the world and Jesus proclaims that “he is the light of the world”. When Jesus is about to leave this world he passes on this mantle to us, (the Church) when he proclaimed, “You are the light of the world” in Matthew 5:14.

“You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden; 15nor does anyone light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on the lampstand, and it gives light to all who are in the house.…

So when God sent light into this dark world, he sent a messenger. If we conclude that God is light and Jesus is the light means that Jesus is God, then you also have to believe that we (the Church) are God. Thus if God refers to himself as a stone and sends Jesus who is identified as the stone, then that is not a valid proof that the verse means that Jesusis God.

Further, there is another main point that needs to be understood here. When you look at Isaiah 8:12-15, it becomes very clear that YHWH is actually talking about another as the rock and not himself. Read closely.

“See, I lay a stone in Zion,
a chosen and precious cornerstone,
and the one who trusts in him
will never be put to shame.”

Notice the words, “I lay a stone”. I guess that Trinitarians just read it as “I am this stone”. But it does not say that or refer to that.
Now notice the words “a chosen and precious cornerstone”. If God is the stone, then ask yourself who is the one who CHOSE the stone?

Again this so-called Trinity proof verse is easily exposed when you decide to read the text carefully and without bias. Obviously, our brother Peter doesn’t support the view that Jesus is God when he talks about Jesus being the stone that causes people to stumble.

← Go back to ‘Supporting the Trinity Doctrine‘.


Discussion

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  • #779721
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @kerwin

    Great, give it consideration. This understanding is common among Christians throughout Christendom.

    #779722
    kerwin
    Participant

    LU,

    Peter is using a Jewish interpretation method of the First Century that we of the modern era find confusing. He is not quoting the Isaiah 8:14 because Jesus is Jehovah but rather because it is true of Jesus. As far as I know you will not find one individual here who does not apply the words ” Sanctify the Lord of hosts himself; and let him be your fear, and let him be your dread” to Jesus because they know that Jesus teaches us that you cannot have God without Jesus and you cannot have Jesus without God. When you put you put your faith in Jesus Christ you must also put you faith in the one true God or your faith is false. Isaiah 8:12-15 is a passage of faith in God and how it becomes a stumbling block to the faithless and unfaithful.

    #779737
    terraricca
    Participant

    hi Kathi

    Is the ruler not a ruler if he is standing? He is only a ruler if he is sitting? hogwash

    why you ask if you going to call everything we tell you hogwash ?

    if you are submissive to the one that sit on the throne that , identify the one that is describe in charge does it

    #779747
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi LU,

    The Holy Spirit creates

    not men from earth.

    Ps 104

    #779749
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi LU,

    The Lord God of Israel is the Lord of the angelic hosts in the OT.

    The anointed man from Nazareth is now given this authority.

     

    #779780
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @kerwin
    Did you see in the Isaiah 8 passage that Jehovah is speaking of Jehovah of hosts as if He is someone else other than Himself? The other person that Jehovah calls Jehovah of hosts is the stone of offense, not faith. Peter ties that stone to be Jesus, not faith. In both passages, the subject is a person that is the stone, not faith.

    #779781
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @NickHassan

    you said:

    The Lord God of Israel is the Lord of the angelic hosts in the OT.

    The anointed man from Nazareth is now given this authority.

    Jehovah is the Lord God of Israel and Jehovah is both the God of gods and the Lord of lords. Jesus is the theos who is the Lord of lords. The Father is the theos who is the God of gods.

    The title “Jehovah of hosts” applies to either one of them depending on context. The person of Jesus made the angels before man, btw. In the context of Isaiah 8, Jehovah, the God of gods is talking about Jehovah, the Lord of lords as the Jehovah of hosts that is the stone who Peter later identifies as Jesus.

    #779782
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi LU,
    Does your litany of gods enable you to become closer to the God of gods?

    #779783
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi LU,
    Jesus did not exist before he was conceived and born.
    Then he was named.

    But the Word was with God

    #779784
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi KW,
    The Holy Spirit had dominion?
    God did.

    #779786
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi LU,
    Paul said
    It is no longer I that liveth but Christ that liveth in me.

    Christ in the brethren worships and serves the Father in Spirit and truth

    #779789
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @NickHassan
    The Word that was with God was a person, the person of Jesus-the Only begotten Son who much later became a man. He wasn’t always a man. You would do well to be able to discern between all who are called theos and make a distinction between who has dominion over all creation and who does not. Rev 5 tells you that two have dominion over all creation.

    #779791
    NickHassan
    Participant

    Hi LU,
    Where does scripture speak of the Word as a person?

    #779793
    NickHassan
    Participant

    hi LU,
    Do you think reliance on one verse to prove your dogma is a good idea?
    2Cor 13 1

    #779915
    Proclaimer
    Participant

    @Lightenup

    Your view that two are called Jehovah is your doctrine. I’ll stick to believing as scripture teaches, that for us, there is one God the Father and that eternal life is to know the only true God and his son.

    Not going to be talked out of it. Wouldn’t even take a cash bribe. No chance.

    #779916
    Proclaimer
    Participant

    Kathi, you come here preaching a false gospel and tell lies about the only true God. Where did you go wrong. How did your life come to this. Were you not created for noble things. Why sell yourself short. You are so fixated on being right that you cannot see the damage that you are doing to yourself. Let God lead you into all truth. Let scripture teach you and rebuke you. Even rebuke is good because it shows that someone is still working in your life. But if you continue to ignore the true gospel and the first commandment, then it could change you forever.

    #779993
    kerwin
    Participant

    Nick,

    Hi KW,
    The Holy Spirit had dominion?
    God did.

    It is his Spirit. It is not a separate individual. It is also God’s word that framed the ages.

    #779994
    kerwin
    Participant

    LU,

    Did you see in the Isaiah 8 passage that Jehovah is speaking of Jehovah of hosts as if He is someone else other than Himself? The other person that Jehovah calls Jehovah of hosts is the stone of offense, not faith. Peter ties that stone to be Jesus, not faith. In both passages, the subject is a person that is the stone, not faith.

    No, so I will have to remember to look for it when I read it again so I know where you are coming from.

    #779998
    Lightenup
    Participant

    @t8

    The only true God, the Father, has a part of Him that is just like Him as offsprings always are. Hebrew names, from what I understand, reflect some significant character, feature, or purpose from what I have read and the name Jehovah reflects a state of being…an always existent state of being and that sets Him apart from all created beings that might be called theos somewhere in scripture. I believe that the one true God, the Father, always existed and I know you do also and His name reflects that-Jehovah. I also believe the Son always existed as an offspring part of the one true God and thus the name Jehovah reflects His always existence. What is unique about an offspring ‘part’ of a person, is that that particular part is just like the person that he is a part of as opposed to the foot or the elbow part per se.

    You seem to understand the one true God as one that does not have an eternal offspring part to Him. I understand the one true God, the Father as one that does have an eternal offspring part to Him. That seems to be the main difference to what influences us as we process the Word of God.

    When Jehovah, the Father speaks about being God alone, the offspring part of Him is included as part of Him, as I understand it. The offspring part of the one true God, the Father is an extremely important part of the Father. With the offspring part, the Father directly creates the cosmos and relates to that creation and provides redemption and salvation to creation. That offspring part, Jehovah (the Son) acts as the Word of His Father and the image of His Father.  It is all very beautiful to know the offspring part of the one true God, as God to us also; as the eternal offspring part of the one true God, the Father.

     

    #780005
    Lightenup
    Participant

    Nick,

    I rely on the entire scriptures and they agree with a right worship of the Father and Son as those who are due the glory and dominion over all creation for ever and ever. I have used many verses over the years here as ‘witness’ to this. Thanks for asking though.

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