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[sirius1]

Quote (Kupchuk @ Mar. 03 2007,13:50)

God wills all mankind to be saved! 1 Tim. 2:4  …our saviour, God, Who wills that all mankind be saved and come to the realization of the truth. 1 Tim. 4:10 …that we rely on the living God Who is the saviour of all mankind, especially of believers.  (Not only believers.) 1 Cor. 15:28 …Who subjects all to Him, that God may be All in all.  (At the consummation God will be All in all, not just some)

Universal salvation is perfectly legitimate…Up to an age of accountability but not necessarily beyond it. You won't find any babies or small children in hell as they're all covered by the unsolicited and universal atonement of Christ, but the same cannot always be said for adults. God does “will” for all to repent and come to Christ, so He would have all to be saved as a matter of His revealed will, yet His secret and sovereign will is almost always hidden from our finite inspection, and for good reason. However, since the Lord mercifully wishes for all babies and small children to reside with Christ in eternity in heaven,

(I take Matt. 19:14 literally: “But Jesus said, 'Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; for of such is the kingdom of heaven.' “)

it was also necessary then that all, (and without exception,) be included in the sacrificial death of Christ, something which both Calvin and Arminius partially understood and misunderstood. It is highly important to understand that the death of Christ was only a sacrifice, which sacrifice made an atonement possible or available. No ancient Jew in Christ's day was ever advantaged by the mere slaughtering of an animal sacrifice, the value of a “covering” for sin, (or atonement as they understood it,) lay in the application of the blood, not in the shedding of it. This can be confusing at times because the scriptures use the words “sacrifice” and “atonement” in an interchangeable sense, yet their root meanings are still different and they are so closely linked with each other because God intends for them both to be a part of one final redemption for fallen man. Now God applies this sacrificial death of Christ to all small ones in an involuntary fashion, (from the child's vantage point,) and thereafter upon their maturity in a solicited way only by their willful acceptance. That's one reason why the damned in hell are both gnashing their teeth and weeping: The gnash their teeth out of literal, actual pain from an actual and literal torment, but they “weep” because they all know that they really could have been saved by applying for Christ's sacrificial atonement since they were if fact covered by His vicarious death while they were still young, and yet as adults “…they would not”. They let it slip right through their negligent hands and that will be just cause for the eternal weeping of regret.

Salvation is indeed universal for all dear, little babies and small children by way of impartation, and universal for the entire balance of humanity both by the expressed, revealed will of God in the free offer of the gospel, and potentially speaking only by Christ's sacrificial death for them as all too were once little babies themselves. Here is where Calvin and Arminius strangely found themselves both in agreement: In the experimental sense of adults, salvation is most definitely particular: If you truy accept of the gospel offer, you are then covered by Christ's death, but if one willfully neglects the gospel offer, they will certainly wish that they had never been born and I hope that no one here ever discovers such a terrible and awful fate.

[sirius1]

Here is a poem that the Lord gave me at the very beginning of my awareness of the eternal realm of glory. It has been posted at only one other heaven forum, to my knowledge that is. Punctuation was originally set for separate stanzas and is now in error in this large paragraph though.

About two years ago I happened to be out in our local neighborhood park where I live, giving our house pet retriever her accustomed evening walk. I have long been a Christian, and that evening, upon gazing up into the glorious and vast starry heavens, my spirit was overcome with such a foretaste of heavenly glory that I had never known possible prior to that evening. It was joyous beyond human expression, absolutely off the charts from our feeble concepts. As the celestial zephyrs wafted into my innermost being, a peace unlike any I had ever sensed before flooded my soul with rivers and rivers of unfathomable peace, fantastic peace. I had previously known the initial peace and joy of first trusting in Christ, but this was different…Way, way more and intense in degree. You will just have to wait and see for yourself. As the evening concluded, I walked back to my house and attempted to share with my good, Christian wife my experience, but she simply couldn't partake of it, it was for me alone, or was it? To my great surprise, upon walking the dog the following evening, the same identical experience repeated itself, all over again, and I was eating it up with indescribable relish. Here is where all this gets interesting: This cycle, this enduring heavenly foretaste kept up it's blessed repetitive rounds for about two and one half weeks until I began to shift from bliss to fear as I finally asked the Lord, “Lord, what are you trying to tell me? Are you doing this to prepare me for my coming home?” The next day I had an unaccountable peace and assurance that I was not coming home, but that I was a member of a race and planet that are soon to end. That is half of what I feel this whole experience was about; It is God's will for the Christian Church to get ready for heaven. Our history will be concluding before too long and time is of the essence for us. Well, off to the park the next evening and guess what? Yeh, you guessed it… All over again, on and on, each evening for about four and one half weeks total of the same evening, heavenly foretastes. I was beginning to crush under the load of glory and found my bliss an unshakeable distraction to my daily duties! Realizing that there had to be some other purpose for this visitation, I finally conceived that it just might be possible that the Lord wished for me to preserve my burden in some literary fashion for others. Yes, that was it! I walked calmly into my study, took up my pen and begin to write out, as best I could, and the stanzas flowed out onto the paper like the oil down upon Aaron's beard. When my little poem of fifteen stanzas was completed I, of course, walked out into our local park at the next opportunity, expecting the usual waves of bliss to assuage my now overflowing soul, only to find that my heavenly raptures had ceased. It had accomplished it's intention, and I am now left with this little poem which I also share with you. May it bless your soul, as it did mine then and now, in the love of Christ.

THERE IS A LAND

There is a land, beyond the clouds,
beyond Orion's brow,
Where, angels gowned, in grace renown, look down and ponder, 'How?'
'Oh how, oh how do mortal men, those transient specks in time,
'Enwrap their eyes, with all that dies, while nobler things, sublime,
'Are set on every verdant hill, in every fragrant vale,
'In every glimmering, golden hall, where we immortals dwell?'
Where is this land, where every breeze sings soft in metered rhyme?
Where every thought, or look, is sought, to dwell on things divine?
Where is a tree, a flowery bough, so weighed with blossoms there,
That glory blooms with sweet perfume, profusely in the air?
Oh, show me now that marbled court, immeasurable to see,
Pavilioned square, yet ends no where, to walk eternally.
If but; To reach, to touch, to hold, to tell them all my heart,
With words of love, like those above, in sentimental art.
To trek that endless, vast domain, immense beyond our dreams,
Yet ever find, another kind, of new and glorious scene.
Oh, show me now Seraphic guest, oh, guide me to the gate,
And take my hand, throughout that land, where all these treasures wait.
Then, in another, different tone, I heard a voice, divine,
Call sweetly there, 'My realm, I'll share, and show you where to find.
'Now take my hand, you'll know it by, a lonely nail print there,
'For heaven is of, my limitless love, which sails throughout it's air.
'And no one finds a silvery stream, or tastes celestial wine,
'Or seeks to touch, with holy hush, the smallest thing of mine,'
'No eye has every yet beheld, the Mighty Mount of God,
'Where choruses blend, their praise to send, in joyous, solemn bond,'
'But only those who find that gate, will walk on streets of gold,
'When galaxies pine, away with time, and lower worlds enfold.'
'I am that Gate,' He said to me, 'I am the Truth, the Way,'
'Oh, seeking soul, this Gate behold,
'I AM, I AM THE WAY.'
           John 14:6

[sirius1]

Here is a poem that the Lord gave me at the very beginning of my awareness of the eternal realm of glory. It has been posted at only one other heaven forum, to my knowledge that is. Punctuation was originally set for separate stanzas and is now in error in this large paragraph though.

About two years ago I happened to be out in our local neighborhood park where I live, giving our house pet retriever her accustomed evening walk. I have long been a Christian, and that evening, upon gazing up into the glorious and vast starry heavens, my spirit was overcome with such a foretaste of heavenly glory that I had never known possible prior to that evening. It was joyous beyond human expression, absolutely off the charts from our feeble concepts. As the celestial zephyrs wafted into my innermost being, a peace unlike any I had ever sensed before flooded my soul with rivers and rivers of unfathomable peace, fantastic peace. I had previously known the initial peace and joy of first trusting in Christ, but this was different…Way, way more and intense in degree. You will just have to wait and see for yourself. As the evening concluded, I walked back to my house and attempted to share with my good, Christian wife my experience, but she simply couldn't partake of it, it was for me alone, or was it? To my great surprise, upon walking the dog the following evening, the same identical experience repeated itself, all over again, and I was eating it up with indescribable relish. Here is where all this gets interesting: This cycle, this enduring heavenly foretaste kept up it's blessed repetitive rounds for about two and one half weeks until I began to shift from bliss to fear as I finally asked the Lord, “Lord, what are you trying to tell me? Are you doing this to prepare me for my coming home?” The next day I had an unaccountable peace and assurance that I was not coming home, but that I was a member of a race and planet that are soon to end. That is half of what I feel this whole experience was about; It is God's will for the Christian Church to get ready for heaven. Our history will be concluding before too long and time is of the essence for us. Well, off to the park the next evening and guess what? Yeh, you guessed it… All over again, on and on, each evening for about four and one half weeks total of the same evening, heavenly foretastes. I was beginning to crush under the load of glory and found my bliss an unshakeable distraction to my daily duties! Realizing that there had to be some other purpose for this visitation, I finally conceived that it just might be possible that the Lord wished for me to preserve my burden in some literary fashion for others. Yes, that was it! I walked calmly into my study, took up my pen and begin to write out, as best I could, and the stanzas flowed out onto the paper like the oil down upon Aaron's beard. When my little poem of fifteen stanzas was completed I, of course, walked out into our local park at the next opportunity, expecting the usual waves of bliss to assuage my now overflowing soul, only to find that my heavenly raptures had ceased. It had accomplished it's intention, and I am now left with this little poem which I also share with you. May it bless your soul, as it did mine then and now, in the love of Christ.

THERE IS A LAND

There is a land, beyond the clouds,
beyond Orion's brow,
Where, angels gowned, in grace renown, look down and ponder, 'How?'
'Oh how, oh how do mortal men, those transient specks in time,
'Enwrap their eyes, with all that dies, while nobler things, sublime,
'Are set on every verdant hill, in every fragrant vale,
'In every glimmering, golden hall, where we immortals dwell?'
Where is this land, where every breeze sings soft in metered rhyme?
Where every thought, or look, is sought, to dwell on things divine?
Where is a tree, a flowery bough, so weighed with blossoms there,
That glory blooms with sweet perfume, profusely in the air?
Oh, show me now that marbled court, immeasurable to see,
Pavilioned square, yet ends no where, to walk eternally.
If but; To reach, to touch, to hold, to tell them all my heart,
With words of love, like those above, in sentimental art.
To trek that endless, vast domain, immense beyond our dreams,
Yet ever find, another kind, of new and glorious scene.
Oh, show me now Seraphic guest, oh, guide me to the gate,
And take my hand, throughout that land, where all these treasures wait.
Then, in another, different tone, I heard a voice, divine,
Call sweetly there, 'My realm, I'll share, and show you where to find.
'Now take my hand, you'll know it by, a lonely nail print there,
'For heaven is of, my limitless love, which sails throughout it's air.
'And no one finds a silvery stream, or tastes celestial wine,
'Or seeks to touch, with holy hush, the smallest thing of mine,'
'No eye has every yet beheld, the Mighty Mount of God,
'Where choruses blend, their praise to send, in joyous, solemn bond,'
'But only those who find that gate, will walk on streets of gold,
'When galaxies pine, away with time, and lower worlds enfold.'
'I am that Gate,' He said to me, 'I am the Truth, the Way,'
'Oh, seeking soul, this Gate behold,
'I AM, I AM THE WAY.'
           John 14:6

[sirius1]

It must be remembered that Christ, in His incarnation, came in the capacity as a man to redeem men and women. This didn't make Him merely a man…He was still properly both divine and human, but He operated chiefly as a man and if He hadn't then we could never have been handed over a righteousness to justify us and a substitutionary death to pardon as well that would have been suitable for mankind. Since the law was given to man, so a man had to both obey and suffer and this is why the gospel story speaks more of His humanity than it does of His divinity and makes the tragic mistake easier in assuming that He was human and nothing more. He was divine, and if He hadn't been then His death would only have had finite redemptive value for us and would have likewise locked Him and us up forever in the realm of the dead as He wouldn't have had a second nature to rise by having lost His sole nature upon the cross, but this didn't happen and all because of Christ's dual natures.
What a glorious and all-wise Redeemer…Both human and divine!

[sirius1]

P.S. to last reply: Maybe I'm not using the forum correctly. I never log out because I saw a recommendation to remain logged in because of a server hassle. Has this snag been laid to rest as yet?

[sirius1]

Hi, I have three posts out and, yes, I typically move around on the internet. That's OK..l'll get back to any input before too long, only there normally isn't much input for me! I have found on another christian web site which site does allow for visions, dreams, etc., that other members will readily chat about X, Y or Z dream/vision of a giant pizza or something else pretty far out, but most forums members seem to avoid my input. I guess you could also say that three mile long elevators which run totally independent of any mechanical power or steel cables is also “pretty far out” (!!!)  but I can't help this, I just share it like I get it and hope that it does edify someone somewhere.  We've got to be modestly cautious here and yet have wide, venturesome, intrepid minds when dealing with a Being who uses gold in place of asphalt for roadways.

A scripturally careful, but a humble, open and expandable mind.

[sirius1]

Alot of things…I'll kick in another before too long. One in particular is just about impossible to describe short of book it is so extensive. It seems that saints commonly have their estates, (plural now!) built either wrapped around what we would call smaller mountains, or scattered here and there upon mountains so huge that they are measured in miles of height rather than in feet! I know that the glorified saints don't use the American linear system of measurment (!) but the Lord does condescend to use our terms, language or concepts or we would miss tons of significance altogether. Anyway, this particular vision that the Lord allowed me to receive took weeks and weeks to amass of one particular place in heaven, (apparently mine,) of two, joined mountains in the midst of a celestial ocean with the taller of the two mountains being about 8 miles high. Mt. Everest is somewhere around 5 1/2 miles above sea level I think, so this one isn't out of the question, especially if the New Jerusalem of Revelation is a whopping 1,500 miles high!! This place is too much, utterly fascinating. It simply is difficult to believe all that the Lord is preparing for those who love Him here…Way, way out of our ballpark to absorb now, or just like sending 240 volts AC through a 3.5 volt DC circuit: Just too much for us to handle in it's fullness here and now. These glimpses have made it really difficult for me to keep my mind on Earthly responsibilities and so they are metered out as He deems fit. For example: On this mountain there happens to be an aviation museum of all things with real, functional, perfect replicas of vintage aircraft propelled by real, operating radial engines but with one amazing difference: No fuel in the tanks! Who needs fuel anyway in a realm where the omnipotence of God Almighty is always present everywhere and at all times? At the very summit of this towering mountain, for instance, is a ramp cut right into one end of it, which ramp descends slowly into a big lobby just under the top of the mountain, but the sides of this progressive ramp cut into stone emit light right out of the vertical, exposed rock surface! This puzzled me for awhile until I understood that the emitted light was to assist landing crafts while the summit was cloud wrapped! This light emitted right out of the sides of the rock for the same reason these airplanes didn't need fuel in the tanks. A wonderful principle to follow out if your imagination will allow. The Lord fully understands just how perfect we will be then and so has made such sprawling, towering estates for saints just like you and me crediting us that the first thing we will do with our selfless, loving, celestial nature and estates is to turn them all open for the use of other saints whom we love almost as much as we love Him.
Hope I didn't miss any errors.

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