Who really is baal gad ?

[Jamie]

Please come back Eliyah I need your teachings. I found a little website of yours but there was no contact and very little information of you there. I have learnd so much from reading your posts here. I saw your hard words of writing so was the old Elijah hard too. Please come back and let me know where you are I want to know more of what you have said in your posts.I also know they made a mockery out of you on this forum by asking you to leave then voting whether for you to leave or come back and then the Administrator who asked you to leave ended up asking you to come back. I know you will keep your word and want come back but please come back for me.

Your friend Jamie

[david]

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Please come back Eliyah I need your teachings.

Would it not be Jesus' teachings that you should need?

If it is Eliyah's words you are looking for, in the past 5 months or so, he devoted probably a couple hundred pages on this forum.

david.

[Jamie]

David I see you as a rude person which fits your organization.What I meant was that we needed his teachings of the real Messiah not your fake jesus that has been proclaimed for two thousand years. Nothing but confusion from your camp.What and where is the fruit of christianity for two thousand years which you proclaim?

Jamie

[Jamie]

Ps I also know of the hundreds of pages you devoted to the forum to no avail. I see you devoted 1, 234 posts to no avail hmm?

Jamie

[Ramblinrose]

Jamie

If you wish to correspond with Eliyah send him an email by using the Mail icon (the envelope) below any of his posts – this will go to his personal email address.

[Jamie]

I tried that it did not work but thanks to a member on here that sent me a private message I have found him and contacted him. He is still running the internet forums telling people the same truth of Yahweh and Yahushua's name and ofcourse baal gad.He is not in well health he says he has had three surgeries in his back from years of heavy lifting and is in very much pain. Thank you Ramblinrose for your intrest in trying to help me. Can you believe the voting mockery that was made of that man on this forum? I have re-read the posts over there at the suggestion forum several times and it tears me to pieces to read the words that man wrote there appologizing if he had said anything wrong to people here and no one even noticed his words. I also saw other posts of him appologizing to others but they never appologized for their ways of talking to him. Go re-read all his posts in the suggestion forum what he wrote there where he even told T8 Heaven that he loved him. I dare people on here to go re-read all his posts there carefully. Thank you for caring Ramblinrose Yahweh bless you.

Jamie

[david]

Jamie, being someone who has studied the teachings of Eliyah, I'm wondering if you could explain the “baal gad” thing in more simpler terms, in one paragraph. I would like to hear the gist of what he was trying to tell us from a different persepective, someone who can explain it more simply.
I do enjoy discussing new things and I had never heard anything like this before.
I understand what he said about the etymology of “god” having a pagan background. But I am still confused about “baal gad.”

[Jamie]

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Jamie, being someone who has studied the teachings of Eliyah, I'm wondering if you could explain the “baal gad” thing in more simpler terms, in one paragraph. I would like to hear the gist of what he was trying to tell us from a different persepective, someone who can explain it more simply. I do enjoy discussing new things and I had never heard anything like this before. I understand what he said about the etymology of “god” having a pagan background. But I am still confused about “baal gad.”

' David I don't know if I can explain to you about what I call 'baal god ' better than eliyah but I will point out a few sides to this issue that your either ignorant or wilfully avoiding as I noticed in several of eliyah's discussions with you that you evaded two aspects of this issue as it is about idolatry or spiritual adultry to YHWH to join an idol to YHWH. You wrote

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I understand what he said about the etymology of “god” having a pagan background. But I am still confused about “baal gad.”

You see the pagan connection that the word 'god' whether capitolized or not still originated with and is rooted in paganism. If you do some research back far enough on ' baal god ' you will find that this was and still is an ' idol ' deity worshipped by the children of Israel at the same time as ' Ashtaroth and Ashtaroth is the same ' Astarte-Easter-Ishtar spoken about in Judges 2:11 – 14 along with ' Baal ' and YHWH's anger was hot against Israel for their idolatry. The same example is given in 1Kings 11:5-6 of King Solomon also served or worshipped Ashtaroth-Astarte-Easter-Ishtar and Baalim. Then again the same ' Baal ' and ' Ashtaroth ' is practiced by Ahab in 1 Kings 15:30-33. When the one 'baal' was worshipped so was its counterpart of ' Ashtaroth '-Astarte-Easter-Ishtar. Then in Joshua 11:16-17; Joshua 12:7; Joshua 13:5 you will read of a deity called 'Baal Gad '.

Then you will read of the same Babylonian deity of fortune and a literal translation of Isaiah 65:11 from Hebrew to English is

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But you are they that forsake YHWH, that forget my holy mountain, that prepare a table for GAD, and that furnish the drink offering unto Meni.

This word ' gad ' in Hebrew is vowel pointed with ' dg ' and literally transliterates from Hebrew to English as ' god ' because it is vowel pointed with ' dg ' in Hebrew check a Lexicon. Hence this Phenecian Babylonian idol called ' Baal God ' that the people had forsaken YHWH for ' Baal God '.
And any good dictionary will tell you that the word ' Baal' means ' Lord '. Or do you want me to show you the dictionary references that ' baal' means 'lord ' ? Hence the words ' Lord God' in the popular English translations as the K.J.V. -N.I.V-R.S.V. Bibles. That is not all either according to most all Encyclopaedias the word ' god ' was adopted into christianity as the nanme of the one supreme being from the Teutonic races conversion to christianity. Also this word traces its origins back to the Sanskrit Language called ' Dyias Pater ' meaning ' FATHER GOD ' as is referenced to ' JUPITER '. Now I will quote eliyah's etymology research proving this was accepted by the Roman Catholic Church.

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Greek Zeus, Roman Jupiter (from Deus Pater), Vedic Dyaus Pita, Germanic Tiwaz (later known as Tyr), Baltic Dievas, Slavic Div, Gaulish Dis Pater, and probably Phrygian Sabazios (from Saba Zeus). Also etymologically connected is the Latin word for 'god', deus, the word for the Christian God used by the Roman Catholic Church. The latin word is also continued in English divine, deity, and the original Germanic word remains visible in Tuesday (originally “Day of Tiwaz”). Dyeus was addressed as Dyeu Phter, literally “Sky Father” or “shining father”, as reflected in Latin Jupiter, Greek Zeu pater, Sanskrit Dyau Pita. In his aspect as a Father God, his consort was Pltvi Mhter, “Earth Mother”.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyeus

' Reflected in the Latin Jupiter, Greek Zeu pater, Sanskrit Dyau Pita. In his aspect as a Father God

' Father God ' is a title for ' Jupiter ' The deity of the Roman 4th kingdom beast system in Daniel 2:40-44; Daniel 7:25; Revelation 13:1-2

All of this was adopted by the Roman Catholic Church I quote

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Also etymologically connected is the Latin word for 'god', 'deus', the word for the Christian God used by the Roman Catholic Church. The latin word is also continued in English 'divine', ' deity ', and the original Germanic word remains visible in Tuesday (originally “Day of Tiwaz”).

Here is the ' Father God Jupiter ' adopted by the Roman Catholic Church.
This is the mental idol image Father God Jupiter of the Roman 4th kingdom beast system in Daniel 2:40-44 and of the same beast kingdom of John in Revelation 13:1-2 the the world has set up an image of the RomanFather God Jupiter and is worshipping that idol Jupiter called Father God which is an image of Rome-the 4th kingdom beast system and John's 1st and same kingdom beast system in Revelation 13:1-2, as the world has set up an idol image Revelarion 13:15-17 of Father God Jupiter of Rome's deity and even believes in Father God Jupiter and has his name or mark in their hands and foreheads or minds all because of the mother and her harlots in Revelation 17:4-5 that is the names of blasphemy in her very forehead or mind. Now you please tell me if people today are not praying to and worshipping Father God Jupiter and this title is title name is not coming out of their mouth's every day? That is enoough for now I may try to explain more later if you want.Now I know you will say this is more than one paragraph but then is your posts every just one paragraph long? Sorry if it seems so long to you but it does take so much space to explain some things in detail as you very well know.

Jamie

[david]

OK, so from what I understand,
–Baal means master, or lord or husband. (and in scripture, this word is used with reference to the Father, as it does appropriately fit him.)
–In time it came to be the name of false gods. (the baals)
–It is reasoned that Yahweh should not be called by the name of false gods (Compare Ex 23:13; josh 23:7) and hence not called “lord” (?) because baal means “lord.”

HOSEA 2:16
“And it must occur in that day,’ is the utterance of Jehovah, ‘that you will call [me] My husband, and you will no longer call me My owner [Or, “My baal.” Heb., ba`·li´.].’”

In the above verse, the Hebrew word “baal” is used with reference to Jehovah.
In the Bible, this word is used with reference to:
(1) a husband as owner of his wife (Ge 20:3);
(2) landowners (Jos 24:11, ftn);
(3) “owners of the nations” (Isa 16:8, ftn);
(4) “confederates” (literally, “owners [masters] of the covenant”) (Ge 14:13, ftn);
(5) owners or possessors of tangibles (Ex 21:28, 34; 22:8; 2Ki 1:8, ftn);
(6) persons or things having something that is characteristic of their nature, manner, occupation, and the like, for example, an archer (literally, “owner of arrows”) (Ge 49:23), a “creditor of the debt” (literally, “owner of a debt of his hand”) (De 15:2), “anyone given to anger” (literally, “owner of anger”) (Pr 22:24), “judicial antagonist” (literally, “owner of judgment”) (Isa 50:8, ftn);
(7) Jehovah (Ho 2:16);
(8) false gods (Jg 2:11, 13).

“baal” means “master, lord, owner, husband, etc.”
Does the fact that some decided to apply that word to false gods make the word unusable? The Bible applied that word to Jehovah, and others. Did those who started worshiping these false gods highjack that word?

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If you do some research back far enough on ' baal god ' you will find that this was and still is an ' idol ' deity worshipped by the children of Israel at the same time as ' Ashtaroth and Ashtaroth is the same ' Astarte-Easter-Ishtar spoken about in Judges 2:11 – 14 along with ' Baal ' and YHWH's anger was hot against Israel for their idolatry. The same example is given in 1Kings 11:5-6 of King Solomon also served or worshipped Ashtaroth-Astarte-Easter-Ishtar and Baalim. Then again the same ' Baal ' and ' Ashtaroth ' is practiced by Ahab in 1 Kings 15:30-33. When the one 'baal' was worshipped so was its counterpart of ' Ashtaroth '-Astarte-Easter-Ishtar.

Yes, false gods, called baals (meaning: owner, master, lord, etc) were worshiped.

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Then in Joshua 11:16-17; Joshua 12:7; Joshua 13:5 you will read of a deity called 'Baal Gad '.

This has been mentioned by Eliyah a few times. But whenever I look at those scriptures, i see locations, not deities:
JOSHUA 11:17
“from Mount Ha´lak, which goes up to Se´ir, and as far as Ba´al-gad in the valley plain of Leb´a·non at the base of Mount Her´mon, and he captured all their kings and went striking them and putting them to death.”

JOSHUA 12:7
“And these are the kings of the land whom Joshua and the sons of Israel defeated on the side of the Jordan toward the west, from Ba´al-gad in the valley plain of Leb´a·non and as far as Mount Ha´lak, which goes up to Se´ir, after which Joshua gave it to the tribes of Israel as a holding by their shares,”
As far as I can tell, “baal gad” is a place. Could I please have an explanation on this.

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This word ' gad ' in Hebrew is vowel pointed with ' dg ' and literally transliterates from Hebrew to English as ' god ' because it is vowel pointed with ' dg ' in Hebrew check a Lexicon.

I have no idea what that means. Could you please explain it differently. Pretend I am a five year old. I won't mind.

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And any good dictionary will tell you that the word ' Baal' means ' Lord '. Or do you want me to show you the dictionary references that ' baal' means 'lord ' ? Hence the words ' Lord God' in the popular English translations as the K.J.V. -N.I.V-R.S.V. Bibles.

Yes, baal means lord, or master, or owner, etc. Is there anything wrong with that?

So far, I don't understand why the word “baal” (master, owner, husband, lord) is wrong, as the Bible itself uses that word with refernce to the Father.

There are those who use knives to murder. Does this means we should not use knives to cut food?
Just because some use that word for false gods, I'm not sure this really justifies us abandoning it, and it's meaning of Lord.

[Jamie]

You asked what was wrong with 'lord' as it refers to the Father? It matters when it is used in substitute place of His Name YHWH as was done by the ' prophets of baal or lord ' and worshiped as was done in 1Kings 18 and as the English translations of the bible have also done today. I see you know very little if any of Hebrew scriptures for the ' dg ' is vowel pointed for the name ' gad ' which makes it ' god' that is spoken in Isaiah 65:11 a Babylonian deity and even in its pronounciation check a Lexicon as I asked you to do above. The word ' god ' traces to ' Jupiter ' that was called father god the idol deity of Rome the fourth beast knigdom system in Daniel Chapter 2 and 7 and also in Revelation 13:1. I have a question for you now David. Is there a difference in keeping and holding onto the pagan idol ' god ' than holding onto the pagan idol ' easter '? Are they both not paganism?

Jamie

[david]

I just had a thought. I'm not sure if it applies.

Daniel, in referring to his three friends in his inspired account, often uses their babylonian names.
Hananiah was renamed Shadrach, which some authorities believe to be a compound name meaning “Command of Aku.” Interestingly, Aku was the name of a Sumerian god. Mishael was renamed Meshach (possibly, Mi·sha·aku), apparently a clever twist of “Who Is Like God?” to “Who Is What Aku Is?” Azariah’s Babylonian name was Abednego, probably meaning “Servant of Nego.” And “Nego” is a variant of “Nebo,” the name of a deity after which a number of Babylonian rulers were also named.

Yet, Daniel used these names in referring to his friends. I'm wondering how this fits in with the thought that it is wrong to use the English word “god” because it may be from pagan sources.
This is just something that popped into my mind yesterday.

david

[MrBob]

Good point David, very similar to Is 1:18 's point about the days of the week.

Anyway, one of the thing about this that makes me uncomfortable is the supposed connection of the Hebrew word for Baal to the English word “God.” From Jamie's post, it seems the evidence for the connection is from the vowel pointing of “gad” in the Hebrew texts.

However, there were no vowel pointings in the original Hebrew texts (Herrell 1). These were added in the Masoretic Hebrew texts. Also, these vowel pointings are supposed to be the reason for the “misguided” translation of YHWH into Jehovah (Gabel 315). If these same people claim that the word “Jehovah” (which was derived by the vowel pointings) is wrong, how can these same people judge others of pagan worship based on these vowel pointings?

Another thing I found wrong was Eliyah's claim that the Hebrew word elohim was used as a specific title to YHWH (It's somewhere in of the first posts). However, if that is true, how can this verse be explained?

Judges 10:6 (KJV)
And the children of Israel did evil again in the sight of the LORD [YHWH] , and served Baalim , and Ashtaroth , and the gods [elohim] of Syria , and the gods [elohim] of Zidon , and the gods [elohim] of Moab , and the gods [elohim] of the children of Ammon , and the gods [elohim] of the Philistines , and forsook the LORD [YHWH] , and served not him.

From the scripture above, we can see that elohim was a general reference to a god.

The biggest thing that get me angry though is what this whole dispute causes. I hate it when I see writings and such of self-righteous people who use the word “god” as “g-d” or “lord” as “l-rd.” As if they are more holy because they block out a part of the word.

The other problem that this whole “Hebrew only” argument causes is that it reinforces the claims and theories of atheistic scholars that Judaism was a “national cult” and Christianity was an attempt to save the faith by changing the “national cult” into a “supernatural cult” (Gabel 193).

Works Cited
Gabel, John B. Wheeler, Charles B. York, Anthony D. The Bible as Literature. New York: Oxford, 2000.

Herrell, Pastor V.S. The History of the Bible On-Line: The Masoretic Text. Kodak, TN: HBPH, 2000. (http://www.christianseparatist.org/ast/hist/mt.htm)

[NickHassan]

Thanks Mr Bob,
Good points.

[Proclaimer]

Good one Mr Bob.

[david]

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Good point David

Yes, good one Mr. Bob.
Just kidding.

[Author]

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