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Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 10 2010,05:19) teraricca 
What? what does, “his”, have to do with it?Georg
same questionQuote (terraricca @ Feb. 10 2010,04:26) georg if i understand correctly;the difference would “his” this is say in the case of Abraham
not mention in the case of Jesus,it is understood that Christ was not the only son of God but the first one,and also the first to be accepted by god as is begotten son,what is not the case with the other sons of God,,God also is first to accept to be recognize as his father,as for the mark ,of the beast ,and the whore,Christ said to his father in a prayer the request to help his disciples because they are not part of the WORLD in any form.than to sustain daily live
terrariccaJesus is the firstborn, and only begotten son of God, everything else was created by Jesus.
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Jhn 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
So, what is the difference between “firstborn”, and only “begotten”, son?
I still don't know what you mean with, “his”?
Georg
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 10 2010,06:49) Hi Georg,
Only begotten has a different greek root from the root for begotten
NickPaul is describing both sons, Abraham's and God's, as the only “BEGOTTEN” sons, in Hebrews; so what roots are you talking about?
Georg
Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 10 2010,14:52) Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Georg
Hi Georg,Col.1:16 Refers to “The Father”, not to Jesus…
Click HereWitnessing to the world in behalf of…
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD)YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgEd
Which of these scriptures do not speak of Jesus?.
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Col 1:19 ¶ For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
Col 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Georg
Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 10 2010,16:22) Ed Whish of these scriptures do not speak of Jesus?.
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Col 1:19 ¶ For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
Col 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Georg
Hi Georg,In English we have “the subject” and “the object”.
In Colossians “the subject” is mentioned in verse 12,
which is “GOD The Father”, while Jesus is the object.
I will insert words into the text for you.Col.1:12-22 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet
to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light(with Jesus, his Son):
13: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness(satan the great 'i am'),
and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
14: In whom we have redemption through his (Jesus=74)[God blood=74], even the forgiveness of sins:
15: Who is the image of the invisible God(The Father: still the subject from verse 12), the firstborn of every creature:
16: For by him(GOD The Father) were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they
be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him(GOD The Father), and for him(GOD The Father):
17: And he(GOD The Father) is before all things, and by him(GOD The Father) all things consist.
18: And he(GOD The Father) is the head of the body(the body is Jesus), the church(we are the body of Christ):
who(Jesus) is the beginning, (and)the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he(GOD The Father) might have the preeminence.
19: For it pleased the Father that in him(Jesus) should all fullness dwell;
20: And, having made peace through the blood of his(Jesus=74) “cross”=74, by him(GOD The Father) to reconcile all things
unto himself(GOD The Father); by him(GOD The Father), I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
21: And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your ('i am' polluted) mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled
22: In the body of his(Jesus) flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:Let's examine verse 16 a little closer…
Look at what is being said here and you can see for a certainty it CANNOT be talking about Jesus!16: For by him were ALL THINGS created, that are (1)in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible,
(2)whether they be thrones, (3)or dominions, (4)or principalities, (5)or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
(1) Jesus could NOT have created his own Father!
(2) Jesus could NOT have created his father's throne!
(3) Jesus could NOT have created his father's dominion!
(4) Jesus could NOT have created his own principality!
(5) Jesus could NOT have created his father's powers!Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD)YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orghi
Lk 24:44 He said to them, “This is what I told you while I was still with you: Everything must be fulfilled that is written about me in the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the Psalms.”
Jn 7:19 Has not Moses given you the law? Yet not one of you keeps the law
Lk 20:46 “Beware of the teachers of the law. They like to walk around in flowing robes and love to be greeted in the marketplaces and have the most important seats in the synagogues and the places of honor at banquets.
Lk 16:16 “The Law and the Prophets were proclaimed until John. Since that time, the good news of the kingdom of God is being preached, and everyone is forcing his way into it.
Lk 11:52 “Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering.”
Lk 11:45 One of the experts in the law answered him, “Teacher, when you say these things, you insult us also.”
Lk 11:46 Jesus replied, “And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them.Mt 23:29 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous
Mt 23:15 “Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when he becomes one, you make him twice as much a son of hell as you are.
the word “pharisees can be replaced by today ;evangelist,priest,Pope,cardinal,bishop,Pastor,Doctor in religion philosophy ,ect.
Quote (Ed J @ Feb. 10 2010,17:37) Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 10 2010,16:22) Ed Whish of these scriptures do not speak of Jesus?.
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Col 1:19 ¶ For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
Col 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Georg
Hi Georg,In English we have “the subject” and “the object”.
In Colossians “the subject” is mentioned in verse 12,
which is “GOD The Father”, while Jesus is the object.
I will insert words into the text for you.Col.1:12-22 Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet
to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light(with Jesus, his Son):
13: Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness(satan the great 'i am'),
and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
14: In whom we have redemption through his (Jesus=74)[God blood=74], even the forgiveness of sins:
15: Who is the image of the invisible God(The Father: still the subject from verse 12), the firstborn of every creature:
16: For by him(GOD The Father) were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they
be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him(GOD The Father), and for him(GOD The Father):
17: And he(GOD The Father) is before all things, and by him(GOD The Father) all things consist.
18: And he(GOD The Father) is the head of the body(the body is Jesus), the church(we are the body of Christ):
who(Jesus) is the beginning, (and)the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he(GOD The Father) might have the preeminence.
19: For it pleased the Father that in him(Jesus) should all fullness dwell;
20: And, having made peace through the blood of his(Jesus=74) “cross”=74, by him(GOD The Father) to reconcile all things
unto himself(GOD The Father); by him(GOD The Father), I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
21: And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your ('i am' polluted) mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled
22: In the body of his(Jesus) flesh through death, to present you holy and unblameable and unreproveable in his sight:Let's examine verse 16 a little closer…
Look at what is being said here and you can see for a certainty it CANNOT be talking about Jesus!16: For by him were ALL THINGS created, that are (1)in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible,
(2)whether they be thrones, (3)or dominions, (4)or principalities, (5)or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
(1) Jesus could NOT have created his own Father!
(2) Jesus could NOT have created his father's throne!
(3) Jesus could NOT have created his father's dominion!
(4) Jesus could NOT have created his own principality!
(5) Jesus could NOT have created his father's powers!Witnessing to the world in behalf of…
117=יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD)YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm! (Psalm 45:17)
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
EdAre you Democrat or Republican?
The fact that you call Satan the great “I am”, makes you a blasphemer, and for that reason you should be banned from this forum. I for one will avoid talking to you, from here on.
Georg
Georg, the word Satan does not represent one specific person. The word Satan means adversary and in Hebrew it's pronounced saw-tawn.
Strong's Number: 07854
Original WordWord Origin
!tXfrom (07853)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
SatanTWOT – 2252a
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
saw-tawn' Noun Masculine
Definition1. adversary, one who withstands
1. adversary (in general – personal or national)Numbers 22:22 And God's anger was kindled because he went : and the angel of the LORD stood in the way for an adversary against him. Now he was riding upon his ass, and his two servants were with him.
The angel of the LORD who was fulfilling the Will of the LORD IS SATAN. Since the angel is acting on behalf of the LORD, it is the LORD who is truly SATAN!!
The LORD being called Satan, of course not as you define him Georg according to a deceitful doctrine, but according to as the BIBLE DEFINES SATAN, which is simply as an adversary.
Hi Jodi,
Yes the word can mean an adversary and is just as the word for angel can be used as messenger.
Weak argument.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 11 2010,06:44) Hi Jodi,
Yes the word can mean an adversary and is just as the word for angel can be used as messenger.
Weak argument.
What do you mean, “CAN mean an adversary?”When does it mean anything else?
The messenger of God was an adversary.
David's messengers were adversaries.
Peter was called an adversary because he had in mind the things of men.Show me one scripture Nick, where adversary represents one individual not part of our creation who has power through supernatural means, and is a rebel against God.
Hi Jodi,
The murderer and the father of lies came to steal and destroy.He is busy doing so in lives all around the globe right now.
But we can find eternal life in Jesus and become free and will crush him under our feet[Rom16]
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Feb. 11 2010,08:11) Hi Jodi,
The murderer and the father of lies came to steal and destroy.He is busy doing so in lives all around the globe right now.
But we can find eternal life in Jesus and become free and will crush him under our feet[Rom16]
Nick,Why are you so ambiguous all the time.
I asked for one scripture and you cannot give it. That speaks a lot.
When you say “he” is busy, who is “he”?
Please give a more detailed explanation of WHO this “he” is and just exactly what he DOES and HOW it is he is able to do it. Why don't you tell us what his motivation is as well, while your at it.
I would really appreciate an explanation on this Nick.
Matthew 15:18 But those things which proceed out of the mouth come from the heart, and they defile a man. 19 For out of the heart proceed evil thoughts, murders, adulteries, fornications, thefts, false witness, blasphemies.
Mark 7:21 For from within, out of the heart of men, proceed evil thoughts, adulteries, fornications, murders, 22 thefts, covetousness, wickedness, deceit, lewdness, an evil eye, blasphemy, pride, foolishness.
Genesis 4:6 So the Lord said to Cain, “Why are you angry? And why has your countenance fallen? 7 If you do well, will you not be accepted? And if you do not do well, sin lies at the door. And its desire is for you, but you should rule over it.” 8 Now Cain talked with Abel his brother; and it came to pass, when they were in the field, that Cain rose up against Abel his brother and killed him. 9 Then the Lord said to Cain, “Where is Abel your brother?” He said, “I do not know. Am I my brother's keeper?”
The FIRST person born after the world fell into corruption was a Murderer and a LIAR.
James 1:14 But each one is tempted when he is drawn away by his own desires and enticed. 15 Then, when desire has conceived, it gives birth to sin; and sin, when it is full-grown, brings forth death.
Sin is aroused from within man, from his heart and his own imagination.
Genesis 8:21 And the Lord smelled a soothing aroma. Then the Lord said in His heart, “I will never again curse the ground for man's sake, although the imagination of man's heart is evil from his youth; nor will I again destroy every living thing as I have done.
Strong's Number: 4190
Original WordWord Origin
poneroßfrom a derivative of (4192)
Transliterated WordTDNT Entry
Poneros6:546,912
Phonetic SpellingParts of Speech
pon-ay-ros' Adjective
Definition1. full of labours, annoyances, hardships
1. pressed and harassed by labours
2. bringing toils, annoyances, perils; of a time full of peril to Christian faith and steadfastness; causing pain and trouble
2. bad, of a bad nature or condition
1. in a physical sense: diseased or blind
2. in an ethical sense: evil wicked, badNAS Word Usage – Total: 77
bad 5, crimes 1, envious 1, envy* 1, evil 50, evil one 5, evil things 1, malignant 1, more evil 1, more wicked 1, vicious 1, wicked 6, wicked man 1, wicked things 1, worthless 11 John 3:11 For this is the message which you have heard from the beginning, that we should love one another ; 12 not as Cain, who was of the evil one and slew his brother. And for what reason did he slay him? Because his deeds were evil, and his brother's were righteous.
Cain was evil, his deeds were evil because he served the sin that grew from his heart. Cain acted upon his carnal nature, which Paul shows quite clearly is our adversary, and anyone who follows after there carnal mind is being a slanderer, or an adversary.
There was NO invisible monster with supernatural powers that was a murderer and a liar from the beginning. In the beginning Cain was a murder and a liar. Scripture shows that the influence to do such evil comes within man himself, it is not placed their by invisible rebel spirits.
Jesus says specifically that MAN is the INVENTOR of evil. Invisible monsters don't put sinful ideas into our minds.
Psalms 78:29 So they ate and were well filled, For He gave them their own desire.
Psalms 81:12 So I gave them over to their own stubborn heart, To walk in their own counsels.
Proverbs 1:31 Therefore they shall eat the fruit of their own way, And be filled to the full with their own fancies.
Proverbs 3:5 Trust in the Lord with all your heart, And lean not on your own understanding;
Proverbs 3:10 Do not be wise in your own eyes; Fear the Lord and depart from evil.
Proverbs 5:22 His own iniquities entrap the wicked man, And he is caught in the cords of his sin.
Proverbs 11:5 The righteousness of the blameless will direct his way aright, But the wicked will fall by his own wickedness.
Proverbs 14:10 The heart knows its own bitterness, And a stranger does not share its joy.
Proverbs 14:14 The backslider in heart will be filled with his own ways, But a good man will be satisfied from above.
Proverbs 18:1 A man who isolates himself seeks his own desire; He rages against all wise judgment.
Proverbs 18:2 A fool has no delight in understanding, But in expressing his own heart.Proverbs 25:28 Whoever has no rule over his own spirit Is like a city broken down, without walls.
Proverbs 28:26 He who trusts in his own heart is a fool, But whoever walks wisely will be delivered.
Isaiah 2:8 Their land is also full of idols; They worship the work of their own hands, That which their own fingers have made.
Hi Jodi,
Jesus spoke a lot about Satan, the devil, and his dominion of darkness and I am surprised you have not seen his teachings.We do not add to or take away from them.
His demonic minions indeed take up residence in men.
Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 10 2010,16:22) Ed Which of these scriptures do not speak of Jesus?.
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Col 1:19 ¶ For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
Col 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Georg
Hi Georg,Perhaps you should take some English grammar lessons?
In English we have the “Subject” and the “Object”.
The “subject” of this text is mentioned in verse 12.Col.1:12 Giving thanks unto “The Father”, which hath made us
meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:All subsequent verses (Col.1:13-23) are still referring to
the “Subject” of “GOD The Father” by the “Object” of Jesus.Witnessing to the world in behalf of… (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (Ed J @ Mar. 02 2010,16:23) Quote (Elizabeth @ Feb. 10 2010,16:22) Ed Which of these scriptures do not speak of Jesus?.
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
Col 1:14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Col 1:15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
Col 1:16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
Col 1:17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church: who is the beginning, the firstborn from the dead; that in all things he might have the preeminence.
Col 1:19 ¶ For it pleased the Father that in him should all fulness dwell;
Col 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Georg
Hi Georg,Perhaps you should take some English grammar lessons?
In English we have the “Subject” and the “Object”.
The “subject” of this text is mentioned in verse 12.Col.1:12 Giving thanks unto “The Father”, which hath made us
meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:All subsequent verses (Col.1:13-23) are still referring to
the “Subject” of “GOD The Father” by the “Object” of Jesus.Witnessing to the world in behalf of… (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים(JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org
edjput your glasses on and look at it again;
Col 1:9 For this reason, since the day we heard about you, we have not stopped praying for you and asking God to fill you with the knowledge of his will through all spiritual wisdom and understanding.
Col 1:10 And we pray this in order that you may live a life worthy of the Lord and may please him in every way: bearing fruit in every good work, growing in the knowledge of God,
Col 1:11 being strengthened with all power according to his glorious might so that you may have great endurance and patience, and joyfully
Col 1:12 giving thanks to the Father, who has qualified you to share in the inheritance of the saints in the kingdom of light.
Col 1:13 For he has rescued us from the dominion of darkness and brought us into the kingdom of the Son he loves,
Col 1:14 in whom we have redemption, the forgiveness of sins.The Supremacy of Christ
Col 1:15 He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn over all creation.
Col 1:16 For by him all things were created: things in heaven and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or powers or rulers or authorities; all things were created by him and for him.
Col 1:17 He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.
Col 1:18 And he is the head of the body, the church; he is the beginning and the firstborn from among the dead, so that in everything he might have the supremacy.
Col 1:19 For God was pleased to have all his fullness dwell in him,
Col 1:20 and through him to reconcile to himself all things, whether things on earth or things in heaven, by making peace through his blood, shed on the cross.
Col 1:21 Once you were alienated from God and were enemies in your minds because of your evil behavior.
Col 1:22 But now he has reconciled you by Christ’s physical body through death to present you holy in his sight, without blemish and free from accusation—show us what you see;
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