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Who is Michael the archangel?
In order to scripturally prove that Michael is Christ Jesus one would of necessity have to be able to link the Prophecy in Daniel 12: 1,2 to the sign of the presence of Christ invisibly present in Kingdom Power. They both must speak of the same kind of World trouble due to happen when Michael 'stands up.' Or when the Christ invisibly takes Kingdom Power. We will note that both Daniel and Matthew speak about this same unparralelled time of World trouble. at [Matthew. Chapter 24: 21,22.] [Daniel 12:1] As well it must line up with what the rest of the Christian Greek scriptures have to say about the responibility of the Christ in performing the resurrection of the dead, for when Michael 'stands up' the resurrection also begins. [Daniel 12:1] [John 5:25-28] [1 Thessalonians 4: 16,17] Does the Bible do that? I will go on to show that it most certainly does!!
We will notice in the prophesy of Daniel, that whenever the term stand up is used it is talking about Kings taking ruling power. Proof of this is found at: Daniel 7:17; 8: 23,24; 11: 3,7, 20, 21 [NWT]
Bearing that in mind, we now turn to Daniel 12: 1-3 where we read: “And during that time Mi'cha-el will stand up the great Prince who is standing, {or ruling} in behalf of the sons of your people. And there will certainly occur a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a Nation until that time. and during that time your people will escape, everyone who is found written down in the Book.
Now, there are clues as to who this great Prince is, as found at Isaiah 9: 6,7 where we read: “For there has been a child born to us, there has been a Son given to us; and the Princely rule will come to be upon his shoulder. And his name will be called Wonderful Counselor Mighty God Eternal Father Prince of Peace. To the abundance of the Princely rule and to peace there will be no end, upon the Throne of David and upon his kingdom in order to establish it firmly and to sustain it by means of justice and by means of righteousness from now on and to time indefinite” …
For those who believe that Jesus was Almighty God, you will notice that it refers to Jesus only as Mighty God; not Almighty God, and there is a great difference between the two. So, thus far we see that Jesus is the Great Prince who stands in behalf of Daniels people. It should also be noted, that a Prince is the Son of a King, but not the King himself, for Jehovah himself has always, and always will be King.
There are other clues as well to consider. We noticed in the Prophecy of Daniel 12: 1 that it is mentioned that when Mi'cha-el stands up, or takes ruling power a “time of distress” is mentioned. This is a time of trouble and distress that has no equal, and that is in harmony with Jesus own words when he gave the composite sign of his presence in Kingdom Power. Matthew 24: 21,22 reads thusly: …”for then there will be great tribulation such as has not occurred since the Worlds beginning, until now, no, nor will occur again. In fact, unless those days were cut short no flesh would be saved; but on account of the chosen ones those days will be cut short.” Daniel 12:1 reads speaking about this same period of trouble: “And there will certainly occur a time of distress such as has not been made to occur since there came to be a Nation until that time.” ” So, Daniel; 12:1 and Matthew 24:21,22 are in complete harmony, one with the other. Both foretold a time of trouble unequaled in human History. That should tell us that Mi'cha-el has to be Christ Jesus, for who else could it be? Has Jehovah at the last minute changed his mind and given ruling power to someone other than the Christ? I seriously doubt that! There is one last clue to be taken into consideration.
Verse 2 of Daniel 12 mentions something that also identifies Mi'cha-el as Christ Jesus, because it mentions that the resurrection is taking place when Mi'cha-el stands up. It says: “And there will be many of those asleep in the ground of dust, who will wake up, these to indefinitely lasting life and those to reproaches [and] to indefinitely lasting abhorrence.” Now since the resurrection is taking place when Mi'cha-el stands up, it does well to consider who was entrusted to do the resurrecting. We learn who that was by reading John 5: 25-28 where we learn the following: “Most truly I say to you, The hour is coming and it is now when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who have given heed will live, For just as the Father has life in himself, so he has granted also to the Son to have life in himself, and he has given him authority to do judging, because Son of man he is. Do not marvel at this, because the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear his voice and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment.” So, when the dead heard Mi'cha-el's voice in Daniel 12:2 they actually heard the voice of the Son of God, as was pointed out in John 5:25-28.
So, then, quite clearly they have heard the voice of Mi'cha-el, and the resurrection begins, and since it is Jesus who is entrusted to do all of the resurrecting, then Mi'cha-el's voice had to be the voice of the Son of God, Jesus christ, and Jesus voice had to be that of Mi'cha-el the archangel. That means then, that they are one and the same person. Jesus is Mi'cha-el the archangel. This thought is not without scriptural proof, for we read at 1 Thessalonins 4:16,17 … “because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call with an archangels voice: …
Now, we learned from the prophecy in Daniel 12:2 that Mi'cha-el is involved in the resurrecting of the dead, and Paul showed us that it is Christ Jesus with the voice of an archangel is also the one involved in this resurrection of the the dead, … … ' And with God's Trumpet, And those who are dead in union with the Christ will rise first. Afterward we the living who are surviving will, together with them be caught away in clouds to meet the Lord in the air; and thus we shall always be with [the] Lord.” Unmistakably then, Christ Jesus is Mi'cha-el the archangel!
There is one more scripture that stamps Mi'cha-el as Christ Jesus, and that scripture is found at Revelation 12: 7-10 where it states this: “And War broke out in heaven. Mi'cha-el and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and it's angels battled but it did not prevail, neither was a place found for them any longer in heaven. So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called devil and satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth, he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. And I heard a loud voice in heaven say: “Now have come to pass the salvation of our God, and the power and the Kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ, because the the accuser of our Brothers has been hurled down, who accuses them day and night before our God” … The 'authority of the Christ' is linked with Michael throwing satan and his cohorts out of the heavens down with him. That also stamps Michael as Christ Jesus!
Now taking this scripture in context, we see that the Christ has been enthroned as King of God's Kingdom, and endowed with full authority to oust Satan and his demons from the heavenly realm, which is his first act as ruling King. So it had to be Christ Jesus in his heavenly spirit form as Mi'cha-el the archangel who was fighting this war against Satan and his demons; for who else had earned the right to clean out the heavenly realm? There is none other, absolutely no one could fill the office meant for only Christ Jesus. [Compare [Matthew 8:28-33] Beyond any doubt, Christ Jesus has to be Mi'cha-el the archange!
So, I have linked the Prophecy in Daniel with Matthew- John and Paul
and I have scripturally proven that Michael and Christ Jesus are one and the same person!Now, I know, that few, if not any, will agree with my interpretation of this subject, but this information is what I have been able to glean from my thirty-five years of Bible study. This, is what I believe to be the truth of the matter. My belief is what I share with all of you now.
If anyone believes, that he/she can supply a better interpretation, please let them feel free to do so. If I'm wrong in my reasoning, I would appreciate very much seeing a better interpretation. I could only benefit from that, if other reasonings prove out to be true, and, without any doubt, refute scripturally, beyond any doubt what I have stated here!
Now to cement my argument, so that no one will be able to refute one word that I've written here, I will cite three final scriptures, that will shut the mouths of those who do not agree that Michael and Christ Jesus are one and the same person. Those scriptures are, as follows: “And I saw the Heaven opened, and look! a white horse. And the one seated upon it is called faithful and true, and he JUDGES and carries on War in righteousness… … and the name his is called is the Word of God.” {Revelation 19:11,13} Now, without any doubt at all, we know that this has to be Christ Jesus, and there is ample reason to believe that, for in John 5:22,27} John penned these words for our enlightenment: “For the Father JUDGES no one at all, but he has commited ALL THE JUDGING to the Son.” … “and he has GIVEN HIM AUTHORITY TO DO JUDGING, because Son of Man he is.” So, it was only Jesus who was apointed to do judging, only he had the authority to do that! Only he had the authority to fight that War in heaven, according to these last final scriptures that I have supplied. He was the one who 'judges and carries on War in righteousness!' Both in heaven and on this earth! {Matthew 28:18} It is as Jesus himself stated, here, “ALL AUTHORITY HAS BEEN GIVEN TO ME IN HEAVEN AND ON EARTH.”
So, without any doubt at all Jesus and Michael are one and the same person. Only a Spiritual – Dunce would try to argue these last few scriptures, that thoroughly cement my scriptural reasoning on this matter. Texas!
[U]
You like creating these threads on Michael. You know, there's about 7 of them now. One would probably do.
I think the 7th day adventists also believe that Jesus is Michael the archangel, but they believe they believe that being the arch angel means being the “chief” OVER the other “angels” and not being an angel himself.
Perhaps you should go in and explore that direction.Something you may have missed regarding John 5:22-27, that I don't think gets mentioned very much, is:
On hearing whose voice do the dead raise?
“when THE DEAD WILL HEAR THE VOICE OF THE SON OF GOD AND those who have given heed WILL LIVE. . . . the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will HEAR HIS [Jesus] VOICE and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life.”
So, on hearing whose voice do the dead come to life?
And then compare that with:
“because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first.”–1 thess 4:16Jesus comes and an archangels voice accompanies him, or however other people want to understand it. But, notice how this is tied into the resurrection of the dead.
Quote (david @ May 03 2009,04:16) Something you may have missed regarding John 5:22-27, that I don't think gets mentioned very much, is: On hearing whose voice do the dead raise?
“when THE DEAD WILL HEAR THE VOICE OF THE SON OF GOD AND those who have given heed WILL LIVE. . . . the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will HEAR HIS [Jesus] VOICE and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life.”
So, on hearing whose voice do the dead come to life?
And then compare that with:
“because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first.”–1 thess 4:16Jesus comes and an archangels voice accompanies him, or however other people want to understand it. But, notice how this is tied into the resurrection of the dead.
David!
No David, that voice is issuing out of the mouth of this archangel, that makes this archangel the Christ. There can be no other proper explanation of that. I think, as I stated in the last paragraph that I cemented my argument with the final scriptures I supplied, because as I pointed out in that paragraph it was Jesus who was given the authority to judge and carry on war in righteousness. Michael, if he was someone else other than the Christ was given no such authority. Of course, only as Jesus he was! This gets more confusing by the moment! Time to drop this subject and find something else to disagree with; don't you think? Texas!Hi texas,
You say
“In order to scripturally prove that Michael is Christ Jesus one would of necessity have to be able to link the Prophecy in Daniel 12: 1,2 to the sign of the presence of Christ invisibly present in Kingdom Power. They both must speak of the same kind of World trouble due to happen when Michael 'stands up.' Or when the Christ invisibly takes Kingdom Power.”Why would you want to try to do so?
Thr trinity doctrine was formed by the same kind of illogic.Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 03 2009,07:16) Hi texas,
You say
“In order to scripturally prove that Michael is Christ Jesus one would of necessity have to be able to link the Prophecy in Daniel 12: 1,2 to the sign of the presence of Christ invisibly present in Kingdom Power. They both must speak of the same kind of World trouble due to happen when Michael 'stands up.' Or when the Christ invisibly takes Kingdom Power.”
Why would you want to try to do so?
Thr trinity doctrine was formed by the same kind of illogic.
Nick!!
One last final thought on this subject about Michael and Jesus being one and the same person. That thought is this: At Romans 12:2 we are told, this: “And quit being fashioned after this system of things, but be transformed by making your minds over, that you may PROVE TO YOURSELVES the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.” Then these words of Paul: “This is fine and acceptable in the sight of our savior God whose will is that all sorts of men should be saved and come to an accurate knowledge of Truth.” {1 Timothy 2:3,4}So, rather than prove something we have convinced ourselves the truth of a matter is, we are not obligated to expect everyone else to go along with us in our beliefs; they have to prove whatever subject we are dealing with to themselves, exactly as we have done, before they accept what we are teaching them. If they do not believe what we are saying, at least we have tried to impart what we know, and understand as the truth, to them. From there, it is all up to the ones we are teaching, whether they will believe what we are saying, or not! No one can force another to believe what they believe, just because we feel that our reasoning is correct reasoning.
I feel now, that I have done everything humanly possible to convey to others on the Board what I believe to be the truth of many matters! More particular this subject about Jesus and Michael being one and the same person. I'm comfortable with what I have taught about that subject, about many subjects, for that matter, because, I believe that I have thoroughly convinced myself of the truth of those matters, so, no more is required of me than that! I'll know, even if I'm not believed, that I did my best to convince others, by showing them what I've learned! What more can I, or anyone else do beyond that? If we have proven a Bible subject to ourselves, then,no more is required of us than that, except, that is, to impart the information that we have gained to others who may be willing to give us a hearing ear.
With that, I now drop this subject about Jesus and Michael being one and the same person! Let anyone, or everyone believe what they will if they have proven to themselves the good and acceptable and perfect will of God.
One final note Nick! We were not discussing the Trinity Doctrine at all! It had absolutely nothing to do with the matter at hand! Truth be told, though, I can punch that Doctrine full of holes too, very easily! I have done so, many many, times; and will do again when the opportunity presents itself! Give yourself a rest Nick, give yourself a rest! Texas!
Quote (david @ May 03 2009,04:16) Something you may have missed regarding John 5:22-27, that I don't think gets mentioned very much, is: On hearing whose voice do the dead raise?
“when THE DEAD WILL HEAR THE VOICE OF THE SON OF GOD AND those who have given heed WILL LIVE. . . . the hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will HEAR HIS [Jesus] VOICE and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life.”
So, on hearing whose voice do the dead come to life?
And then compare that with:
“because the Lord himself will descend from heaven with a commanding call, with an archangel’s voice and with God’s trumpet, and those who are dead in union with Christ will rise first.”–1 thess 4:16Jesus comes and an archangels voice accompanies him, or however other people want to understand it. But, notice how this is tied into the resurrection of the dead.
David!
Don't forget David, that Jesus was a heavenly angel prior to his coming to this earth, and since, as you already know, he was, after he was put to death, resurrected in the Spirit, and returned to the invisible heavens as a Spirit angel once again. So, when he descends again with the voice of an Archangel, it will be with the voice of Michael the Archangel, because that scripture clearly told us, {that the lord himself} will descend WITH THE VOICE of an Archange. In other words employing that voice himself. Now, since Jesus was an angel prior to his coming to this earth, what do you suppose his name was in the heavenly realm? Give yourself a serious shake David, it might just serve to arouse you from your spiritual slumber. They hear the voice of Michael the Archangel, who was himself Christ Jesus while he walked this earth in human form. So, in hearing the voice of Michael they would be hearing the voice of Christ Jesus anyway! Wake up David, wake up! Texas!Hi texas,
Scripture is straightforward.
You have learned that the JWs are false religion.
You need to let go of the bad approach of the JWs to learning from scripture.
Let it speak without human addition and support itself with other verses that confirms what is written.2 Corinthians 13
1This is the third time I am coming to you. In the mouth of two or three witnesses shall every word be established.Jesus is the son of God, Angels are different creatures all together. the were created to worship,praise and do Gods bidding. Where the heck did this whole theory come from? Michael and Jesus the same?I don't know who is teaching you this stuff, but Ill give them this, they have quite an imagination. And the say Im reaching when I'm in the conspiracy threads on the other website I get on.
Quote David!
No David, that voice is issuing out of the mouth of this archangel, that makes this archangel the Christ. There can be no other proper explanation of that.Hi Texas. Of course I believe Christ is the archangel. I never suggested otherwise, and have commented on that fact far more than anyone on here, yourself included.
Quote Give yourself a serious shake David, it might just serve to arouse you from your spiritual slumber.
If I completely agree with you, does that mean you are sleeping too? Or just not great at reading?Quote Wake up David, wake up! Texas!
Read better texas, read better.All I was saying in that post, was that however you want to understand that scripture, it is interesting isn't it, that Jesus voice is said to raise the dead, and here, we have Jesus with the voice of an archangel and the dead are raised. So, logically, whose voice was heard? Jesus or the archangel? Obviously, they are the same one. I was just trying to cut past all the comments like Nick give, who responded to your post to me saying:
Quote Where does scripture clearly tell us Jesus returns with the voice of MICHAEL?
I was just saying to set that aside and notice in John, whose voice the dead hear, when they come to life.Quote Angels are different creatures all together. Yes, because scriptures say that. No. The word “angel” is applied to both spirit creatures and humans….hundreds of times I believe. Check the Bible.
Hi David,
The boxes under Texas' name are warnings that have been given out over time. He continued to offend and break rules, and so he is no longer able to post here.
Enjoy the summer weather!
MandyYeah Id like to know where it says humans are angels as well. Where do you get this stuff man? I mean the Angels arent even the same beings as humans, not even after we are released from this mortal coil are we not the same as angels. And Jesus is The Son of God, Not an Angel. That is why he can deliver your souls and Angels Cant. I mean lucifer is An angel, and he still has to answer the Jesus. WHO HAS POWER STILL OVER ALL THE ANGELS. The only one higher the Jesus is God Himself.
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