- This topic is empty.
- Posts
tk
when Jesus says now everything is accomplished ;this is related to the Messiah ,all what was said that he would do ,what would happen to him, this was until his dead ,but his Resurrection was still to come and the promise of the holy spirit the comforter,
I also want to bring to your attention that the ceremonial law ,is not the OLD Testament but only a small part of it
Col 2:16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
Col 2:17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.Paul uses the only scriptures available to him to explain that all thing pointing out to Christ ,SO i SAY IT AGAIN WE CAN NOT UNDERSTAND THE FULL TRUTH OF GOD AND CHRIST WITHOUT THE OLD TESTAMENT,
i DO NOT HATE ANYONE;
UNDERSTAND THAT PAUL,JOHN,PETER,JAMES,LETTERS ARE UNDERSTANDINGS OF THE SCRIPTURES AND TEACHINGS OF CHRIST BASED ON THOSE SCRIPTURES O.T.
Pierre
Tim and all! What I find very interesting is that most people think that we are still under the Ten Commandments….The fact is we never were….it is a Covenant God made with the Children of Israel…
But keep in mind that we are not without a written Law,,,Jesus did not abolish the Law, in fact He magnified the Law and made it Holy and for all…at the Sermon on the Mount…..and He gave us the New Covenant in His blood…..and the Great Commandments….What He did abolish is the sacrificial law, He is our perfect Scarifies….no other needed…
Exd 34:27 ¶ And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel.
Exd 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.
Luk 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup [is] the New Covenant in my blood, which is shed for you.
Mat 22:36 Master, which [is] the great commandment in the law?
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.Jesus was a Jew and they keep the Sabbath, which is a Covenant for the children o Israel..
Exd 31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, [for] a perpetual covenant.
Exd 31:17 It [is] a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.
Peace Irene
Context
<>
New American Standard Bible——————————————————————————–
52And Jesus said to them, “Therefore every scribe who has become a disciple of the kingdom of heaven is like a head of a household, who brings out of his treasure things new and old.”It's all God. It's all great and good, old and new. Peace.
Quote (mikeangel @ Sep. 10 2011,22:29) Tim,
Do you Pray to God? In other words, do you believe in a Ruler of creation, who created it, who we worship and petition and ask for blessings?
Mark: Bless you this day.Jesus said…when you pray, go into your closet, shut the door and pray to your father in heaven…! Yes I have learned not to stand in front of people and fake a prayer with many good words to look righteous. I go inside my heart/mind and meditate and listen for the voice of God to align with his written word.
Do I ask God for things. No, God knows what I need before I ask so I wait on God for the most part. Yet we must stay cognizant of the fact that the earth God created was originally given to mankind. God can only work on your behalf with your authorization or request, lest he usurp mans authority in the earth.
Jesus said,….One must worship the father in spirit of truth/words of God, it is these that the father seeks as worshipers. The words of God are spirit and when interpreted correctly they give life to the hearer. Not death and destruction but life more abundant.
God richly bless you Mike, these are my opinions, TK
Quote (Pastry @ Sep. 11 2011,09:37) Tim and all! What I find very interesting is that most people think that we are still under the Ten Commandments….The fact is we never were….it is a Covenant God made with the Children of Israel…
But keep in mind that we are not without a written Law,,,Jesus did not abolish the Law, in fact He magnified the Law and made it Holy and for all…at the Sermon on the Mount…..and He gave us the New Covenant in His blood…..and the Great Commandments….What He did abolish is the sacrificial law, He is our perfect Scarifies….no other needed…
Exd 34:27 ¶ And the LORD said unto Moses, Write thou these words: for after the tenor of these words I have made a covenant with thee and with Israel.
Exd 34:28 And he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he did neither eat bread, nor drink water. And he wrote upon the tables the words of the covenant, the ten commandments.
Luk 22:20 Likewise also the cup after supper, saying, This cup [is] the New Covenant in my blood, which is shed for you.
Mat 22:36 Master, which [is] the great commandment in the law?
Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.Jesus was a Jew and they keep the Sabbath, which is a Covenant for the children o Israel..
Exd 31:16 Wherefore the children of Israel shall keep the sabbath, to observe the sabbath throughout their generations, [for] a perpetual covenant.
Exd 31:17 It [is] a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for [in] six days the LORD made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed.
Peace Irene
Irene: God bless you this day and always.If we are not under the ten commandments because as you say they were given to the Children of Israel, that leaves only the old Jewish laws of which not only do we not have them available to see and learn from but they were for the self-proclaimed chosen Jews. This leaves us with no laws for the New Testament.
Jesus never ever said that he abolished the sacrificial laws. He said they would not alter even one jot or tittle until ALL is fulfilled.
The sermon on the mountain by Jesus at the beginning had nothing to do with the law! Where do you come up with that sermon having anything to do with the law?
Jesus was preaching blessings or good things to happen upon the people that were poor(didn't think they knew it all) in spirit/doctrines, they could receive the new truth, they that mourned as unworthy sinners yet desired to know the truth would be comforted, the meek or those willing to change their way of thinking under the law, would inherit the earth. Blessed are they that hunger and thirst after righteousness for THEY SHALL BE FILLED by God, not work and deeds. The pure in heart(those who accept the sinless perfection of God through Jesus) will see God. The peacemakers will teach peace and rest to others through the forgiveness of Jesus and will be known as children of God/Peace. Blessed is (the poor fools) that say we have all been made righteous, perfect, clean and sin free through Jesus.
How was Jesus a Jew? God was his father! How could Jesus be a bloodline Jew? He wasn't!
Jesus did not keep the Sabbath he fulfilled it! Jesus didn't follow the law. He set free a Woman guilty under the law. He did not follow ceremonial washings. He performed no sacrifices under the law. Jesus didn't pay the temple tax until they leaned on him.
This dissertation on the mountain, from Jesus, is not in any way a law or commandment. Its straight out facts of how the blessings of God will now work.
These are my beliefs and perceptions at this time, Bless you, TK
tk
Quote How was Jesus a Jew? God was his father! How could Jesus be a bloodline Jew? He wasn't! MT 2:2 “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we saw His star in the east and have come to worship Him.”
MT 27:11 Now Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor questioned Him, saying, “Are You the King of the Jews?” And Jesus said to him, “It is as you say.”JN 2:13 The Passover of the Jews was near, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
JN 2:18 The Jews then said to Him, “ What sign do You show us as your authority for doing these things?”
JN 2:20 The Jews then said, “It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?”
JN 3:1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews;
JN 4:9 Therefore the Samaritan woman *said to Him, “How is it that You, being a Jew, ask me for a drink since I am a Samaritan woman?” (For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.)
JN 4:22 “ You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
JN 5:1 After these things there was a feast of the Jews, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.JN 9:22 His parents said this because they were afraid of the Jews; for the Jews had already agreed that if anyone confessed Him to be Christ, he was to be put out of the synagogue.
JN 18:20 Jesus answered him, “I have spoken openly to the world; I always taught in synagogues and in the temple, where all the Jews come together; and I spoke nothing in secret.
how can someone claim that he is the Messiah and not be a Jew ?
Pierre
Tim! You said this
[/QUOTE]
If we are not under the ten commandments because as you say they were given to the Children of Israel, that leaves only the old Jewish laws of which not only do we not have them available to see and learn from but they were for the self-proclaimed chosen Jews. This leaves us with no laws for the New Testament.Quote What is the Great Commandment?
Mat 22:36 Master, which [is] the great commandment in the law?Mat 22:37 Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
Mat 22:38 This is the first and great commandment.
Mat 22:39 And the second [is] like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
Mat 22:40 On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets.You said this
Jesus never ever said that he abolished the sacrificial laws. He said they would not alter even one jot or tittle until ALL is fulfilled.Quote Jesus fulfilled the sacrificial Law by dying on the Cross for all of us… No more animal scarifies needed,
Jesus is our perfect scarify..
You said this
Jesus was preaching blessings or good things to happen upon the people that were poor(didn't think they knew it all) in spirit/doctrines, they could receive the new truth, they that mourned as unworthy sinners yet desired to know the truth would be comforted, the meek or those willing to change their way of thinking under the law, would inherit the earth. Blessed are they that hunger and thirst after righteousness for THEY SHALL BE FILLED by God, not work and deeds. The pure in heart(those who accept the sinless perfection of God through Jesus) will see God. The peacemakers will teach peace and rest to others through the forgiveness of Jesus and will be known as children of God/Peace. Blessed is (the poor fools) that say we have all been made righteous, perfect, clean and sin free through Jesus.Jesus not only taught us blessings on the Sermon on the Mount, He also said this
Mat 5:27 ¶ Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:Mat 5:28 But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. etc.
This is considered magnifying the law… adultery etc. being part of the Law even the Great Commandment if you love your neighbor as yourself you would not do any of the law of Old…. ….. you really need to read up on that,..Peace Irene
Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 12 2011,04:04) tk Quote How was Jesus a Jew? God was his father! How could Jesus be a bloodline Jew? He wasn't! MT 2:2 “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we saw His star in the east and have come to worship Him.”
MT 27:11 Now Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor questioned Him, saying, “Are You the King of the Jews?” And Jesus said to him, “It is as you say.”JN 2:13 The Passover of the Jews was near, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
JN 2:18 The Jews then said to Him, “ What sign do You show us as your authority for doing these things?”
JN 2:20 The Jews then said, “It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?”
JN 3:1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews;
JN 4:9 Therefore the Samaritan woman *said to Him, “How is it that You, being a Jew, ask me for a drink since I am a Samaritan woman?” (For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.)
JN 4:22 “ You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
JN 5:1 After these things there was a feast of the Jews, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.JN 9:22 His parents said this because they were afraid of the Jews; for the Jews had already agreed that if anyone confessed Him to be Christ, he was to be put out of the synagogue.
JN 18:20 Jesus answered him, “I have spoken openly to the world; I always taught in synagogues and in the temple, where all the Jews come together; and I spoke nothing in secret.
how can someone claim that he is the Messiah and not be a Jew ?
Pierre
Good post Pierre…
Quote (Pastry @ Sep. 12 2011,11:28) Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 12 2011,04:04) tk Quote How was Jesus a Jew? God was his father! How could Jesus be a bloodline Jew? He wasn't! MT 2:2 “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we saw His star in the east and have come to worship Him.”
MT 27:11 Now Jesus stood before the governor, and the governor questioned Him, saying, “Are You the King of the Jews?” And Jesus said to him, “It is as you say.”JN 2:13 The Passover of the Jews was near, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.
JN 2:18 The Jews then said to Him, “ What sign do You show us as your authority for doing these things?”
JN 2:20 The Jews then said, “It took forty-six years to build this temple, and will You raise it up in three days?”
JN 3:1 Now there was a man of the Pharisees, named Nicodemus, a ruler of the Jews;
JN 4:9 Therefore the Samaritan woman *said to Him, “How is it that You, being a Jew, ask me for a drink since I am a Samaritan woman?” (For Jews have no dealings with Samaritans.)
JN 4:22 “ You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews.
JN 5:1 After these things there was a feast of the Jews, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem.JN 9:22 His parents said this because they were afraid of the Jews; for the Jews had already agreed that if anyone confessed Him to be Christ, he was to be put out of the synagogue.
JN 18:20 Jesus answered him, “I have spoken openly to the world; I always taught in synagogues and in the temple, where all the Jews come together; and I spoke nothing in secret.
how can someone claim that he is the Messiah and not be a Jew ?
Pierre
Good post Pierre… tk
Quote Jesus said,….One must worship the father in spirit of truth/words of God, do you really believe that this is all it means?the words of God ? I mean in truth?
Pierre
Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 12 2011,07:20) tk Quote Jesus said,….One must worship the father in spirit of truth/words of God, do you really believe that this is all it means?the words of God ? I mean in truth?
Pierre
pierre: Only for the “true” worshipers!!John4:23….when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth:…for the Father seeketh such to worship him!!!
V24….God is spirit: and they that worship him “MUST” worship him in spirit and in truth.
You can make it say what you want it to say but Jesus said it and I follow it. You do what you wish! TK
Quote (ftk @ Sep. 13 2011,05:17) Quote (terraricca @ Sep. 12 2011,07:20) tk Quote Jesus said,….One must worship the father in spirit of truth/words of God, do you really believe that this is all it means?the words of God ? I mean in truth?
Pierre
pierre: Only for the “true” worshipers!!John4:23….when the true worshipers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth:…for the Father seeketh such to worship him!!!
V24….God is spirit: and they that worship him “MUST” worship him in spirit and in truth.
You can make it say what you want it to say but Jesus said it and I follow it. You do what you wish! TK
tkworship in spirit means with our mind and heart and knowledge,
but in truth means that all what WE DO has to be in accord with that worship,either what we say,or do as to be totally true to God and his words,we can lie in our spirit but we can lie between our spirit and our actions ,like saying something and doing another,
this is were the deeds coming in our true faith as to seen in those deeds,or our faith is dead
Pierre
Pierre: The “fruit” produced by a human being is the “words” that come from the storehouse of his heart, good or evil. Fruit can be eaten, accepted, taken into another for harm or good. The fruit of the spirit is not works and deeds. One fruit of the spirit is kindness in word and then there can be deed.
Matt: 12:37….Jesus said,….by your words thou shalt be justified and by thy words thou art condemned.
Works and deeds can express love and kindness to others. But works and deeds cannot save you from sin or cleanse you or make you whole or perform any part of the total salvation in Christ. IMO, TK
Here is where the dog chases his tail. James states that faith without works is dead. If you have faith and love God, you will do something good. If you are doubtful or wicked, you will do bad things. Not only will you do bad things but your mouth will give forth unrightiousness. This is a plain as day concept to me that many do not understand. Just because it says that faith alone saves you, which is true because only Jesus saves with his sacrifice, doesn't mean you can decide “well, the bible says my faith saves me and I'm good”. You are a stupid fool if you believe that. You ignore all of Gods teaching about mercy and love. Your salvation doesn't come from your works, but your inner self is shown through them. Bad people do bad things, Good people do good things. God knows which is which. God outlines how you are supose to act in the bible. If you love him you will try to please him and regret where you don't. Simple. Almost twist proof………
Quote (mikeangel @ Sep. 15 2011,04:53) Here is where the dog chases his tail. James states that faith without works is dead. If you have faith and love God, you will do something good. If you are doubtful or wicked, you will do bad things. Not only will you do bad things but your mouth will give forth unrightiousness. This is a plain as day concept to me that many do not understand. Just because it says that faith alone saves you, which is true because only Jesus saves with his sacrifice, doesn't mean you can decide “well, the bible says my faith saves me and I'm good”. You are a stupid fool if you believe that. You ignore all of Gods teaching about mercy and love. Your salvation doesn't come from your works, but your inner self is shown through them. Bad people do bad things, Good people do good things. God knows which is which. God outlines how you are supose to act in the bible. If you love him you will try to please him and regret where you don't. Simple. Almost twist proof………
hi markgood post ,so TK what you say ?
Pierre
Quote (mikeangel @ Sep. 14 2011,21:53) Here is where the dog chases his tail. James states that faith without works is dead. If you have faith and love God, you will do something good. If you are doubtful or wicked, you will do bad things. Not only will you do bad things but your mouth will give forth unrightiousness. This is a plain as day concept to me that many do not understand. Just because it says that faith alone saves you, which is true because only Jesus saves with his sacrifice, doesn't mean you can decide “well, the bible says my faith saves me and I'm good”. You are a stupid fool if you believe that. You ignore all of Gods teaching about mercy and love. Your salvation doesn't come from your works, but your inner self is shown through them. Bad people do bad things, Good people do good things. God knows which is which. God outlines how you are supose to act in the bible. If you love him you will try to please him and regret where you don't. Simple. Almost twist proof………
Mark, and I agree with Pierre here… this is the best post you have made that I seen you do…. keep up the good work…. you are a very loving person, and I for one appreciate such it will be my pleasure to call you FRIEND….Peace an Love IrenePierre and Irene,
Thank you very much. It's not me. I count for and know nothing on my own, I mean that. God reveals himself to me in the Bible and his world. It's the only thing in this life I can completely trust. All credit and Glory to him. I call you all friends and love you, and will see you at the table of God one day. Today would be just great. Love always, Mark
Quote (mikeangel @ Sep. 14 2011,21:53) Here is where the dog chases his tail. James states that faith without works is dead. If you have faith and love God, you will do something good. If you are doubtful or wicked, you will do bad things. Not only will you do bad things but your mouth will give forth unrightiousness. This is a plain as day concept to me that many do not understand. Just because it says that faith alone saves you, which is true because only Jesus saves with his sacrifice, doesn't mean you can decide “well, the bible says my faith saves me and I'm good”. You are a stupid fool if you believe that. You ignore all of Gods teaching about mercy and love. Your salvation doesn't come from your works, but your inner self is shown through them. Bad people do bad things, Good people do good things. God knows which is which. God outlines how you are supose to act in the bible. If you love him you will try to please him and regret where you don't. Simple. Almost twist proof………
For All:A human being living in this world gets up and goes to bed daily with works and deeds in between, arising, working & sleeping. This is the life of one called human. Every person does them whether they know God or Jesus or nothing. Physicality is a reality of duality.
Only God is good. God is good news. God is good life. God is all good truth. Now when a man reads Gods words and finds out from them the good news of what Jesus has done for us and given us there is great joy and love created in the person that received the good news about God. That salvation truth that is in him is forever if he hold fast to it and won't let it go. Even if he doesn't do another thing for anyone else.
A “wiser man”, that received the good news of salvation from Jesus that perfected him and made him perfect in the creators eyes would go forth to some or many and share the truth of the love of God and the salvation that is provided. Those words he would use are the “fruit” of the spirit of God if they align with God.
A man saying I have faith in Gods salvation, whether written or orally is doing the work of God by creating faith in what he is believing about God!! The disciples said to Jesus,….What shall we do to do the works of God….Jesus answered this is the work of God…..that you believe Jesus words! When one shares “Gods words” with another, he is “doing the work of God”……if he does not share or teach the truth of God, it may grow old to him and he could disbelieve to loose it all, but that is not mine to say. He doesn't go to hell to be tortured for it.
But whether he shares or does not share the truth of God, he will still, as a human being, get up and do “human” works and deeds until he goes to sleep at night again. Those are human works chosen and controlled by the person apart from God.
Human works and deeds whether kind or unkind are apart from God. They are chosen movements of life under the control of the man. You do not “get” to God any way but by “faith” therefore you cannot fall away from God(or leave God in your mind) through works and deeds, good or evil.
WORKS AND DEEDS DO NOT PURIFY YOUR SOUL!!!!!!! WORKS AND DEEDS ARE APART FROM SALVATION IN CHRIST. YOU CAN'T WORK YOUR WAY TO GOD SO IT STAND YOU CANNOT WORK YOUR WAY FROM GOD! ONLY BELIEF AND UNBELIEF CAN CONNECT OR DISCONNECT,…..AND THOSE ARE OF THE MIND!!
It is true that if your heart is full of the love of God, you will most likely want to express that love. That is true. But you are not condemned if you don't. There is no condemnation in Christ!
The real works that Jesus sent his followers out to do was, healing the sick, raising the dead(in sin), casting out devils/lies of untruth, with the truth! That is the “true” mission of disciples of Jesus. That is the “true” work. IMO, TK
TK
Quote The real works that Jesus sent his followers out to do was, healing the sick, raising the dead(in sin), casting out devils/lies of untruth, with the truth! That is the “true” mission of disciples of Jesus. That is the “true” work. IMO, TK this is your opinion, I did not see a command like that from Christ ,but it seems that his 11 + Paul did most of the miracles ,so show that the disciples later have continue and recieved the same ability from God to do such a miracles ,
Pierre
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
