when Heaven and angels created?

[sscott]

To pick up on our conversation:

Nick Says:

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“Hi sscott, fair enough. Gen 1 encompasses eternity too.

sscott says:

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1 Thus the heavens and the earth, and all the host of them, were finished. 2 And on the seventh day God ended His work which He had done, and He rested on the seventh day from all His work which He had done. Eternity? Or 7 days. Gen 1,2 about the first 7 days.

[charity]

Hi Scott, great thoughts

Maybe somthing in this; even as we should end at entering our rest by ceasing from our own will.
even as God enter the seventh day and rested

Act 7:49 Heaven [is] my throne, and earth [is] my footstool: what house will ye build me? saith the Lord: or what [is] the place of my rest?

As if the seven day creation is not yet finished? untill all that are created end the race to the rest place?
creation moving on still?

The Sun of righteousness Malachi 4

Gen 1:16 And God made two great lights; the greater light to rule the day, and the lesser light to rule the night: [he made] the stars also.
Gen 15:5 And he brought him forth abroad, and said, Look now toward heaven, and tell the stars, if thou be able to number them: and he said unto him, So shall thy seed be.
Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind.

Recreation to be transformed

Gen 22:17 That in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which [is] upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;
Gen 26:4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;

Hbr 1:14 Are they not all ministering spirits, sent forth to minister for them who shall be heirs of salvation?

Maybe we are created to be glorified back to what we were in the beginning

Rev 2:28 And I will give him the morning star.
Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, [and] the bright and morning star.

charity

[charity]

Also this Angels on earth,

Moving all his creation;

Hbr 1:5 For unto which of the angels said he at any time, Thou art my Son, this day have I begotten thee? And again, I will be to him a Father, and he shall be to me a Son?

Angels with signs and wonders; even the gift of the holy ghost, maybe even that we should have to follow Christ to god before we receive the holy ghost; with the power of truth

Hbr 2:4 God also bearing [them] witness, both with signs and wonders, and with divers miracles, and gifts of the Holy Ghost, according to his own will?

charity

[charity]

I’m sorry guy’s I don’t mean to torment you with my thoughts!

But I love to allow God to be as powerful as needs, seen as our minds conceive what we shall become?

charity

[sscott]

I don't seen any scriptures that state angels existed before the 7 days of creation…before the “beginning”.

[NickHassan]

Hi sscott,
You cannot see before the beginning because time was only created for creation and God is timeless.

[charity]

Quote (sscott @ Dec. 27 2006,04:49)

I don't seen any scriptures that state angels existed before the 7 days of creation…before the “beginning”.

Okay thanks Scott

Gods language is different to ours, he specks of the sun and moon as we have them, also the new Jerusalem has no need of sun or moon for the father and the son are its light,
Yet the earth is never going to be destroyed for we have the bow in the sky to remind us of god promise, and it is our inheritance for ever to every generation to follow.

Also we have children of the night and children of the day,

We are beast’s fish and trees all through the bible.

Considering and thinking much about these things

[charity]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 27 2006,05:31)

Hi sscott, You cannot see before the beginning because time was only created for creation and God is timeless.

God created us at the end of our race purified and in the image of him and the Son,

Went then and began the creation that would in time arive at the days of the Son that then would lead us to be transformed into What God had planed from the beginning

charity

[david]

JOB 38:4-7
“Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell [me], if you do know understanding. Who set its measurements, in case you know, Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line? Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down, Or who laid its cornerstone, When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?”

In Rev 22:16, Jesus is referred to as a bright morning star. So, it's not to much of a leap to think angels could figuratively be called morning stars. Of course, real stars don't cry out together because they're happy.

In other places, Job itself, angels are referred to as “son's of God.”:
JOB 1:6
“Now it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and even Satan proceeded to enter right among them.”

JOB 2:1
“Afterward it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and Satan also proceeded to enter right among them to take his station before Jehovah.”

The point of this is that the morning stars or son's of God were there to shout in applause when these things were created.

[charity]

Quote (david @ Dec. 27 2006,09:11)

JOB 38:4-7 “Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell [me], if you do know understanding. Who set its measurements, in case you know, Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line? Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down, Or who laid its cornerstone, When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?” In Rev 22:16, Jesus is referred to as a bright morning star.  So, it's not to much of a leap to think angels could figuratively be called morning stars.  Of course, real stars don't cry out together because they're happy. In other places, Job itself, angels are referred to as “son's of God.”: JOB 1:6 “Now it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and even Satan proceeded to enter right among them.” JOB 2:1 “Afterward it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and Satan also proceeded to enter right among them to take his station before Jehovah.” The point of this is that the morning stars or son's of God were there to shout in applause when these things were created.

hi david

charity

[NickHassan]

Hi David,
You say
“In Rev 22:16, Jesus is referred to as a bright morning star. So, it's not to much of a leap to think angels could figuratively be called morning stars. “

It is an established scriptural principle.
Rev 1
“20The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.”

[sscott]

Quote (david @ Dec. 27 2006,09:11)

JOB 38:4-7 “Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell [me], if you do know understanding. Who set its measurements, in case you know, Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line? Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down, Or who laid its cornerstone, When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?” In Rev 22:16, Jesus is referred to as a bright morning star. So, it's not to much of a leap to think angels could figuratively be called morning stars. Of course, real stars don't cry out together because they're happy. In other places, Job itself, angels are referred to as “son's of God.”: JOB 1:6 “Now it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and even Satan proceeded to enter right among them.” JOB 2:1 “Afterward it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and Satan also proceeded to enter right among them to take his station before Jehovah.” The point of this is that the morning stars or son's of God were there to shout in applause when these things were created.

They shouted when the earths foundations were laid…..on day 3.

[NickHassan]

Hi sscott,
Gen 1
' 1In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth.

2And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.”

So the earth was created before genesis 1.1 but was yet formless. To be the earth surely it must have been a distinct orb in the heavens. God, by His Spirit, manifested in His creation. It goes without saying that God was ever in the highest heavens.

[charity]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ Dec. 27 2006,18:36)

Hi David, You say “In Rev 22:16, Jesus is referred to as a bright morning star.  So, it's not to much of a leap to think angels could figuratively be called morning stars.  “ It is an established scriptural principle. Rev 1 “20The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.”

So then shall our souls be lifted in faith and hope?

For even the Angel was sent before him to minister and testify to us that should receive the truth

Rev 22:16 I Jesus have sent mine angel to testify unto you these things in the churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, [and] the bright and morning star.

charity

[david]

Quote

Hi David, You say “In Rev 22:16, Jesus is referred to as a bright morning star. So, it's not to much of a leap to think angels could figuratively be called morning stars. “ It is an established scriptural principle. Rev 1 “20The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches.”

Right. Sorry. I didn't spend a lot of time on this. So I was right, even though I couldn't provide the actual scripture.

Quote

Quote (david @ Dec. 27 2006,09:11) JOB 38:4-7 “Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell [me], if you do know understanding. Who set its measurements, in case you know, Or who stretched out upon it the measuring line? Into what have its socket pedestals been sunk down, Or who laid its cornerstone, When the morning stars joyfully cried out together, And all the sons of God began shouting in applause?” In Rev 22:16, Jesus is referred to as a bright morning star. So, it's not to much of a leap to think angels could figuratively be called morning stars. Of course, real stars don't cry out together because they're happy. In other places, Job itself, angels are referred to as “son's of God.”: JOB 1:6 “Now it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and even Satan proceeded to enter right among them.” JOB 2:1 “Afterward it came to be the day when the sons of the [true] God entered to take their station before Jehovah, and Satan also proceeded to enter right among them to take his station before Jehovah.” The point of this is that the morning stars or son's of God were there to shout in applause when these things were created. They shouted when the earths foundations were laid…..on day 3.

So when do you believe the angels were created?

[david]

“God went on to say: ‘Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every moving animal that is moving upon the earth.’” (Genesis 1:26)

When God said, “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness,” he was not talking to himself as if he were a two-in-one god or a three-in-one god. He was talking to to at least one other heavenly person separate and distinct from himself and was inviting that spirit person to join him in the producing of an earthly, human creature.

It seems there were spirit persons whom God had created even before the creation of the earth. This fact was called to the attention of faithful Job of the land of Uz, when God said to him:

“Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell me, if you do know understanding. Who set its measurements, in case you know . . . or who laid its cornerstone, when the morning stars joyfully cried out together, and all the sons of God began shouting in applause?” (Job 38:1-7)

Founding the earth, laying it's foundation or cornerstone seems to indicate the beginning of the earth's creation. It seems to indicate that the angels were there in joy, watching as these things were happening, from the earths founding.

HERE'S AN INTERESTING POINT:
While some think that the angels were created somewhere in the days of creation, even the starry “heavens and the earth” itself were created in a beginning before the first “day” of creation began. (Gen. 1:1)

GENESIS 1:1
“In [the] beginning God created the heavens and the earth.”

God’s Word shows that angels, the morning stars and sons of God, sang and shouted for joy when the foundations of the earth were laid; so they must have been created even before the earth was made. And since Jesus Christ, in his prehuman existence as the Logos, was “the beginning of the creation by God,” and used of God to create all other things, it follows that the angels were created after God created the Logos and before the creation of the material universe.—Job 38:7; Rev. 3:14.

david

[charity]

Quote (david @ Dec. 28 2006,02:26)

“God went on to say: ‘Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every moving animal that is moving upon the earth.’” (Genesis 1:26) When God said, “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness,” he was not talking to himself as if he were a two-in-one god or a three-in-one god. He was talking to to at least one other heavenly person separate and distinct from himself and was inviting that spirit person to join him in the producing of an earthly, human creature. It seems there were spirit persons whom God had created even before the creation of the earth. This fact was called to the attention of faithful Job of the land of Uz, when God said to him: “Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell me, if you do know understanding. Who set its measurements, in case you know . . . or who laid its cornerstone, when the morning stars joyfully cried out together, and all the sons of God began shouting in applause?” (Job 38:1-7) Founding the earth, laying it's foundation or cornerstone seems to indicate the beginning of the earth's creation.  It seems to indicate that the angels were there in joy, watching as these things were happening, from the earths founding. HERE'S AN INTERESTING POINT: While some think that the angels were created somewhere in the days of creation, even the starry “heavens and the earth” itself were created in a beginning before the first “day” of creation began. (Gen. 1:1) GENESIS 1:1 “In [the] beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” God’s Word shows that angels, the morning stars and sons of God, sang and shouted for joy when the foundations of the earth were laid; so they must have been created even before the earth was made. And since Jesus Christ, in his prehuman existence as the Logos, was “the beginning of the creation by God,” and used of God to create all other things, it follows that the angels were created after God created the Logos and before the creation of the material universe.—Job 38:7; Rev. 3:14. david

david way way good thinking!

So where do the bad angels finish, complete darkness as the first day

Also the creation of the Son and father that begun from 2006 years ago.

Was the creation that should replenish and subdue the earth that the Adam creation filled the earth with?

Brings the creation into heavenly hosts on earth, as the 7 days only include until God had finished the heavenly host of heavens and earth

But now God walks out of the 7 day’s and picks up dust and forms man to start his journey towards what he had created him to end as

Created first the finished Man
Gen 1:28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

they were created before anything grew from being watered, still nothing on earth no start even no man on earth yet to tioll the ground? but 7 days are finished

Gen 2:5 And every plant of the field before it was in the earth, and every herb of the field before it grew: for the LORD God had not caused it to rain upon the earth, and [there was] not a man to till the ground.

so God takes from the dust to start the earth moving.

Gen 2:7 And the LORD God formed man [of] the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.

This is numbering the seed as dust creation
Gen 13:16 And I will make thy seed as the dust of the earth: so that if a man can number the dust of the earth, [then] shall thy seed also be numbered.

to come in promise then the seed numbered as stars?
Gen 22:17 that in blessing I will bless thee, and in multiplying I will multiply thy seed as the stars of the heaven, and as the sand which [is] upon the sea shore; and thy seed shall possess the gate of his enemies;

And the grand formally end that with refused to be transformed still as numbered dust against the stars of heaven

Hang on wait!!they did receive the star tital but?

Jud 1:13 Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.

charity

[NickHassan]

Quote (david @ Dec. 28 2006,02:26)

“God went on to say: ‘Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness, and let them have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and the domestic animals and all the earth and every moving animal that is moving upon the earth.’” (Genesis 1:26) When God said, “Let us make man in our image, according to our likeness,” he was not talking to himself as if he were a two-in-one god or a three-in-one god. He was talking to to at least one other heavenly person separate and distinct from himself and was inviting that spirit person to join him in the producing of an earthly, human creature. It seems there were spirit persons whom God had created even before the creation of the earth. This fact was called to the attention of faithful Job of the land of Uz, when God said to him: “Where did you happen to be when I founded the earth? Tell me, if you do know understanding. Who set its measurements, in case you know . . . or who laid its cornerstone, when the morning stars joyfully cried out together, and all the sons of God began shouting in applause?” (Job 38:1-7) Founding the earth, laying it's foundation or cornerstone seems to indicate the beginning of the earth's creation.  It seems to indicate that the angels were there in joy, watching as these things were happening, from the earths founding. HERE'S AN INTERESTING POINT: While some think that the angels were created somewhere in the days of creation, even the starry “heavens and the earth” itself were created in a beginning before the first “day” of creation began. (Gen. 1:1) GENESIS 1:1 “In [the] beginning God created the heavens and the earth.” God’s Word shows that angels, the morning stars and sons of God, sang and shouted for joy when the foundations of the earth were laid; so they must have been created even before the earth was made. And since Jesus Christ, in his prehuman existence as the Logos, was “the beginning of the creation by God,” and used of God to create all other things, it follows that the angels were created after God created the Logos and before the creation of the material universe.—Job 38:7; Rev. 3:14. david

Hi david,
The foundation of earth was in the beginning and ps 89 and Jb 38 suggest that the heavenly hosts were before that event.

Psalm 102:25
Of old hast thou laid the foundation of the earth: and the heavens are the work of thy hands.
Psalm 104:5
Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever
Proverbs 8:29
When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
Isaiah 40:21
Have ye not known? have ye not heard? hath it not been told you from the beginning? have ye not understood from the foundations of the earth?
Isaiah 48:13
Mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand hath spanned the heavens: when I call unto them, they stand up together.
Isaiah 51:13
And forgettest the LORD thy maker, that hath stretched forth the heavens, and laid the foundations of the earth; and hast feared continually every day because of the fury of the oppressor, as if he were ready to destroy? and where is the fury of the oppressor?
Psalm 89
1I will sing of the mercies of the LORD for ever: with my mouth will I make known thy faithfulness to all generations.

2For I have said, Mercy shall be built up for ever: thy faithfulness shalt thou establish in the very heavens.

3I have made a covenant with my chosen, I have sworn unto David my servant,

4Thy seed will I establish for ever, and build up thy throne to all generations. Selah.

5And the heavens shall praise thy wonders, O LORD: thy faithfulness also in the congregation of the saints.

6For who in the heaven can be compared unto the LORD? who among the sons of the mighty can be likened unto the LORD?

7God is greatly to be feared in the assembly of the saints, and to be had in reverence of all them that are about him.

😯 LORD God of hosts, who is a strong LORD like unto thee? or to thy faithfulness round about thee?”

Who would compare ANY of the sons of the Almighty God with Him?

[NickHassan]

For JA

[Arnold]

The Bible says, in the beginning God created the heavens and the earth; the question is, when was that beginning?
If you believe creation took place less than 7000 years ago, then the History channel, National Geography, and the Discovery channel, are all wrong, I mean their scientists.
How do you explain away the fact that it takes millions of years to form the mountains, or the Hawaiian islands? just as an example. Do you just ignore all that? Do you know how oil, gas, and coal are formed? do you know how long that takes? or do you believe God just put them into the ground knowing we would need it?
Why would God create this earth in such a disarray, knowing he was about to create man on it?
If the earth looked like that when it was created, would that have given the angels reason to shout for joy?

Georg

[Author]

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