Trinity – t8's proof text #2

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
One Spirit.
The ONE Spirit ever proceeds from God through Christ to us.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 12 2007,11:38)

Hi W, One Spirit. The ONE Spirit ever proceeds from God through Christ to us.

NH

Thanks!

You just proved my point.

The Father and Jesus is the selfsame spirit!

Therefore Jesus is God in the flesh!

1 Cor 12:11
But all these worketh that one and the selfsame Spirit, dividing to every man severally as he will.

Rev 22:11
And he shewed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal, proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb.

Phil 1:19
For I know that this shall turn to my salvation through your prayer, and the supply of the Spirit of Jesus Christ,

2 Cor 3:17
Now the Lord(Kurios) is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord(Kurios) is, there is liberty.

1 Cor 3:16
Know ye not that ye are the temple of God, and that the Spirit of God dwelleth in you?

2 Cor 13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus (Yeshua)Christ is in you, except ye be reprobates?

Rom 8:
9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
10  And if Christ be in you, the body is dead because of sin; but the Spirit is life because of righteousness.

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
God was indeed manifest in the flesh of Jesus.

Jn14
“8Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

9Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father?

10Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

11Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake. “
But the vessel was not also the contents.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 13 2007,07:49)

Hi W, God was indeed manifest in the flesh of Jesus. Jn14 “8Philip saith unto him, Lord, show us the Father, and it sufficeth us. 9Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Show us the Father? 10Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works. 11Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake. “ But the vessel was not also the contents.

Amen!

And later on Thomas confirmed this by saying…

“My Lord and MY God”!

I wonder why Jesus nor John corrected him?

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
Men are body, soul and Spirit[1Thess 5].
Christ was a man- body, soul and spirit.
The vessel of man is designed to hold the Spirit of God.
Many vessels instead contain evil spirits which Jesus and the apostles cleansed men from.
At the Jordan Christ was filled with the Spirit of God.
Like us he had two spirits-his own and the Holy Spirit.
Rom 8
“16The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: “

As with us[ecc12] own spirit left him at death.

Matt 27
“50Jesus, when he had cried again with a loud voice, yielded up the ghost.”

His own spirit is not the Spirit of Christ-that Spirit is the Holy Spirit- which he shares with his body on earth.

[Worshipping Jesus]

NH

You engage in inference again.

You say…

Quote

At the Jordan Christ was filled with the Spirit of God.

Where is this written?

You say…

Quote

His own spirit is not the Spirit of Christ-that Spirit is the Holy Spirit- which he shares with his body on earth.

HUH?

Where is this written?

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
Lk3
” 21Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened,

22And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased. “
Lk 4
” 1And Jesus being full of the Holy Ghost returned from Jordan, and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness, “

Do you not yet share in the Spirit of Christ?
You should be blessed in the Holy Spirit if you are in Christ.
Those who do not have the Spirit of Christ are not of him.[Rom8]

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 13 2007,09:35)

Hi W, Lk3 ” 21Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened, 22And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased. “ Lk 4 ” 1And Jesus being full of the Holy Ghost returned from Jordan, and was led by the Spirit into the wilderness, “ Do you not yet share in the Spirit of Christ? You should be blessed in the Holy Spirit if you are in Christ. Those who do not have the Spirit of Christ are not of him.[Rom8]

NH

Still on the 2 Spirits again.

The Spirit of Christ and the Holy Spirit!

There is “One Spirit”!

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
No,
Christ the man had his own human spirit which left him when he died.
Mt 27.50.
That is not the Spirit of Christ.

[Proclaimer]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 13 2007,09:15)

You engage in inference again.

The Trinity doctrine isn't inference is it?
3 persons are a HIM, that isn't inference is it?
All 3 members are co-equal isn't inference is it?
Jesus is/was a dual natured being isn't inference either, is it?

No of course not.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (t8 @ June 13 2007,23:07)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 13 2007,09:15) You engage in inference again. The Trinity doctrine isn't inference is it? 3 persons are a HIM, that isn't inference is it? All 3 members are co-equal isn't inference is it? Jesus is/was a dual natured being isn't inference either, is it? No of course not.

t8

Because you cant understand the truth of the Trinity in the Bible dosnt make it not so.

Isaiah 1:18 has just blasted your Henothiestic view all to _ _ _ _!

Your view that there is more than one “divine” being called “a” god or gods is pure speculation and inference and totally unscriptural.

Read um and weep t8. For your site is full of false doctrine.

There is only “One divine Being” that created the universe.

Isaiah 43:10-11
10Ye are my witnesses, saith the LORD, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. 11I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.

Isaiah 45:5,14,18,21,22
5I am the LORD, and there is none else, there is no God beside me: I girded thee, though thou hast not known me:… 14Thus saith the LORD, The labour of Egypt, and merchandise of Ethiopia and of the Sabeans, men of stature, shall come over unto thee, and they shall be thine: they shall come after thee; in chains they shall come over, and they shall fall down unto thee, they shall make supplication unto thee, saying, Surely God is in thee; and there is none else, there is no God… 18For thus saith the LORD that created the heavens; God himself that formed the earth and made it; he hath established it, he created it not in vain, he formed it to be inhabited: I am the LORD; and there is none else…. 21Tell ye, and bring them near; yea, let them take counsel together: who hath declared this from ancient time? who hath told it from that time? have not I the LORD? and there is no God else beside me; a just God and a Saviour; there is none beside me….. 22Look unto me, and be ye saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am God, and there is none else.

Isaiah 44:24
Thus says the LORD, your Redeemer, and the one who formed you from the womb,
“I, the LORD, am the maker of all things,
Stretching out the heavens by Myself
And spreading out the earth all alone,

Job 9:5-8
5″It is God who removes the mountains, they know not how,
When He overturns them in His anger;
6Who shakes the earth out of its place,
And its pillars tremble;
7Who commands the sun not to shine,
And sets a seal upon the stars;
8 Who alone stretches out the heavens
And tramples down the waves of the sea;

John 1:1-4
1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
2The same was in the beginning with God.
3All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

t8. How do you explain this? Your interpretation of John 1:-3 goes entirely against 100s of qualified scholars. You have created a real delima for yourself in scripture.

There is only one “Divine Being” that created all things.

Do you not believe the words of YHWH?

You should throw away your pride and believe the Prophets that penned the words of YHWH and repent of your false doctrine.

Then the glorious light of the Gospel of Christ, oops, I mean Gospel of God, well you know what I mean, there is no difference is there , anyway if you repent it will shine unto you.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 13 2007,18:33)

Hi W, No, Christ the man had his own human spirit which left him when he died. Mt 27.50. That is not the Spirit of Christ.

NH

So now we have a “Spirit of Christ” that left him,

but there is another “Spirit of Christ” that didnt leave him?

[Not3in1]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 13 2007,08:50)

And later on Thomas confirmed this by saying… “My Lord and MY God”!

If God is One, and God is the Father, when Thomas said, “…and my God.” Did he really say, “….and my Father.”

?

[NickHassan]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 14 2007,12:03)

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 13 2007,18:33) Hi W, No, Christ the man had his own human spirit which left him when he died. Mt 27.50. That is not the Spirit of Christ. NH So now we have a “Spirit of Christ” that left him, but there is another “Spirit of Christ” that didnt leave him?

Hi W,
Do you argue with Scripture?
Mt27
” 50And Jesus cried out again with a loud voice, and yielded up His spirit. “
Lk23
“46And Jesus, crying out with a loud voice, said, “Father, INTO YOUR HANDS I COMMIT MY SPIRIT.” Having said this, He breathed His last.”
Jn19
” 30Therefore when Jesus had received the sour wine, He said, “It is finished!” And He bowed His head and gave up His spirit. “

Surely even though you may have the Holy Spirit you also have your own spirit?[Rom8].
Christ is like us.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Not3in1 @ June 14 2007,12:39)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 13 2007,08:50) And later on Thomas confirmed this by saying… “My Lord and MY God”! If God is One, and God is the Father, when Thomas said, “…and my God.”  Did he really say, “….and my Father.” ?

not3

Look for yourself and judge for yourself…

Jn 20:
[28]And Thomas answered and *said unto him*, My Lord and my God.
[29] Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
[30] And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book:
[31] But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name.

Notice he “said unto him”. Also notice Jesus blesses him and dos'nt correct him of what could be considered blasphemy, and John the witness didnt correct him and yet claims this incident was a sign.

This same witness John also wrote Jn 1:1 and wrote John 6 which claims Jesus came down from heaven.

Unambiguous if you ask me!

Blessings

[Not3in1]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 14 2007,13:03)

Quote (Not3in1 @ June 14 2007,12:39) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 13 2007,08:50) And later on Thomas confirmed this by saying… “My Lord and MY God”! If God is One, and God is the Father, when Thomas said, “…and my God.”  Did he really say, “….and my Father.” ? not3 Look for yourself and judge for yourself… Jn 20: [28]And Thomas answered and *said unto him*, My Lord and my God. [29] Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed. [30] And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book: [31] But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name. Notice he “said unto him”. Also notice Jesus blesses him and dos'nt correct him of what could be considered blasphemy, and John the witness didnt correct him and yet claims this incident was a sign. This same witness John also wrote Jn 1:1 and wrote John 6 which claims Jesus came down from heaven. Unambiguous if you ask me! Blessings

OK, I followed you. But you still didn't answer my question, really.

If Thomas called Jesus his Lord and God – did he mean that Jesus was also the Father? For everyone knew that God was the Father.

“My Lord, and my Father!” Could it be? If not, why?

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Not3in1 @ June 14 2007,16:05)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 14 2007,13:03) Quote (Not3in1 @ June 14 2007,12:39) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ June 13 2007,08:50) And later on Thomas confirmed this by saying… “My Lord and MY God”! If God is One, and God is the Father, when Thomas said, “…and my God.”  Did he really say, “….and my Father.” ? not3 Look for yourself and judge for yourself… Jn 20: [28]And Thomas answered and *said unto him*, My Lord and my God. [29] Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed. [30] And many other signs truly did Jesus in the presence of his disciples, which are not written in this book: [31] But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name. Notice he “said unto him”. Also notice Jesus blesses him and dos'nt correct him of what could be considered blasphemy, and John the witness didnt correct him and yet claims this incident was a sign. This same witness John also wrote Jn 1:1 and wrote John 6 which claims Jesus came down from heaven. Unambiguous if you ask me! Blessings OK, I followed you.  But you still didn't answer my question, really. If Thomas called Jesus his Lord and God – did he mean that Jesus was also the Father?  For everyone knew that God was the Father. “My Lord, and my Father!” Could it be?  If not, why?

not3

No! Because Jesus spent much of his ministry speaking of the Father.

I dont think Thomas had them confused!

Jn 20:
28 And Thomas answered and *said unto him*, My Lord and my God.

He didnt say… “said unto them“!

John knew exactly what he saw and heard.

[NickHassan]

Hi W,
Listen to Jesus teaching Thomas.
Jn 14
” 5Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don't know where you are going, so how can we know the way?”
6Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.”

8Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.”

9Jesus answered: “Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? 10Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves. 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. 14You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.

[Not3in1]

To the Jews and God-fearing Gentiles of the day, there was only One God, and that God was the FATHER of Abraham.

Being the good Jew that Thomas was, if he referred to Jesus as “God,” then he was calling him the God of Abraham! He was calling him the Father.

Wow, I can see how the oneness doctrine got started now…..

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (Nick Hassan @ June 14 2007,18:22)

Hi W, Listen to Jesus teaching Thomas. Jn 14 ” 5Thomas said to him, “Lord, we don't know where you are going, so how can we know the way?” 6Jesus answered, “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. 7If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him.” 8Philip said, “Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us.” 9Jesus answered: “Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? 10Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work. 11Believe me when I say that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; or at least believe on the evidence of the miracles themselves. 12I tell you the truth, anyone who has faith in me will do what I have been doing. He will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father. 13And I will do whatever you ask in my name, so that the Son may bring glory to the Father. 14You may ask me for anything in my name, and I will do it.

NH

The problem that you have is Thomas didnt say…

“MY LORD AND MY FATHER”, did he?

Listen again…

Jn 20:
28 And Thomas answered and *said unto him*, My Lord and my God.

[Author]

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