- This topic is empty.
- Posts
Hi SS,
You say
“But did Jesus really have to wait until he was thirty years old to receive the fullness of the Holy Spirit in his baptism? NO!We know he was already full of grace and truth. He already had the glory of the only begotten of the Father.
Joh 1:14 And the Word was made flesh, and dwelt among us, (and we beheld his glory, the glory as of the only begotten of the Father,) FULL OF GRACE AND TRUTH. “Now to make this connection you must have proof that the timespan being spoken of here is that before the baptism of Jesus and not afterwards. Yet it is the glory of the Son that is spoken of here and we know from Is 53.2 that Jesus as a man was not one to attract the eye.
He also perfomed no recorded works of power prior to his anointing.
In fact we do know John was among those who did see the glory of Christ on the mountain as recorded for example in Matt.17.
Peter also mentions the event in 2 Peter 1.16f when he said
“we were eyewitnesses of his majesty. For when he received honor and glory from the Father, such an utterance was made to him by the Majestic Glory..”So it seems this is what John is referring to rather than any expression of his own glory as a child or an adolescent or even a young man. the glory was only shown on the mountain.
2Phil tells us he emptied himself and Hebrews says he was like to us in all ways except sin so there is no evdence that he was any different as a vessel, but like to us, and the power and abilities came from God, his Father, Who was with him, from his anointing with God's Spirit in the Jordan.[Acts 10]
So if you could show us the evidence for these other claims we would be grateful.
Hi SS,
You said
“So the name Messiah means “anointed one””
Indeed.
Anointed by God with His Hioly spirit.
So clearly he was not also the God, or part of the God, that anointed himHi SS,
We too were made of the breath of God into the dust of man [gen 2.7]. Does that mean we were always like the Son of God?
You said.
“Jesus always had the fullness of the Holy Spirit, “the word” has always contained the breath of the Holy Spirit.”But then you say
“Jesus accepts and submits himself entirely to his Fathers will as the Messiah. The Father is well pleased and reveals his Son as the Messiah to Israel BY SENDING THE ANOINTING AND CONFIRMS HE IS WELL PLEASED”So which is true?
Was he always anointed,
or did God send the anointing?What happened in the Jordan since scripture indicates that is when Jesus began his ministry of power and wisdom?
He was anointed there.
Hi SS,
You quote
Joh 10:25 JESUS ANSWERED THEM, I TOLD YOU, AND YE BELIEVED NOT: THE WORKS THAT I DO IN MY FATHER'S NAME, THEY BEAR WITNESS OF ME.
Joh 10:26 But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
Joh 10:27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
Joh 10:28 And I give them life everlasting: and they shall not perish for ever. AND NO MAN SHALL PLUCK THEM OUT OF MY HAND.
Joh 10:29 That which my Father hath given me is greater than all: AND NO ONE CAN SNATCH THEM OUT OF THE HAND OF MY FATHER.
Joh 10:30 I AND THE FATHER ARE ONE. “So here Jesus speaks of the Father God himself as the Son of that God and their very close relationship.
He is a being with life in himself who was with the Father in the beginning.
He does not say he is the Father, or that he and the Father are in fact the one God, but he says he is one with the Father.
We should not try to read what is not written unto what is written.
He does say he is in the Father and the Father is in him.
That is true unity.
Hi SS,
You quote
“Exo 40:13 And thou shalt put upon Aaron the holy garments, and ANOINT HIM, and SANCTIFY HIM; THAT HE MAY MINISTER UNTO ME IN THE PRIEST'S OFFICE.”
So the blessing and the ministry of any priest only begins when they are anointed and equipped for the task by God.Jesus Christ, the appointed Messiah and Priest then began his ministry when he was anointed by God “with the Holy Spirit and power'[Acts 10], in the Jordan.
Prior to that he was an ordinary person with no advantages over any of us, made like to us in always but sin and not one that any would take notice of as Is 53 shows.
Hi SS,
You say
“By the ANOINTING Jesus accepts his life as the messiah, the “anointed one””Rather scripture says that he came to be baptised by John to fulfill all righteousness.
Matt 3.13f
” 13(A)Then Jesus arrived (B)from Galilee at the Jordan coming to John, to be baptized by him.
14But John tried to prevent Him, saying, “I have need to be baptized by You, and do You come to me?”15But Jesus answering said to him, “Permit it at this time; for in this way it is fitting for us Âto fulfill all righteousness.” Then he permitted Him.”
Nothing written there about accepting his role as messiah then. Can you substantiate the matter?
Hi,
It was Jesus who warned us against the yeast of the Pharisees.
It was the Pharisees who he accused of raising up their traditions above the Scriptures.
It was the Pharisees who engineered the death of Jesus.
The spirit of tradition hates Jesus and is the spirit of antichrist.Traditionalists today deny the Son of God and hold fast to their false doctrines such as trinity.
Hi,
The Pharisees loved tradition more than scripture. Such idolatry is still seen in the whore of Babylon today and that is why God has no part of their empty religious pomp and cermony.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Aug. 07 2006,23:19) Hi E,
Can you not abide in the Word and yet claim you are following the Master?
Anyone who are not saved and claim to be abiding in the word are doing just as your quote.Hi ,
The leaven of the Pharisees is one of self importance, self righteousness, and murderous rebellion against the ways of God. They elevated their own teachings and traditions above that of scripture.They cared not that they had been caught showing no respect to the Scriptures and that antichrist spirit continued and continues to persecute the sons of God.
I agree with you that it is the spirit of the antichrist that persecutes the saints, the blood bought. If you read the scriptures, it speaks of many who opposed the faith and created persecution upon the believers. When the apostles would go to a city and begin to preach the gospel, Jews who knew them or heard of them would make false accusations against them, causing them to be arrested and often times beaten for the faith. Yet, the apostles believed it was an honor to be persecuted for the faith. They would give praise to God.
Even today, we must beware of those who are always trying to falsely accuse us for our stand in Christ. For they are the enemies of God and will war against all that is faithful and true.
Dear Robin t:
Just to let you know that I was also raised in the Catholic church by my parents who did their best to teach me about the existence of God. However, as an adult I could see that many of the doctrines that the Catholic church was teaching could not possibly be correct, and so I did not continue in the Catholic church. Also, I was married in the assembly of God church, and I became a member of a Southern Baptist church, but I say all of that to let you know that although I was taught about God and I had been a part of each of these churches, I did not have a personal relationship with God. In fact, I had become, I guess, what you might call an agnostic, but in February 1980, after I had been married 15 years, my wife came to me, telling me that she did not love me any more. My initial reaction to that was, “well if you do not love me any more, I guess the only option is to get a divorce”, but I have a son who was eight years old at the time, and I began thinking, “If my wife remarries, no one could possibly love my son like I love him, and so I got on my knees and prayed, “Lord if you are there, I would like my wife and I to stay together if is your will, but nevertheless, not my will but yours be done”. Jesus heard me from heaven, and baptized me with the Holy Spirit thus revealing to me that God is indeed a reality and that His testimony regarding His Son is true.
Jesus said, speaking to Nicodemus, “Verily, verily, I say unto thee, except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter the kingdom of God”. (John 3:5)
I have done the work of an evangelist since 1996 using a trac that I prepared myself, and I have offered to share it with many who are members of the Catholic church. Most of them refuse, because as I understand, they have been indoctrinated against listening to evangelicals. But when I have managed to ask some of them if they have born again, they do not know what I am talking about, and so the question to you is, have you been born again? Do you have a personal relationship with God through His Son Jesus. If the answer to these questions is no, then you are not part of God's church, but you can be a part of it by coming to God with a repentant heart through his Son Jesus His Christ.
One of the Catholic traditions is for Catholic parents to have their infant children baptized, but the scriptures states to the church, “Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned”. (Mark 16:15-16) Can an infant believe? If the answer is an obvious, no. Why then would the church baptize an infant?
Many Catholic people are “good” people. I have family that are still part of the Catholic church, and I consider them the best of people, but it is not because of our goodness, but the goodness of God that we can be saved. Salvation is a gift from God. It does not matter how good or even how bad you have been, but if you believe the message that God gave His only begotten Son so that your sins can be forgiven and washed away by his blood. Water baptism is an action in response to that faith and it should show that you have repented. Baptism symbolizes your union with Jesus in his death, burial and resurrection. To be born again means that you have been resurrected from the dead (spiritual separation from God), and God is now the Father of your spirit.
Other doctrines that the Catholic church teach which are not scriptural are: that the virgin Mary was sinless (The scripture states, “for all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God”. (Romans 3:23) The only person who did not sin was Jesus.), the Catholic church also prays the rosary, and a part of that is the “Hail Mary” in which they pray to Mary saying, “Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for our sinners now and at the hour of our death”. (God has no mother or father, the virgin Mary gave birth to the Son of God, and she considered this a tremendous blessing for God to have chosen her to have His Son. Also, Mary is asleep at present, and so how can she pray for any one. I can pray for you while I am still alive, but once I die, my spirit goes to God, but my soul is asleep), another is that they call the Pope “Holy Father” and priests they call “fathers”. (If we are God's children, then God is our Father), and the doctrine of the “Trinity” is also a misunderstanding of scripture and one other that comes to mind is the doctrine of “Transubstantiation”. There may be others, but these are the ones that come to my mind.
My concern is not to condemn any one who is in the Catholic church, but to show you the truth. If you want to continue with them after hearing what I have said, then certainly that is up to you.
Hi Nine,
I don't think robyn has posted anything for a couple of weeks.
As well, many things have been pointed out to her. She seems blind to them.david
Yes 942767, she hasn't been here for a while, but your post is not in vain. It will be read by others all the same.
Hi,
Man's tradition has supplanted the scriptures as the basis of faith once again and our work is to try to help men climb out of the deceptive quicksand that tradition is. Most are happy to stay there and see it as evil to put their faith rather in the safety ropes of scripture.To preach the gospel of Jesus now is more difficult because it has become strange again to traditional ears and it received by most in the same way as the Athenians did. Idolatry of tradition rules.
Acts 17
“16Now while Paul waited for them at Athens, his spirit was stirred in him, when he saw the city wholly given to idolatry.17Therefore disputed he in the synagogue with the Jews, and with the devout persons, and in the market daily with them that met with him.
18Then certain philosophers of the Epicureans, and of the Stoicks, encountered him. And some said, What will this babbler say? other some, He seemeth to be a setter forth of strange gods: because he preached unto them Jesus, and the resurrection.
19And they took him, and brought him unto Areopagus, saying, May we know what this new doctrine, whereof thou speakest, is?
20For thou bringest certain strange things to our ears: we would know therefore what these things mean.
21(For all the Athenians and strangers which were there spent their time in nothing else, but either to tell, or to hear some new thing.)
22Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.
23For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.
24God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
28For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring.
29Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device.
30And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:
31Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
32And when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked: and others said, We will hear thee again of this matter.
33So Paul departed from among them.
34Howbeit certain men clave unto him, and believed: among the which was Dionysius the Areopagite, and a woman named Damaris, and others with them”
Hi,
Mk 7
“1Then came together unto him the Pharisees, and certain of the scribes, which came from Jerusalem.2And when they saw some of his disciples eat bread with defiled, that is to say, with unwashen, hands, they found fault.
3For the Pharisees, and all the Jews, except they wash their hands oft, eat not, holding the tradition of the elders.
4And when they come from the market, except they wash, they eat not. And many other things there be, which they have received to hold, as the washing of cups, and pots, brasen vessels, and of tables.
5Then the Pharisees and scribes asked him, Why walk not thy disciples according to the tradition of the elders, but eat bread with unwashen hands?
6He answered and said unto them, Well hath Esaias prophesied of you hypocrites, as it is written, This people honoureth me with their lips, but their heart is far from me.
7Howbeit in vain do they worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men.
8For laying aside the commandment of God, ye hold the tradition of men, as the washing of pots and cups: and many other such like things ye do.
9And he said unto them, Full well ye reject the commandment of God, that ye may keep your own tradition.
10For Moses said, Honour thy father and thy mother; and, Whoso curseth father or mother, let him die the death:
11But ye say, If a man shall say to his father or mother, It is Corban, that is to say, a gift, by whatsoever thou mightest be profited by me; he shall be free.
12And ye suffer him no more to do ought for his father or his mother;
13Making the word of God of none effect through your tradition, which ye have delivered: and many such like things do ye.”
Day after day men parade their particular traditional teachings through this site. The queue to boast of their proud history and the crowds that walk with them and they look down on us as fools who are oldfashioned and narrow minded because we attempt to abide in the Word of God.
We work to challenge men to search deeper and establish more secure and lasting foundations.
But we are about as successful as Paul was in Athens.Hi,
Matt 13
” 15For this people's heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.16But blessed are your eyes, for they see: and your ears, for they hear.
17For verily I say unto you, That many prophets and righteous men have desired to see those things which ye see, and have not seen them; and to hear those things which ye hear, and have not heard them.
18Hear ye therefore the parable of the sower.
19When any one heareth the word of the kingdom, and understandeth it not, then cometh the wicked one, and catcheth away that which was sown in his heart. This is he which received seed by the way side.
20But he that received the seed into stony places, the same is he that heareth the word, and anon with joy receiveth it;
21Yet hath he not root in himself, but dureth for a while: for when tribulation or persecution ariseth because of the word, by and by he is offended.
22He also that received seed among the thorns is he that heareth the word; and the care of this world, and the deceitfulness of riches, choke the word, and he becometh unfruitful.
23But he that received seed into the good ground is he that heareth the word, and understandeth it; which also beareth fruit, and bringeth forth, some an hundredfold, some sixty, some thirty.”
So what is the wayside?
The soil and heart is hard.
The Word cannot penetrate
The Water does not soak in but flows off.
They see the gospel only fit only as food for the birdsClosed minded but sure of their own understandings
They refuse to hear and will not listen
They are content
With nothing
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
