This is why jesus christ is god

Participant

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 18 2010,00:03)

Here is an interesting quote from Ignatius, a disciple of John who wrote John 1:1:

Quote

It is better for a man to be silent and be [a Christian], than to talk and not to be one. “The kingdom of God is not in word, but in power.” [591] Men “believe with the heart, and confess with the mouth,” the one “unto righteousness,” the other “unto salvation.” [592] It is good to teach, if he who speaks also acts. For he who shall both “do and teach, the same shall be great in the kingdom.” [593] Our Lord and God, Jesus Christ, the Son of the living God, first did and then taught, as Luke testifies, “whose praise is in the Gospel through all the Churches.” [594] There is nothing which is hid from the Lord, but our very secrets are near to Him. Let us therefore do all things as those who have Him dwelling in us, that we may be His temples, [595] and He may be in us as God. Let Christ speak in us, even as He did in Paul. Let the Holy Spirit teach us to speak the things of Christ in like manner as He did.

So much is understandable when you can see the Father as the unbegotten God and the Son as the begotten God of the Father. In this quote, Ignatius calls Jesus God, son of the living God. He also says that we can be His (the Son's) temples and He may be in us as God.

From here: http://www.ellopos.net/elpenor/greek-texts/fathers/ignatius/epistle-ephesians.asp?pg=23

Hi Kathi,

Thanks for clarifying where you are getting your ideas.

If you look at what you copied:

[593] Our Lord and God, Jesus Christ, the Son of the living God

This is probably the same word Theos that can mean a myriad of things such as:

1) a god or goddess, a general name of deities or divinities
2) the Godhead, trinity
a) God the Father, the first person in the trinity
b) Christ, the second person of the trinity
c) Holy Spirit, the third person in the trinity
3) spoken of the only and true God
a) refers to the things of God
b) his counsels, interests, things due to him
4) whatever can in any respect be likened unto God, or resemble him in any way
a) God's representative or viceregent
1) of magistrates and judges

Therefore, as you can see, #4 is the best translation for Theos (God).

Why the “best”? If you read the rest of the sentence you will see …the son of the living God, which is clearly showing that Jesus is NOT GOD (Jews and Christians believed in only ONE GOD) but the son of God.

So which is correct?: 1- Jesus is God or 2- Jesus is likened unto God (resembles God)?

The Professor

August 18, 2010 at 9:29 pm#212806

Participant

Quote (Lightenup @ Aug. 17 2010,16:03)

Here is an interesting quote from Ignatius, a disciple of John who wrote John 1:1:

Quote

From here: http://www.ellopos.net/elpenor/greek-texts/fathers/ignatius/epistle-ephesians.asp?pg=23

Kathi, you are correct in your analysis.

I personally wouldn't call Jesus the begotten God…for fear of misinterpretation that he is a God before YHVH.

—–

It is important to understand that they are one in the same.

YHVH is the source of all things.

The Word of God/Jesus

Is YHVH reflecting and understanding himself, and who he is…unto to creation.

—–

It's almost like God saying… if I can be a man, what kind of man would I be?

Jesus Christ!!!

This means that, The Word of God… is YHVH expressing and revealing HIS PERSON to creation.

Yet his revelation is about him, but isn't really him.

Because YHVH is unknowable… but to make himself knowable, he has to do it through knowable means…

and since he is unknowable, the knowable means…expresses his unknowable traits in a knowable fashion…

——-

So it is to be understand… That The Word of God/Jesus Christ

is YHVH expressed to creation…

So he is indeed God.

Yet he is not literally God/YHVH himself.

only YHVH expressed/revealed.

(YHVH is unknowable) (The Word of God, is YHVH knowable).

August 18, 2010 at 11:46 pm#212820

Participant

Hi RokkaMan,

The systems of religion and traditions of men communicate…
distortions of truth, confusion of mind, and distractions of spirit.

John 1:1…
In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God,
and the Word was God.

English ↔ Hebrew ↔ Greek
“Word of God”(86) = (אלהים](86] = [ο λογος](86)th Prime Hō Lōgôs
“Word of God” ↔ “GOD” ↔ “The Word”

I hope me carefully lining this up for you will help you to see “Bible Truth”!

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 19, 2010 at 12:08 am#212824

Participant

Hi RokkaMan,

…and “The Word” was God. (John 1:1)

You reject Scripture to instead put 'your understanding' above The Word of God?
Your treading in very dangerous waters my friend! (Ezek. 3:19 / Rev. 22:19)

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 19, 2010 at 2:25 am#212848

Participant

Quote (RokkaMan @ Aug. 15 2010,10:55)

942767

do you agree or disagree?

is there anyone that disagrees?

Hello RM,

Wouldn't it be nice if you had any Scripture to go with what you write.

Where is all these “lies” coming from?

YOU:

So if there is no greater demonstration of love than to lay one's life down for another.

Me:

This is a faulty premise for a thesis: A person must die to demonstrate the greatest love.

YOU:

Then for God to demonstrate HIS love… he would have to lay down HIS life. No one else's.

ME:

Now you are saying what God MUST do….DIE.

Gee, by my understanding God can't die, nor do the angels. Physically or spiritually. But according to YOU God MUST DIE to really show how much He loves us. But at least you admitted He couldn't do it literally, so , why all of this writings?

YOU:

If his son was a different being than himself…

ME:

That is the problem here, no one knows that His son is different from God. And now everything is “spiritual” since that is the only thing “real”.

YOU:

Why did God become a man to physically die?

ME:

He didn't become a man….to live or die.

This is why it is best to give Bible verses.

Now I am beginning to see why people don't like what I write, it is from the Bible.

As Paul would say, “Why don't you demonstrate how much you love us and do what you say must be done?”

YOU:

Instead of creation, he had to become one of us…so that in life after death we can become one of his.

ME:

Again YOU telling God what He “HAD TO DO”….become one of us.

What floors me is that you have others agreeing with you…and throwing in other non-Biblical sayings like ….the only begotten God. And no one speaking out!

They have thrown out the Bible and thrown in “Church Fathers” and other writers, without a bit of Scripture or Biblical Doctrine.

Mar 1:1 The beginning of the gospel of Jesus Christ, the Son of God.

Mar 3:11 Whenever the unclean spirits saw Him, they would fall down before Him and shout, “You are the Son of God!”

Luk 22:70 And they all said, “Are You the Son of God, then?” And He said to them, “Yes, I am.”

Jhn 10:36 do you say of Him, whom the Father sanctified and sent into the world, 'You are blaspheming,' because I said, 'I am the Son of God'?

This is stupid! You have a Bible use it.

The Professor

August 19, 2010 at 2:48 am#212851

Participant

Quote (Kangaroo Jack @ Aug. 15 2010,15:45)

Marty said:

Quote

The body of Christ is God's own flesh and blood, and is God's body.

Thanks Marty! This is what Keith and I have been trying to tell you. God became incarnate.

WJ and I are slowly cuttin through the cobwebs and the muck in your mind.

Good show Marty!

the Roo

Hello Marty and Roo,

Could you guys provide ANY Scriptures showing where God became incarnate?

This is what I got when I did a word search:

Sorry! The word incarnate doesn't occur in the KJV.
Sorry! The word incarnate doesn't occur in the NLT.
Sorry! The word incarnate doesn't occur in the NIV.
Sorry! The word incarnate doesn't occur in the ESV.
Sorry! The word incarnate doesn't occur in the NASB.

Marty said:”The body of Christ is God's own flesh and blood, and is God's body.”

You guys say that God is spirit and then say that Jesus is God's flesh and blood body.

Where does all of this come from?

Couldn't find anything in the Bible that said the above either.

The Professor

August 19, 2010 at 8:28 am#212888

Participant

First of Davidbfun,

I'm not telling you what God HAD TO DO.

I'm telling you, WHAT GOD HAS DONE, and in that, his decision is perfect.

——

Secondly… Jesus Christ said this.

John 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

So if a man cannot demonstrate any greater act of love, by laying his life down for his friends…

If God is god, and he loves us… he of course, would then love us more than this demosntration would he not?

are you saying, that a man's love can be greater than God's?

———–

Thirdly you said

Quote

This is a faulty premise for a thesis: A person must die to demonstrate the greatest love.

Then you are calling Jesus a liar… for he explicitely said, there is no greater demonstration of love, than to lay down your life for a friend.

————

In continuation of your faulty understanding and twisting of my words….

you said

Quote

I said God is a spirit… he cannot die spiritually.

I did, indeed say, he could die physically…

becausing dying physically would be symbolic of dying spiritually.

God can manifest as anything in creation, then destroy the manifestation… isn't that common sense?

You don't need to read the bible, to know that nothing is too difficult for the LORD.

————

You also stated That is the problem here, no one knows that His son is different from God. And now everything is “spiritual” since that is the only thing “real”.

John 1 begs to differ….

It says, The Word of God was God…and later manifested in flesh and was beheld as the only begotten of The Father.

If anything scripture explicitely states they are one in the same….

The folly comes, when men like you…take Jesus' words, when he says that YHVH is his Father…and create a division among the two based on your interpretation.

but if you read the explicite statements of the bible…

There are many verses that state they are the same, and none stating they are different.

I dare you to ask me to prove it so I can make you look like a fool. for the glory of God

You also stated

Quote

He didn't become a man….to live or die.

O really?

What does it mean to manifest?

–verb (used with object)
3. to make clear or evident to the eye or the understanding; show plainly: He manifested his approval with a hearty laugh.

So when it says in 1 timothy 3: 16And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.

So God was (manifested) perceived, made clear or evident to the eye or understanding, or shown plainly in the flesh. died and recieved up into glory.

————

Quote

Again YOU telling God what He “HAD TO DO”….become one of us.

If God didn't have to do these things…why did he do them?
lol

Everything he does, is a perfect decision in which he had to do… he didn't do anything out of necessity…he did it all out of love.

God doesn't NEED to do anything, like you are falsely portraying me to claim…

he does it all out of love, and out of love is his decisions perfect.

and then the rest of what you said in your post, was just foolish ranting, no insight, truth or an attempt to bridge the gap of misunderstandings.

————

Jesus Christ is the Son of God, anyone obedient to God's will is The Son of God.

The only begotten is when the meaning of simple obedience changes into inheritence.

How can anything in creation, or anything MADE inherit God's throne and kingdom?

The Word of God was God to begin with as John 1 explains…

his glory was suspended, and he was manifested in a human being and was called Yeshua/immanuel/Jesus Christ.

He died for our sins, and was restored his glory and given the inheritence of his Father.

Jesus Christ is now our Lord, Savior, and God once again.

and after revelations he will give everything back to YHVH The Father, so that God may be all in all.

Is this not biblical?

August 19, 2010 at 4:50 pm#212915

Participant

Quote (RokkaMan @ Aug. 20 2010,03:28)

First of Davidbfun,

I'm not telling you what God HAD TO DO.

I'm telling you, WHAT GOD HAS DONE, and in that, his decision is perfect.

——

Secondly… Jesus Christ said this.

John 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

So if a man cannot demonstrate any greater act of love, by laying his life down for his friends…

If God is god, and he loves us… he of course, would then love us more than this demosntration would he not?

are you saying, that a man's love can be greater than God's?

———–

Thirdly you said

Quote

This is a faulty premise for a thesis: A person must die to demonstrate the greatest love.

Then you are calling Jesus a liar… for he explicitely said, there is no greater demonstration of love, than to lay down your life for a friend.

————

In continuation of your faulty understanding and twisting of my words….

you said

Quote

I said God is a spirit… he cannot die spiritually.

I did, indeed say, he could die physically…

becausing dying physically would be symbolic of dying spiritually.

God can manifest as anything in creation, then destroy the manifestation… isn't that common sense?

You don't need to read the bible, to know that nothing is too difficult for the LORD.

————

You also stated That is the problem here, no one knows that His son is different from God. And now everything is “spiritual” since that is the only thing “real”.

John 1 begs to differ….

It says, The Word of God was God…and later manifested in flesh and was beheld as the only begotten of The Father.

If anything scripture explicitely states they are one in the same….

The folly comes, when men like you…take Jesus' words, when he says that YHVH is his Father…and create a division among the two based on your interpretation.

but if you read the explicite statements of the bible…

There are many verses that state they are the same, and none stating they are different.

I dare you to ask me to prove it so I can make you look like a fool. for the glory of God

You also stated

Quote

He didn't become a man….to live or die.

O really?

What does it mean to manifest?

–verb (used with object)
3. to make clear or evident to the eye or the understanding; show plainly: He manifested his approval with a hearty laugh.

So God was (manifested) perceived, made clear or evident to the eye or understanding, or shown plainly in the flesh. died and recieved up into glory.

————

Quote

Again YOU telling God what He “HAD TO DO”….become one of us.

If God didn't have to do these things…why did he do them?
lol

Everything he does, is a perfect decision in which he had to do… he didn't do anything out of necessity…he did it all out of love.

God doesn't NEED to do anything, like you are falsely portraying me to claim…

he does it all out of love, and out of love is his decisions perfect.

and then the rest of what you said in your post, was just foolish ranting, no insight, truth or an attempt to bridge the gap of misunderstandings.

————

Jesus Christ is the Son of God, anyone obedient to God's will is The Son of God.

The only begotten is when the meaning of simple obedience changes into inheritence.

How can anything in creation, or anything MADE inherit God's throne and kingdom?

The Word of God was God to begin with as John 1 explains…

his glory was suspended, and he was manifested in a human being and was called Yeshua/immanuel/Jesus Christ.

He died for our sins, and was restored his glory and given the inheritence of his Father.

Jesus Christ is now our Lord, Savior, and God once again.

and after revelations he will give everything back to YHVH The Father, so that God may be all in all.

Is this not biblical?

RM,

Jhn 15:23 “He who hates Me hates My Father also.

YOU:

Jesus Christ is now our Lord, Savior, and God “once again”.

Jhn 8:38 “I speak the things which I have seen with My Father; therefore you also do the things which you heard from your father.”

Jhn 15:26 “When the Helper (Comforter) comes, whom I will send to you from the Father, that is the Spirit of truth who proceeds FROM THE FATHER, She will testify about Me,

Jhn 15:15 “No longer do I call you slaves, for the slave does not know what his master is doing; but I have called you friends, for all things that I have heard “FROM MY FATHER” I have made known to you.

Jhn 15:16 “You did not choose Me but I chose you, and appointed you that you would go and bear fruit, and that your fruit would remain, so that whatever you ask “OF THE FATHER” in “MY NAME” He may give to you.

Jhn 15:17 “This I command you, that you love one another.

Jesus was preparing his disciples that they, too, would give their lives in order to produce fruit, no? And die for the cause.

These are just a small few of verses that show your fairy tale to be from somewhere other than the Bible.

God is not in Jesus' body vicariously living….regardless of how many times you say it. Look at the verses above….Jesus didn't become God AGAIN as you claim. God was and is in Heaven while Jesus was here on the Earth.

I'll show you a couple of your own sayings” YOU:

Everything he does, is a perfect decision in which “HE HAD TO DO”… he didn't do anything out of necessity…he did it all out of love.

YOU:

Then you are calling Jesus a liar… for he explicitely said, there is no greater demonstration of love, than to lay down your life for a friend.

Finally, you realize WHO SAID THIS: It was not God but Jesus.

I will leave you with YOUR words and YOUR deceptions:

YOU:

I said God is a spirit… he cannot die spiritually.

I did, indeed say, he could die physically…

The Professor

August 19, 2010 at 5:04 pm#212916

Participant

Quote (RokkaMan @ Aug. 20 2010,03:28)

First of Davidbfun,

I'm not telling you what God HAD TO DO.

I'm telling you, WHAT GOD HAS DONE, and in that, his decision is perfect.

——

Secondly… Jesus Christ said this.

John 15:13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

So if a man cannot demonstrate any greater act of love, by laying his life down for his friends…

If God is god, and he loves us… he of course, would then love us more than this demosntration would he not?

are you saying, that a man's love can be greater than God's?

———–

Thirdly you said

Quote

This is a faulty premise for a thesis: A person must die to demonstrate the greatest love.

Then you are calling Jesus a liar… for he explicitely said, there is no greater demonstration of love, than to lay down your life for a friend.

————

In continuation of your faulty understanding and twisting of my words….

you said

Quote

I said God is a spirit… he cannot die spiritually.

I did, indeed say, he could die physically…

becausing dying physically would be symbolic of dying spiritually.

God can manifest as anything in creation, then destroy the manifestation… isn't that common sense?

You don't need to read the bible, to know that nothing is too difficult for the LORD.

————

You also stated That is the problem here, no one knows that His son is different from God. And now everything is “spiritual” since that is the only thing “real”.

John 1 begs to differ….

It says, The Word of God was God…and later manifested in flesh and was beheld as the only begotten of The Father.

If anything scripture explicitely states they are one in the same….

The folly comes, when men like you…take Jesus' words, when he says that YHVH is his Father…and create a division among the two based on your interpretation.

but if you read the explicite statements of the bible…

There are many verses that state they are the same, and none stating they are different.

I dare you to ask me to prove it so I can make you look like a fool. for the glory of God

You also stated

Quote

He didn't become a man….to live or die.

O really?

What does it mean to manifest?

–verb (used with object)
3. to make clear or evident to the eye or the understanding; show plainly: He manifested his approval with a hearty laugh.

So God was (manifested) perceived, made clear or evident to the eye or understanding, or shown plainly in the flesh. died and recieved up into glory.

————

Quote

Again YOU telling God what He “HAD TO DO”….become one of us.

If God didn't have to do these things…why did he do them?
lol

Everything he does, is a perfect decision in which he had to do… he didn't do anything out of necessity…he did it all out of love.

God doesn't NEED to do anything, like you are falsely portraying me to claim…

he does it all out of love, and out of love is his decisions perfect.

and then the rest of what you said in your post, was just foolish ranting, no insight, truth or an attempt to bridge the gap of misunderstandings.

————

Jesus Christ is the Son of God, anyone obedient to God's will is The Son of God.

The only begotten is when the meaning of simple obedience changes into inheritence.

How can anything in creation, or anything MADE inherit God's throne and kingdom?

The Word of God was God to begin with as John 1 explains…

his glory was suspended, and he was manifested in a human being and was called Yeshua/immanuel/Jesus Christ.

He died for our sins, and was restored his glory and given the inheritence of his Father.

Jesus Christ is now our Lord, Savior, and God once again.

and after revelations he will give everything back to YHVH The Father, so that God may be all in all.

Is this not biblical?

Hello RM,

One other item that you referred to is John 1 which according to YOU says that Jesus is God.

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God and the Word was God.

How many people here? TWO. Who are they? Word and God.
When was this? In the beginning!

Jhn 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.

How many people here? TWO. Who are they? He and God.
When was this? In the beginning!

Who is being referred to as “he” in v2? “Word” from v1.

Is “He” of “Word” referred to as God or is he a separate and different person?

I didn't need to try to confuse people and explain to them who or what “Word” is in v1 because it doesn't matter. v2 tells us, Word = He

Furthermore “Word” AND “He” was WITH God, meaning that neither one could be God, whom he was with.

THIS IS WHY JESUS CHRIST CANNOT BE GOD!!!!

By the way v14-17 says that the “Word” became flesh, NOT God.

The Professor

August 19, 2010 at 5:37 pm#212917

Participant

RM,

In addition if you don't want to believe what is WRITTEN in John 1 as I explained in my previous post maybe we can try to use logic: (doubtful though)

Word = Jesus (Son)
God = Father

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Son and the Son was with the Father and the Son was the Father.

Son = Father

Who here on hn believes that the Son is his Father?

YOU said that the WORD = God which is saying the same thing.

I have quoted Scripture and quoted Scripture to no avail because you do not respond to them and none of your writings have Scripture either to back up the words that you spew out on the page.

So, I will stand on these two verses in regards to future corrections of your posts:

Pro 9:7 He who corrects a scoffer gets dishonor for himself, And he who reproves a wicked man gets insults for himself.

Pro 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you, Reprove a wise man and he will love you.

The Professor

August 19, 2010 at 7:50 pm#212928

terraricca

Participant

yea vain discussion,work who is useless,

Pierre

August 19, 2010 at 9:38 pm#212940

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 20 2010,04:37)

RM,

In addition if you don't want to believe what is WRITTEN in John 1 as I explained in my previous post maybe we can try to use logic: (doubtful though)

Word = Jesus (Son)
God = Father

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Son and the Son was with the Father and the Son was the Father.

Son = Father

Who here on hn believes that the Son is his Father?

YOU said that the WORD = God which is saying the same thing.

I have quoted Scripture and quoted Scripture to no avail because you do not respond to them and none of your writings have Scripture either to back up the words that you spew out on the page.

So, I will stand on these two verses in regards to future corrections of your posts:

Pro 9:7 He who corrects a scoffer gets dishonor for himself, And he who reproves a wicked man gets insults for himself.

Pro 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you, Reprove a wise man and he will love you.

The Professor

In the beginning was The Son, The Son was with The Father and The Son was The Father.

———-

That's exactly right.

———-

Father and Son are roles… they do not define you…

they are roles you play when you have a relationship.

———-

If I am a Father, I am so…only to my children and no one else.

If I am a Son, I am so… only to my parents and no one else.

———-

YHVH is The Father of all things.

The Son, is his reflected image, subject to himself.

So the Son isn't YHVH The Father.

The Son is the reflected image of The Father.

and the Image itself is YHVH.

So when you look at The Son, you are looking at the image of The Father.

————
If i take a picture of myself… the picture isn't me, but when you look at the picture, you can see me.

This is the same was, The Son was with the father… and Was the Father…

You are looking at YHVH through his reflection as The Son.

——-

The Son's role is to be obedient to The Father, and represent The Father in all things… including creation and judgement.

but, you choose to continue to put words in my mouth and add to scripture.

i'm interpreting scripture in the only way that makes sense.

If Jesus Christ was not the reflection of YHVH… then christianity is a false religion.

August 19, 2010 at 11:24 pm#212967

Participant

Quote (RokkaMan @ Aug. 20 2010,16:38)

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 20 2010,04:37)

RM,

In addition if you don't want to believe what is WRITTEN in John 1 as I explained in my previous post maybe we can try to use logic: (doubtful though)

Word = Jesus (Son)
God = Father

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Son and the Son was with the Father and the Son was the Father.

Son = Father

Who here on hn believes that the Son is his Father?

YOU said that the WORD = God which is saying the same thing.

I have quoted Scripture and quoted Scripture to no avail because you do not respond to them and none of your writings have Scripture either to back up the words that you spew out on the page.

So, I will stand on these two verses in regards to future corrections of your posts:

Pro 9:7 He who corrects a scoffer gets dishonor for himself, And he who reproves a wicked man gets insults for himself.

Pro 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you, Reprove a wise man and he will love you.

The Professor

In the beginning was The Son, The Son was with The Father and The Son was The Father.

———-

That's exactly right.

———-

Father and Son are roles… they do not define you…

they are roles you play when you have a relationship.

———-

If I am a Father, I am so…only to my children and no one else.

If I am a Son, I am so… only to my parents and no one else.

———-

YHVH is The Father of all things.

The Son, is his reflected image, subject to himself.

So the Son isn't YHVH The Father.

The Son is the reflected image of The Father.

and the Image itself is YHVH.

So when you look at The Son, you are looking at the image of The Father.

————
If i take a picture of myself… the picture isn't me, but when you look at the picture, you can see me.

This is the same was, The Son was with the father… and Was the Father…

You are looking at YHVH through his reflection as The Son.

——-

The Son's role is to be obedient to The Father, and represent The Father in all things… including creation and judgement.

but, you choose to continue to put words in my mouth and add to scripture.

i'm interpreting scripture in the only way that makes sense.

If Jesus Christ was not the reflection of YHVH… then christianity is a false religion.

RM,

son = father; what folly

role playing and nothing written is true…according to you

Pro 18:2 A fool does not delight in understanding, But only in revealing his own mind.

The Professor

August 20, 2010 at 2:19 pm#213114

Participant

Quote (RokkaMan @ Aug. 20 2010,16:38)

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 20 2010,04:37)

RM,

In addition if you don't want to believe what is WRITTEN in John 1 as I explained in my previous post maybe we can try to use logic: (doubtful though)

Word = Jesus (Son)
God = Father

John 1:1 In the beginning was the Son and the Son was with the Father and the Son was the Father.

Son = Father

Who here on hn believes that the Son is his Father?

YOU said that the WORD = God which is saying the same thing.

I have quoted Scripture and quoted Scripture to no avail because you do not respond to them and none of your writings have Scripture either to back up the words that you spew out on the page.

So, I will stand on these two verses in regards to future corrections of your posts:

Pro 9:7 He who corrects a scoffer gets dishonor for himself, And he who reproves a wicked man gets insults for himself.

Pro 9:8 Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you, Reprove a wise man and he will love you.

The Professor

In the beginning was The Son, The Son was with The Father and The Son was The Father.

———-

That's exactly right.

———-

Father and Son are roles… they do not define you…

they are roles you play when you have a relationship.

———-

If I am a Father, I am so…only to my children and no one else.

If I am a Son, I am so… only to my parents and no one else.

———-

YHVH is The Father of all things.

The Son, is his reflected image, subject to himself.

So the Son isn't YHVH The Father.

The Son is the reflected image of The Father.

and the Image itself is YHVH.

So when you look at The Son, you are looking at the image of The Father.

————
If i take a picture of myself… the picture isn't me, but when you look at the picture, you can see me.

This is the same was, The Son was with the father… and Was the Father…

You are looking at YHVH through his reflection as The Son.

——-

The Son's role is to be obedient to The Father, and represent The Father in all things… including creation and judgement.

but, you choose to continue to put words in my mouth and add to scripture.

i'm interpreting scripture in the only way that makes sense.

If Jesus Christ was not the reflection of YHVH… then christianity is a false religion.

Good morning RM,

How about if we believe Scripture to give you understanding?

YOU:

If Jesus Christ was not the reflection of YHVH… then christianity is a false religion.

ME:

How about Jesus being the son of God? Not just a reflection.

I understand the concept of what you are saying because Jesus explained that to his disciples when they asked to see the Father.

However, by what you say Jesus = Father which is not true.

You might be less confused if you used the Bible and tried to use the Wisdom provided.

Sometimes I will try to provide an analogy to “help” someone see something but I have to use the Bible as a foundation and give references so that you and others can debate what IS WRITTEN.

John 1 doesn't even allude to Jesus being an image or reflection of God. It is explaining what happened in the beginning which you missed….and what was happening in the beginning is that Jesus was WITH God and this is why Jesus CANNOT be God whom he was with.

The Professor

August 22, 2010 at 6:44 pm#213411

Participant

Wow you guys need to shutup seriously.

You keep saying I am saying that Jesus = The Father.

and I keep having to say he IS NOT The Father, but the reflected image of The Father… IN WHICH THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT A SON IS.

————

Your children are not you, but reflections of you. Little YOU's…

————

The Same with Jesus, HE IS NOT YHVH… he is THE PERFECT REFLECTION OF YHVH…. HIS CHILD.

————

Nothing else exists that is the literal child of God…

we become adopted children of God, but Jesus is the actual child of God.

————

why do you both keep puttin words in my mouth?

your lack of understanding is astonishing.

August 23, 2010 at 7:26 am#213477

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 20 2010,04:04)

Hello RM,

Jhn 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.

How many people here? TWO. Who are they? He and God.
When was this? In the beginning!

Who is being referred to as “he” in v2? “Word” from v1.

Is “He” of “Word” referred to as God or is he a separate and different person?

I didn't need to try to confuse people and explain to them who or what “Word” is in v1 because it doesn't matter. v2 tells us, Word = He

Furthermore “Word” AND “He” was WITH God, meaning that neither one could be God, whom he was with.

THIS IS WHY JESUS CHRIST CANNOT BE GOD!!!!

The Professor

Hi David,

It does NOT say “he” in John 1:2; what's said is: The Same!
You are putting spin on what The Bible says in an attempt to
make the Scriptures conform to 'your' understanding of them?
Saying there are 'two' people there is NOT The Bible what says!

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org

August 23, 2010 at 2:32 pm#213499

Participant

Quote (RokkaMan @ Aug. 23 2010,13:44)

Wow you guys need to shutup seriously.

You keep saying I am saying that Jesus = The Father.

and I keep having to say he IS NOT The Father, but the reflected image of The Father… IN WHICH THAT IS EXACTLY WHAT A SON IS.

————

Your children are not you, but reflections of you. Little YOU's…

————

The Same with Jesus, HE IS NOT YHVH… he is THE PERFECT REFLECTION OF YHVH…. HIS CHILD.

————

Nothing else exists that is the literal child of God…

we become adopted children of God, but Jesus is the actual child of God.

————

why do you both keep puttin words in my mouth?

your lack of understanding is astonishing.

Hello RM,

I try not to misquote or speak for you and I usually include the post to show this. However, since you didn't hit quote on mine the following is from yours:

In the beginning was The Son, The Son was with The Father and The Son was The Father.

———-

That's exactly right.

This says Son = Father

I understand the other parts of what you say, but when you say this at the beginning and then explain something else, which should be believed?

Sometimes the Bible says that the Father looks like the son (for those that have seen the son, they can then relate to what the Father looks like)and others the son looks like the Father.

The Professor

August 23, 2010 at 2:44 pm#213502

Participant

Quote (davidbfun @ Aug. 20 2010,04:04)

Hello RM,

Jhn 1:2 He was in the beginning with God.

How many people here? TWO. Who are they? He and God.
When was this? In the beginning!

Who is being referred to as “he” in v2? “Word” from v1.

Is “He” of “Word” referred to as God or is he a separate and different person?

I didn't need to try to confuse people and explain to them who or what “Word” is in v1 because it doesn't matter. v2 tells us, Word = He

Furthermore “Word” AND “He” was WITH God, meaning that neither one could be God, whom he was with.

THIS IS WHY JESUS CHRIST CANNOT BE GOD!!!!

The Professor

(((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((Edit)))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))
Hi David,

Witnessing to the world in behalf of YHVH (Psalm 45:17)
יהוה האלהים (JEHOVAH GOD) YÄ-hä-vā hä ĔL-ō-Hêêm!
Ed J (AKJV Joshua 22:34 / Isaiah 60:13-15)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.org[/quote]

August 26, 2010 at 2:39 pm#213929