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georg
who you think are the two witness, some say it is OT NT but how can they die and be called to be risen to heaven?
the way they suffer it should be man ?
Pierre
Pierre
I have done a study on that subject, and will put it up for you.
The two Witnesses
Rev. 11:1 “And there was given me a reed like unto a rod: and the angel stood, saying, rise, and measure the temple of God, and the altar, and them that worship therein.”
John was told to measure the temple; this is God’s spiritual temple, the saints. And the altar, the altar is were you offer up your sacrifice; John was told to measure their sacrifices too. Describing the reed as a rod is to say, saints need correction and discipline too.
Rev. 3:19 “As many as I love, I rebuke and chasten, be zealous therefore and repent.”
Job thought he was a righteous man, even argued with God about that; and what did he have to go through before he learned what his problem was?
Rev. 11:2 “But the court which is without the temple leave out, and measure it not; for it is given unto the Gentiles: and the holy city shall they treat under foot forty and two month.”
The court outside the temple are the gentiles, nonbelievers; measure them not. They will be measured during Christ’s millennium.
How can you tread on the holy city, and for forty two month? It was not the city itself that was trodden under, rather the saints that would occupy that city. The holy city is the New Jerusalem coming down from heaven.
Rev. 21:2 “And I John saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down from God out of heaven, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband.”
It is the mansion Jesus had said he would go and prepare for his bride, the church/saints. It is a spiritual city for spirit beings; so, it could not have possibly be trodden under by any human being. The time given for the “holy city” to be trodden under is the same as is given for Antichrists reign; forty two month = 1,260 days = years.
Rev.11:3 “And I will give power unto my two witnesses, and they shall prophesy a thousand two hundred and threescore days, clothed in sackcloth.”
Now the question is; who are the two witnesses? If we noticed that the time of their witnessing is the same as the Antichrists reign, then we should realize, they could not be two individuals.
v. 4 “These are the two olive trees, and the two candlesticks standing before the god of the earth.”
Hear the two witnesses are called olive trees and candlesticks. Olive Trees are the source of the oil; the oil symbolizes God’s Holy Spirit; the Holy Spirit is what gives us understanding, and we receive the Holy Spirit and understanding by reading the two witnesses, the Old and the New Testament; they are the two witnesses, the word of God. A candlestick holds up the candle so when the candle is lit it can light up the dark. The saints, the real witnesses or candles, received their faith and strength from the two witnesses to stand before the god, ruler, of the earth, Satan.
2 Cor. 4:4 “In whom the god of this world hath blinded the minds of them which believe not…”
Jesus spoke of these two witnesses too.
John 5:39 “Search the scriptures; (Old Testament) for in them ye thing ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify (witness) of me.”
Mat. 24:14 “And this gospel (New Testament), of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come.”
Is anyone taken the next verse literal?
Rev. 11:5 “And if any man will hurt them, fire proceedeth out of their mouth, and devoureth their enemies: and if any man will hurt them, he must in this manner be killed.”
God would never turn a human being into a fire-breezing dragon. However, if you remain an enemy of God during the millennium, you will be destroyed in the lake of fire. The hurt you can do to the word of God, the two witnesses, is not believing it; and that will cause you the greatest hurt.
v. 6 “These have power to shut heaven, that it rain not in the days of their prophecy: and have powers over waters to turn them to blood, and to smite the earth with all plagues, as often as they will.”
You have to ask yourself; is this scripture really speaking of these “two witnesses”? Who was it that had power to shut up heaven that it rain not for three and a half years, in his days of prophecy? Was it not Elijah? And who was it that had power to turn water into blood; to smite the earth with all plagues, in the days of his prophecy? Was it not Moses?
Luke 4:25 “But I tell you of a truth, many widows were in Israel in the days of Eli’as, when the heaven was shut up three years and six month, when great famine was throughout all the land.”
Rev. 11:7 And when they shall have finished their testimony, the beast that ascended out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them, and shall overcome them, and kill them.”
Here is another clue by which we can tell that these two witnesses are not two individuals; it says, the beast that came out of the bottomless pit shall make war against them; that beast was the “League of Nation”, and is now the “United Nation” (See the seventh head). This shows that the two witnesses have witnessed not only through the time of the Antichrist, but far beyond. The intention of the United Nation is, to rule the “World” by a “one world government”. So, how are they going to make war against them? They have been for some time. It all started very slow, as not to attract attention to their plan. Take prayers out of schools; you do want to start with the youngest once first. Don’t allow the name Jesus be spoken in schools; or mention God; or the ten commandments. Then take out religious symbols from public places. Have comedy TV shows make fun of God, Jesus, and religion in general. Make movies that defame Jesus in the worst and vile way. Religion has to be done away with, you wouldn’t after all want people with conscience, point out the lies, corruption, and fraud in our government; in our elected officials; the Leaders of our nation. You want to relax people in their religious believes, make them think, if our leaders can do, so can we.
v. 8 “And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.”
Most people would assume that this great city is Jerusalem; it is not. For one thing Jesus was crucified outside the city, outside Jerusalem. This city is spiritually called Sodom and Egypt. What Egypt and Sodom symbolize is sin and perversion. In other words, this great city is the world, Satan’s world. That is where Jesus was crucified. There are no real bodies lying in the streets either. The dying of the two witnesses is happening in the bodies of them that call themselves Christians but pay no attention to the word of God, or the things that go on around them. This nation is supposed to be 80 percent or more Christian; really? Then how did we sink so low?
v. 9 “And they of the people and kindreds and tongues and nations shall see their dead bodies three days and a half, and shall not suffer their dead bodies to be put in graves.”
We can witness the killing of the “two witnesses” every day on our TV sets. We are the dead bodies; dead inside, not quite ready for burial yet. Three and a half days? We have entered in to a time of our life were some people begin to wonder; what is happening? What is going on? Something don’t feel right. For 1,260 years the two witnesses gave strength and support to the saints, now, in less time that it took us to hit bottom, people are beginning to reach out for the same strength and support.
v. 10 “And they that dwell upon the earth shall rejoice over them, and make merry, and shall send gifts one to another; because these two prophets tormented them that dwelt on the earth.”
Yes, people have celebrated the defeat of these two prophets, witnesses. We have seen the parades of the homosexuals, lesbians, and atheists on our TVs. People are so happy indeed to sin freely, to do as they please an
d not have to feel bad embarrassed or ashamed; every body is doing it including our government leaders, no more restrictions. People no longer demand accountability from our leaders, so they don’t have to fear they will be held accountable either. The two witnesses are dead, we won, or so they think.
v. 11 “And after three days and a half the Spirit of life from God entered into them, and they stood upon their feet; and great fear fell upon them which saw them.”
We do now live in the very last days of our time; people are sensing it and are fearful, not knowing what to believe or what will happen. They see the change in our government, but don’t know what to make of it. So they flock into churches and hope for the rapture that will never come. They begin to realize; something isn’t right. The government is changing everything this country used to stand for; why are they doing that? What will happen to us; do we have a future? People will begin to bring the two witnesses back to life because they realize that “life” is in them. This turnaround will even put fear in those that once celebrated their death.
v. 12 “And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.”
I seriously doubt that any one will hear a voice; what we will hear will be most likely a loud rumbling like a great thunder. The ascending of the two witnesses is symbolic, meaning, it is the end of witnessing, in Christ millennium there will be no more witnessing, only teaching. The loud thunder is announcing God’s wrath on the entire world.
Rev. 11:13 “And the same hour was there a great earthquake, and the tenth part of the city fell, and in the earthquake were slain of men seven thousand: and the remnant were affrighted, and gave glory to the God of heaven.”
This great earthquake is what Jeremiah is describing.
Jer. 25:30 “Therefore prophecy thou against them all these words, and say unto them, The LORD shall roar from on high, and utter his voice from his holy habitation; he shall mightily roar upon his habitation; he shall give a shout, as they that tread the grapes, against all the inhabitants of the earth.”
v. 31 “A noise shall come even to the ends of the earth; for the LORD has a controversy with the nations, he will plead with all flesh (he has pleaded); he will give them that are wicked to the sword, saith the LORD.”
v. 32 “Thus saith the LORD of host, behold, evil shall go forth from nation to nation, and a great whirlwind shall be raised up from the coasts of the earth.”
v. 33 “And the slain of the LORD shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground.”
God will be true to his word, and there will be no place to hide.
Is. 13:11 “And I will punish the world for their evil, and the wicked for their iniquity; and I will cause the arrogance of the proud to cease, and will lay low the haughtiness of the terrible.”
If this doesn’t put fear in you, then I don’t know what will. That’s why it’s good to know.
Nah. 1:7 “The LORD is good, a strong hold in the day of trouble; and he knoweth them that trust in him.”
How are you treading the “two witnesses”?Georg
Hi Georg,
The league of nations was in the pit??
No satan will be bound there for 1000 years.[Rev20]georg
i have made my self a copy of you 2 wtns explanation and now i am look at it so i get back a soon i can give you info on it ,
Pierre
Quote (Nick Hassan @ May 27 2010,10:19) Hi Georg,
Do you have an opinion on this?
Nick, have you ever ask yourself, what are you good for on the forum?
You're good in pointing out scriptures, not quoting them, just pointing them out, the reason, you don't understand scriptures, and, when I give you scriptures you ignore them for the same reason, no understanding; so, why should I assume that you would understand when I explain something. You are in fact a nuisance and a hindrance to others that may want to learn, you bog them down with silly and unprofitable arguments rather then getting out of the way of those who have an interest; I admit, there are not many.
Is the reason you support this forum that you want get kicked off?
You really hate this forum, don't you?Georg
Hi Georg,
One scripture with your opinion is not truth.
Learn to find support in scripture first before teaching.
Otherwise it just finishes up as yet another opinion from Georg.Quote (Arnold @ May 27 2010,09:08) Nick What is a bottomless pit?
Georg
georgin my book a bottomless pit ,is a hole with walls,is it not ?
Pierre
Pierre
Every hole has walls, and a bottom; the emphasis is on a “bottomless” pit; can that be possible?
Have you heard the expression, “he came out of nowhere”? can anything, or any one, come out of “nowhere”?
Georg
Hi Georg,
If you think all is physical you might question this.
But scripture is spiritual.
Do not try to conform what is spiritual to shallow carnality.Nick
I said I want to be challenged by you, to do that you have to understand scripture; you're no challenge, you're an instigator.
Georg
Hi Georg,
You have many private interpretations and opinions on scripture but do you have understanding??Quote (Arnold @ May 28 2010,20:27) Pierre Every hole has walls, and a bottom; the emphasis is on a “bottomless” pit; can that be possible?
Have you heard the expression, “he came out of nowhere”? can anything, or any one, come out of “nowhere”?
Georg
hi georgyou say;Every hole has walls, and a bottom
this is wrong,many holes have no bottom,did you never drill trough a 2×4??
the bottomless pit ,would mean to me that he could be running trough a circle pipe type ,like is confinement would be endless and unless someone take him out he would stay there forever
Pierre thinking
Quote (terraricca @ May 29 2010,09:53) Quote (Arnold @ May 28 2010,20:27) Pierre Every hole has walls, and a bottom; the emphasis is on a “bottomless” pit; can that be possible?
Have you heard the expression, “he came out of nowhere”? can anything, or any one, come out of “nowhere”?
Georg
hi georgyou say;Every hole has walls, and a bottom
this is wrong,many holes have no bottom,did you never drill trough a 2×4??
the bottomless pit ,would mean to me that he could be running trough a circle pipe type ,like is confinement would be endless and unless someone take him out he would stay there forever
Pierre thinking
Pierre, it says “PIT”, not a pipe or a hole in a 2×4.Georg
Quote (terraricca @ May 29 2010,13:28) georg well, what is your version of the pit?
Oh, come on Pierre, I thought you said you don't like small talk.
It is a figure of speech, like, it came out of nowhere.
This beast is the seventh head, Rev. 17:10. The beast/government that was “A ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT”, and is not; with the fall of the western leg of Rome, a one world government fell apart, “it was not”; and is to come.
The idea to rule the world by a “one world government” was never forgotten. Many attempts were made by the kings that started to rule what used to be the western Roman empire. Some, such as Charlemagne, had some success, but only until their death. The popes of the RCC tried to help by crowning some of the kings, HOLY ROMAN EMPERORS; it didn't help either.
Then in 1918, after the first WW, the nations got together and tried a different approach, with out force, they formed the “LEAGUE OF NATION”. “IT” was to become their “one world government”. “IT” did not last long, 1946, “IT” went into perdition, but out of “IT” came the “eighth”,Rev 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.
The “UNITED NATION”, that is what the world is working on now, to make it a “one world government”.
And we all know the outcome of that.Georg
Quote (Arnold @ May 30 2010,02:48) Quote (terraricca @ May 29 2010,13:28) georg well, what is your version of the pit?
Oh, come on Pierre, I thought you said you don't like small talk.
It is a figure of speech, like, it came out of nowhere.
This beast is the seventh head, Rev. 17:10. The beast/government that was “A ONE WORLD GOVERNMENT”, and is not; with the fall of the western leg of Rome, a one world government fell apart, “it was not”; and is to come.
The idea to rule the world by a “one world government” was never forgotten. Many attempts were made by the kings that started to rule what used to be the western Roman empire. Some, such as Charlemagne, had some success, but only until their death. The popes of the RCC tried to help by crowning some of the kings, HOLY ROMAN EMPERORS; it didn't help either.
Then in 1918, after the first WW, the nations got together and tried a different approach, with out force, they formed the “LEAGUE OF NATION”. “IT” was to become their “one world government”. “IT” did not last long, 1946, “IT” went into perdition, but out of “IT” came the “eighth”,Rev 17:11 And the beast that was, and is not, even he is the eighth, and is of the seven, and goeth into perdition.
The “UNITED NATION”, that is what the world is working on now, to make it a “one world government”.
And we all know the outcome of that.Georg
georgnot the version of IT, but of PIT
Pierre
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