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Hi Tow,
As you show the temple is now spiritual, currently in heaven where only the priest Jesus can minister and then on the renewed earth. Christ, the lamb of God, is the sacrifice of the new priesthood. So there is no place for the levites to sacrifice now or in the future.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 03 2008,16:33) Hi Tow,
As you show the temple is now spiritual, currently in heaven where only the priest Jesus can minister and then on the renewed earth. Christ, the lamb of God, is the sacrifice of the new priesthood. So there is no place for the levites to sacrifice now or in the future.
Really, here. Reread it and show me a spiritual temple. You are truly blinded and in deception at this point,================================
Eze 40:47 And he measured the court, a hundred cubits long and a hundred cubits broad, a square. And the altar was in front of the temple.Eze 41:5 Then he measured the wall of the temple, six cubits thick, and the breadth of the side chambers, four cubits, all around the temple.
Eze 41:13 Then he measured the temple, a hundred cubits long; and the yard and the building with its walls, a hundred cubits long;
Eze 43:10 “As for you, son of man, describe to the house of Israel the temple, that they may be ashamed of their iniquities; and they shall measure the plan.
======================================So are you saying they are measuring G-d here? But here's the ringer Nick
======================================
Eze 44:10 But the Levites who went far from me, going astray from me after their idols when Israel went astray, shall bear their punishment.
Eze 44:11 They shall be ministers in my sanctuary, having oversight at the gates of the temple and ministering in the temple. They shall slaughter the burnt offering and the sacrifice for the people, and they shall stand before the people, to minister to them.
================================Hi Tow,
Remember the Lord Jesus will rule from Jerusalem during the 1000yr reign[Rev20] and a physical temple will be built at that time as shown in Zech 6 and Ezek 44. The end of the 1000yr reign brings the judgement of the nations and then those in Christ will be with him on earth for eternity and then there will be no physical temple. The physical mirrors the spiritual.So you have no proof that Zech 6 and Eze 40-44 take place during your supposed 1000 year reign. None.
You are right because the NT contradicts and conflicts with Tanakh.
If the pharmacist tells me to not take two different medications at the same time because they could cause me harm taken together, should I ignore his knowledge and go by blind faith?
The Tanakh and the GT do not mix well. They oppose each other.
Hi tow,
Not so.
The harmony is mindboggling.
You should listen to the great physician who told you man cannot live on bread alone.
And you need the Spirit of God .
God gives the Spirit to those who ask.[Lk11]Quote (Nick Hassan @ Jan. 03 2008,20:27) Hi tow,
Not so.
The harmony is mindboggling.
You should listen to the great physician who told you man cannot live on bread alone.
And you need the Spirit of God .
God gives the Spirit to those who ask.[Lk11]
Then show me the harmony. You claim to lead people to truth, lets see it.Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 03 2008,07:13)
OP to overcome Nickocity:Christianity tries to show that the Torah (called the “Law” in the GT) was incomplete and that it was flawed because no one could perfectly obey it. What does Tanakh say? From the Christian ESV:
=====================================
Deu 30:11 “For this commandment that I command you today is not too hard for you, neither is it far off.
Deu 30:12 It is not in heaven, that you should say, 'Who will ascend to heaven for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?'
Deu 30:13 Neither is it beyond the sea, that you should say, 'Who will go over the sea for us and bring it to us, that we may hear it and do it?'
Deu 30:14 But the word is very near you. It is in your mouth and in your heart, so that you can do it.Psa 12:6 The words of the LORD are pure words, like silver refined in a furnace on the ground, purified seven times.
Psa 12:7 You, O LORD, will keep them; you will guard us from this generation forever.Psa 19:7 The law of the LORD is perfect, reviving the soul; the testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple;
Psa 19:8 the precepts of the LORD are right, rejoicing the heart; the commandment of the LORD is pure, enlightening the eyes;Psa 119:7 I will praise you with an upright heart, when I learn your righteous rules.
Psa 119:8 I will keep your statutes; do not utterly forsake me!
Psa 119:9 How can a young man keep his way pure? By guarding it according to your word.
Psa 119:10 With my whole heart I seek you; let me not wander from your commandments!
Psa 119:11 I have stored up your word in my heart, that I might not sin against you.Psa 119:98 Your commandment makes me wiser than my enemies, for it is ever with me.
Psa 119:99 I have more understanding than all my teachers, for your testimonies are my meditation.
Psa 119:100 I understand more than the aged, for I keep your precepts.Psa 119:160 The sum of your word is truth, and every one of your righteous rules endures forever.
====================================Well, so much for the imperfect and incomplete theory
Hey Nick,
Regardless of what you say about me, you say you believe the OT is 100% true. So tell me, why don't YOU believe it?
Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 04 2008,02:31) Here is some evidence for you SOL. From http://www.religiousstudies.uncc.edu/jdtabor/ebionites.html
=======================================
The Ebionite/Nazarene movement was made up of mostly Jewish/Israelite followers of John the Baptizer and later Jesus, who were concentrated in Palestine and surrounding regions and led by “James the Just” (the oldest brother of Jesus), and flourished between the years 30-80 C.E. They were zealous for the Torah and continued to walk in all the mitzvot (commandments) as enlightened by their Rabbi and Teacher, but accepted non-Jews into their fellowship on the basis of some version of the Noachide Laws (Acts 15 and 21).The Essenes (possibly from 'Ossim, meaning “Doers of Torah”), who wrote or collected the Dead Sea Scrolls, pioneered certain aspects of this “Way” over 150 years before the birth of Jesus. They were a wilderness (out in the Arava, near the Dead Sea–based on Isaiah 40:3), baptizing (mikveh of repentance as entrance requirement into their fellowship), new covenant, messianic/apocalyptic group (they were expecting three redemptive Figures—the Prophet like Moses and his two Messiahs), that saw themselves as the remnant core of God's faithful people—preparing the Way for the return of YHVH's Glory (Kavod) as set forth in Isaiah 40-66. They too referred to themselves as the Way, the Poor, the Saints, the New Covenanters, Children of Light, and so forth. Perhaps their most common designation was the Yachad–the brotherhood or community, and they referred to themselves as brother and sister. They were bitterly opposed to the corrupt Priests in Jerusalem, to the Herods, and even to the Pharisees whom they saw as compromising with that establishment to get power and influence from the Hellenistic/Roman powers. They had their own developed Halacha (interpretation of Torah), some aspects of which Jesus picks up (ideal of no divorce, not using oaths, etc.). They followed one they called the True Teacher (Teacher of Righteousness) whom most scholars believe lived in the 1st century B.C.E. and was opposed and possibly killed by the Hasmonean King/Priests at the instigation of the Pharisees. John the Baptizer seems to arise out of this context and rekindle the apocalyptic fervor of the movement in the early decades of the first century C.E.
I use Ebionite/Nazarene as an historical designation to refer to those original, 1st century, largely Palestinian followers of Jesus, gathered around Yaaqov (James) in Jerusalem, who were zealous for the Torah, but saw themselves as part of the New Covenant Way inaugurated by their “True Teacher” Jesus.
====================================So much for these folks NOT believing in YHVH or following the same Torah. The Torah they rejected was not the written, but the oral Torah, later put into writing in the Talmud.
If you are going to seek a “new” relgion, at least be informed. What you keep putting forward is modern Nazarene Esseneism, which is gnostic and occultic. This movement does not match historic Nazarene/Essene ways.
The Nazarean – they were Jews by nationality – originally from Gileaditis, Bashanitis and the Transjordon… They acknowledged Moses and believed that he had received laws – not this law, however, but some other. And so, they were Jews who kept all the Jewish observances, but they would not offer sacrifice or eat meat. They considered it unlawful to eat meat or make sacrifices with it. They claim that these Books are fictions, and that none of these customs were instituted by the fathers. This was the difference between the Nazarean and the others…
(Panarion 1:18)
After this [Nazarean] sect in turn comes another closely connected with them, called the Ossaeanes. These are Jews like the former … originally came from Nabataea, Ituraea, Moabitis and Arielis, the lands beyond the basin of what sacred scripture called the Salt Sea… Though it is different from the other six of these seven sects, it causes schism only by forbidding the books of Moses like the Nazarean.
(Panarion 1:19)Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 04 2008,14:28) Hey Nick, Regardless of what you say about me, you say you believe the OT is 100% true. So tell me, why don't YOU believe it?
Hi tow,
All true.
Often misunderstood.
Frequently misused
but all true.Now what about you?
So Tow, if you believe that much of the Old Testament is fiction or fallacies of man then YOU AGREE with the Nazarene Essenes and yet reject the teachings of their Teacher of Righteousness and Master, Yeshua.
You have chosen Rabbinic Judaism a modern form of Pharisism.
Is it possible you are under the wrong Jewish sect?
Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 03 2008,21:35) Quote (Towshab @ Jan. 04 2008,02:31) Here is some evidence for you SOL. From http://www.religiousstudies.uncc.edu/jdtabor/ebionites.html
=======================================
The Ebionite/Nazarene movement was made up of mostly Jewish/Israelite followers of John the Baptizer and later Jesus, who were concentrated in Palestine and surrounding regions and led by “James the Just” (the oldest brother of Jesus), and flourished between the years 30-80 C.E. They were zealous for the Torah and continued to walk in all the mitzvot (commandments) as enlightened by their Rabbi and Teacher, but accepted non-Jews into their fellowship on the basis of some version of the Noachide Laws (Acts 15 and 21).The Essenes (possibly from 'Ossim, meaning “Doers of Torah”), who wrote or collected the Dead Sea Scrolls, pioneered certain aspects of this “Way” over 150 years before the birth of Jesus. They were a wilderness (out in the Arava, near the Dead Sea–based on Isaiah 40:3), baptizing (mikveh of repentance as entrance requirement into their fellowship), new covenant, messianic/apocalyptic group (they were expecting three redemptive Figures—the Prophet like Moses and his two Messiahs), that saw themselves as the remnant core of God's faithful people—preparing the Way for the return of YHVH's Glory (Kavod) as set forth in Isaiah 40-66. They too referred to themselves as the Way, the Poor, the Saints, the New Covenanters, Children of Light, and so forth. Perhaps their most common designation was the Yachad–the brotherhood or community, and they referred to themselves as brother and sister. They were bitterly opposed to the corrupt Priests in Jerusalem, to the Herods, and even to the Pharisees whom they saw as compromising with that establishment to get power and influence from the Hellenistic/Roman powers. They had their own developed Halacha (interpretation of Torah), some aspects of which Jesus picks up (ideal of no divorce, not using oaths, etc.). They followed one they called the True Teacher (Teacher of Righteousness) whom most scholars believe lived in the 1st century B.C.E. and was opposed and possibly killed by the Hasmonean King/Priests at the instigation of the Pharisees. John the Baptizer seems to arise out of this context and rekindle the apocalyptic fervor of the movement in the early decades of the first century C.E.
I use Ebionite/Nazarene as an historical designation to refer to those original, 1st century, largely Palestinian followers of Jesus, gathered around Yaaqov (James) in Jerusalem, who were zealous for the Torah, but saw themselves as part of the New Covenant Way inaugurated by their “True Teacher” Jesus.
====================================So much for these folks NOT believing in YHVH or following the same Torah. The Torah they rejected was not the written, but the oral Torah, later put into writing in the Talmud.
If you are going to seek a “new” relgion, at least be informed. What you keep putting forward is modern Nazarene Esseneism, which is gnostic and occultic. This movement does not match historic Nazarene/Essene ways.
The Nazarean – they were Jews by nationality – originally from Gileaditis, Bashanitis and the Transjordon… They acknowledged Moses and believed that he had received laws – not this law, however, but some other.Proof required.
Quote And so, they were Jews who kept all the Jewish observances, but they would not offer sacrifice or eat meat. Yes they were vegans. And?
Quote They considered it unlawful to eat meat or make sacrifices with it. Proof required on the sacrifice thing.
Quote They claim that these Books are fictions, and that none of these customs were instituted by the fathers. This was the difference between the Nazarean and the others…
(Panarion 1:18)Proof required.
Quote After this [Nazarean] sect in turn comes another closely connected with them, called the Ossaeanes. These are Jews like the former … originally came from Nabataea, Ituraea, Moabitis and Arielis, the lands beyond the basin of what sacred scripture called the Salt Sea… Though it is different from the other six of these seven sects, it causes schism only by forbidding the books of Moses like the Nazarean.
(Panarion 1:19)Sounds like they were almost as confused as modern day Christianity.
Quote http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Essenes
Poor.Quote (Son of Light @ Jan. 03 2008,21:39) So Tow, if you believe that much of the Old Testament is fiction or fallacies of man then YOU AGREE with the Nazarene Essenes and yet reject the teachings of their Teacher of Righteousness and Master, Yeshua. I do not say MUCH of the Tanakh is untrue. You've been biased by Nick Hassan AKA Mr. Twister. I do not believe that G-d inspires men to commit genocide. I also struggle with miracles because they cannot be verified. Finally, some mitzvot (mostly dietary) reflect the times; modern technology would render them obsolete.
Quote You have chosen Rabbinic Judaism a modern form of Pharisism. Snore. I am much closer to Karaite judaism. Look it up.
Quote Is it possible you are under the wrong Jewish sect?
Is it possible you have fallen prey to gnostic lies?
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