The timing of the crucifixion

[kejonn]

Hi all,

So as to not get too far off topic in the Sabbath thread, I wanted to start this thread to discuss the days of death and resurrection of Yeshua.

There are two verses in particular that are interesting. The first is one that everyone naturally assumes speaks of the time Yeshua is in the tomb.

Mat 12:40  For just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the great fish, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.

This is the only time in scripture where three nights is included along with three days. However, I've seen some ideas out there that say that Yeshua is NOT speaking of his burial here, but his earthly ministry. In other words, the three days and nights are an allegory for three summers and three winters, or basically three years of ministry. What in the context of the whole chapter would lend you either the view of ministry or his death? After all, Jonah was not dead while he was in the fish…

Also, what of this passage:

Luk 24:17  And he said to them, “What is this conversation that you are holding with each other as you walk?” And they stood still, looking sad.
Luk 24:18  Then one of them, named Cleopas, answered him, “Are you the only visitor to Jerusalem who does not know the things that have happened there in these days?”
Luk 24:19  And he said to them, “What things?” And they said to him, “Concerning Jesus of Nazareth, a man who was a prophet mighty in deed and word before God and all the people,
Luk 24:20  and how our chief priests and rulers delivered him up to be condemned to death, and crucified him.
Luk 24:21  But we had hoped that he was the one to redeem Israel. Yes, and besides all this, it is now the third day since these things happened.

Any ideas?

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi All!

kejonn is right. I suppose the day of Jesus resurection is a different subject than the Sabbath.

So I thought I would bring these two post over from the Sabbath threads.

Heres some more information about Yeshua being crucified on Friday and his Ressurection on Sunday.

Understanding the Jewish time system:

Luke 13:32 ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.’
Even during the Exodus there is an excellent example of Jewish inclusive time keeping. The Bible says: “The Lord also said to Moses, “Go to the people and consecrate them today and tomorrow, and let them wash their garments; and let them be ready for the third day, for on the third day the Lord will come down on Mount Sinai in the sight of all the people.” Exodus 19:10-11
Intro: The purpose of this section:

The term, three days and three nights is: Absolutely equivalent with “after three days”, “on the third day”, three days later”
The term, three days and three nights: Does not require three literal days and three literal nights.
The term, three days and three nights: Does not require 72 literal hours.
That a Friday crucifixion at 3 PM with at Sunday resurrection at 6 AM would have been considered three days and three nights by the Jewish people of the day.

From the mouth of Jesus!

Luke 13:32 ‘Behold, I cast out demons and perform cures today and tomorrow, and the third day I reach My goal.’

What this proves is that the expression “the third day” represents a literal duration of Friday – Sunday!!! Jesus spoke Lk 12:32 ON A FRIDAY and he entered Jerusalem on a Sunday exactly one week before he died!
This proves, by Jesus own words, that Friday – Sunday = less than 72 hours and that the expression “3 days and 3 nights” is Friday – Sunday!!!
http://www.bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm#IIB

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi All!

The Early Church Fathers has much to say about the ressurection of our lord. I will post some later but thought this was rather interesting and deals with this point now.

“Preparation”, the first century word for Friday!

Charles C. Torrey explains, In Aramaic, “the middle days of the week were designated by numbers, ‘third, fourth, fifth,’ but Friday was always arubta; there was no ‘sixth day’ of the week; . . . Its Greek equivalent, paraskeue-Friday, was likewise adopted, from the first, by the Greek Church.”
The Didache, dated between A.D. 70 to 120, enjoins Christians to fast on “the fourth day and Preparation” (8:1), that is, Wednesday and Friday. It is noteworthy that Friday is designated simply as “Preparation-paraskeuen,” without the article or the noun “day,” thus indicating the technical usage of the term. By the time of Tertullian (c. A.D. 160-225) paraskeue had already become such a fixed name for Friday that he even argues that this had been the name for Friday since creation. This clearly indicate that Christians adopted the Jewish practice of numbering the first five days of the week and of naming the sixth and the seventh as paraskeue and sabbaton—Preparation and Sabbath.
250 AD IGNATIUS: “On the day of the preparation, then, at the third hour, He received the sentence from Pilate, the Father permitting that to happen; at the sixth hour He was crucified; at the ninth hour He gave up the ghost; and before sunset He was buried. During the Sabbath He continued under the earth in the tomb in which Joseph of Arimathaea had laid Him. At the dawning of the Lord's day He arose from the dead, according to what was spoken by Himself, “As Jonah was three days and three nights in the whale's belly, so shall the Son of man also be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.” The day of the preparation, then, comprises the passion; the Sabbath embraces the burial; the Lord's Day contains the resurrection.” The (Epistle of Ignatius to the Trallians, chapter 9)

[IM4Truth]

Kejonn Yes I do. I hope I can explain. Jesus died on Wednesday afternoon which was Passover and Thursday was the beginning of the Days of Unleavened Bread. The first day are always a Annual Sabbath. That is why they had to hurry up asked for Pilate's permission to get Jesus down, because usually it took days for a victim to die. and get Jesus buried, before the Annual Sabbath began. He died on Wednesday afternoon He was laid in the tomb before sundown. Thursday sundown, One day, Friday sundown second day, Saturday sundown third say. So when the Women came to the Grave on Sunday morning He had already risen.

I hope that explains it, my Husband gave me some help, He was sitting next to me, and telling me what to say. He has an article that explains it even better. I will put it down for you too.

Peace and Love Mrs.:D

[kenrch]

Quote (IM4Truth @ Oct. 06 2007,06:37)

Kejonn Yes I do. I hope I can explain. Jesus died on Wednesday afternoon which was Passover and  Thursday was the beginning of the Days of Unleavened Bread. The first day are always a Annual Sabbath.  That is why they  had to hurry up asked for Pilate's permission to get Jesus down, because usually it took days for a victim to die. and get Jesus buried, before the Annual Sabbath began. He died on Wednesday afternoon He was laid in the tomb before sundown. Thursday sundown, One day, Friday sundown second day, Saturday sundown third say. So when the Women came to the Grave on  Sunday morning He had already risen. I hope that explains it, my Husband gave me some help, He was sitting next to me, and telling me what to say.  He has an article that explains it even better. I will put it down for you too. Peace and Love Mrs.:D

Three days, 36 light hours and three nights, 36 night time hours. That's three days and three nights 72 hours.

You cannot get 3 days and 3 nights from Friday to Sunday.
The Rcc started that with their Easter Sunday resurrection.

Scripture says that the tomb was found “empty” on Sunday.
He “has risen” said the angel.

Why complicate things? The Jewish day was only 12 hours! And every excuse imaginable to keep the doctrines of the RCC (mother of harlots). What did JESUS SAY?

Do you think just may be Jesus knew what Satan was going to do and that's why HE was so precise in saying three days and three nights.

Three days and three nights IS THREE DAYS AND THREE NIGHTS, period!

God Bless,

Ken

[IM4Truth]

This is taken out of an Article of Daniels Vision that my Husband wrote, it explains Jesus dead and resurrection.

v. 27 “ And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week; (seven years) and
in the midst of the week (three and a halve years) he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease ,…”
This verse has absolutely nothing to do with Antichrist. Christ’s ministry lasted for three and a halve years, or halve a week. During this time he confirmed, preached, the new covenant with many; and in the midst of the week, not only in the midst of the seventieth week, but also in the midst of a literal week; he was cut of. His death caused the old covenant sacrifices and oblations, offerings, to cease. They were no more necessary; even so the Jews continued to do them. Christ’s crucifixion took place on a Wednesday and he was laid in the tomb on Wednesday evening before sundown; Thursday evening being the first day, Friday evening being the second day, and Saturday evening the third day. What did Jesus say his sign would be?
Mat. 12:40 “ For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale’s belly; so shall the son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.”
Jesus said three days and three nights and he meant three days and three nights. The reason for the confusion is, no one seams to pay attention that the next day was not a weekly Sabbath, it was Thursday, the first of seven annual holy days, also called “ a high day”. These holy days had to be kept just like a Sabbath, no work etc. Immediately after the Passover follows the seven days of unleavened bread, the first and seventh day are high days, annual Sabbath;
Lev. 23:5 “In the fourteenth day of the first month at even, is the LORD’S passover”.
God’s days start and end at even, sundown.
v. 6 “And on the fifteenth day of the same month is the feast of unleavened bread unto
the LORD; seven days ye must eat unleavened bread”.
v. 7 “In the first day ye shall have an holy convocation: ye shall do no servile work
therein.”
v. 8 “But ye shall offer an offering made by fire unto the LORD seven days; in the
seventh day is an holy convocation; ye shall do no servile work therein”.
This is why we read in;
John 19:31 “The Jews therefore, because it was the preparation (for the first day of unleavened bread), that the bodies should not remain upon the cross on thesabbath day, (for that sabbath day was an high day,) besought Pilate that their legs might be broken, and that they might be taken away”.
Jesus burial was a hurry up and temporal burial because the people had to prepare for their holy day the next day, and all that before sundown, that is why they laid him in a tomb nearby;
v. 41 “Now in the place where he was crucified there was a garden; and in the garden
a new sepulchre, wherein was never man yet laid”.
v. 42 “There laid they Jesus therefore because of the Jews preparation day; for the
sepulchre was nigh at hand”.
Then on Friday, the Jews had no time to give Jesus a proper burial either because that was the preparation day for their weekly Sabbath. And of course by the time the woman got to the grave on Sunday, very early, Christ had already risen. After the resurrection he stayed around for 40 days, why? The only reason I can think of is: Jesus knew the day of Pentecost was 50 days away, the day when the Apostles would receive the Holy Spirit, the helper and comforter. To leave the Apostles all alone for that time, might have caused a repeat of what happened to the Israelites when Moses left them for 40 days.
Acts 1:2 “Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen.”
v. 3 “To whom also he showed himself alive after his passion by many infallible proofs, being seen of them forty days, and speaking of the things pertaining to the kingdom of God.”
v. 4 “And being assembled together with them, commanded them that they should not depart from Jerusalem, but wait for the promise of the Father, which, saith he, ye have heard of me.”
v. 5 “For John truly baptized with water, but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.”
And so we read in,
Acts 2:1 “And when the days of Pentecost was fully come…”
Indicating that the Apostles only had to wait maybe 10 days by themselves.
Also, if you really want to know when Jesus was born? This is a good way to figure that out too. He was baptized at age 30, his ministry lasted for three and a half years or, he died in April; so add 6 month to April and you have the month of his birth. Are you surprised or chocked? Or do you think it does not matter? I tell you, yes it does!

Peace and Love Mrs.

[IM4Truth]

Ken I do not understand how you are constantly piking on me and have to bring up the Harlots like I am still in that system. I have come out of Her a long time ago, even before you did, who knows. But tell you the truth I am getting sick and tired of your accusation all the time. Why can you not take the right out of the things were do you get what I wrote to be wrong anyway. 3 days and 3 nights.
You are constantly judging by doing so, and I wonder who is wrong.

[kejonn]

Hmmm, I'm still looking for clues that would point to the sign of Jonah being his time in the tomb. That verse says three days and three nights, but these verses say something different:

Mat 16:21  From that time Jesus began to show his disciples that he must go to Jerusalem and suffer many things from the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised.

Mat 17:22  As they were gathering in Galilee, Jesus said to them, “The Son of Man is about to be delivered into the hands of men,
Mat 17:23  and they will kill him, and he will be raised on the third day.” And they were greatly distressed.

Mat 20:18  “See, we are going up to Jerusalem. And the Son of Man will be delivered over to the chief priests and scribes, and they will condemn him to death
Mat 20:19  and deliver him over to the Gentiles to be mocked and flogged and crucified, and he will be raised on the third day.

Luk 9:22  saying, “The Son of Man must suffer many things and be rejected by the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and on the third day be raised.”

Luk 18:32  For he will be delivered over to the Gentiles and will be mocked and shamefully treated and spit upon.
Luk 18:33  And after flogging him, they will kill him, and on the third day he will rise.”

Note that the phrase “on the third day” appears three times in the very same book, Matthew, that spoke of the sign of Jonah. Yet all three of these times it was very specific as to the event: the day that Yeshua would be raised. The sign of Jonah was had nothing in the context that supports it other than reading into it.

Another thing about the sign of Jonah, which is mentioned in all three synoptics: each one speaks of how Jonah preached repentence to Ninevah. We know this happened after he was spit out by the fish, and that there was no mention of being in the fish to the Ninevites. If Jonah preached after the fish, then the sign of Yeshua being in the tomb three days and three nights is incomplete because Yeshua did not preach after the resurrection.

Just trying to reconcile scripture.

[IM4Truth]

kejonn I really don't get that scripture there has to be an explanation for it ,tho. Maybe because the Woman came to the Tomb on Sunday Morning and the Tomb was empty they assumed that He was risen on Sunday. And there is such a fine Line between the end of one day and the beginning of the next day. But the way I understand it is that Jesus was resurrected on Saturday before the Sun went down. He was buried on Wednesday before the Sun went down and rose on Saturday before the Sun went down. And if you figure that it gives you 3 days and 3 nights, is that not correct?

Peace and Love Mrs.

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi All.

This is the timeline before Yeshuas death, burial and ressurection.

There is much scripture here to support it.

Friday

Nisan 7

30 or 33 AD
John 12:1 Six days before the Passover Jesus came to Bethany to visit Lazarus, Mary and Martha. A dinner is served in his honor
Jesus' feet anointed with Nard by Mary
Chief priests and Pharisees plotting to arrest Jesus

Saturday

Nisan 8

30 or 33 AD
John 12:2-5 In Bethany, Jesus ate a supper with Mary, Martha and Lazarus.
John 12:3 Mary ointments Jesus’ feet with Spikenard, Judas objects
Mt 26:6-13, Mark 14:3-9, Luke 7:36-38, John 12:2-11

Sunday

Nisan 9

30 or 33 AD

Triumphal Entry
John 12:1-13: Triumphal Entry into Jerusalem and Palm Sunday
Jesus weeps over Jerusalem and curses it and the temple
Chief priests plotting to kill Jesus
Mt 21:7-9, Mark 11:8-10, Luke 19:35-38, John 12:12-16.

Monday

Nisan 10

30 or 33 AD

Temple cleansed
Mark 11:12 Next day when they came from Bethany
Mt 21:12: Jesus cleanses temple second time. (Mark records the actual sequence whereas Matthew’s account combines the whole story into one factual account and is not chronological)
Passover lamb selected on Nisan 10: Ex 12:3. It may well be that the act of entering the temple and cleansing it was anti-typical of Ex 12:3. Jesus symbolically presented Himself in the Temple as the Lamb to be slain four days later.
Mk 11:19 Jesus leaves for Bethany again
Matt 21:13, Luke 19:46

Tuesday

Nisan 11

30 or 33 AD

Destruction of Jerusalem foretold
Mark 11:20 And in the morning, as they passed by, they saw the fig tree dried up from the roots.
Mark 11:27-13:37 Jesus authority Questioned
Leaders ask many questions but ask no more after being refuted
Widows mite
Matt 24:1 Destruction of Jerusalem in 70 AD foretold
Matt 21:23-23:39; Luke 20:1-21:4.

Wednesday

Nisan 12

30 or 33 AD
Sunset, 6 PM Tues – Sunset, 6 PM Wed, Roman (our) time
This was “two days before Passover”, chief priests plot to kill Jesus Mt 26:2-5, Mark 14:1-2, Luke 22:1-2.
Judas bargains with leaders
Jesus retires to the Mount of Olives

Thursday

Nisan 13

30 or 33 AD
Sunset, 6 PM Wed – Sunset, 6 PM Thurs Roman (our) time
Disciples sent to prepare upper room for 8 day Passover feast- Mat 26:17-19, Mark 14:12-16, Luke 22:7-13.

Friday

Crucifixion

Nisan 14

30 or 33 AD

Passover

And

Preparation Day for Feast of unleavened bread
Friday the 14th of Nisan is the Passover, It started at sundown, what we call today 6 PM Thursday and ended at sundown Friday 6 PM our (Roman) time. Lev 23:5
The week day of the Passover changed from year to year as do our birthdays. In the year 33 AD Passover was on a Friday.
It is also Preparation day for the Feast of unleavened bread. Some are confused by the expression: “day of preparation for the Passover” as used in Jn 19:14; Matt. 27:62
Judas identified as the betrayer- Mat 26:21-25, Mark 14:18-21, Luke 22:21-23, John 13:21-30.
Passover meal and The Lord's Supper- Mat 26:26-29, Mark 14:22-25, Luke 22:14-16.
Around 12 PM Roman time, Jesus retires to Gethsemane and is arrested- Mat 26:30-56, Mark 14:26-52, Luke 22:39-53, John 18:1-12.
12 AM- 6 AM Roman time, (but still Nisan 14) the trials took place in the darkness of the morning.
6 AM Roman time (“sixth hour” Jn 19:14). Jews tell Pilate: “We have no king but Caesar.”
Crucifixion began at about 9 am (the third hour- Mark 15:25). Jesus died at the very moment the Passover lamb was to be slain at the Temple, the ninth hour on the 14th of Nisan (our Friday 3 PM). From the moment Jesus was laid in the tomb, until sunset, the Jews reckoned to be the first day in the grave, even though it was only a few hours. All of this took place on what was the preparation day – not only for the 7th day Sabbath, but also for the upcoming Feast of Unleavened Bread.
From Noon to 3 PM Roman time (6th-9th hour Jewish time) the sky is dark. This may have been a very literal fulfillment of Ex 12:6 where the Passover lamb was to be killed “between the evenings”.
Between 3-5 PM thousands of lambs are being slain for Passover at the same Jesus dies.
John 19:31 Thieves legs broken because it was the preparation day and a Saturday was a “high day”
2 Mary’s watch Joseph and Nicodemus bury Jesus

Saturday

Nisan 15

30 or 33 AD

Sabbath
Sunset, 6 PM Fri – Sunset, 6 PM Sat, Roman Time
Chief priests and Pharisees ask Pilate to put a guard on tomb about 7 PM (4 hours after Jesus died and one hour into the Sabbath but our Friday night) Matthew 27:62
John 19:31 it was a “high” Seventh day (Saturday) Sabbath because it was ALSO the 15th of Nisan, a feast day: Lev 23:6-7 “On the first day you shall have a holy convocation; you shall not do any laborious work.”
The Messiah rests in the tomb, observing the Sabbath day rest the entire day. This is the second day in the grave.
No Bible verse outright states that Jesus was risen on Saturday.

Sunday

Nisan 16

30 or 33 AD
Sunset, 6 PM Sat – Sunset, 6 PM Sun, Roman (our) Time
The resurrection takes place just at day break about 6 AM
The day of first fruits/ wave/ sheaf offering
http://www.bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm#IIB

[Worshipping Jesus]

Hi All!

Here is some more information on the subject.

I am merely posting it here for others to comment on and to get both sides so that we can all come to the truth.

So far what I have seen is the evidence here is solid. If not then maybe we can get some evidence from the other side.

Saturday Resurrection totally unbiblical

1. The fact that Mary did not anoint body on Friday when she had time, and chose to wait for two more days till Sunday morning to anoint the body.
2. Nisan 10 (according to “View #5 Wednesday crucifixion”) would also have been a Sabbath and hundreds or thousands of people would have broken the Sabbath on that day by cutting palm branches. Christ also would have broken the Sabbath by making the donkey carry a burden.
3. Another reason this date is not acceptable is because it would have eliminated Christ rising on the day of First Fruits/Wave Sheaf
4. Since you reject that Mk 16:9 gives the actual time of Jesus resurrection, you must accept that the Bible never actually tells us what day Jesus arose. Where is YOUR Bible verse that says (or even hints at) your belief that Jesus was actually raised on Saturday? In light of such emphasis the Bible places upon the first day of the week are you comfortable knowing that you must admit that GOD NEVER SPECIFICALLY TOLD US the day Jesus was raised. We view this as completely unacceptable to consider and believe this one fact alone proves that Mk 16:9 is giving the actual time Jesus was raised, rather then just stating that he “had been risen before Sunday and thus was in his resurrected stated on Sunday”.
5. Why did the two men on the road to Emmaus feel that Sunday was “the third day” since Jesus was crucified. How do you account for the fact that these two men were EXPECTING JESUS TO RAISE (Sunday-the third day) that very day they walked on the road while talking to Jesus.
6. How do you explain the fact that the universal uninspired history record of Christians before 300 AD teaches that Jesus died on Friday and was raised on Sunday?
7. If Jesus was in the tomb from Wednesday to Saturday, BUT NO ONE SAW HIM TILL SUNDAY MORNING, then no man was really a true to the fact that Jesus was not in the tomb LONGER THAN 72 hours or 3 1/2 days literal days if Jesus died on Wednesday, and was resurrected at 3:00 PM on Saturday, He was in the ground 4 days and 3 nights as the Jews counted time?

Literally 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours impossible!

1. Those who insist that we must literally interpret 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours “It is the sign of Jonah” they say, haven’t understood that it is impossible to harmonize LITERALLY all the data.
2. If Jesus was resurrected If he rose AFTER the third day, after 72 hours, then all the above verses would read on the FOURTH day.
3. “On the third day” vs. “after three days” are literally quite different:

[kenrch]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Oct. 06 2007,08:08)

Hi All! Here is some more information on the subject. I am merely posting it here for others to comment on and to get both sides so that we can all come to the truth. So far what I have seen is the evidence here is solid. If not then maybe we can get some evidence from the other side. Saturday Resurrection totally unbiblical 1. The fact that Mary did not anoint body on Friday when she had time, and chose to wait for two more days till Sunday morning to anoint the body. 2. Nisan 10 (according to “View #5 Wednesday crucifixion”) would also have been a Sabbath and hundreds or thousands of people would have broken the Sabbath on that day by cutting palm branches. Christ also would have broken the Sabbath by making the donkey carry a burden. 3. Another reason this date is not acceptable is because it would have eliminated Christ rising on the day of First Fruits/Wave Sheaf 4. Since you reject that Mk 16:9 gives the actual time of Jesus resurrection, you must accept that the Bible never actually tells us what day Jesus arose. Where is YOUR Bible verse that says (or even hints at) your belief that Jesus was actually raised on Saturday? In light of such emphasis the Bible places upon the first day of the week are you comfortable knowing that you must admit that GOD NEVER SPECIFICALLY TOLD US the day Jesus was raised. We view this as completely unacceptable to consider and believe this one fact alone proves that Mk 16:9 is giving the actual time Jesus was raised, rather then just stating that he “had been risen before Sunday and thus was in his resurrected stated on Sunday”. 5. Why did the two men on the road to Emmaus feel that Sunday was “the third day” since Jesus was crucified. How do you account for the fact that these two men were EXPECTING JESUS TO RAISE (Sunday-the third day) that very day they walked on the road while talking to Jesus. 6. How do you explain the fact that the universal uninspired history record of Christians before 300 AD teaches that Jesus died on Friday and was raised on Sunday? 7. If Jesus was in the tomb from Wednesday to Saturday, BUT NO ONE SAW HIM TILL SUNDAY MORNING, then no man was really a true to the fact that Jesus was not in the tomb LONGER THAN 72 hours or 3 1/2 days literal days if Jesus died on Wednesday, and was resurrected at 3:00 PM on Saturday, He was in the ground 4 days and 3 nights as the Jews counted time? Literally 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours impossible! 1. Those who insist that we must literally interpret 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours “It is the sign of Jonah” they say, haven’t understood that it is impossible to harmonize LITERALLY all the data. 2. If Jesus was resurrected If he rose AFTER the third day, after 72 hours, then all the above verses would read on the FOURTH day. 3. “On the third day” vs. “after three days” are literally quite different: If Jesus raised literally “on the third day”, then the third day was not yet over, it is literally less than 72 hours. If Jesus raised literally “after three days”, then Jesus would have risen sometime literally after 72 hours. But this would be ON THE FOURTH DAY. 1. Notice that the chief priests and Pharisees wanted the tomb guarded only until the third day, because that is when the resurrection was to occur, NOT on the fourth day! And remember, the watch at the tomb began at the end of the seventh day Sabbath, so that it could be guarded for all of the third day, which Sabbatarians say is Saturday. It was at the end of the duration of 3 days, using their own literalness, that guards STOPPED guarding the tomb. This proves that Jesus was going to raise before, not AFTER 72 hours had elapsed! 2. Since we have irrefutable Bible evidence that 3 days & 3 nights may in fact be literally less than 72 hours or 3 days & 2 nights or 3 nights & 2 days (Cornelius: Acts 10:3,9, 23,24,30; Starving servant: 1 Sam. 30:12,13; Queen Esther 4:16; 5:1) we must call into question the literal length of time Jonah was in the sea monster!!! In light of the Bible passages, how can we be sure that Jonah was literally (Roman time thinking) 72 hours in the sea monster??? We come full circle to the well established point that the Jews would have viewed Friday 3 PM to Sunday 6 AM as being 3 days & 3 nights! OOps forgot the source. http://www.bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm#IIB

Jon 1:17 Now the LORD3068 had prepared4487 a great1419 fish1709 to swallow up1104 (853) Jonah.3124 And Jonah3124 was1961 in the belly4578 of the fish1709 three7969 days3117 and three7969 nights.3915

Days
H3117
יום
yôm
yome
From an unused root meaning to be hot; a day (as the warm hours), whether literally (from sunrise to sunset, or from one sunset to the next), or figuratively (a space of time defined by an associated term), (often used adverbially): – age, + always, + chronicles, continually (-ance), daily, ([birth-], each, to) day, (now a, two) days (agone), + elder, X end, + evening, + (for) ever (-lasting, -more), X full, life, as (so) long as (. . . live), (even) now, + old, + outlived, + perpetually, presently, + remaineth, X required, season, X since, space, then, (process of) time, + as at other times, + in trouble, weather, (as) when, (a, the, within a) while (that), X whole (+ age), (full) year (-ly), + younger.

Nights
H3915
לילה ליל ליל
layil lêyl layelâh
lah'-yil, lale, lah'-yel-aw
From the same as H3883; properly a twist (away of the light), that is, night; figuratively adversity: – ([mid-]) night (season).

How long was Jona in the fish?

The RCC is the whore, the Mother of Harlots. Her master is the father of lies.

Think I'll believe Jesus

[Worshipping Jesus]

Quote (kenrch @ Oct. 06 2007,12:18)

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Oct. 06 2007,08:08) Hi All! Here is some more information on the subject. I am merely posting it here for others to comment on and to get both sides so that we can all come to the truth. So far what I have seen is the evidence here is solid. If not then maybe we can get some evidence from the other side. Saturday Resurrection totally unbiblical 1. The fact that Mary did not anoint body on Friday when she had time, and chose to wait for two more days till Sunday morning to anoint the body. 2. Nisan 10 (according to “View #5 Wednesday crucifixion”) would also have been a Sabbath and hundreds or thousands of people would have broken the Sabbath on that day by cutting palm branches. Christ also would have broken the Sabbath by making the donkey carry a burden. 3. Another reason this date is not acceptable is because it would have eliminated Christ rising on the day of First Fruits/Wave Sheaf 4. Since you reject that Mk 16:9 gives the actual time of Jesus resurrection, you must accept that the Bible never actually tells us what day Jesus arose. Where is YOUR Bible verse that says (or even hints at) your belief that Jesus was actually raised on Saturday? In light of such emphasis the Bible places upon the first day of the week are you comfortable knowing that you must admit that GOD NEVER SPECIFICALLY TOLD US the day Jesus was raised. We view this as completely unacceptable to consider and believe this one fact alone proves that Mk 16:9 is giving the actual time Jesus was raised, rather then just stating that he “had been risen before Sunday and thus was in his resurrected stated on Sunday”. 5. Why did the two men on the road to Emmaus feel that Sunday was “the third day” since Jesus was crucified. How do you account for the fact that these two men were EXPECTING JESUS TO RAISE (Sunday-the third day) that very day they walked on the road while talking to Jesus. 6. How do you explain the fact that the universal uninspired history record of Christians before 300 AD teaches that Jesus died on Friday and was raised on Sunday? 7. If Jesus was in the tomb from Wednesday to Saturday, BUT NO ONE SAW HIM TILL SUNDAY MORNING, then no man was really a true to the fact that Jesus was not in the tomb LONGER THAN 72 hours or 3 1/2 days literal days if Jesus died on Wednesday, and was resurrected at 3:00 PM on Saturday, He was in the ground 4 days and 3 nights as the Jews counted time? Literally 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours impossible! 1. Those who insist that we must literally interpret 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours “It is the sign of Jonah” they say, haven’t understood that it is impossible to harmonize LITERALLY all the data. 2. If Jesus was resurrected If he rose AFTER the third day, after 72 hours, then all the above verses would read on the FOURTH day. 3. “On the third day” vs. “after three days” are literally quite different: If Jesus raised literally “on the third day”, then the third day was not yet over, it is literally less than 72 hours. If Jesus raised literally “after three days”, then Jesus would have risen sometime literally after 72 hours. But this would be ON THE FOURTH DAY. 1. Notice that the chief priests and Pharisees wanted the tomb guarded only until the third day, because that is when the resurrection was to occur, NOT on the fourth day! And remember, the watch at the tomb began at the end of the seventh day Sabbath, so that it could be guarded for all of the third day, which Sabbatarians say is Saturday. It was at the end of the duration of 3 days, using their own literalness, that guards STOPPED guarding the tomb. This proves that Jesus was going to raise before, not AFTER 72 hours had elapsed! 2. Since we have irrefutable Bible evidence that 3 days & 3 nights may in fact be literally less than 72 hours or 3 days & 2 nights or 3 nights & 2 days (Cornelius: Acts 10:3,9, 23,24,30; Starving servant: 1 Sam. 30:12,13; Queen Esther 4:16; 5:1) we must call into question the literal length of time Jonah was in the sea monster!!! In light of the Bible passages, how can we be sure that Jonah was literally (Roman time thinking) 72 hours in the sea monster??? We come full circle to the well established point that the Jews would have viewed Friday 3 PM to Sunday 6 AM as being 3 days & 3 nights! OOps forgot the source. http://www.bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm#IIB Jon 1:17  Now the LORD3068 had prepared4487 a great1419 fish1709 to swallow up1104 (853) Jonah.3124 And Jonah3124 was1961 in the belly4578 of the fish1709 three7969 days3117 and three7969 nights.3915 Days H3117 יום yôm yome From an unused root meaning to be hot; a day (as the warm hours), whether literally (from sunrise to sunset, or from one sunset to the next), or figuratively (a space of time defined by an associated term), (often used adverbially): – age, + always, + chronicles, continually (-ance), daily, ([birth-], each, to) day, (now a, two) days (agone), + elder, X end, + evening, + (for) ever (-lasting, -more), X full, life, as (so) long as (. . . live), (even) now, + old, + outlived, + perpetually, presently, + remaineth, X required, season, X since, space, then, (process of) time, + as at other times, + in trouble, weather, (as) when, (a, the, within a) while (that), X whole (+ age), (full) year (-ly), + younger. Nights H3915 לילה    ליל    ליל layil  lêyl  layelâh lah'-yil, lale, lah'-yel-aw From the same as H3883; properly a twist (away of the light), that is, night; figuratively adversity: – ([mid-]) night (season). How long was Jona in the fish? The RCC is the whore, the Mother of Harlots. Her master is the father of lies. Think I'll believe Jesus

kenrch

Gal. 4:21-31
Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, and the other by a free woman. But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh, but he of the freewoman was by promise. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the Mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar…. But Jerusalem which is above is free which is the mother of us all…. Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born of the Spirit, even so it is now. Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free

Blessings!  

[kenrch]

Quote (IM4Truth @ Oct. 06 2007,07:12)

Ken I do not understand how you are constantly piking on me and have to bring up the Harlots like I am still in that system. I have come out of Her a long time ago, even before you did, who knows. But tell you the truth I am getting sick and tired of your accusation all the time. Why can you not take the right out of the things were do you get what I wrote to be wrong anyway. 3 days and 3 nights. You are constantly judging by doing so, and I wonder who is wrong.

Ha! Mrs I was agreeing with you! But to tell you the truth it was a mistake. I didn't mean to “QUOTE” you, that happened out of habit of quoting everyone else.

I will have to by knee pads

[kenrch]

Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Oct. 06 2007,18:42)

Quote (kenrch @ Oct. 06 2007,12:18) Quote (WorshippingJesus @ Oct. 06 2007,08:08) Hi All! Here is some more information on the subject. I am merely posting it here for others to comment on and to get both sides so that we can all come to the truth. So far what I have seen is the evidence here is solid. If not then maybe we can get some evidence from the other side. Saturday Resurrection totally unbiblical 1. The fact that Mary did not anoint body on Friday when she had time, and chose to wait for two more days till Sunday morning to anoint the body. 2. Nisan 10 (according to “View #5 Wednesday crucifixion”) would also have been a Sabbath and hundreds or thousands of people would have broken the Sabbath on that day by cutting palm branches. Christ also would have broken the Sabbath by making the donkey carry a burden. 3. Another reason this date is not acceptable is because it would have eliminated Christ rising on the day of First Fruits/Wave Sheaf 4. Since you reject that Mk 16:9 gives the actual time of Jesus resurrection, you must accept that the Bible never actually tells us what day Jesus arose. Where is YOUR Bible verse that says (or even hints at) your belief that Jesus was actually raised on Saturday? In light of such emphasis the Bible places upon the first day of the week are you comfortable knowing that you must admit that GOD NEVER SPECIFICALLY TOLD US the day Jesus was raised. We view this as completely unacceptable to consider and believe this one fact alone proves that Mk 16:9 is giving the actual time Jesus was raised, rather then just stating that he “had been risen before Sunday and thus was in his resurrected stated on Sunday”. 5. Why did the two men on the road to Emmaus feel that Sunday was “the third day” since Jesus was crucified. How do you account for the fact that these two men were EXPECTING JESUS TO RAISE (Sunday-the third day) that very day they walked on the road while talking to Jesus. 6. How do you explain the fact that the universal uninspired history record of Christians before 300 AD teaches that Jesus died on Friday and was raised on Sunday? 7. If Jesus was in the tomb from Wednesday to Saturday, BUT NO ONE SAW HIM TILL SUNDAY MORNING, then no man was really a true to the fact that Jesus was not in the tomb LONGER THAN 72 hours or 3 1/2 days literal days if Jesus died on Wednesday, and was resurrected at 3:00 PM on Saturday, He was in the ground 4 days and 3 nights as the Jews counted time? Literally 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours impossible! 1. Those who insist that we must literally interpret 3 days & 3 nights = 72 Hours “It is the sign of Jonah” they say, haven’t understood that it is impossible to harmonize LITERALLY all the data. 2. If Jesus was resurrected If he rose AFTER the third day, after 72 hours, then all the above verses would read on the FOURTH day. 3. “On the third day” vs. “after three days” are literally quite different: If Jesus raised literally “on the third day”, then the third day was not yet over, it is literally less than 72 hours. If Jesus raised literally “after three days”, then Jesus would have risen sometime literally after 72 hours. But this would be ON THE FOURTH DAY. 1. Notice that the chief priests and Pharisees wanted the tomb guarded only until the third day, because that is when the resurrection was to occur, NOT on the fourth day! And remember, the watch at the tomb began at the end of the seventh day Sabbath, so that it could be guarded for all of the third day, which Sabbatarians say is Saturday. It was at the end of the duration of 3 days, using their own literalness, that guards STOPPED guarding the tomb. This proves that Jesus was going to raise before, not AFTER 72 hours had elapsed! 2. Since we have irrefutable Bible evidence that 3 days & 3 nights may in fact be literally less than 72 hours or 3 days & 2 nights or 3 nights & 2 days (Cornelius: Acts 10:3,9, 23,24,30; Starving servant: 1 Sam. 30:12,13; Queen Esther 4:16; 5:1) we must call into question the literal length of time Jonah was in the sea monster!!! In light of the Bible passages, how can we be sure that Jonah was literally (Roman time thinking) 72 hours in the sea monster??? We come full circle to the well established point that the Jews would have viewed Friday 3 PM to Sunday 6 AM as being 3 days & 3 nights! OOps forgot the source. http://www.bible.ca/d-3-days-and-3-nights.htm#IIB Jon 1:17  Now the LORD3068 had prepared4487 a great1419 fish1709 to swallow up1104 (853) Jonah.3124 And Jonah3124 was1961 in the belly4578 of the fish1709 three7969 days3117 and three7969 nights.3915 Days H3117 יום yôm yome From an unused root meaning to be hot; a day (as the warm hours), whether literally (from sunrise to sunset, or from one sunset to the next), or figuratively (a space of time defined by an associated term), (often used adverbially): – age, + always, + chronicles, continually (-ance), daily, ([birth-], each, to) day, (now a, two) days (agone), + elder, X end, + evening, + (for) ever (-lasting, -more), X full, life, as (so) long as (. . . live), (even) now, + old, + outlived, + perpetually, presently, + remaineth, X required, season, X since, space, then, (process of) time, + as at other times, + in trouble, weather, (as) when, (a, the, within a) while (that), X whole (+ age), (full) year (-ly), + younger. Nights H3915 לילה    ליל    ליל layil  lêyl  layelâh lah'-yil, lale, lah'-yel-aw From the same as H3883; properly a twist (away of the light), that is, night; figuratively adversity: – ([mid-]) night (season). How long was Jona in the fish? The RCC is the whore, the Mother of Harlots. Her master is the father of lies. Think I'll believe Jesus kenrch Gal. 4:21-31 Tell me, ye that desire to be under the law, do ye not hear the law? For it is written, that Abraham had two sons, the one by a bondmaid, and the other by a free woman. But he who was of the bondwoman was born after the flesh, but he of the freewoman was by promise. Which things are an allegory: for these are the two covenants; the one from the Mount Sinai, which gendereth to bondage, which is Agar…. But Jerusalem which is above is free which is the mother of us all…. Now we, brethren, as Isaac was, are the children of promise. But as then he that was born after the flesh persecuted him that was born of the Spirit, even so it is now. Nevertheless what saith the scripture? Cast out the bondwoman and her son: for the son of the bondwoman shall not be heir with the son of the freewoman. So then, brethren, we are not children of the bondwoman, but of the free Blessings!

Gal 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,

WJ Again! Which of the Ten Commandments point to the coming Messiah?

This was a collection of food for the saints at Jersulem.

Notice verse two NOT WHEN you gather as if it were a weekly thing. But upon the first day of the week gather….

“..that there be no gatherings when I come.”

Paul was tell them to gather food on the first day of the week for the saints at Jersulem. Then He says so NO GATHERINGS would be when he got there.

1Co 16:1 Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I have given order to the churches of Galatia, even so do ye.
1Co 16:2 Upon the first day of the week let every one of you lay by him in store, as God hath prospered him, that there be no gatherings when I come.

Act 20:7 And upon the first day of the week, when the disciples came together to break bread, Paul preached unto them, ready to depart on the morrow; and continued his speech until midnight.

The apostles “came together to break bread “EVERYDAY”. The lived together at that time, didn't they?

Act 2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart,

Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.

AGAIN WJ! Which of the Ten Commandments pointed to Christ? Are you ever going to answer that quesion?

Do you have anymore twisted scripture? Anymore scripture pulled out of context?

This isn't the Trinity thread where scriptures aren't exactly clear. The Sabbath is plainly kept all through scripture.

If you don't believe me then ask your MOTHER the RCC who changed the day to the first.

You keep the RCC doctrines? Then you are CATHOLIC and so are her daughters. This is the truth is it NOT?

But hang around as you are just proving the Sabbath by having to twist and pull scripture out of context to TRY and prove your Mother's doctrines. When even your Mother the RCC says “there is no scripture changing the Sabbath day”.

When God is ready the Spirit will open your eyes. Thing is you are so deeply rooted in HER that I pray you SEE. But as I said that won't happen until God has finished using you to prove the Sabbath.

God bless you WJ as you do HIS work.

Ken

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