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Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,07:43) Wakeup, You have nothing from the words of Jesus nor the words of the Apostles.
Nothing.
Don't you think that they would have reconfirmed what you are saying if it was truth?
2Besee.For your information.
The apostles are to preach the gospel.
Prophets are to prophecy.
The old testament is also the word of God.The books you are reading are strange flesh.
wakeup.
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,07:43) Wakeup, You have nothing from the words of Jesus nor the words of the Apostles.
Nothing.
Don't you think that they would have reconfirmed what you are saying if it was truth?
2Besee.The gospels are to reveal the kingdom of God.
The prophesies are to reveal the future,things coming to this world.Some are fulfilled,and most still to come.wakeup.
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,08:10) And regarding the book of Revelations. You are trying to fit all of your beliefs into one chapter of the new testament.
I will re-post what I quoted earlier, from the Amillenial Audio..“Your position says that only in the 20th chapter of the book of Revelation does it allow for the time period for the unfulfilled prophecies of a golden age as foretold by the old testament prophets to be fulfilled.
In other words, your position says that we only have a Revelation 20 to get all these prophecies fulfilled in, and we object to you and your position because your position doesn't allow for all these prophecies to be fulfilled. And thus the only place left to fit all these in is in Revelation 20.
But there are glaring omissions occurring in the 20th chapter of the book of Revelation which many people assume will BE there.
For example,
Omission number one, that is not found.
Jerusalem and Palestine are not mentioned in the chapter.
And yet multitudes of people just assume that Jerusalem and Palestine are found in the 20th chapter of Revelation.
No mention.
Omission number two, the Jews are not mentioned.
Neither is anything said about their restoration to the land.
Their conversion, or any of their activities – none of that is found in the 20th chapter.Omission number three.
An earthly throne is not found in this chapter.
Where is it?
It's not there.There are thrones in heaven that are mentioned on which martyrs are reigning with Christ, and the location of the great white throne is not given or identified.
Thrones in heaven, a great white throne of judgment, but no earthly throne is mentioned in the 20th chapter of Revelation.Wouldn't you think it should be there?
But it isn't.
The 4th glaring omission that you assume is there or would have us believe is there:
There's not a word about universal peace occurring in this chapter.
The 5th omission:
There is no mention to abundant prosperity occurring in this chapter.
The 6th glaring omission:
The productivity of the earth is not mentioned in this 20th chapter.
And the 7th omission: There is nothing about longevity of life in this chapter.
Now these are all statements that are found in the old testament prophecies.
So you say “This has all got to occur in the 20th chapter — this is not occurring now, it is not occurring in the eternal state of affairs, it's got to occur in Revelation 20.
But when we come to Revelation 20, all of these things are omitted.
I ask then if these omissions are not significant? Especially as we cannot find them taught by other new testament writers?
Where would we find any of these descriptions, we got to go back to the old testament. But no new testament writer gives us these reaffirmations.
Don't you think that's significant?”
2Besee.Rev.20 only prophecy the last bit of what will happen.
There are many more prophesies in the book of revelation and the old testament,that we ought to put together to see the big picture.
And you obviously have not been there.You are at the moment feeding on strange flesh.
This will only confuse you more and more.
Those books dont have the true answer.
You will be led into the wilderness.wakeup.
Wakeup,
The words of Jesus do not count, to you?
The words of the Apostles do not count?One verse to confirm what you teach, from the new testament, you cannot find one single verse, can you.
Quote There are many more prophesies in the book of revelation and the old testament,that we ought to put together to see the big picture. Hi Wakeup,
I do. As God shows me, I see it.Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 12 2013,10:42) For your information.
The apostles are to preach the gospel.
Prophets are to prophecy.Hi Wakeup,
Jesus spoke of His return and so did the Disciples and Paul, so what are you saying, wakeup?
That is silly.
lol.I would like to quote a person,
Quote “Amil seems to be as far up the ladder as one can get when it comes to understanding of endtimes things. It's obviously a step up from pre-mil, since, usually former pre-mils become amils, and not the other way around. I'm not stating that amil is correct or incorrect, it just seems that once one becomes amil there is nothing better to become, as if amil trumps all. And I honestly do not mean any of this sarcastically. It's just the way I perceive things overall “ Wakeup,
I have only one more thing to say, for now.I could quote you plenty of scriptures from the new testament that speak of the return of Jesus and the kingdom to come. And you know that.
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,09:00) Wakeup, The words of Jesus do not count, to you?
The words of the Apostles do not count?One verse to confirm what you teach, from the new testament, you cannot find one single verse, can you.
Edj.Jesus did prophecy a bit here and there,(matt.24).
and so the apostles.But to know prophecy we must go to revelation and the old prophets.
Thats what they are there for.What about Ez.37 and 38. is that not prophecy?
Can you find that in the gospels? NO.
And many ,many more that you and all, have not gone through. Some have, but not able to bring the picture together.The best thing is to ask questions,and not go against.
But compare answer and scripture.
You are reading my answers with a defensive mind.
Not to learn.Only reject when scriptural proven wrong.
And no one can.wakeup.
Wakeup,
You still cannot find anything in the NT can you, which agrees with your teachings.
One day when I have some time, I will do a big post with all of it.
Deal?
BTW, Wakeup,
Regarding the other thread, I think I will leave it, I see now that it is not really fair to have a conversation with just one person and exclude all others.
Okay?
I will talk to you in the normal forum, like here
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,09:50) Wakeup, You still cannot find anything in the NT can you, which agrees with your teachings.
One day when I have some time, I will do a big post with all of it.
Deal?
BTW, Wakeup,
Regarding the other thread, I think I will leave it, I see now that it is not really fair to have a conversation with just one person and exclude all others.
Okay?
I will talk to you in the normal forum, like here
2Besee.What do you call the book of revelation?
Is that not in the new testament?Revelation means revealing;not keep secret.
Dont post heaps of scriptures,just to fill up the screen.
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 12 2013,12:52) Dont post heaps of scriptures,just to fill up the screen.
Why? Because they are from the new testament instead of the old testament? Is it not you and your three who post 'heaps' of scriptures that fill up the screen from the old testament over and over?Have you found that ONE verse from the new testament yet which agrees with your view?
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,14:54) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 12 2013,12:52) Dont post heaps of scriptures,just to fill up the screen.
Why? Because they are from the new testament instead of the old testament? Is it not you and your three who post 'heaps' of scriptures that fill up the screen from the old testament over and over?Have you found that ONE verse from the new testament yet which agrees with your view?
2Besee.With what few?
wakeup.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 12 2013,11:34) Jesus did prophecy a bit here and there,(matt.24).
and so the apostles.But to know prophecy we must go to revelation and the old prophets.
Thats what they are there for.What about Ez.37 and 38. is that not prophecy?
Can you find that in the gospels? NO.
And many ,many more that you and all, have not gone through. Some have, but not able to bring the picture together.The best thing is to ask questions,and not go against.
But compare answer and scripture.
You are reading my answers with a defensive mind.
Not to learn.Only reject when scriptural proven wrong.
And no one can.wakeup.
Wakeup,Most of the old testament prophecies pointed to JESUS and then Jesus came, and now we have the words and prophecies of Jesus and of the Apostles to teach us regarding end times. Why do you want to go back?
Sure, there are prophecies in the old testament which can apply to us today, regarding end times, but you have to know which ones that they are, and they have to agree with the new testament, otherwise they may already have been fulfilled, such as the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD.
———
Tell me again Wakeup…
How will you know that it is Jesus sitting on a throne in Jerusalem?
What are the key signs to make you “go out” and believe it is Jesus returned?
What would it look like to you?Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,14:54) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 12 2013,12:52) Dont post heaps of scriptures,just to fill up the screen.
Why? Because they are from the new testament instead of the old testament? Is it not you and your three who post 'heaps' of scriptures that fill up the screen from the old testament over and over?Have you found that ONE verse from the new testament yet which agrees with your view?
2Besee.Only if you are revealing something,or teaching us something,of course in that case it is necessary,
to post many srciptures.wakeup.
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,18:43) Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 12 2013,11:34) Jesus did prophecy a bit here and there,(matt.24).
and so the apostles.But to know prophecy we must go to revelation and the old prophets.
Thats what they are there for.What about Ez.37 and 38. is that not prophecy?
Can you find that in the gospels? NO.
And many ,many more that you and all, have not gone through. Some have, but not able to bring the picture together.The best thing is to ask questions,and not go against.
But compare answer and scripture.
You are reading my answers with a defensive mind.
Not to learn.Only reject when scriptural proven wrong.
And no one can.wakeup.
Wakeup,Most of the old testament prophecies pointed to JESUS and then Jesus came, and now we have the words and prophecies of Jesus and of the Apostles to teach us regarding end times. Why do you want to go back?
Sure, there are prophecies in the old testament which can apply to us today, regarding end times, but you have to know which ones that they are, and they have to agree with the new testament, otherwise they may already have been fulfilled, such as the destruction of Jerusalem in 70AD.
———
Tell me again Wakeup…
How will you know that it is Jesus sitting on a throne in Jerusalem?
What are the key signs to make you “go out” and believe it is Jesus returned?
What would it look like to you?
2Besee.This is exactly what I am saying; you need to know the prophesies. Daniel and Revelation tells you what the false prophet is going to do when he comes.
And he will be here soon.
jerusalem was desstroyed by the romans.70 ad.
Jerusalem again will be trodden down by the Romans.
END TIME ROMANS. ok. which are ruling us today.
where are you ? usa/canada?wakeup.
Quote (2besee @ Feb. 12 2013,07:28) Quote (Devolution @ Feb. 12 2013,00:12) 2besee, Zechariah 14:5 >And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the LORD my God shall come, and all the saints with thee.
Tell me, what Day is appointed for The Lord to come, of which Day only the Lord knows, that very same Day where He comes accompanied by all His saints?
a) Christmas Day
b) Valentines Day
c) The Day of The LordDevo,
Nothing from the new testament?
Nothing – not a thing?
Wow.If what you teach is truth then why did the Disciples and Jesus not mention it? Did they forget?
ONE VERSE DEVO, from any of the NT excluding Revelations.
One verse to confirm ANYTHING that you teach.
2besee,Are you going to answer the question or not?
Devo,
I am looking at it now (the whole chapter of Zechariah 14).
You know Zechariah 14 is a difficult chapter. Even Luther states, quote: “In this chapter, I surrender, for I am not certain of what the prophet treats.” – and I agree!So far from what I have read, this seems okay:
http://www.studylight.org/com/bcc/view.cgi?book=zec&chapter=014
But I have only skim read it.
Quote (Wakeup @ Feb. 12 2013,22:03) 2Besee. This is exactly what I am saying; you need to know the prophesies. Daniel and Revelation tells you what the false prophet is going to do when he comes.
And he will be here soon.
jerusalem was desstroyed by the romans.70 ad.
Jerusalem again will be trodden down by the Romans.
END TIME ROMANS. ok. which are ruling us today.
where are you ? usa/canada?wakeup.
Wakeup,Knowing Revelations and Daniel is something that i was wanting to learn more of. But then, with what I disagree with, you tried to be a teacher with Journey and Devo on Revelations and Daniel and I no longer trusted your interpretations.
If you want to 'discuss' with an open mind, then let us discuss.
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