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Nick
Dan 7:3 And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another.
Dan 7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.Beasts are kingdoms; kingdoms are ruled or governed by kings, therefore they are governments.
That's why.Rev 13:1 And I stood upon the sand of the sea, and saw a beast rise up out of the sea, having seven heads and ten horns, and upon his horns ten crowns, and upon his heads the name of blasphemy.
Rev 13:2 And the beast which I saw was like unto a leopard, and his feet were as the feet of a bear, and his mouth as the mouth of a lion: and the dragon gave him his power, and his seat, and great authority.This beast, being made up of the three previous beasts (Dan. 7:4-6), is the fourth beast, the Roman beast, or government. Being made up of the three previous kingdoms is to show that the Romans were as bad as the three put together (Dan. 7:7).
Rev 13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
And he, “he” is the pope, the head if the image. The pope structured his church after the Roman government with the pope replacing the emperor. Anyone opposing him would be killed.
That's why.Rev 13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
Notice it says “a mark”; that shows, there is more than one mark by which those that have received “a mark” can be identified. It is not the number 666 that is a mark, that number only identifies the Antichrist. Her marks are her doctrines, false doctrines. “Right hand” means you have received them, “forehead” means you believe them.
That's why.Georg
Hi Georg,
You may be right but you need to show your foundational proofs.
Otherwise they remain as opinions.They are kingdoms?
Scripture says they are kings.Dan 7:3 And four great beasts came up from the sea, diverse one from another.
Dan 7:17 These great beasts, which are four, are four kings, which shall arise out of the earth.To show they were as BAD? Where does this analogy spring from in scripture?
Does scripture mention the pope?
Where is proof that the mark is doctrines?
Nick, your not looking for prove, your looking for arguments.
The fact is you know nothing, and pretend to know everything.
You are so annoying; you know that?
I guess that's your best quality.Georg
Hi Georg,
I am looking for soundly constructed teachings.
Let scripture teach.
Line upon line.We should not bolster it with opinions.
Is that so georg?,
You have called me a wolf in sheeps clothing before.
So convince me that you are a source of God's truth.
Show your deductions are based on scriptural principles.I have, but your lack of understanding wont let you recognize them. You would even argue with Jesus Christ, were he to come on this forum.
Georg
Hi Georg,
Is it necessary to accept your tecahings as infallible
to avoid these unfortunate personal attacks?Sad really as you seem capable of some useful work among us.
Nick
You say let scripture speak; but you reject scripture that I give you without explaining why.
You don't have to believe my explanations; but you should tell me why, and offer your take on the subject, aaaand, give me reasons for the scriptures you put up, it's not always the number of scriptures that are convincing.
You call my expression of annoyance, and frustration, personal attacks; they would not have to happen if you were to engage in a civilized debate.
I welcome a challenge, show me the holes you mentioned, lets look at them one by one. Why not start right here with this thread? Give me scripture, and reason, if you disagree.Georg
Quote (Cindy @ Feb. 15 2009,07:25) Nick You say let scripture speak; but you reject scripture that I give you without explaining why.
You don't have to believe my explanations; but you should tell me why, and offer your take on the subject, aaaand, give me reasons for the scriptures you put up, it's not always the number of scriptures that are convincing.
You call my expression of annoyance, and frustration, personal attacks; they would not have to happen if you were to engage in a civilized debate.
I welcome a challenge, show me the holes you mentioned, lets look at them one by one. Why not start right here with this thread? Give me scripture, and reason, if you disagree.Georg
Georg,May I offer a suggestion. My experience is that your request will not be honored. For myself, I decided I am no bigger than the thing I let annoy me. I choose to be bigger.
For what it is worth!
Blessings,
Seeking
Seeking
Thank you for what is good advise, but,,,,,,,,,,,two things, one ,I'm german, and two, I'm alway ready to give Nick another chance, up to a point.
I am aware of your battle with Nick.Georg
Hi Georg,
Are these opinions and suppositions what yopu mean when you say this?
“You say let scripture speak; but you reject scripture that I give you without explaining why.”
You said
“This huge army that John describes would have to be the Huns, who in the 5th century almost overran all of Europe.”
” This grievous sore fell on all of what used to be the Western Roman Empire and was now ruled over by the pope, the image; all had the mark of the beast, the cross; and all worshiped the image, the pope. This terrible plague happened in the middle of the 14th century and killed well over 25 million people; they called it the Black Death plague”
“This great star that fell from heaven was the pope.”
“Water is symbolic for the truth of God; Jesus said,
John 7:37 “… if any man thirst let him come unto me, and drink “.
v. 38 “ He that believeth on me, as the scripture has said, out of his belly shall flow rivers of living waters”. READ ON. IT IS THE SPIRIT“Rev. 16:3 “ And the second angel poured out his vial upon the sea (all the nations), and it became as the blood of a dead man; and every living soul died in the sea”.
Millions of men died from all nations, became as the blood of a dead man; and even those soldiers that survived the war were more dead then alive. Every soldier will tell you, after fighting and surviving many battles, after seeing the horrors of war, you are not the same as you were before; war changes every soldier, the old you will have died in you. The same is true for the civilians in whose country the war was fought. ““The sun, the moon, and stars are objects that give us light, but how could a third of all of them have turned dark? They didn’t; it is not their light the Bible speaks off. Our kings and rulers, our leaders, they are our light; “
” This beast, kingdom, is the seventh king of Rev. 17:10, that came into existence during the First World War; his name was “ the League of Nations “.”
” Again, this great mountain is no meteorite. Mountain is a metaphor for kingdom or nation. Germany is a great mountain, a great nation; it was symbolically cast into the sea of nations, and they all caught on fire and became as blood. In other words, this is speaking of the Second World War. “
” This great earthquake has nothing to do with the shaking of the ground; it is the shaking of governments, man’s societies, man’s ways of life. No greater war was ever fought then the Second World War. It was the greatest shaking the earth people had ever experienced. “
“Islands are provinces; mountains are kingdoms; fled away or were not found is to say, they were now ruled over, at least for a long while, by their liberators. “
“During the Second World War, enough bombs were dropped, all over the world, that for the Apostle John it could have been easily taken for hail. For John a 100-pound stone or a 100-pound bomb would have looked the same. Even if he saw the bombs exploding on impact, how would you expect John to describe that, not even knowing what an explosion was, except to say “the plague was exceeding great.”
“What John was shown was the A-bomb fallen from the sky; to him it was a star. When it exploded, in John’s mind that opened the bottomless pit because where else could the smoke come from; this huge mushroom cloud had to come from a great furnace, which darkened the sun, and the air,”
“In the next four verses, John attempts to describe another kind of locust, the B-29 Bomber.”
“This trumpet sound announced the return of Jesus Christ to this earth, but unnoticed by any human.”
“The hair as of a woman would be the vapor trail of the highflying bombers, coming from the four propellers engines, lion teeth. “
Hi Georg,
It takes a brave man to pin his colours to the wall as you have done and I admire your effort.
Some of what you say may be true but it is all unproveable at this time.
Many will disagree with your opinions but that is another matter.Hi Georg,
I agree with you that some of the prophecies of Revelation may have already been fulfilled and few have noticed and thus the end will come as a thief. I agree that many of the prophecies do overlap or look at things from another perspective.The hows and whens are another matter.
But the seventh trumpet has yet to sound.
Rev11
Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, ” The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever.”Nick
Remember what I said? show me the holes one at a time and we will work our way through it, let me see how brave you are.
Georg
Hi Georg,
You cannot declare that you are correct in matters of prophecy as time will tell.
Opinions are just that, opinions, at this stage.Nick
That is a cob out and you know it. You have the guts to say I'm wrong, but you don't have the nerve to show me where.
Georg
Hi Georg,
Nobody can prove it right or wrong but some of the ideas seem farfetched to be about B29s, bombs being hail and women's hair. Death loses it's meaning and becomes some sort of burnout.You make strong statements about what you see as allegories without showing any scriptural principles as supporting evidence for making them.
Do you think Jesus has already returned?
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