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Nick
If, by saints you mean those who come up in the first resurrection as spirit beings, no, I don't believe I will be among them.
Georg
Hi Georg,
There are no plaster super saints in heaven but one body still on earth awaiting the return of the head, Lord Jesus.Nick
There are no saints in heaven period, and Christ is the head of the body, “his church”, that is true; but, do you really think every church on earth is the body of Christ? His church was not divided, and they believed the word of God, they did not make up their own doctrines.
Georg
Quote (samual @ Mar. 17 2009,20:39) Theodorej… Greetings! Traveling through this subject matter on Natural and Spiritual Israel according to the Scriptural evidence presented it becomes apparent that misconceptions are easily formed due to the Promises of God to Abraham, Isaac and Jacob (a covenant) and the New Covenant between Jesus Christ and the Faithful Followers. It seems difficult for the reader to understand how both old and new covenants can be fulfilled when they appear to run contrary.
You mention (rightly) that Israel “is scattered throughout the four corners of the earth.” This statement is true for both Natural and Spiritual Israel, for neither one can ascertain with certainty their ancestral past. Not only that, but false prophets and teachers on both sides have turned truth inside out to confuse those seeking the purity of God’s Word and intent. But even so, there is purpose behind it. See what the Apostle Paul stated:
2 Corinthians 4:3-4 (New American Standard Bible)
“And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled to those who are perishing, in whose case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelieving so that they might not see the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the image of God.”As we can see from the religious views of both Natural Jews and many professed Spiritual Jews, neither believe Jesus to be the Son of God; that truth is hidden from them. The largest part of Christendom have Jesus as part of a Triune God, where all parts are equal. This doctrine, of course, is false as Jesus made clear in so many ways; but the lie separates “those who are perishing” from those who worship God in Spirit and Truth.
When considering the Promises of God to the Natural Jews, God has kept His word. See what the Apostle Paul says:
Romans 9:22-28 (New American Standard Bible)
“What if God, although willing to demonstrate His wrath and to make His power known, endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction? And He did so to make known the riches of His glory upon vessels of mercy, which He prepared beforehand for glory, even us, whom He also called, not from among Jews only, but also from among Gentiles. As He says also in Hosea, ‘I WILL CALL THOSE WHO WERE NOT MY PEOPLE, 'MY PEOPLE,' AND HER WHO WAS NOT BELOVED, 'BELOVED.'” “AND IT SHALL BE THAT IN THE PLACE WHERE IT WAS SAID TO THEM, 'YOU ARE NOT MY PEOPLE,' THERE THEY SHALL BE CALLED SONS OF THE LIVING GOD.” Isaiah cries out concerning Israel, “THOUGH THE NUMBER OF THE SONS OF ISRAEL BE LIKE THE SAND OF THE SEA, IT IS THE REMNANT THAT WILL BE SAVED; FOR THE LORD WILL EXECUTE HIS WORD ON THE EARTH, THOROUGHLY AND QUICKLY.”As can be seen, it isn’t the entire Jewish Nation that would listen to or accept Jesus as the Son of God, but a “remnant that will be saved.” And, as you are aware, the Twelve Apostles were Natural Israelites, all in line with God’s Promises.
But what about Jerusalem? When Jesus actually arrives with His heavenly Armies to cleanse this earth of Satanic rulership and unleash the Day of the fierce wrath of God the Almighty against the wicked and ungodly, will “God’s Kingdom on earth” (the seat of government and worship) be centered in Jerusalem as it was before?
We have evidence to the contrary. See what Jesus stated:
John 4:21-22 (New American Standard Bible)
“Jesus said to her, “Woman, believe Me, an hour is coming when neither in this mountain nor in Jerusalem will you worship the Father. You worship what you do not know; we worship what we know, for salvation is from the Jews…. God is spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”Much of what we have been lead to believe is not in harmony with Scripture. Only by digging deeper in the Word of God and by resting our hope on His opening out eyes to Truth will we ever come out of the darkness and into His everlasting light.
God bless!
Greetings Samual…..Point well taken….Jesus was asked by his apostles “Who is a Jew?” he answered “Any Body who keeps my commandments”this answer constitutes a definition of a spiritual Jew….One who worships in spirit while being obedient to the law..Jerusalem today is a secular city with a smorgesbord Jews ,Muslims and christians of various belief systems….none of which keep his commandments…The truth found in the scripture is hidden from the wise and the learned,however ,is very much available to those of a contrite spirit with the demenor of a child…Quote (Cindy @ Mar. 19 2009,20:19) Nick There are no saints in heaven period, and Christ is the head of the body, “his church”, that is true; but, do you really think every church on earth is the body of Christ? His church was not divided, and they believed the word of God, they did not make up their own doctrines.
Georg
Hi georg,
Of course the whore is not of Christ.
The whore is the one who is divided and continues to divide.
God's children on earth are not divided from their brothers in Christ and never will be.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 20 2009,06:08) Quote (Cindy @ Mar. 19 2009,20:19) Nick There are no saints in heaven period, and Christ is the head of the body, “his church”, that is true; but, do you really think every church on earth is the body of Christ? His church was not divided, and they believed the word of God, they did not make up their own doctrines.
Georg
Hi georg,
Of course the whore is not of Christ.
The whore is the one who is divided and continues to divide.
God's children on earth are not divided from their brothers in Christ and never will be.
Nick I would like to know how you recognize your Brothers and Sisters in Christ?Notice this is Irene
Peace and Love IreneQuote (Cindy @ Mar. 19 2009,19:53) Nick If, by saints you mean those who come up in the first resurrection as spirit beings, no, I don't believe I will be among them.
Georg
Hi Georg,
If you are hopeful of salvation through the sheep and goat judgement after the second resurrection then study up on Matt25 as it will be according to mercy shown towards the Sons of God. Nothing else will be taken into account.Hi Georg,
Of course if you think the sons of God are with Jesus then there is nothing further possible to do.
It is not so though as you are yet another falsely saying the resurrection has already happened.Nick
It is quite obvious that you don't understand the purpose for the millennium. If, as you say, all the dead were to be resurrected after the millennium; how could any of them be saved, especially those that never knew or heard of Jesus?
Look at Mat. 25, what it says.Mat 25:31 When the Son of man shall come in his glory, and all the holy angels with him, then shall he sit upon the throne of his glory:
This is the beginning of the millennium
Mat 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
He will gather before him all nations, that is people, not animals. Jesus is the good shepherd, and as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, why? sheep follow the shepherd, goats like to wonder off on their own. Jesus is speaking allegorically here, and it also does not mean that some nations are like sheep, and other nations are like goats, it means, there will be goats in all nations, those that will not follow the shepherd. They are the once that care only for them self. That is what the millennium will be for.
Georg
Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 20 2009,10:20) Hi Georg,
If you are hopeful of salvation through the sheep and goat judgement after the second resurrection then study up on Matt25 as it will be according to mercy shown towards the Sons of God. Nothing else will be taken into account.
Nick,let me ad something to the sheep and goats because I have studied up on them.
Mat 25:32 And before him shall be gathered all nations: and he shall separate them one from another, as a shepherd divideth his sheep from the goats:
Why would Jesus gather all nations before him , and then separate them again one from another? nations are already separated by their borders.
As I already said, this is the beginning of the millennium during which all that are in their graves shall come forth, but as Paul says, all in their order, meaning, not all at once.
Now the question is, where are the graves of those that are being resurrected? From the earliest times, kings have conquered other kings/nations, and have become empires. That means soldiers have died in far away lands where they were buried. Conquered nations were taken prisoners, and sold as slaves far from their home were they died and were buried.
Now, as they are being resurrected they find them self in that land were they were slaves; not a happy awakening. So the first thing Jesus will do is, place every one in his own country, with his family and friends because that will make the joy of being resurrected complete; only then will people feel safe and secure, and gradually more and more family members and friends will be resurrected; all through the entire millennium.
Unfortunately, there will be those that will not listen to the teaching of Jesus, the goats, they will be separated from the sheep as they would hinder the “sheep” from following the shepherd.
Think about it.Georg
Hi Georg,
Why?
To define the muster as all men who have lived from whatever origin.
Then their origins become ireelevant as only actions towards the brothers of Jesus are their hope of mercy.
They have refused or ignored the gospel and have not become sons and according to Jn3 should have no expectation of salvation.Quote (Nick Hassan @ Mar. 21 2009,07:00) Hi Georg,
Why?
To define the muster as all men who have lived from whatever origin.
Then their origins become ireelevant as only actions towards the brothers of Jesus are their hope of mercy.
They have refused or ignored the gospel and have not become sons and according to Jn3 should have no expectation of salvation.
Nick, what are you talking about?
You speak of love and mercy, and yet you show none of it to any of your brothers that had the misfortune of never having heard the name Jesus, thank God, Jesus does not share your “to bad” attitude.Georg
Hi Georg,
Because you have accepted false ideas that Jesus has come you rob others of hope who are ignorant of your error.Nick
Who is the messenger I'm abusing?
And who are the others you call ignorant?
As far as my false ideas, and errors; you have yet to prove me wrong one time.
Time and again have I ask you to show me where I'm wrong; you have never taken up the challenge.
Do you have something against learning from others?Georg
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