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Hi ,
Rudy has reminded us of another false trail many of us have walked along. It is so easy to forget the warning from John about idols and to serve mammon and not our real master.Yes we are told to pray for our needs, that we do not have because we do not ask. We are told to be anxious about nothing but to pray about everything. But we are also told to seek first the kingdom and everything else will be added to us.
What he has taught me finally in 25 yrs of walking with him, like Paul, is to learn to be satisfied with a sufficiency. The poor He has chosen to be rich in faith. The meek inherit the earth. If you have more than you need then some of it probably belongs to someone else.
But what he has armfuls to give away are truly precious treasures-love, joy, peace, family, hope, confidence, security, harmony, freedom, joy , comfort, strength, health, beauty, knowledge, understanding, wisdom, purpose, vision, joy, fellowship. Did I mention joy?
Some comes through the rod of suffering and pain but it is worth it whatever it takes. Hope this helps someone.
The prosperity gospel is there, but it has been engaged in an americanized version. Those who lead this group, would be the first to tell you, that it costs you everything.
The rich man Jesus encountered, turn away sorrowful. As you mete, it shall be meted back to you. The rich man, because he had much riches, esteemed to himself that to give it all up, was not worth following Christ Jesus.
Jesus then says something quite interesting. By essentially saying, if you count anything as being more worthy of me, you are not worthy of me. Cannot be my disciplined follower.
And adds that there is no one who has given up family, towns, lands, wealth etc. ..who shall receive in this life a hundred-fold blessing.
The meaning I gather, is that the rich man under-estimated the inherited blessing of Christ. If the rich man had given up his riches, he would have been in for one heavenly blessing! A hundred fold of what he had! But as he value-judged it, so it was value-judged back to him.
One of the things that spells out the value of faith for me, is where scripture says, faith as a grain of mustard seed, is least of all the seeds that be in the field.
So my personal configuration, self-applies it in this manner.
In my heart, faith is the least of all the other seeds that be in my heart. Fear is a bigger seed than faith. With it, a whole source of bigger and more pressing impressions, loom large over the element of faith.
Faith is, in a spiritual sense, is a kind of cruxificion to the soul-physical. Through the soul-physical, comes all manner of worldly lusts. All that is in the world, the lusts of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life; is not of the Father, but is of the world. And the world passes away, and the lust thereof, but he that does the will of God, abides forever.
So what do I know about faith really? Not that much. The application of its law, is beyond loving my own children. Beyond every selfish motive. Simply an instrument of obedience. A cross-carrier, in denying my own self.
Can we really put to death all that the soul-physical implies, and ever set our constitution in terms of the soul-spiritual only?
Much easier types of attitude-engagements, robs us from a faith that grows no matter what.
The blessing of Abraham has come upon us who believe. How much larger are the seeds of doubt? Abraham proclaims in light of his blessing, 'so that no man can say he has made me rich, but God'…others mounted high in the blessing of God.
It is there, but which god/God do we serve? The lusts of the soul-physical? Or the trust to our will, Christ in our soul-spiritual?
See Deut. chapter 28.
Hi jm,
Faith is vital
Heb 11
“6But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him. “The enemy of faith is doubt.
Jas 1
” 5If any of you lack wisdom, let him ask of God, that giveth to all men liberally, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him.6But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea driven with the wind and tossed.
7For let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.
8A double minded man is unstable in all his ways.”
I see doubt as like a disease of the plant that stops the sap of grace flowing through our branches and makes the Gardener inclined to severely prune us, or cut us down. It is our greatest enemy in that because of it fear and anxiety and depression and other problems can breed.
There are a several sciptures that come to mind which allows us to discern this subject. The first is John 10:10. This is the chapter where Yeshua is speaking about His sheep and He as the good shepherd. In this verse he says I came that they might have life and have it abundantly. The life he refers to here is zoe which is both physical and spiritual but has nothing to do with material. The physical was breathed into us at creation, the spiritual was breathed into man in John 20:22 where Yeshua, after ressurection breathed into His disciples the breath of life via the Holy Spirit. 1 Cor 15:45 tells us the first adam became a living soul, the second a life giving spirit. This can go back to John 3 where Yeshua said in order to enter the Kingdom of YWHW we must be born of water and the Spirit(verse 5). Consider the water here to be the way in which we come into this world in the flesh and being born of the Spirit when Yeshua breathes the Holy Spirit into our spirit. Verse 6 tells us that which is born of the flesh is flesh and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
Another is 1 Timothy 6: 3-11. I speaks of those who teach godliness as a means to finanical gain, from them turn away. Paul tells us godliness with contentment is great gain. It goes on to say those who intend to be rich fall into temptation and a snare and many foolish and harmful desires which plunge men into destruction and ruin and the goes on to talk about the love of money. The word here is those who intend or want to get rich which implies premedetation on getting there.
I have heard it so often, you can't out give God, God is no man's debtor, give and it shall be given pressed down, shaken together.
But we are also called to be wise stewards. As far as giving is concerned, I give what the Lord tells me to give and more if I feel like it.
As far as prosperity is concerned, I am not a wealthy man finacially, but I feel hugely wealthy spiritually. This is the prosperity that counts of course.
Nick:
I agree with your initial post on this thread, but one thing that you did not mention, and that is that our sins are forgiven.
God Bless
Hi everyone:
“But thou shalt remember the Lord thy God: for it is he that giveth thee power to get wealth, THAT HE MAY ESTABLISH HIS COVENANT which he sware unto thy fathers, as it is this day”. (Deut. 8:18)
“But this I say, he which soweth sparingly shall reap also sparingly; and he which soweth bountifully shall reap also bountifully. Every man according as he purposeth in his heart, so let him give, not grudgingly, or of necessity: for God loveth a cheerful giver. And God is able to make all grace abound toward you; that ye, always having all sufficiency in all things may abound to every good work. (As it is written, he hath dispersed abroad; he hath given to the poor: his righteousness remaineth for ever. Now he that ministereth seed to the sower both minister bread for you your food, and multiply your seed sown, and increase the fruits of your righteousness;) For the administration of this service not only supplieth the want of the saints, but is abundant also by many thanksgivings unto God”. (2 Co. 9:6-12)
God is able to give us financial wealth but is so that His kingdom may be established. If we have and abundance of monies after we have taken care of our needs and those of our family, should we not use it to share the gospel with the world, and to help those who members of our Christian family who may be needy at the time that we may have an abundance, and the Lord also tells us that we should feed our enemies if they hunger.
“He that is faithful in that which is least is faithful also in much: and he that is unjust in the least is unjust also in much. If therefore ye have not been faithful in the unrighteous mammon, who will commit to your trust true riches?” “For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also”. (Matt. 6:21)
“A good man leaveth an inheritance to his children's children: and the wealth of the sinner is laid up for the just”. (Proverbs 13:22)
In conclusion, true prospserity is the satisfaction that we have used whatever our God has entrusted to us in accomplishing his purpose which is the salvation of His children from the consequence of sin.
Amen.
Proverbs 19:8
He who gets wisdom loves his own soul; he who cherishes understanding prospers.3 John 1:2
Beloved, I wish above all things that thou mayest prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth.It is clear that this doesn't mean we can lay hands on one another to receive the latest Ferrari.
Listen to this comp on “the love of money”
Hi,
Prov 30
” 7Two things have I required of thee; deny me them not before I die:8Remove far from me vanity and lies: give me neither poverty nor riches; feed me with food convenient for me:
9Lest I be full, and deny thee, and say, Who is the LORD? or lest I be poor, and steal, and take the name of my God in vain. “
Hi,
Jas1
9Let the brother of low degree rejoice in that he is exalted:10But the rich, in that he is made low: because as the flower of the grass he shall pass away.
Jas 5
1Go to now, ye rich men, weep and howl for your miseries that shall come upon you.
2Your riches are corrupted, and your garments are motheaten.
3Your gold and silver is cankered; and the rust of them shall be a witness against you, and shall eat your flesh as it were fire. Ye have heaped treasure together for the last days.
4Behold, the hire of the labourers who have reaped down your fields, which is of you kept back by fraud, crieth: and the cries of them which have reaped are entered into the ears of the Lord of sabaoth.
5Ye have lived in pleasure on the earth, and been wanton; ye have nourished your hearts, as in a day of slaughter.
6Ye have condemned and killed the just; and he doth not resist you.
7Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receive the early and latter rain.
Hi,
Satan offered Jesus earthly treasure, power and glory.
He still offers these to avaricious men.God offers sufficiency, but pressed down and overflowing.
He favours the poor and the downtrodden.Hi,
Lk 4
5 And he led Him up and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world in a moment of time. 6 And the devil said to Him, “I will give You all this domain and [c]its glory; for it has been handed over to me, and I give it to whomever I wish. 7 Therefore if You [d]worship before me, it shall all be Yours.”Hi,
Riches are a tragic curse.
Who needs faith, who needs to pray when all your barns are fulljas 1
Let the brother of low degree rejoice in that he is exalted:10 But the rich, in that he is made low: because as the flower of the grass he shall pass away.
11 For the sun is no sooner risen with a burning heat, but it withereth the grass, and the flower thereof falleth, and the grace of the fashion of it perisheth: so also shall the rich man fade away in his ways.
Hi,
Is 2
5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the Lord.6 Therefore thou hast forsaken thy people the house of Jacob, because they be replenished from the east, and are soothsayers like the Philistines, and they please themselves in the children of strangers.
7 Their land also is full of silver and gold, neither is there any end of their treasures; their land is also full of horses, neither is there any end of their chariots:
8 Their land also is full of idols; they worship the work of their own hands, that which their own fingers have made:
Idolatry makes folk wealthy
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