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Tim,
Scripture attests that the command to love one another is in fact a law. It is not only a law it is the sum of all the laws that are from God.
Romans 13:9(NIV)
The commandments, “You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” “You shall not covet,” and whatever other command there may be, are summed up in this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.”
1 John 2(NIV)
We know that we have come to know him if we keep his commands. 4 Whoever says, “I know him,” but does not do what he commands is a liar, and the truth is not in that person. 5 But if anyone obeys his word, love for God is truly made complete in them. This is how we know we are in him: 6 Whoever claims to live in him must live as Jesus did.
7 Dear friends, I am not writing you a new command but an old one, which you have had since the beginning. This old command is the message you have heard. 8 Yet I am writing you a new command; its truth is seen in him and in you, because the darkness is passing and the true light is already shining.9 Anyone who claims to be in the light but hates a brother or sister is still in the darkness. 10 Anyone who loves their brother and sister lives in the light, and there is nothing in them to make them stumble. 11 But anyone who hates a brother or sister is in the darkness and walks around in the darkness. They do not know where they are going, because the darkness has blinded them.
I did not address the scripture you used but I did address the ideas you expressed.
Kerwin: Thank you for your response. I have deep respect for abiding in love. Obeying commandments is not love. To obey anyone or anything is to react to a demand under fear of some form of punishment or duress. To obey God is to be afraid not to obey God. To love God is to join yourself to God willingly accepting all that God is. God is love! We join ourselves to love. Love doesn't control by force or threat.
Love allows choices of life and the returning effects of those choices. Love doesn't condemn. Love doesn't take into account a wrong done. Love is all forgiving, patient, kind, longsuffering. Accepting Gods words as truth and abiding in that truth and holding fast to every word God speaks through Jesus! To love your neighbor is automatic as you see Gods love to yourself. You can't love your neighbor any more than you love yourself. We are all equal.
We are judged by the word of God/Jesus. Jesus says,….now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. What God hath cleansed let no man call unclean! When a man accepts that verse from Christ, and holds fast to it no matter what anyone else says, then he has been judged as clean by the word of God. There remains no further judgment. Why would there be another judgment from Jesus.
As I see it in the New Covenant, if a person sets a rule or standard of life for another, it effects not the other person, yet it sets that particular standard/law up for the person who set the rule.If I set up any laws for others as sin against God they become my own laws with judgment, of myself. Where there is no law I would have set a law unto myself. After setting a law unto myself, if I break it I stand condemned. Had I walked in love and set no standards or laws then I would be a free man. The same freedom I give to all is the freedom God has given to all. You will reap what you sow.
Sow love and reap a lifetime of Love. The mind of Christ must be cleared and clean of any dark thoughts, sin or blockages of any kind, to allow the annointing of God to flow through us. Thats my choice. IMO, God Bless you, TK
Quote (Tim Kraft @ Mar. 11 2011,04:14) Kerwin: Thank you for your response. I have deep respect for abiding in love. Obeying commandments is not love. To obey anyone or anything is to react to a demand under fear of some form of punishment or duress. To obey God is to be afraid not to obey God. To love God is to join yourself to God willingly accepting all that God is. God is love! We join ourselves to love. Love doesn't control by force or threat. Love allows choices of life and the returning effects of those choices. Love doesn't condemn. Love doesn't take into account a wrong done. Love is all forgiving, patient, kind, longsuffering. Accepting Gods words as truth and abiding in that truth and holding fast to every word God speaks through Jesus! To love your neighbor is automatic as you see Gods love to yourself. You can't love your neighbor any more than you love yourself. We are all equal.
We are judged by the word of God/Jesus. Jesus says,….now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you. What God hath cleansed let no man call unclean! When a man accepts that verse from Christ, and holds fast to it no matter what anyone else says, then he has been judged as clean by the word of God. There remains no further judgment. Why would there be another judgment from Jesus.
As I see it in the New Covenant, if a person sets a rule or standard of life for another, it effects not the other person, yet it sets that particular standard/law up for the person who set the rule.If I set up any laws for others as sin against God they become my own laws with judgment, of myself. Where there is no law I would have set a law unto myself. After setting a law unto myself, if I break it I stand condemned. Had I walked in love and set no standards or laws then I would be a free man. The same freedom I give to all is the freedom God has given to all. You will reap what you sow.
Sow love and reap a lifetime of Love. The mind of Christ must be cleared and clean of any dark thoughts, sin or blockages of any kind, to allow the annointing of God to flow through us. Thats my choice. IMO, God Bless you, TK
TKdid Christ not say to follow him and if you do not do it you are already judge.??
Jn 3:19 This is the verdict: Light has come into the world, but men loved darkness instead of light because their deeds were evil.
Jn 3:20 Everyone who does evil hates the light, and will not come into the light for fear that his deeds will be exposed.
Jn 3:21 But whoever lives by the truth comes into the light, so that it may be seen plainly that what he has done has been done through God.”Pierre
Tim Kraft,
Is a parent disciplining their child for wrongdoing an act of love?
Is a parent testing that child's skills an act of love when the child finds the testing unpleasant?
Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 11 2011,15:36) Tim Kraft, Is a parent disciplining their child for wrongdoing an act of love?
Is a parent testing that child's skills an act of love when the child finds the testing unpleasant?
Kerwin: No sir, it is not an act of love to discipline a child. Disciplining a child is saying, do this my way or the way I say is best for you. It is a controlling act to conform the child to what the parent thinks is best.
I disciplined my three children to help conform to this world but I can't call that pure God love.Sometimes it is the best thing for the child to do, sometimes it is not, that is not the root question. Conforming is controlling or insisting on a certain way of performance. That is not freedom and that can't be love.
Love is not self seeking.Never say when you are tempted that you are temped by God. God tempts/test nobody.
God is not running our lives. We are. God gave us creative powers of mind and a world to express them in.
In the world of duality, ebb and flow, up and down, hot or cold all forces are avaliable to be experienced from one extreme to the other extreme.There are no extremes in heaven. Earth is the place for feeling of experience. You can't know cold if you haven't experienced hot. You can't know pain without experience. You can't know sorrow without joy. You may finally choose perfect balance in the middle but the choice of one extreme to the other is a free choice of experience from God. Not good and evil. Evil is a lie. Evil is a creation of man. Evil is a lie. Evil is not truth. Evil is an illusion of thought. We call pain evil, it is not. We think sorrow is evil. It is not. There is only God/good. Evil is the great lie of darkness.
God has actually said to mankind, now go and take dominion over all creation. Religion has reversed that and says, Oh, God thou art in control and even if thou beat me and kill me I will serve you!
It returns back to the original choice of man given by God of whether to believe in good only(God is everwhere) or evil ( contrary illusions of thought that man has created in his mind that separate him from perfect union with God) That is the choice of truth or lies. Good or evil. “Beliefs”
All truth or untruth is in the mind. God can only be connected to in mind. Faith or believing is the only connection. Therefore lack of faith or disbelieving perfect union is the only way to separate from God. IMO, TK
Quote (Tim Kraft @ Mar. 12 2011,03:42) Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 11 2011,15:36) Tim Kraft, Is a parent disciplining their child for wrongdoing an act of love?
Is a parent testing that child's skills an act of love when the child finds the testing unpleasant?
Kerwin: No sir, it is not an act of love to discipline a child. Disciplining a child is saying, do this my way or the way I say is best for you. It is a controlling act to conform the child to what the parent thinks is best.
I disciplined my three children to help conform to this world but I can't call that pure God love.Sometimes it is the best thing for the child to do, sometimes it is not, that is not the root question. Conforming is controlling or insisting on a certain way of performance. That is not freedom and that can't be love.
Love is not self seeking.Never say when you are tempted that you are temped by God. God tempts/test nobody.
God is not running our lives. We are. God gave us creative powers of mind and a world to express them in.
In the world of duality, ebb and flow, up and down, hot or cold all forces are avaliable to be experienced from one extreme to the other extreme.There are no extremes in heaven. Earth is the place for feeling of experience. You can't know cold if you haven't experienced hot. You can't know pain without experience. You can't know sorrow without joy. You may finally choose perfect balance in the middle but the choice of one extreme to the other is a free choice of experience from God. Not good and evil. Evil is a lie. Evil is a creation of man. Evil is a lie. Evil is not truth. Evil is an illusion of thought. We call pain evil, it is not. We think sorrow is evil. It is not. There is only God/good. Evil is the great lie of darkness.
God has actually said to mankind, now go and take dominion over all creation. Religion has reversed that and says, Oh, God thou art in control and even if thou beat me and kill me I will serve you!
It returns back to the original choice of man given by God of whether to believe in good only(God is everwhere) or evil ( contrary illusions of thought that man has created in his mind that separate him from perfect union with God) That is the choice of truth or lies. Good or evil. “Beliefs”
All truth or untruth is in the mind. God can only be connected to in mind. Faith or believing is the only connection. Therefore lack of faith or disbelieving perfect union is the only way to separate from God. IMO, TK
TKPs 94:12 Blessed is the man you discipline, O LORD,
the man you teach from your law;
Pr 1:2 for attaining wisdom and discipline;
for understanding words of insight;
Pr 1:7 The fear of the LORD is the beginning of knowledge,
but fools despise wisdom and discipline.
Pr 3:11 My son, do not despise the LORD'S discipline
and do not resent his rebuke,
Pr 5:12 You will say, “How I hated discipline!
How my heart spurned correction!
Pr 5:23 He will die for lack of discipline,
led astray by his own great folly.
Pr 6:23 For these commands are a lamp,
this teaching is a light,
and the corrections of discipline
are the way to life,Pr 15:32 He who ignores discipline despises himself,
but whoever heeds correction gains understanding.Heb 12:5 And you have forgotten that word of encouragement that addresses you as sons:
“My son, do not make light of the Lord’s discipline,
and do not lose heart when he rebukes you,
Heb 12:7 Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as sons. For what son is not disciplined by his father?
Heb 12:8 If you are not disciplined (and everyone undergoes discipline), then you are illegitimate children and not true sons.
Heb 12:11 No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.
Rev 3:19 Those whom I love I rebuke and discipline. So be earnest, and repent.I will discipline you but only with justice;
I will not let you go entirely unpunished.’Pr 29:17 Discipline your son, and he will give you peace;
he will bring delight to your soul.Pr 13:24 He who spares the rod hates his son,
but he who loves him is careful to discipline himThis is what scriptures says
Pierre
Come on Pierre: The word “discipline” is only used once in the entire Bible, Job36:10—–KJV!
Other translations? The KJV says “chastening” of the Lord. The word means to educate, teach, instruct! Not spank them and send them to their rooms. He who the lord loves he teaches!!
Take care that words used then and now have picked up very different connotations of meaning. TKTim,
Do you believe God’s definition of love? I asks because among other attributes he clearly states love “does not delight in evil”, 1 Corinthians 13:4.
When a parent who loves their child discipline them they do as you what they deem best for the child. In this they are showing love for the child for they are showing they do not delight in evil behavior from that child. In too many cases that love is corrupt by slavery to sin. The love of God is not corrupt as he does what he knows is best.
Discipline is a matter of justice more than control or even intimidation. It is correctly used to teach wrongdoers that self serving actions have a cost. If one has a righteous mindset then one will learn from being disciplined even though it is unpleasant.
Some individuals enable evil by not confronting it. In doing so they are acting hateful and so do not despise it thus making themselves an accomplice to the evil. Of course when confronting it do not sin yourself.
Quote (Tim Kraft @ Mar. 13 2011,04:24) Come on Pierre: The word “discipline” is only used once in the entire Bible, Job36:10—–KJV! Other translations? The KJV says “chastening” of the Lord. The word means to educate, teach, instruct! Not spank them and send them to their rooms. He who the lord loves he teaches!!
Take care that words used then and now have picked up very different connotations of meaning. TK
TKI never had in my mine a spank,god does not use spanky's
but reasoning ,understanding,as you say
Pierre
Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 12 2011,20:52) Tim, Do you believe God’s definition of love? I asks because among other attributes he clearly states love “does not delight in evil”, 1 Corinthians 13:4.
When a parent who loves their child discipline them they do as you what they deem best for the child. In this they are showing love for the child for they are showing they do not delight in evil behavior from that child. In too many cases that love is corrupt by slavery to sin. The love of God is not corrupt as he does what he knows is best.
Discipline is a matter of justice more than control or even intimidation. It is correctly used to teach wrongdoers that self serving actions have a cost. If one has a righteous mindset then one will learn from being disciplined even though it is unpleasant.
Some individuals enable evil by not confronting it. In doing so they are acting hateful and so do not despise it thus making themselves an accomplice to the evil. Of course when confronting it do not sin yourself.
Kerwin: I would not even know what love really is without God's definintion.Religion says God loves us. Then most say ….but beware of his wrath, he might kill you or… God took that little boy we don't know why, etc.! Religion say's
follow God, and then say's we must follow the law of Moses, which says thou shalt not kill and thou shalt not steal. Then religion say's it was God who sent armys in to ravage, kill, destroy, take their spoils, pillage the cities etc. THAT IS NOT LOVE!!
Wrath worketh not love! Love thinketh no evil. God is love. I do not serve the gods of the old testament that killed and destroyed. I cannot be so fickle minded as to say part of god did this and part of god did that.
It seems that I have been tagged some how as puporting that there is no evil I will try to clairify that.
I don't believe there was evil in the begining. There was only God. I believe man created a belief in evil that exists outside of God (in outer darkness) world wide and man must re-create the love energy he altered. God cleansed mankind and made him whole with his word/Jesus so that the annointed power(Christos) of love can flow through us unto the world.
When we enlighten the world again we will live in peace. Now we must war againt lies and deceptions of the truth, there is no evil in God and God is everywhere. We must erradicate evil(thinking) from the earth.When evil thinking is gone, so will be evil actions!! IMO, TK
Hi Kerwin,
2Samuel 23:2-7 The Spirit of the LORD spake by me, and his word was in my tongue. The
God of Israel said, the Rock of Israel spake to me, He that ruleth over men must be just,
ruling in the fear of God. And he shall be as the light of the morning, when the sun riseth,
even a morning without clouds; as the tender grass springing out of the earth by clear
shining after rain. Although my house be not so with God; yet he hath made with me
an everlasting covenant, ordered in all things, and sure: for this is all my salvation,
and all my desire, although he make it not to grow. But the sons of Belial shall
be all of them as thorns thrust away, because they cannot be taken with hands:
But the man that shall touch them must be fenced with iron and the staff of a spear;
and they shall be utterly burned with fire in the same place.Your brother
in Christ, Jesus!
Ed J (Joshua 22:34)
http://www.holycitybiblecode.orgQuote (kerwin @ Mar. 12 2011,20:52) Tim, Do you believe God’s definition of love? I asks because among other attributes he clearly states love “does not delight in evil”, 1 Corinthians 13:4.
When a parent who loves their child discipline them they do as you what they deem best for the child. In this they are showing love for the child for they are showing they do not delight in evil behavior from that child. In too many cases that love is corrupt by slavery to sin. The love of God is not corrupt as he does what he knows is best.
Discipline is a matter of justice more than control or even intimidation. It is correctly used to teach wrongdoers that self serving actions have a cost. If one has a righteous mindset then one will learn from being disciplined even though it is unpleasant.
Some individuals enable evil by not confronting it. In doing so they are acting hateful and so do not despise it thus making themselves an accomplice to the evil. Of course when confronting it do not sin yourself.
Bullseye. Amen. Good post. Peace-MarkKerwin: I am earnestly attempting to find out what sin is. I am not trying to “do sin” or “be sinful”! I appreciate your time and do not want to badger you with questions.
In the Garden of Eden did Adam sin by disobeying God or was sin created because he believed in evil?
By God telling Adam before-hand when all was good “if you accept/believe” evil information along with good, you will surely die, is that not just a warning of stimulus & response? He definitly didn't call it a sin. The word is not there.
Which action do you believe to be the sin? Disobeying God or believing in evil?
When we ask forgiveness of sin, and God is faithful and just to forgive us our sin, AND CLEANSE US FROM ALL UNRIGHTEOUSNESS AND SIN!
Is sin against God an individually perceived immoral action against God or against another person.
Is sin an action taken that is against God or an action that separates us from God in our minds/thinking!
Why is the expression used that we have washed away sin, or taken away our sin, or saved us from sin.
Christianity is pretty much built on sin and being cleansed, washed, purified from it, forgiven of it, or sentenced to hell and destruction forever for it. I think it is important to know and understand. IMO, TK
Tim,
Scripture tells us God is love.
1 John 4
7 Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9 This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. 10 This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins. 11 Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12 No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us.
13 This is how we know that we live in him and he in us: He has given us of his Spirit. 14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world. 15 If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in them and they in God. 16 And so we know and rely on the love God has for us.
God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in them. 17 This is how love is made complete among us so that we will have confidence on the day of judgment: In this world we are like Jesus. 18 There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.
19 We love because he first loved us. 20 Whoever claims to love God yet hates a brother or sister is a liar. For whoever does not love their brother and sister, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen. 21 And he has given us this command: Anyone who loves God must also love their brother and sister.Adam sinned by rebelling against love.
Love includes actions that are harsh since it is the motive behind those actions. That is why scripture states:
Proverbs 3:12
because the LORD disciplines those he loves, as a father the son he delights in.
Proverbs 19:20
Listen to advice and accept discipline, and at the end you will be counted among the wise.
Hebrews 12
7 Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as his children. For what children are not disciplined by their father? 8 If you are not disciplined—and everyone undergoes discipline—then you are not legitimate, not true sons and daughters at all. 9 Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live! 10 They disciplined us for a little while as they thought best; but God disciplines us for our good, in order that we may share in his holiness. 11 No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.
I use the Lord’s discipline in order to train myself in righteousness. I do not rail against it. I seek to understand why his actions are loving even though I do not question that they are.
God determines how long each of his creations will live on this and he contends with Satan in order to take care of their needs every day. Never the less he is more concerned with the survival of their soul than their welfare in other areas as he can remedy the rest but not a soul that seeks after evil. He sets the lifespan of a child short to further his plan to save all those that can be saved. There are results of acting hatefully and when we see those and call on the name of God for forgiveness then we will be saved. This world is the result of the sin of mankind.
Mankind is my nature corrupt. He was not made that way but chose to follow a crooked path and therefore was handed over to his idol until he sees his error, repents, and calls on God who is love.
God will cleanse us from the corruption in us which chases after the lures of the evil one. When fully mature the temptation will be there but we will see touching them as unclean as playing in a sewer full of corruption. God’s discipline aids us in our growth.
Note:All scriptures from NIV.
Quote (kerwin @ Mar. 15 2011,21:29) Tim, Scripture tells us God is love.
1 John 4
7 Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. Everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. 8 Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love. 9 This is how God showed his love among us: He sent his one and only Son into the world that we might live through him. 10 This is love: not that we loved God, but that he loved us and sent his Son as an atoning sacrifice for our sins. 11 Dear friends, since God so loved us, we also ought to love one another. 12 No one has ever seen God; but if we love one another, God lives in us and his love is made complete in us.
13 This is how we know that we live in him and he in us: He has given us of his Spirit. 14 And we have seen and testify that the Father has sent his Son to be the Savior of the world. 15 If anyone acknowledges that Jesus is the Son of God, God lives in them and they in God. 16 And so we know and rely on the love God has for us.
God is love. Whoever lives in love lives in God, and God in them. 17 This is how love is made complete among us so that we will have confidence on the day of judgment: In this world we are like Jesus. 18 There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.
19 We love because he first loved us. 20 Whoever claims to love God yet hates a brother or sister is a liar. For whoever does not love their brother and sister, whom they have seen, cannot love God, whom they have not seen. 21 And he has given us this command: Anyone who loves God must also love their brother and sister.Adam sinned by rebelling against love.
Love includes actions that are harsh since it is the motive behind those actions. That is why scripture states:
Proverbs 3:12
because the LORD disciplines those he loves, as a father the son he delights in.
Proverbs 19:20
Listen to advice and accept discipline, and at the end you will be counted among the wise.
Hebrews 12
7 Endure hardship as discipline; God is treating you as his children. For what children are not disciplined by their father? 8 If you are not disciplined—and everyone undergoes discipline—then you are not legitimate, not true sons and daughters at all. 9 Moreover, we have all had human fathers who disciplined us and we respected them for it. How much more should we submit to the Father of spirits and live! 10 They disciplined us for a little while as they thought best; but God disciplines us for our good, in order that we may share in his holiness. 11 No discipline seems pleasant at the time, but painful. Later on, however, it produces a harvest of righteousness and peace for those who have been trained by it.
I use the Lord’s discipline in order to train myself in righteousness. I do not rail against it. I seek to understand why his actions are loving even though I do not question that they are.
God determines how long each of his creations will live on this and he contends with Satan in order to take care of their needs every day. Never the less he is more concerned with the survival of their soul than their welfare in other areas as he can remedy the rest but not a soul that seeks after evil. He sets the lifespan of a child short to further his plan to save all those that can be saved. There are results of acting hatefully and when we see those and call on the name of God for forgiveness then we will be saved. This world is the result of the sin of mankind.
Mankind is my nature corrupt. He was not made that way but chose to follow a crooked path and therefore was handed over to his idol until he sees his error, repents, and calls on God who is love.
God will cleanse us from the corruption in us which chases after the lures of the evil one. When fully mature the temptation will be there but we will see touching them as unclean as playing in a sewer full of corruption. God’s discipline aids us in our growth.
Note:All scriptures from NIV.
Kerwin: Thank you for your truth. We are in agreement that God is love. Therefore we know, without love we could do nothing. But love was the life breathed into mankind at creation which annimated the soul and body.
Mankind is life from God. We are love in a body.No matter how many good works, no matter if I give all my goods, my possessions, to feed the poor or allow my body to be burned by disease, if I have not God, It profits me nothing. No gain without love.
God suffereth long and is kind. God envieth not: God vaunteteth not(doesn't boast) Love does not behave unseemly, Love seeketh not her own way.
Love is not easily provoked, but can be! God doesn't believe in evil and therefore thinketh no evil: love doesn't rejoice in iniquity/sin or any belief of separation: God beareth, believeth, hopeth and endureth all words. God never faileth!
We know in part and prophesy in part until that which is perfected developes within: Proverbs says …in all things/words find understanding. Words are dead until the breath of life (understanding) is acquired.
Now we see through glass that is darkened with sin beliefs and uncleanliness. But when the perfect enlightenment/understanding clears out all the negative obsticles pure power of God/love will flow through us and out to a dying world. Eradicating sickness/death and restoring life abundantly.
Anyone who picks up a KJV Bible and reads the story of the Garden of Eden without preconception will not say; Adam sinned by rebelling against love. They would not even know what the word “sin” was.
And it was a choice of beliefs of information avaliable, not a rebellion against God. He already knew the consequences if he made the choice!
The Lord “Teaches” those whom he loves.
Websters: “Discipline”: to train, control or punish. IMO, TKHi Tim,
Just some thoughts here relating to the Garden of Eden story. That worm/snake that persuaded Eve was living in the same Garden right? It was a very unique snake it could reason. It wasn't cast out of the garden before Adam and Eve so it's fairly safe to believe it also hadn't eaten of the tree of good and evil also if you assume like Adam and Eve it was issued the same choice as they concerning it. It definately wasn't doing God's will by it's act of persuasion. Could it be a symbol of our freewill or ability to make decisions that are not in accordance with God's love and will? Then you have the beginnings of all the sinning business and so it goes sin, repentence,atonement, sacrifice, laws and information given throughout the old testament of how to identify sin, procedures to follow for atonement and sacrifice. Communities rising and falling through out all this. Prophesies being given of the messiah. Then comes Jesus the fulfillment of the law and the prophesies referred to as the second Adam. The difference being he does not partake of the tree of good and evil symbolically. He is aware of evil and it's ways, but, does no believe in them through God's power and grace and teaches us that we are able to do all the things he does. He even flat out says that all things we see him do we also can do, and even greater things.On one condition that we live his teachings and as result become one with him and God. Thereby we overcome the 'original' sin and no longer are partakers of the tree of knowledge of good and evil. The true vine teaching (john:15) kind of illustrate this.
Is that kind of what you are saying?With Love and Respect,
WispringWispring: I think you are correct in that our freewill is our right given by God to choose what to believe from the avenues of knowledge in this life and what not to believe. What we believe will influence our lives on earth and what we refuse to believe, that could have been good for us, we will experience too. If we sow the spirit of God, peace, love, joy, longsuffering, meekness, kindness and gentleness, that is the fruit that we will harvest in our lives. If we sow to destruction we will suffer the fruit of evil, pain, evil, sickness and death.
I agree with you in that we can do all things through Christ which gives our strength. Christ(Christos') is the annointing of God's power.
Those who are washed clean by the words of Jesus from God, who says I have cleanses you, are those who believe that as truth. As we allow God to cleanse us by his word, Jesus, then we are also made whole, sin-free, made worthy, saved from sin and healed from sickness, disease and destruction, strictly by believing the words from God through Jesus.The condition of living his teachings for me is to abide in his words and allow his words to abide in me. He promises if we do allow his words to abide in us we may ask (place demand) what we will(desire) and it shall be done for us BY OUR FATHER IN HEAVEN.
Thank you for your comments and beliefs they bring life to me in my heart. You realize that we are not disscussing mainstream accepted religion here! At lease it is new to me. The cornerstone of religion is “sin” yet most can't even tell you what it is. We will search and find!! God Bless you, TK
Hi Tim,
Quote You realize that we are not disscussing mainstream accepted religion here! Is that right? Well, just so you are aware of this, I don't subject my soul to the experience of reading the bible to find religion. I do this to help myself find the mind of Christ and find God within me. Just where Jesus told me it would be.
Luke 17:20-21 (King James Version)
20And when he was demanded of the Pharisees, when the kingdom of God should come, he answered them and said, The kingdom of God cometh not with observation:
21Neither shall they say, Lo here! or, lo there! for, behold, the kingdom of God is within you.
I remember the first time I read this teaching I thought to myself, “What are all the things that are in kingdom of God to the best of my knowledge and came up with stuff like… There is God, there is jesus, there are angels, there are those who earned thier place in the kingom of God, there is light, there is infinite knowledge of all things(because, of course, God is there), and most likely many wonderous things that i could not imagine” This made me realise that it wasn't some place “out there”, rather, it was some place “in here”. That was a happy day.
With Love and Respect,
WispringWispring: From where I came from, to where I am, in revelation knowledge from God, excites me no end because I am getting a glimpse of what we all truly are. If we let our mental awareness, expand beyond the perimeters we unwitingly set around ourselves in our minds, we will find that we are unlimited beings. It may be that we are living for a time in somewhat of a limited existence but we definitely have the capability to expand our consciousness and abilities farther than we now allow them to expand. How far have we fallen from the truth due to lies and deceptions from religion. The light is now coming brighter and we are rising to the occasion. The Gospel of God has forever been greater than mankind has been able to accept. The truth has always been there it was just diluted and covered to make it powerless. IMO,God bless you, TK
Hi Kerwin,
Maybe it wasn't rebellion against God, maybe it was curiosity and ignorance. Adam was there with her when she ate the fruit(accepted the knowledge) and saw she wasn't dead. Maybe he thought “Hmmm, I wonder why she isn't dead now”. Maybe it's because when God said they would die they didn't ask how they would die, when they would die, what they would die to. So out of there own ignorance they decided to partake of the fruit(knowledge). Maybe they weren't aware of the fact that they would die to being in God's presence and guidance continually. You are a deep thinker. Please ponder this.With Love and Respect,
Wispring
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